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Topic: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was
Replies: 30   Last Post: Jan 16, 2019 12:38 PM by: clmsntgr1®
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Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:18 AM
 

Looking back now, from a talent stand point it wasn't close at all but the reason I ask is how was a freshman Hunter Johnson unable to beat out an inexperienced Kelly Bryant but an inexperienced Trevor Lawrence beat out a seasoned Kelly Bryant? Trevor Lawrence must have been several times better than Hunter.

2019 student level member

Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was

[3]
Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:20 AM
 

We’ll find out this fall just how good Hunter Johnson really is. I look forward to following him as he seemed like a great kid.

2019 orange level member

Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:22 AM
 

Same here. I will be cheering for Northwestern and Mizzou this year.

2019 student level member

Snowflake Basher........Out


Screw Mizzou


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:28 AM
 

They are garbage. Their fans are also terrible. They had a few good seasons a couple years ago and think they are a powerhouse.


KB won't be surrounded by the talent level he had at Clemson***


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:33 AM
 



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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Re: Screw Mizzou


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:25 PM
 

I’m grateful to Mizzou. They’ve been in the SEC for only an minute and already have twice the number of SEC East titles as the coots.

Of course, Mizzou won those when they still had the Big 12 talent. Now their talent level is down to SEC level and it’s harder for them to compete.


Re: Screw Mizzou


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:36 PM
 

haha, B12 talent in the SEC least is funny... but what happened to A&M?


Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:32 AM
 

How good are Northwestern's OL and WR's?

2019 white level member

Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:35 AM
 

Heard somewhere that they return all but 1 WR that got significant playing time.

Not sure how good they are but at least they should be experienced.


Do you think Dabo also didn't want to scare TL off?


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:21 AM
 

If Hunter had started and excelled, do you think Trevor would have second guessed coming to Clemson?

I doubt it, but it's just food for thought. Trevor doesn't seem like the guy that is scared of anything. But maybe Dabo knew how darn good Trevor was going to be and didn't want to even come close to taking the risk of not landing him.

2019 student level member

Snowflake Basher........Out


That makes it seem as though Hunter Johnson wasted 2 years

[1]
Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:26 AM
 

of his life by committing to Clemson. Maybe KB was better than HJ, but KB's sugar bowl performance was the leading reason he lost the job to TL. The dominoes fell perfect for us fans

2019 student level member

Re: Do you think Dabo also didn't want to scare TL off?


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:27 AM
 

Dabo has said multiple times that Trevor never once asked about another QB during his recruitment or after his commitment.

I doubt Johnson was held to prevent scaring away Trevor if Dabo thought Johnson could have helped beat Bama in the Sugar Bowl.


Re: Do you think Dabo also didn't want to scare TL off?


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:35 PM
 

HJ couldn't learn the playbook. That is from a source on the scout team. He said the olinemen would have to tell him which direction the play was going. Just wasn't picking it up quickly. That's why HJ never came in at Syracuse when KB went down.


Dabo does play chess vs TNet just playing checkers, but


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:28 AM
 

I don't think even his crystal ball works that good. :)

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Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was

[2]
Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:25 AM
 

I think the biggest difference in how quickly Lawrence and Johnson were ready was level of play in high school. Johnson had a bigger learning curve to game speed and playbook.

In my opinion Johnson looked completely different during the spring game. He looked much better than Bryant at that point.

Bryant wasn't going to lose his job in practice and so he remained listed at #1 on the depth chart after the spring.

In reality Bryant was hoping to keep his lead on Brice at that point.

I am glad that Johnson left when he did, and I am glad that Bryant left when he did. Both decisions allowed Lawrence to develop fast enough to dominate the playoff.


Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:31 PM
 

^^This^^.

2019 purple level member

Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was

[1]
Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:27 AM
 

true but Hunter is now a 3rd year QB. I'd not be surprised if he is one of the best B1G QBs in 2019


From a pure talent standpoint...


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:28 AM
 

everyone had a pretty good idea what we were getting with Trevor Lawrence. At the end of the day, however, he was a true freshman with no game experience at the collegiate level. Did we really want to roll into College Station with an inexperienced true freshman at QB? While I think the expectation was that he would begin seeing more PT as the season progressed, I don't think anyone could have reasonably envisioned what we got once he took over the starting job. He is a unique and special talent.




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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:29 AM
 

I've heard it was so obvious during Spring Camp that TL was gonna be the guy that the coaches spoke with KB about a position change. Not in a pushy way but an idea that was floated just to see what kind of interest KB had. He wanted to be QB. We felt comfortable starting KB and knew we could win with either guy. But TL taking over was inevitable. And it was obvious that our coaches assumed it would be the Texas A&M game.

I think TL was hands down the guy during practice, but he had to prove it in a game before we would elevate him to starter.


Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:31 AM
 

Hard to really know how good Hunter will be. You have to keep in mind, Trevor played in a spread offense in high school at Cartersville, so his learning curve transitioning to our offense was much slimmer than Hunter's, who had to learn the spread offense and RPO's from scratch. If I remember right, his freshman year, several said Hunter was having some issues in that area in practices, which is why Cooper stayed above him most of the year though Hunter had been outperforming Cooper in the limited game play he had.

Trevor coming in and understanding it already (to a degree, minus the specific playbook) helped him in jumping Hunter, as well as closing the gap he'd have with Kelly. From there, it was about performance...which would only be shown in games. I think honestly, as I said back then, I think him and Kelly were even walking out of fall camp. I think Trevor had the skill and potential upside, Kelly had the experience and leadership...but as everyone saw, that'd change once Trevor got real experience in a college game...and it did, by end of game 4.


Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was

[1]
Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:34 AM
 

I think Dabo really struggled with it . Not because he couldn't see that Trevor Lawrence was the truth ... but because of his love for KB and all the battling he did to be the starter .
So from the emotional standpoint I think Dabo and Scelliott immensely hated to pull that trigger , but from a team standpoint I bet the decision had been made long before the GT game .

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DB23


Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 11:37 AM
 

I don't know that I have ever put it together, but I'm betting Lawrence first start being Syracuse was not accident.

They were the only team the previous season who showed the ability to come close. The coaches knew it was time to put it all out there to win that game.

It didn't turn out they way they expected, but it makes a lot of sense for that to be part of the thought process.


Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:37 PM
 

That and KB sulked through the second half of the Ga Tech game, just like he did at the Spring Game. He was hurting the run game as much as the passing game. No way he should have had more carries than the RBs in 2017.

2019 purple level member

Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was

[1]
Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:24 PM
 

I think we have to take into account as well that the team loved KB as well, and you risk dividing up the locker room if you make that change prior to seeing Lawrence play in a real game. Doing it the way they did it became obvious that Lawrence was the better guy by the time the GT game ended. If you move to Lawrence before the season then many on the team may have agreed that Bryant wasn't given a fair chance, and that especially gets difficult if Lawrence happened to struggle early on. Doing it this way also took a lot of pressure off of Lawrence in those first few games.


Hunter didn't have the poise TL has, he would get rattled***


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:13 PM
 




Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:27 PM
 

We really have no idea what the situation was with Johnson. Perhaps he struggled with adapting to the playbook? Keep in mind there's more involved than just learning the plays. The QB also has to be familiar with the blocking assignments for his line, and be adapted at reading defenses that are more complex than anything they see in high school.

I'm not saying any of that was the case for Johnson. I'm only saying that there could be more to it than simply how much talent he had. Keep in mind that he was also behind Cooper on the depth chart for a good portion of the season.


Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:28 PM
 

I hope Hunter Johnson wins the Big 10 at NW this season.

I question if he really was a threat to TL if he wasn’t used in the Syracuse loss instead of Zerrick Cooper. Remember, he didn’t beat out KB or Cooper on the depth chart.


This is why all conversations and decisions should have....


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:30 PM
 

...ended.

TL a true freshman was neck-in-neck with KB. BOOM, that's all you need to know. Because, if some dude straight out of high school was even with a senior, a smart person would quickly realize the senior has little to no upward potential for improvement whereas a freshman the sky was the limit.

Honestly, I never understood why there was even a debate or question about this other than DB felt bad that KB patiently sat behind DW and waited his turn, did everything asked of him, was a good student and person. I think DB bent over backwards to make the KB thing work out when in his head he knew TL was A LOT BETTER. Don't rule with your heart...rule with your head DB!

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Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:33 PM
 

TL is 50 points better than KB. Just ask Bama.


Re: Just curious, how close do you think the KBvsTL debate was

[1]
Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:35 PM
 


TL is 50 points better than KB. Just ask Bama.


Actually I take that back, the gap is wider than that. TL is better than Bama with Tua by 28 and KB is worse than Bama with Hurts by 22. So I’ll say 80 points is the gap between the two.


Not EVEN close - just trying to manage an ego***


Posted: Jan 16, 2019 12:38 PM
 



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