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YOUR BALANCE
JK - here's your inconsistency
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JK - here's your inconsistency


Feb 10, 2020, 3:21 PM

Brownell bad losses by RPI:

'19-20: 64 - Minnesota, 65 - Yale, 67 - Miami, 112- Wake Forest, 138- South Carolina, 142 - Va Tech

'18-'19: 83 - NC State, Nebraska - 89, Miami - 129

'17-'18: 57 - Temple, 69 - Va Tech, 72 NC State

'16-'17: 50 - Va Tech x 2, 78 - Georgia Tech, 85 - Syracuse, 161 - Oklahoma

'15-'16: 59 - Georgia, 72 - South Carolina, 77 - Florida State, 78 - Alabama, 80 - Va Tech, 120- NC State, 173 - UMass, 264 - Minnesota

Facilities and fans aside, Clemson was good enough to win everyone of these games. Win half of these games and Clemson has 2 more NCAAs and Brownell isn't near a hot seat.

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Re: JK - here's your inconsistency


Feb 10, 2020, 3:27 PM



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looks consistant to me***


Feb 10, 2020, 3:32 PM



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You misunderstood, as usual.


Feb 10, 2020, 3:33 PM

I did not ask for proof that we are inconsistent - I know that we are. My point was that I don't think we are any more inconsistent than just about every other college basketball team out there.

College basketball teams are naturally going to have games where they play well and games where they do not. It's a long season, with a lot of games, played against a large pool of solid teams.

I suspect that you can pull the season results of just about any college basketball team and find games that they shouldn't have lost.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Re: You misunderstood, as usual.


Feb 10, 2020, 3:37 PM

So you have a hypothesis but want me to do the work? I’m showing you that we consistently lose to low quality opponents.

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Re: You misunderstood, as usual.


Feb 10, 2020, 3:43 PM

JUST THINK VIZCOOT IN A MERE 4 DAYS YOU WILL HAVE 2 COACHES AT CLEMSON TO B!TCH OUT. YOU MUST BE IN HEAVEN.

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Lmao this made me chuckle


Feb 10, 2020, 9:20 PM

On the other hand I’m concerned about DEROs blood pressure

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and we do it on a consistent basis


Feb 10, 2020, 3:52 PM [ in reply to Re: You misunderstood, as usual. ]

We have hovered around .500 in 6 of his 10 years. Middle-of-the-pack is the norm, not the exception.

Some people are fine with that.

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Re: You misunderstood, as usual.


Feb 10, 2020, 3:54 PM [ in reply to Re: You misunderstood, as usual. ]

This is why I am speechless...

Every team in the NCAA world is going to have a bad loss (or many). Especially if you are a better team, the losses look worse. Dear LAUWDEY even 538 has an article of the absurdity of chaos in college right now so pulling RPI is a little funny.

Step-back from that a minute and discount road losses. There is a huge amount a variable right down to the preference for the type of basketball (not as uniform as you might think).

Next, you only looked at RPI which distilled larger tends down into a single metric but you can't build out from there again. That ignores a LARGE amount of variability from scheme to injury to whatever.

Finally, I hear Brad has been very consistent at beating *lower* teams but not able to produce any upsets. This season has been a bit of an inverse. Still as 5-8-ity as ever but still, shesh.

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Re: You misunderstood, as usual.


Feb 10, 2020, 4:03 PM

The fact that this conversation is even occurring, including all the excuses and rationalizations, just proves the point.

One is either fine with mediocrity or not.
One believes Clemson can do better, or not.
The rest is just window dressing. But hey, it’s a message board.

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"Anybody that says Coach Brownell is the best coach to come through Clemson is going to start an argument." -JP Hall


Last night was a game Clemson should have won...


Feb 10, 2020, 4:07 PM

even without Simms in the lineup. However, the last two to three minutes of the game were hard to watch. It was as if someone flipped a switch and the team suddenly forgot how to shoot and how to defend. This ongoing level of inconsistency has been a common theme throughout Brownell's tenure at Clemson.




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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Re: Last night is a game Clemson should have won...


Feb 10, 2020, 4:14 PM

BigCUFan® said:

even without Simms in the lineup. However, the last two to three minutes of the game were hard to watch. It was as if someone flipped a switch and the team suddenly forgot how to shoot and how to defend. This ongoing level of inconsistency has been a common theme throughout Brownell's tenure at Clemson.




How do you gauge that? Our best player was out and his preseason expected back up is out with an ACL. We only had 1 big man in the game. Our backup center was Khavon Moore.

Which Clemson teams would be successful with their two best big men injured?

Also, you act like ND was a terrible team. In their last 5 games including ours they are 4-1 with a 1 point loss to FSU

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With Simms out...


Feb 10, 2020, 4:30 PM

I didn't think Clemson had any realistic chance of winning the game but they certainly played well enough to win...for most of the game.

The foul on Mooney that he converted into a four-point play with the game tied at 43 was beyond stupid. That play put the Fighting Irish ahead for the first time in the second half.

Then Clemson simply forgot to guard Pflueger.

As usual, it really boiled down to Clemson not making enough shots. In fact, I think Brownell said as much in his post game presser. They made just three of the first 14 shots which they did manage to overcome. They're getting good looks but, for whatever reason, they're not making those shots which explains why Clemson is 13th in the ACC in points per game with a 66.1 ppg average. Clemson was just 9 of 34 from behind the arc and missed 3 of 4 shots after cutting Notre Dame's lead to 54-52.

Like I said, in the last two to three minutes of the game, they just forgot how to defend and shoot.

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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Yup, exactly. Can't argue the consistent inconsistency.


Feb 10, 2020, 9:34 PM [ in reply to Re: You misunderstood, as usual. ]

Saying every team does it (to our level) is false. And nd the time for excuses has passed... years ago. The reality of our mediocre play and being consistently inconsistent is very clear and can't be argued.

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Re: You misunderstood, as usual.


Feb 10, 2020, 4:10 PM [ in reply to Re: You misunderstood, as usual. ]

He has one major upset not just this year, but in his career - that’s Duke. It is his only career Top 5 win. If you mean wins games against clearly better opponents he does that every year - which makes his inability to avoid the disastrous loss that more aggravating. Complaining about using the RPI is complaining for its own sake. It was NCAA metric for years and historical numbers are still readily available. Yes, good teams lose to bad in basketball more than in football. But I don’t believe with the regularity Brownell does. Losing those games is why we don’t more consistently make the NCAA. That is the minimal goal - even JK has said so. So comparing ourselves to team that don’t make the NCAA is pointless. Teams that do make the NCAA, more importantly coaches who consistently make the NCAA, do not make a habit of losing these types of games. In all of the seasons listed we won games against better teams than those listed. Most seasons we won more games against much higher ranked teams than these total losses. I only went through 5 years but I imagine it would be consistent over the remaining seasons. We are good enough to win these games. Even if it is the norm to lose some of these you shouldn’t be losing to sub-100 rpi teams - no matter how you try to dismiss the metric. Not coincidently, the only year we made the tournament is the year we didn’t lost to a sub-100 team. Apologizing for losing that kind of game is simply accepting never ending mediocrity.

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So instead, you did work that no one asked for.


Feb 10, 2020, 8:58 PM [ in reply to Re: You misunderstood, as usual. ]

Good job.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Re: JK - here's your inconsistency


Feb 10, 2020, 4:10 PM

LOL

If we won every game that we were favored in and lost every game that we were a dog, our record would be worse.

Did you know that under Brownell, we have finished higher than our preseason ACC ranking?

This is an incredibly dumb post even for viztiz.

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Re: JK - here's your inconsistency


Feb 10, 2020, 4:22 PM

Nice strawman argument. Would you like to respond to anything actually posted.

If not, just to humor your idiotic reply, RPI is fluid during the season. The is final RPI for all teams. By and large teams should predominantly do exactly what you seem to be mocking. This is further stratified by quadrants. Most Q1 and Q2 don’t actually pick up a lot of losses to Q4 teams.

How about this stat. For this season UNC is the only team with a worse Quad 3 record than Clemson. That would seem to reinforce my notion.

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More for Judge


Feb 10, 2020, 4:41 PM

only UNC has a worse Quad 3 record this season.

Only Boston College has a worse non-conference RPI. (Not SOS - actual RPI against non-conference opponents)

So, no, not everyone manages to take bad losses the way we do.

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