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All-TigerNet [10666]
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When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 1:17 PM
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Say we bulldoze the Calhoun house, change the name of the honors college, and erase any "Calhoun" reference on the campus... What's next?
Tillman Hall is obviously next. Then what?
Thomas Green Clemson, son-in-law of Calhoun, fought for the Confederacy. Are we going to change the name of the University as well?
Just wondering. Thanks!
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Orange Blooded [3673]
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why would someone who lives 20 minutes from the school
Jun 9, 2020, 1:21 PM
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grow up around it choose to attend it and then make such a big fuss about it years after? very strange.
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110%er [8501]
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Re: why would someone who lives 20 minutes from the school
Jun 9, 2020, 1:29 PM
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Yeah it is strange that someone would grow up seeing something they believe is unfair, work hard and make himself into a person with some measure of power, and then try to affect change that he feels will benefit his friends and family who are still in that area. Never heard of anyone trying to do that before.
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110%er [9683]
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How would it benefit his friends and family?***
1
Jun 9, 2020, 3:50 PM
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110%er [8501]
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Re: How would it benefit his friends and family?***
Jun 9, 2020, 4:39 PM
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He’s got a ton of family and friends in the area, it it’s possible some of them may also want to attend Clemson and have the same feelings as Nuk about Calhoun and Tillman. He may also one day want his children to attend his alma mater.
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Legend [15870]
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Re: why would someone who lives 20 minutes from the school
Jun 9, 2020, 4:35 PM
[ in reply to Re: why would someone who lives 20 minutes from the school ] |
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It is more than that and you know it. If Nuk was so concerned about the names on buildings at Clemson why did he wait until an incident like the GF death to bring up his opinions about Clemson now. He has been in the NFL for a few years now and is a top earner in the NFL. IMO he is just an opportunist like many other groups or individuals who are using the GF incident to create more racial tensions. Their actions IMO only cause more division among the races. It like throwing gas on a fire that is already spreading in very dangerous directions.
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110%er [8501]
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Re: why would someone who lives 20 minutes from the school
Jun 9, 2020, 5:14 PM
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Thanks you for telling me what I know, your are certainly the subject matter on that. Nuk can decide to speak on this whenever he #### well pleases no matter how you feel about it. He’s been listing Daniel high school as his alma mater during games for years, it’s just now that he’s let us know why. It’s well documented that he’s a guy who doesn’t like speaking publicly; he went most of his career at Clemson without giving a single interview. Perhaps the George Floyd murder (not incident) and the conversations that followed are what led him to speak up. Perhaps as a young black man who has already seen violence tear at his family (not race related) he has a reticence about making waves. Perhaps he’s listening to the leaders of his community that are telling him that now is the time to stand up for what you believe. I don’t know as I haven’t even met the man these are all suppositions. What is certain is that you don’t know either, and when you make a judgement about someone without knowing there motives and heart that’s referred to as ignorance. It’s almost like thinking a football coach is a racist who’s trying to mock a movement based on an innocuous t-shirt.
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Standout [304]
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All-TigerNet [13236]
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Re: why would someone who lives 20 minutes from the school
Jun 9, 2020, 2:25 PM
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I know it's right. It's like, who learns anything as they get older. I thought everyone knew everything they needed to know by age 10.
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Walk-On [119]
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All-In [27366]
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CU Guru [1437]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 1:27 PM
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A slippery slope fallacy occurs when someone makes a claim about a series of events that would lead to one major event, usually a bad event. In this fallacy, a person makes a claim that one event leads to another event and so on until we come to some awful conclusion. Along the way, each step or event in the faulty logic becomes more and more improbable.
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Legend [18786]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 1:32 PM
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I don't think all social change should move at lightening speed. People need time to adjust, I get it.
I think this is what bothers a lot of people. I wish more tolerance was in us all.
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Legend [16439]
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Maybe we sell naming rights to Nuk and Deshaun for
Jun 9, 2020, 1:31 PM
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say $5 million. Let them put their money where their mouths are. Then we control the price for any future changes.
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Orange Blooded [3516]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 1:45 PM
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I think you have to deal with what is right in front of you at the moment. Calhoun and Tillman were horrible human beings, even by the standards of their day. It’s the right thing to do for a multitude of reasons, but mainly because neither deserves honored today.
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Trainer [29]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 1:54 PM
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NEVER Never got his BIG PAYDAY THANKS TO CLEMSON' They forget real quick' Man I made it on MY OWN'
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Standout [304]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 2:21 PM
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Maybe he is satisfied when wrongs are corrected. When overt racists have their names removed from buildings. Maybe when he feels like he can go for a jog in his neighborhood without fearing for his life. But I’m not him, so i couldn’t really answer that.
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Orange Blooded [3673]
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ORtiger...
Jun 9, 2020, 2:27 PM
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feel free to find another school. I will fight for TG Clemson.
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Walk-On [119]
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Re: ORtiger...
Jun 9, 2020, 3:42 PM
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You sound like Dabo talking about Kaep a few years ago... We see how that turned out
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Legend [16327]
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we can settle it just combine with
Jun 9, 2020, 2:28 PM
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south carolina and call it the untied university of south carolina
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Orange Blooded [4770]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 2:30 PM
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The NFL was founded by racists but he has no problem cashing those checks, just like he had no problem playing here when it was to his advantage. You can change the name but he will still find something to whine about, just not anything related to whoever is paying him. What a heroic stance.
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Orange Blooded [4146]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 2:34 PM
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He won't. For whatever reason he has an axe to grind with CLEMSON and he will never be satisfied. I guess he uses it for motivation. I am proud of his accomplishments, he was a great player for CLEMSON, but I am past caring what he says or does as a pro.
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MVP [508]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 2:48 PM
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Hopkins and others who agree with his principle are very wrong and short sighted. If John C. Calhoun did own slaves back in that time of our history, which he apparently did, this was an integral practice and universally accepted at that time in our history and cannot ever be excised or forgotten. History happened whether we like it or not. This example as well as many others throughout our nation's history should never be forgotten, but rather only brought up to this time in history we now live in, a time in which we fully recognize the past faults of our nation's history by now coming together in unity to affect positive change in "Equality for All" for not only our own generation but for generations yet to come in the future of our nation as "One Nation Under God." So let us be thankful for all those who went before us for it is by and through their examples we have learned to make improvements for all of humanity to live by for now and on into the future!
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Legend [19923]
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Calhoun didn't just own slaves
Jun 9, 2020, 3:45 PM
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He was the leading advocate for, and defender of, slavery in his time. He argued it was a "positive good", not a necessary evil, for both whites and blacks.
Tillman was the leader of a white supremacist terrorist group known as the Red Shirts and participated in mass murders of black men, one of whom was a South Carolina state senator.
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All-In [44026]
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But Clemson isn't honoring those aspects of these men.
Jun 9, 2020, 3:50 PM
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Clemson honors them for their key contributions to the formation of the university.
Negative aspects of their lives, which had nothing to do with Clemson University, shouldn't prevent them from being recognized for the good they did.
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Orange Blooded [4816]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 3:26 PM
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To appease the haunting thoughts of the Clemson
buildings be renamed will not be enough.The land
that Clemson was built on was Calhoun's plantation.
His son-in-law, Thomas G. Clemson inherited it
and donated it for the purpose of a land grant
college to be built. So to appease NUK, we must
tear down the school and plant a briar patch.
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110%er [9028]
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Changing a name on a thing will not irreversibly damage
Jun 9, 2020, 3:41 PM
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anything, except the soft racism, that pretends black people shouldn't question any traditions.
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Orange Blooded [4816]
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Re: Changing a name on a thing will not irreversibly damage
Jun 9, 2020, 4:21 PM
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It's not traditions, it's history and it belongs to us
all. We must leave it there so we never forget the wrongs
so we don't repeat. Teach the history to our kids but don't
make them feel like all of our history is wrong.
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Legend [15870]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 4:24 PM
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It want stop with Clemson either. Winthrop has a building named after Ben Tillman. What other colleges are next. Then do we start rewriting history, burning books, eliminating courses related to slavery and the civil war. We learned through trying to appease Hitler and other people like him that Appeasement does not work. They only want more or even take what they want through unethical or violent sources.
Nuk seems to forget that because of CLEMSON , Dabo and the other coaches, the football facilities, the many Clemson fans who purchase Nuk Hopkins jerseys, and other Nuk merchandise, the NFL have helped to make Nuk a millionaire. Money he can use to make life better for his family. My question is if someone were to go back to Nuk’s middle school and HS days did he ever make racist remarks. What skeletons might be in his closet. In fairness to Nuk would it benefit anyone by going back into Nuk’s history. It would not. Just like some of the people who help to start Clemson University.
It seems double standards are used by some. We could investigate the history of many white or black leaders in history and find fault with all of them. But it seems the faults of the white man seem to be more damming and create more racial tensions then those of a black man. Hence the double standard. ( This statement is my personal opinion and in no way is meant to be racist. I pray all races will take a step back and look in the mirror. Then maybe we can come together. What we are doing now and what we have done in the past does not seem to be working.)
When do they go after the American Flag??
When I refer to “they” it is any race or hate groups whose only goals are to divide and destabilize our society and this country. Or those who feel entitled to Double Standards.
Message was edited by: wueagle86®
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Orange Blooded [3516]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 5:03 PM
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You are one of the most hysterical (the emotional kind...not the funny kind) And hyperbolic posters here. I’m sure there are groups with an agenda, but it doesn’t mean they are wrong in this particular case...or Winthrop, for that matter.
Tillman was a horrible person and does not deserve to be honored today, even for any good he may have tripped over along the way. Removing his name is the right thing to do. If it leads to more demands, we can address those on their merits as well. As for Tillman, way past time to remove the name.
I understand the angst...I really do. But, the time has come.
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Orange Blooded [4816]
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Re: When is Hopkins going to be satisfied? It won't stop with Calhoun.
Jun 9, 2020, 5:26 PM
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I accidentally gave you a thumbs up but I don't agree
100% with you. On the Tillman name, that's up to Clemson
and if they remove it, that's their call. We all agree that
he was a terrible person but he cast the vote that allowed
the University to be built.
Just put a plaque below his name and say that he made a lot
of bad decisions about race.
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All-In [27366]
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Never.***
Jun 9, 2020, 4:51 PM
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