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110%er [7173]
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If The ACC Was Considered Top Notch
Nov 21, 2019, 2:51 PM
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If the ACC was considered top notch - how would it look to you?
***Disclaimer*** I am of the belief all the ACC is weak talk is purposeful and being used to push an agenda. Some of the more soft headed fall for it; many others are able to separate propaganda from facts.
^^^ How it would look to me is another team emerging as a team that "CAN SERIOUSLY CHALLENGE THE TOP OF OTHER CONFERENCES"!
*** That's it. I am not overly impressed with the Big 10 top to bottom. Same with every conference out there including the SEC. It seems the ACC has different rules and every team is required to be good or something. No other team in the Big 10 has seriously taken a stab at a title outside of Ohio State since Michigan in 1997-98 season. Yet, that is acceptable to so many.
If getting teams ranked is the question then - HOW? When the powers that be have pre-season rankings? So many get lost when you start talking impact of pre-season rankings. To them: start reading slowly! So, if a team is or group of teams from the same conference is ranked w/o having "Proven Nothing" yet. A team that loses to that team close doesn't get penalized as much. If it's the same conference; that team could actually "gain respect". If that team with the ranking handles it's "layup game all FBS teams schedule since there aren't scrimmages in FBS". Plus handle, a FBS opponent that may or may not be P5 before conference play assuming the P5 game wasn't a conference game - then they move up most likely. Having likely not really having to prove anything against any team most people would call "worthy"! There are only a handful of teams people consider worthy in the 1st place - a very short list of about 12 - 15 teams.
Unless the ACC starts doing like Duke and having early season games against Alabama and then pulling those games off - it(ACC) may never get to so called respectability! But, my point is, how come N. Carolina beating SEC S. Carolina isn't a notch in the cap? Had S. Carolina won it would have been deemed "proof" of SEC superiority. This is how you know there is more at work here than what's happening on the field.
When Louisville was beating Kentucky for back to back years. FSU run over Florida. GT even got one in over Georgia. The talk was how the SEC teams were beat up. Similar to Clemson having to hear this about dominating Alabama!
What's your take? Would just one other team being capable of beating teams in that group of 12 - 15 teams be enough?
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CU Guru [1437]
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Re: If The ACC Was Considered Top Notch
Nov 21, 2019, 3:21 PM
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At the minimum you need at least two teams that would be considered a national title contender to start November and at least four that could pose a real threat to win the conference throughout the year (favored by less than 20 points).
Big10 (elite) hio State and Penn State(NC) Wisconsin, Minnesota, and Michigan(Conference Champion)
SEC (elite): LSU, Alabama, Georgia (NC) Florida (Conference Champion)
Pac 12(Not Elite): Oregon, Utah (NC), Washington (Conference Champion)
Big 12 (Note Elite): Okla (NC), Baylor (Conference Champion)
ACC (Note Elite): Clemson (NC), None
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110%er [7173]
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Re: If The ACC Was Considered Top Notch
Nov 21, 2019, 4:56 PM
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At the minimum you need at least two teams that would be considered a national title contender to start November and at least four that could pose a real threat to win the conference throughout the year (favored by less than 20 points). Big10 (elite) ">">hio State and Penn State(NC) Wisconsin, Minnesota, and Michigan(Conference Champion) SEC (elite): LSU, Alabama, Georgia (NC) Florida (Conference Champion) Pac 12(Not Elite): Oregon, Utah (NC), Washington (Conference Champion) Big 12 (Note Elite): Okla (NC), Baylor (Conference Champion) ACC (Note Elite): Clemson (NC), None
Wilst I understand what you are saying: Big Ten does not have another elite program besides OSU. Penn State last won it in 1986. Last time they seriously challenged for it too. They do get teams ranked - but see original post.
Pac 12 - Meh. Oregon challenged for it. But, during the playoff era who else? USC won a BCS title and played for it; but has falling just like FSU.
SEC - original post. Top of that conference.
Big 12 - had Texas in 2005 win BCS. They hadn't won prior to that one since 1970; yet they have the reputation as a football school. Who else?
But, not beating up what you said! It's just more proof in fact! It's an unfair narrative especially when you consider where FSU was. And where Clemson is now! There was a brief moment when both were elite together.
So I get that argument - at the same time - I don't understand how other conference's teams get away with "not being serious contenders for decades" yet aren't called out as much.
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110%er [7173]
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Stop Comparing it to the SEC & it's every other conference
Nov 24, 2019, 7:19 PM
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Everyone wanting to compare the ACC to the SEC is the problem i.m.o. "It's not and will never be"! The down right reverence for the football teams isn't there enough generally speaking when it comes to ACC schools.
But, clearly there are good players in the conference. Quick google NFL players by conference.
Most people would be surprised where the ACC is on the list. But, do not take my word, take a look.
These things go in cycles and Miami hopefully will get an Urban Meyer type who loves South Beach and the great recruiting grounds there soon. Hopefully, FSU does not go back to what they were pre-Bowden. Hopefully, it's still that job that is highly coveted. I think it is and the recruiting almost takes care of itself.
Georgia Tech is going to be a problem - Geoff Collins will get it turned around sooner rather than later. GT may not get to spectacular; but I feel they will get to respectability under him. The Greater Atlanta area has an abundance of players and some good H.S. programs!
Louisville under Satterfield will be a problem going forward! He had them pretty tough already with someone else's players. Now imagine that staff(followed him from APP) with the type of players they need to run it! I can see them getting to where they are 8 to 10 wins and ranked!
How long will Mack Brown coach - who knows - but as long as he is there U of Non-Compliance will only get better! North Carolina as a state produces some really good talent; so if he wins the recruiting wars between the other 3 ACC schools and APP he will have something special.
Can Babers find a QB? He had the Basketball WR's; but Devito didn't have that moxy that Dungey did. If he finds that kid and it's likely as most people don't recruit that part of the country heavy except BC and a few outlier Big 10 teams, they will be back!
I think Wake, UVA and VT are all on up swings that will continue.
Is the conference there yet - no but I don't recall much at all coming out of the SEC when Miami was running things! Or FSU was always in the conversation. Yeah in 2013, but prior to that unless it was simultaneous to Saban's arrival in the SEC. In short, these things are cyclical and I can easily see it turning one day!
How many teams each season have a realistic chance? Pretty soon the landscape of college football will change anyway i.m.o. with the group of 5 having their own NC.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: If The ACC Was Considered Top Notch
Nov 24, 2019, 8:00 PM
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Well, when teams like BC and Syracuse get absolutely destroyed by weak Big 12 doormat Kansas and Big 10 doormat Maryland, it makes the rest of the ACC look like high school caliber teams on a good day. Nothing is going to change until that nonsense stops. CLEMSON has to win every freaking game it plays until the end of time if we plan to be in the CFP conversation each year.
One could argue that CLEMSON did not beat either of those schools like those doormat teams from other P5 conferences did. And then barely beating UNC just threw so much fuel on any already huge flame, and was fodder for the pundits of the world.
Bottom line: The other ACC teams need to man up if things are going to change.
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110%er [7173]
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Up until Recently @Orange
Nov 24, 2019, 9:05 PM
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Fairly recently Florida St, Louisville, and Clemson all beat their SEC rival. In fact, FSU had a bit of a run on Florida. Louisville had been beating Kentucky too fairly regularly. Georgia TEch even managed to beat the dawgs one year when the other 3 won in Athens.
But, no narrative about how good the ACC is!
In 2016 the ACC won the Bowl Challenge going 9-3.
I agree to a degree with what you are saying - embarrassing losses are bad. But, how come no one wants to talk about losing to Georgia State at home. San Jose St at home. Memphis at home. And I am missing a few.
It's not about how good or bad the ACC is - but more - how overblown the narrative of how bad it is! Every conference has embarrassing losses! But, last I checked the ACC can claim 3 of the last 6 and played in 4 of the last 6. At the end of the day, if everybody else wants "participation trophies" good for them. If the ACC is producing even just 1 team that's winning it all - why is it being beat up so much?
The answer: "to keep them out of it". It matters because - they tried their hardest to make it a strength of schedule thing! Yet nobody complains about:
FAU, Cincinatti, Miami(oh),Northwestern, Michigan St., Indiana, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Penn St., Maryland, Rutgers! Who in that mix is a juggernaut and has made a serious run at a championship? Penn State? It's been since 1986: try again. Wisconsin. Nope. The rest are just hot garbage right now except Cincinatte! I would argue they didn't play a great schedule - but they like SEC schools get the benefit of the doubt.
Call their weak games out in other words just as much as you call out ACC schools!
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