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Topic: SC is moving forward on a bill
Replies: 72   Last Post: Feb 4, 2016 7:01 AM by: vlastimil_hort
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SC is moving forward on a bill

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:19 AM
 

to allow school personel to carry concealed weapons in schools. What's your thoughts on this?

From what I have read this is what is required:

-Must be a CC permit holder
-Must go through an extra 2 weeks of training from the Justice Academy.
-Guns must be in a safe and secure place when not in use (most likely a lock box).
-Guns must have fragmentation ammunition to keep the bullet from passing through one body and into an innocent bystander
- SLED will have a list of who the CC personnel are in each school.
-I'm sure there are more but I haven't seen anything else.

Is this a good idea? Bad idea? What are the positives and negatives.

As a teacher I will post my thoughts later.

2019 white level member


Terrible idea IMO***

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:19 AM
 



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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Re: Terrible idea IMO***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:20 AM
 

Why? Not saying you're wrong just would like your opinion on why.

2019 white level member


Many schools already have armed security....

[3]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:26 AM
 

While supporters call it a necessary self-defense and deterrent measure, opponents fear allowing teachers to carry concealed guns will lead to more campus violence. I think it also sends a bad message to the students.

Ultimately, teachers just don't have the hours of tactical training.

If an when the police do have to respond to a school, it becomes more difficult to differentiate friend from foe.




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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Re: Many schools already have armed security....

[2]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 1:23 PM
 

FWIW, Most college professors I know are bleeding heart liberals...

"Stalwart universities—Harvard, Princeton, Yale—most certainly offer status. The Citadel offers character. "


Re: Terrible idea IMO***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:48 AM
 

If you're a teacher go work. No wonder schools s*ck.


i own multiple guns that I like to shoot for hobby, but


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 11:24 AM
 

This idea is dumb. I don't even carry a gun on me. How many situations is someone honestly on where they need a gun for self defense? I have country friends that are big guys that tell me they carry for self defense. Not realizing that no one is going to jump a guy that big.

2019 student level member

Liability Cola by CU_Tigers_time is now trending on Tnet.


they won't jump on them but they will pull a gun on them***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 11:57 AM
 




how many people on tigernet have killed someone with a gun for self defense?


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:12 PM
 

like I said. I own guns and enjoy shooting them. I just haven't had the need nor do I ever think I'll have a need to shoot someone in the name of self defense.

I'm a college educated male in his twenties. I think I'll do just fine avoiding situations to get mugged/ killed...

2019 student level member

Liability Cola by CU_Tigers_time is now trending on Tnet.


So cu_Tigers the people at VT, the church in Charleston

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:20 PM
 

several malls, elementary schools and other public places were just in the wrong place. All dangerous places. Maybe if someone had been carry at one of these places lives may have been saved.

You must plan on staying at home and keeping your kids in isolation??

We as Free citizens should be able to protect ourselves. Gun control has really worked!!!

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Break down the statistical chance of being involved in something like that...


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:29 PM
 

It's easy to bring up isolated incidents, but you need to factor in all the schools/ churches that didn't have any issues. It's all fear tactics pushing bills for and against guns. There isnt any proof that legally armed treachers would be able to take down a shooter. Getting a carry permit teaches gun safety and laws. Not military training lol.

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Liability Cola by CU_Tigers_time is now trending on Tnet.


thta's sound statistical information. It only takes ONCE to


Posted: Feb 4, 2016 6:18 AM
 

skew your numbers!! Have you ever looked down the barrel of a bun? I have, but I probably have lived a MUCH different life than you have. Gooday


Re: thta's sound statistical information. It only takes ONCE to


Posted: Feb 4, 2016 6:40 AM
 

> skew your numbers!! Have you ever looked down the
> barrel of a bun? I have, but I probably have lived a
> MUCH different life than you have. Gooday

Yes. Yes I have.


Only one***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 1:15 PM
 



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Re: i own multiple guns that I like to shoot for hobby, but


Posted: Feb 3, 2016 4:18 PM
 

Will you please change that picture, it hurts my eyes when it flashes...


Re: SC is moving forward on a bill

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:20 AM
 

and to keep from getting the banhammer if this becomes a divisive arguing match I will delete the thread.

2019 white level member


Yeah that will fix the problem.


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:24 AM
 

No never mind it wont

2019 student level member


I am a CWP holder and a strong supporter of the 2nd

[2]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:26 AM
 

amendment. I think another solution is metal detectors that automatic lock doors and double doors that would "trap" the perp in between them, there are many solutions to any problem. I fire my guns on a regular basis and I am very focused on bullet control which I think is the key in any situation where the firearm is discharged. I think more than two weeks and multiple trips to the firing range on a very regular basis should be mandatory as well. With all those kids and teachers around, bullet control is imperative!!


I'm not advocating for this change

[2]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:31 AM
 

It has potential positives and negatives and well reasoned folks can disagree... but you are 100% correct in your assertion that bullet control and the requisite practice to obtain it should be imperative to anyone carrying, much less anyone carrying in a school environment.

I myself carry, and feel that the right to do so carries with it a grave responsibility to make sure I am capable, as best i can be, to make decisions and control my firearm. And those things can only be obtained with very regular practice. Far too many folks who carry their weapons only practice as much as it takes to pass the initial test and do little else except for some recreational practice once or twice a year (if that). When I took the multiple courses in Texas the statistics presented were scary as to just how few folks who legally carry take subsequent firearms courses or regularly practice firearm control.

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Thanks for a very reasonable post.***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:36 AM
 



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faaaar too many don't realize the responsibility that comes


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:50 AM
 

with the carrying of a weapon


Who pays for that?

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:32 AM
 

tax payers.

2019 student level member


and if saves ONE kids life it is worth it! What if it was

[2]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:46 AM
 

your kid?


bullet control is a direct result of where your firearm is


Posted: Feb 3, 2016 11:58 AM
 

aimed, and the intended target. a soft target will/might allow the projectile to pass, mostly according to the ammunition/caliber/gauge used. i am pretty sure "rat shot" for example, won't travel a mile and a half and strike an unsuspecting target. imo, it's more of the weapon's user to know what situation he/she may face and be able to hit what they aim at. in other words in sc, we don't really need a 7mm magnum (for our deer ,as an example. a BIG bear might be different) given our relatively closer shooting ranges and smaller sized animals. in other words, it's more important,imo again, to know what you are shooting at,and the ability to hit said target.


Re: SC is moving forward on a bill


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:27 AM
 

It's not the best solution but at least it could save students from getting killed.


Why not Give everyone a gun? Tuition, books and a gun?***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:31 AM
 



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Can we bring back the quick draw at high noon?***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:33 AM
 



2019 student level member


public hangings on the town square might open some eyes

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:49 AM
 

and minds of criminals!


That was the solution where I went to school....


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 1:26 PM
 

and I don't ever remember anyone ever getting shot...

The school issued me one of these for 4 years...

http://www.lrbarms.com/images/831_M14_Rifle.JPG

"Stalwart universities—Harvard, Princeton, Yale—most certainly offer status. The Citadel offers character. "


Re: SC is moving forward on a bill

[2]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:32 AM
 

As long as there's a high standard for oversight and training I absolutely support this. The first defense to a criminal is the potential victims ability to defend one self. Police took 11 minutes to respond to the active shooter in Oregon. That is simply to get on site, then spend more time evaluating the situation and locating the shooter. At least this plan gives the opportunity to fight back and save lives.

military_donation.jpg

they already can.......


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:35 AM
 

if the principal, president, superintendent, director, etc. gives them permission.

I know of one campus that allows it because I used to work there, and the person in charge there allowed us - even encouraged us - to. He even sent us to CWP class if we wanted; that's how I got mine.



SECTION 16-23-420. Possession of firearm on school property; concealed weapons.

(A) It is unlawful for a person to possess a firearm of any kind on any premises or property owned, operated, or controlled by a private or public school, college, university, technical college, other post-secondary institution, or in any publicly owned building, without the express permission of the authorities in charge of the premises or property. The provisions of this subsection related to any premises or property owned, operated, or controlled by a private or public school, college, university, technical college, or other post-secondary institution, do not apply to a person who is authorized to carry a concealed weapon pursuant to Article 4, Chapter 31, Title 23 when the weapon remains inside an attended or locked motor vehicle and is secured in a closed glove compartment, closed console, closed trunk, or in a closed container secured by an integral fastener and transported in the luggage compartment of the vehicle.

http://www.scstatehouse.gov/code/t16c023.php

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Teachers I had growing up that I would trust w/ a gun...

[4]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:36 AM
 

none.

I guess they'll have to add firearm training to the elementary-ed college curriculum. Maybe they can pair that class with the one where they teach how to decorate bulletin boards.

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There's something in these hills.


^^^^ THIS ^^^^***

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:37 AM
 



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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


lol...I'm sure some would've been tempted to aim my way at

[2]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:52 AM
 

one point or another


I'm a HS teacher and a handgun owner. I think this is a bad

[3]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:37 AM
 

idea and just as much as a knee jerk reaction that the gun takers have when someone gets shot. There is already too much BS in public schools, this adds more. IMO - of course.


that's another reason I'm in favor of exploring other non-


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:53 AM
 

violent measures


As the husband of a teacher

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:38 AM
 

my initial reaction is that I like the bill. I don't think that it is necessary for all teachers to carry, but it gives some teachers the choice to do so. My wife's school has a retired US Marshall as security and he designed the layout of the school as to make it difficult for any attack to go very far within the confines of the building. I do think that you need to have classes on carrying in a school and I do like that they will have a list of all that carry.

Overall I think it's a step in the right direction but there needs to be strenuous courses on safety when dealing with children.


Re: As the husband of a teacher


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:09 AM
 

Yes sir, I am sympathetic with your view. I just know some of the teachers in my school that I would be afraid of if they were carrying!!! They're crazy!! :)


Re: As the husband of a teacher

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:21 AM
 

Exactly, that is where I think not all Teachers need to carry and I stress there needs to be a heavy dose of vetting and safety classes before being allowed to have your CC in schools.


MORE guns in school? What could possibly go wrong?***

[2]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:40 AM
 




exactly, the only one with a gun should be the shooter

[2]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:45 AM
 

and just make it illegal for anyone to shoot on school grounds

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Great idea***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:52 AM
 



2019 orange level member


Re: SC is moving forward on a bill


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 9:53 AM
 

Lockbox = Fail

Useless.

Carry means carry.

That is all.


Re: SC is moving forward on a bill

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:01 AM
 

As a college professor in the Midlands I have owned shotguns for hunting in the past and am a supporter of gun ownership, however there are places where gun limits should apply. I could see a school safety officer, a school administrator or a coach who was certified as being the personnel in a school who would have permission to carry, otherwise I think this is not a good idea. There are simply to many circumstances which could end unexpectedly.

Go Tigers!


Of course when I was in HS at a rural SC school, there were

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:12 AM
 

guns on campus every day. Many of us students came to school after hunting early in the AM or were going to quail/deer/squirrel hunt in the afternoon. We had them in our gun racks or trunks.


I think it's fine. I bet there won't be that many that


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:47 AM
 

end up doing it. If I was a teacher, I would not CC, but I wouldn't be opposed if others did.


It's a great idea, but


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 10:53 AM
 

I think there should be a cap on the number per school. Maybe like 1 per so many students. That way it still makes a mass shooting unlikely and minimizes any unintended consequences. Just a thought.

I think in general there are fewer (not none, but fewer) mass shootings in areas where people are more likely to carry. This law seems pragmatic and reasonable.


I am a school teacher and a CWP holder. This is a terrible


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 11:11 AM
 

idea. Getting off a tactically clean shot inside a classroom is impossible. For outside classroom scenarios, there are SRO's that are trained in these settings.

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I am a school teacher and a CWP holder. This is a terrible


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 11:12 AM
 

idea. Getting off a tactically clean shot inside a classroom is impossible. For outside classroom scenarios, there are SRO's that are trained in these settings.

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As a teacher/Coach and a CC Permit holder

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 11:21 AM
 

I don't know where I stand on this. On the one hand, I can see how this could be a potential life saver. Most school policies (including my employment) is to get all kids in the classroom and out of line of sight immediately. So the confrontation would most likely happen in the hallway where there "should be" no students and brick walls and solid wooden doors between the confrontation and the student. If the shooter is in the classroom then it either originated with a student who was in the class or a teacher did not do his or her job of securing their classroom. So I don't see that potential for extra loss of life. I also feel sure that as a teacher who is one of the protectors it will be their job to go in the hallway and confront the shooter should an active shooter incident happen. I know personally, whenever I carry (not on school grounds, I like my job and want to keep it) if you ever see my weapon, the situation has escalated to the point where deadly force is now the ONLY option. Other than that you will never know I have it on me. Showing a weapon is not a threat it is an escalation. Therefore, when it becomes visible, shots will be fired. Thank God it has never come to that with me. However, I trust myself with a CC, but I don't trust anybody else with one. Just my opinion.

On the flip side of that. I understand the negatives as well. The worse can happen at a moment's notice and if it was done by my trigger finger I would never forgive myself. Sure I may have saved 100's of kids from a gunman but if that bullet went through and hit another kid, I couldn't live with that.

One thing I do find interesting is the people who are against it are not really giving reasons as to why they are (some have but most have not).

2019 white level member


I think they should have guns in schools


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 11:29 AM
 

Locked up in a safe place in the administrators office. And only the administrator or the SRO could use them in an emergency. I do NOT think the teachers should have them because they can get taken and used by students that way.

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Re: SC is moving forward on a bill


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 11:37 AM
 

A common theme of mass shootings is that they occur in places where guns are banned and killers know that everyone will be unarmed.

Gun-free zones are easy picking for the insane killers. At least take down the signs and keep 'em guessing.


I am 110% for it! But it is also important to get the parents on board when it comes to

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:00 PM
 

school discipline. The school and teachers need back up from those spineless jelly fish in administration of each school district. Plus some of these kids need their butts busted.

Most important is we need God back in our schools. We use to have Christian speakers come to our school and my home room teacher use to have use read scripture during that period. He was eventually fired for it.

But yes I am in favor of teachers and admins to carry a canceled weapon.

Several years ago a very close friend of mine had his wife kidnapped from the school parking lot by a 15 year old kid. He took her to a diserted area where he was going to rape and kill her. When he pointed the gun she lunged at him. He shot her knocking her to the ground. He would fire a shoot look at her and laugh. He did this for about 5 mins.

She survived but it took her years to recover emotionally. If she had been armed she may have been able to defend herself and shot the little punk.

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Guns and God.


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:07 PM
 

Got it.

Pistol whip anyone who says otherwise.

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There's something in these hills.


Besides sarcasm do you have any positive suggestions ????***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:12 PM
 



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Well schools are pubic so tossing God in there isn't going


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 2:07 PM
 

to happen.

Guns aren't the answer, either. I don't know any teachers that I would trust with a gun. Certainly none on the elementary level.

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There's something in these hills.


Re: SC is moving forward on a bill


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:18 PM
 

I would support this bill.

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in the last 35 years there have been 23 different times that


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:25 PM
 

A school shooting has resulted in 2 or more deaths. This includes private schools, public schools, and colleges. There are 98,817 public schools in the USA alone. The statistical chance of being in a school that has an open shooter is nearly nonexistent, but conservatives feel like they need to overreact to media, the same way the liberals are overreacting with gun control.

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Liability Cola by CU_Tigers_time is now trending on Tnet.


Ludicrous.***


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:23 PM
 



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null


Re: SC is moving forward on a bill

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 12:34 PM
 

We protect our goverment, money and other materialistic possessions with guns. The most important individuals who need to be protected are not. Our kids need protection from an armed teacher that is present. Not metal detectors or tasers. Pass this bill!!!!


You know teachers?


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 2:09 PM
 

I do and that's a scary thought.

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There's something in these hills.


Re: SC is moving forward on a bill


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 1:16 PM
 

Absolutely a great idea .... A lot of schools have one armed resource officer that at a lot of times is not there!

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Re: SC is moving forward on a bill


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 1:22 PM
 

We have this here (Ut) and it's no big deal. In fact, if you're a CCW holder, it's legal to CC in any public building minus courthouses.

Most of the provisions are the same as the proposed SC law. Must be a CCW card holder (which means age 21+). This precludes most students on campus from carrying. Faculty members on the other hand....

"Stalwart universities—Harvard, Princeton, Yale—most certainly offer status. The Citadel offers character. "


"In Use"

[1]
Posted: Feb 2, 2016 1:25 PM
 

Locked when not "in use". Carrying your gun is considered "in use". Not "in use" would be locked in a drawer while you are in the shower.

Just so you know.

Fever
CWP holder

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I support the second amendment


Posted: Feb 2, 2016 3:00 PM
 

but this is getting way out of hand.

If more guns made us safer, America would be the safest country on earth with over 300 million guns.


More is not better.


This thread belongs on the P&R bored.


Posted: Feb 3, 2016 11:25 AM
 

Gentlemen, talking politics on one of our main bores will turn new members away, alienate prospective recruits and their families and rupture our fellowship and brotherhood.

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Re: This thread belongs on the P&R bored.


Posted: Feb 3, 2016 11:27 AM
 

Never seen that board. I believe the discussion was civil and not divisive. By the way. That was one #### of a bump.

2019 white level member


It's political and always ends in tears.


Posted: Feb 3, 2016 4:10 PM
 

Click on the change boreds block and scroll down, a long way. You might enjoy it.

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Great idea. Already in action in some private schools.


Posted: Feb 3, 2016 11:28 AM
 

I would much rather send my future kids to a school where all the teachers are armed guards.

2019 student level member

Snowflake Basher........Out


Face it


Posted: Feb 3, 2016 11:49 AM
 

Shootings like this just won't stop. Sadly, they're a part of the way things are now. There's just too many soft targets, too many psychos, and too many guns. I own guns and love to shoot them. Not for self defense or prepping, but for fun. I know it's probably better to live normally that to be on constant alert with a gun. If someone wants to shoot someplace up, chances are they can. I just hope they won't. Mental health screenings and some common sense gun laws may help, but it won't stop every case. I'd say it's a better start than arming educators though.
Allowing teachers to carry guns in schools just increases the risk. They're human and deal with stress everyday. I'd hate for one of them to snap and have 20 kids locked in a room with a gun-wielding maniac.


Re: SC is moving forward on a bill


Posted: Feb 3, 2016 4:56 PM
 

seen in this thread and a common media mantra

...ccw holders are all gomers with no training

reality is with budget cuts, many get more training and trigger time than some of the rookie good guys in blue

many shoot IDPA and USPSA on the weekends too

a responsible citizen is generally a responsible citizen

and heck you abut have to be a lawyer just to dance around the current laws...i.e. generally quite proficient, knowledgeable folks...GENERALLY

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wow so it has come to this? Fear is a great motivator for madness


Posted: Feb 3, 2016 5:06 PM
 

Mm

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terrible idea. absolutely terrible.***


Posted: Feb 4, 2016 7:01 AM
 




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