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Asst Coach [710]
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Recruiting '13 and Brownlee....stop being hypocrites
Jan 25, 2013, 8:50 AM
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Recruiting is the life line of any program.
Clear and obvious to anyone who knows anything about sports.
Dabo KNOWS this. He's a GREAT recruiter. Don't know if it's from his days of selling insurance or what, but he can SELL you a program. He has the ENTHUSIASM and EMOTION that he wears on his sleeve. We don't win anything without a large part of it being OUTSTANDING recruiting (again, largely stems from his persona). Great players can cover up for poor coaching. Not completely, but can definitely make bad X and O coaches look pretty good.
Now switch to Brownell.
Brownlee is tagged as a good X and O guy. Seems bright. Teaches concepts. Grinds it out. Plays ugly and will need to out-scrape/scratch/struggle you to get a win. Overall a pretty successful system guy. He has shown NO ABILITY to recruit at the same level as a Dabo. Not locally. Not nationally. This is not a swipe at Filer - Roper (whom I like alot) - Blossomgame - etc, I'm just comparing to Dabo. These are guys who in FB we would MAYBE take one of to fill out numbers, NOT BE THE STAPLE OF A PROGRAM. Throw in Brad Brownell's persona- clearly subdued, calmer (dry and boring if you elaborate), and it's a snowball effect. I've never met Brownlee, but this is what it appears to be on TV...the same TV RECRUITS and their PARENTS, AAU COACHES, etc watch.
Point is this:
Dabo has built a successful program off of RECRUITING and ENTHUSIASM. He fought for and got the upgraded facilities. Brownlee has neither the RECRUITING ABILITY nor ENTHUSIASM to do the same. Just hasn't shown it. We're missing on the instate 5* guys (Brice Johnson, Sindarious Thornwell) and even others we had no business losing (Jerai Grant's brother), and certainly can't complete with the big boys. Our best recruit coming up (Rooks) was a no brainer due to family ties (mother graduate) and didn't take much to recruit him.
I'm not saying Brownlee is a bad coach. I'm saying the formula here (using FB as a blue print) has been completely different. Can't be hypocritical and not be able to see that. I do think ultimately he will be let go, probably in a year or so. It will come down to RECRUITING and ENTHUSIASM, something that has always been a concern from him.
Flame away (or label me a coot or whatever else substitutes having a meaningful discussion on a message board), but this is where things are at.
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110%er [5627]
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That's dumb .... you can't compare Clemson BB recruiting
Jan 25, 2013, 8:56 AM
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to FB recruiting ... entirely different level of traditions, national recognition, and expectations. Brad is doing just fine. The young guys we have will be a nucleus for solid team.
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Orange Blooded [2428]
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Chevy driver!***
Jan 25, 2013, 8:59 AM
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110%er [7913]
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Orange Blooded [3573]
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Okey DOKEY. whatever you SAY.***
Jan 25, 2013, 8:57 AM
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Orange Blooded [4367]
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Brownlee should go, Brownell Should stay
Jan 25, 2013, 9:01 AM
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I agree.
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Legend [16256]
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Dabo has a national college football brand at his back,
Jan 25, 2013, 9:03 AM
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regardless of whether it'd been properly earned or not. He's been a master at spinning that history and image into success in recruiting and now on the field.
Clemson basketball and thus Coach Brownell don't have that luxury. It's going to take a long steady run of success on the hardwood to establish that type of draw for our basketball program that football enjoys. The only way this happens is to allow a coach like Brownell enough time to fully cycle his recruits and his style of play into the mix, and hope it develops into consistent winning. IMO he has two more years minimum after this season to steer the program through these waters, barring a colossal collapse.
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Asst Coach [710]
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Re: Dabo has a national college football brand at his back,
Jan 25, 2013, 9:30 AM
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" going to take a long steady run of success on the hardwood "
again it's gotta start somewhere, and that's recruiting.
if this isn't brownell's strength then get some assistants who can...go get a major JUCO guy...get a big time undeveloped player planted on a bench at Duke, UNC, UCLA, etc..we just can't keep bringing in marginal players and expect success
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Legend [16256]
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It is WAY too soon to refer to our underclassmen as
Jan 25, 2013, 10:27 AM
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marginal players. Injuries to Devin Coleman and Jaron Blossomgame have hampered us this year, in addition to a seemingly utter lack of leadership from the two old soldiers in the program. With the type of suffocating defense we play though, we'll win our fair share of games this season still, and BB's 2013 class doesn't look too shabby. Rod Hall is emerging as a take it to the hole scorer, which will open up more offense as the season rolls on.
Outside of losing heartbreakers a little too consistently, there's a lot to like about this team and where it's headed.
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110%er [8008]
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I agree with you. Dabo is a great recruiter and that is his
Jan 25, 2013, 9:06 AM
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strength. Brownell is a very good coach. So far I haven't been impressed with his recruiting. If he could recruit as well as Purnell, Clemson could compete in the ACC.
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110%er [5627]
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Purnell didn't land any big time basketball players .... he
Jan 25, 2013, 9:10 AM
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recruited atheletes to fit his system. Milt would have been his biggest catch, and we see how good he's been. Filer, Blossomgame, McDaniels all had offers from good basketball programs, but Brownell landed them. He's doing as well as he can for now.
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CU Medallion [73569]
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Brownells problem is he seems to be recruiting Purnell type
Jan 25, 2013, 9:31 AM
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players. Athletes. Personally I think he needs 2-3 less athletic players who can shoot. His offense requires someone who can hit the 3 but he hasn't recruited 1 yet. Keep recruiting athletes but get some shooters too.
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Asst Coach [710]
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Re: Brownells problem is he seems to be recruiting Purnell type
Jan 25, 2013, 9:37 AM
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he's totally missed on the right balance...
way to heavy in the back court, and NO DEPTH up front
complain about booker-jennings but next yr
Nnoko Sullivan Josh Smith...wow
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All-TigerNet [14921]
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Apples and Oranges. Bowden spent 10 years
Jan 25, 2013, 9:14 AM
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pumping the money into the program to elevate our recruiting and Dabo had the benefit of helping orchestrate a lot of it. That's why there wasn't any drop off after he left.
Brownell came in at the 11th hour to replace a coach who left in the middle of the night with an almost bare recruiting cupboard (I think that Thornton kid who's at UGAy was the only kid he had gotten to commit when he left).
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Asst Coach [710]
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Re: Apples and Oranges. Bowden spent 10 years
Jan 25, 2013, 9:33 AM
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Dabo and Bowden are of the same mold...can sell you a program....Coach BB I just don't see it....if you are a top ranked recruit, you want to play for UNC-Duke-UCLA-FLA ...
why aren't we going to NYC, Chicago, Detroit....
there are inner city athletes who can bring a more exciting brand of ball here...
BB needs to make a change in his style of bringing guys in or he (fair or not) will be out of a job here in the next 1-2 yrs
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110%er [7913]
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Dabo has a tremendous advantage of football being
Jan 25, 2013, 9:15 AM
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incredibly important to Clemson fans compared to basketball.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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It's so obvious I'm surprised the OP missed it.
Jan 25, 2013, 9:18 AM
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Then all of us don't have an agenda we just stick with the truth.
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Asst Coach [710]
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Re: Dabo has a tremendous advantage of football being
Jan 25, 2013, 9:36 AM
[ in reply to Dabo has a tremendous advantage of football being ] |
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agreed, but you have to make your own tradition
losing to coastal carolina 2 yrs straight?
scoring 10 pts at half time?
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110%er [5298]
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Re: Recruiting '13 and Brownlee....stop being hypocrites
Jan 25, 2013, 9:21 AM
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I don't understand how his enthusiasm is in question. He looks pretty enthusiastic on the court to me. Clemson basketball isn't in the same position as Clemson football as far as recruiting. There are plenty of Clemson basketball games where LJ looks to be between a quarter and half full. Can you imagine DV a quarter or half full? It would look ridiculous.
Heck you can tell the difference in tradition by looking at what is celebrated in each area of play. We have banners for making it to the NCAAT and NIT in LJ even though many of them were just one and done appearances. We have a NC in football, with a ton of ACC championships. It is easy for us to recruit for football, but seems pretty impossible for us to get on top in basketball.
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All-American [598]
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"Drop off"??? "From Bowden"???
Jan 25, 2013, 9:30 AM
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Wasn't very much farther that we could have dropped...
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Legend [18133]
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REAL ESTATE
Jan 25, 2013, 9:36 AM
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Dabo sold commercial REAL ESTATE. I wish you people would get that straight. He did not sell insurance.
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Asst Coach [710]
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Re: REAL ESTATE
Jan 25, 2013, 9:38 AM
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mistake noted....REAL ESTATE. Dabo sold REAL ESTATE. got it.
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Commissioner [942]
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Recruiting is Dabo's strength; coaching is Brad's strength.
Jan 25, 2013, 9:43 AM
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A big difference is that the ACC is a much, much stronger basketball conference (even in down years) than the ACC is in football (even in up years, which there has not been any since Dabo has been Head Coach). As a result, Brad has a much tougher job.
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110%er [7191]
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Re: Recruiting '13 and Brownlee....stop being hypocrites
Jan 25, 2013, 9:52 AM
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First off it's Brownell,not Brownlee.Your not Mike Partick.
Secondly,please don't try to impress us by using a FB anology to explain basketball.
Next.Don't compare Brad to Dabo.Brad is from Indiana.Dabo from the South.That a big difference when it comes to being familiar with a certain region ,or area.(Jack Leggett has some of the same issues when it comes to recruting talent.He loves Maine(where he is from) yet has let several good local prospects get away to our rival 90 miles down the road).
Brad is a good coach,but apparently does not have much of an eye,imo,for offensive minded players.You can play defense all you want,but if you don't have some good consistent scores you are not going to win many games,no matter how good an X or O guy you are.
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Orange Blooded [3397]
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Re: Recruiting '13 and Brownlee....stop being hypocrites
Jan 25, 2013, 10:20 AM
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Dabo has the benefit of excellent facilities including player amenities to use in recruiting while the basketball program doesn't have anywhere near the same advantage. I think recruiting would be much better just with the addition of an improved practice facility along with player locker rooms, etc.
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CU Guru [1162]
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Act like 6'9 basketball players rain down in SC
Jan 12, 2013, 7:53 AM
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Seriously, you made your point and now you're beating the dead horse to oblivion.
Now please, enlighten me, what is YOUR solution, who would YOU hire?
Rather hear that then a broken record.
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Orange Blooded [2609]
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Cedceb is a hypocrite coot on a Tiger board***
Jan 25, 2013, 2:35 PM
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