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Lot o points [155750]
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How many of you believe there once was absolutely nothing,
Mar 25, 2020, 7:05 PM
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just a big empty nothing, and then a ginormous exploooosion (from nothing...you have to assume nothing exploded) completely and totally ignored the laws of conservation of matter and energy and just farted the whole universe into existence in a matter of pure happenstance and chance with the end result that we're sitting here having meaningless debates today that will change no ones' minds?
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CU Medallion [73569]
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The big bang assumes a big something exploded
Mar 25, 2020, 7:12 PM
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My point always is, ok, so where did that big something come from?
Oh and, meh, it passes lame time at work.
Stupid battles vs working.
I'm with stupid -->
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Scout Team [170]
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Where did god come from?***
Mar 25, 2020, 7:35 PM
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CU Medallion [73569]
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idk? didnt say i had any answers either way.***
Mar 25, 2020, 8:21 PM
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: idk? didnt say i had any answers either way.***
Mar 25, 2020, 10:02 PM
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well that is honestly refreshing to hear
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All-Conference [404]
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Re: How many of you believe there once was absolutely nothing,
Mar 25, 2020, 7:20 PM
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Only a complete IDIOT would believe that! LMFAO!
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Oculus Spirit [81683]
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Nobody knows?
Mar 25, 2020, 7:24 PM
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The current scientific theory of the big bang is sound science, nobody knows beforehand or where the energy and matter came from, right?
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CU Medallion [50635]
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the trouble i've seen***
Mar 25, 2020, 7:25 PM
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Legend [18018]
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Lot o points [155750]
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I believe us to be buds. We could have an argument and
Mar 25, 2020, 7:48 PM
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Call each other dirty SOB’s and still have a beer an hour later, so with that in mind I hope you take this as intended.
I ain’t watching nodamn 15 minute video just because. Gimme some bullet points and if it seems catchy I’ll bookmark it and watch it later during one of the numerous moments in which I celebrate the final stages of the digestive process.
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Legend [18018]
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lol, here ya go...
Mar 25, 2020, 8:18 PM
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- It wasn't the first event in the "totality" of our reality (it was just an "interesting" one). Our Universe is but a part of a larger Universe is, I think, how he puts it.
- The sentence, "what came before the big bang" doesn't mean anything. His example is, consider the question "which way is north?" That question makes sense everywhere except if you're at the very top of the North Pole. The fact that time was created by the big bang makes the question "what came before the big bang" make no sense.
Both of those possibilities are what he says in the first 3 minutes. I should have specified you didn't have to watch all 15min to find the answer. But the whole thing is incredibly interesting (at least it is to me).
Make sure you wash your hands after "celebrating." 
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Oculus Spirit [93639]
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It's amazing that when I say there was no time before...
Mar 26, 2020, 8:55 AM
[ in reply to Here's Brian Greene on Joe Rogan's podcast talking about it ] |
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the creation to explain how I believe we relate to eternity the nonbelievers here ignore me but when it's put in context of a big bang it is interesting. The only difference is the between the terms, 'big bang,' and 'creation.'
Whether or not it made a bang doesn't change that man struggles with the concept of eternity which includes time but is not measure by it. When I broached the subject the room emptied like someone fired a shotgun.
Imo, the concept of time and eternity answers most the questions which puzzled me most about God and the Bible.
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Rock Defender [53]
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What can you say man?
Mar 25, 2020, 7:24 PM
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110%er [8981]
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Re: What can you say man?
Mar 25, 2020, 7:29 PM
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i am really really lucky that the thousands of electrical/chemical reactions happen on time every time in this bag of goo that i walk around in
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Rock Defender [53]
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Some things that man still after all these years
Mar 25, 2020, 7:32 PM
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: Some things that man still after all these years
Mar 25, 2020, 7:50 PM
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You’re right, the Bronze Age myths had it figured out though...
Come on dude, would you believe that nonsense if you were taught it as an adult?
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Some things that man still after all these years
Mar 25, 2020, 8:28 PM
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Scout Team [170]
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I can say we don’t know if the big bang started
Mar 25, 2020, 7:31 PM
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From nothin or not, we just have evidence about what happened afterwards.
We have no evidence of talking snakes however.
This isn’t that hard people. Follow the evidence, not the dunce at church asking for money
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: I can say we don’t know if the big bang started
Mar 25, 2020, 7:37 PM
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Scout Team [170]
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So are the miracles parables too?
Mar 25, 2020, 7:52 PM
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What about jesus himself? Real or parable?
I think you just don’t want to admit how mythical the book sounds
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: So are the miracles parables too?
Mar 25, 2020, 8:03 PM
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Scout Team [170]
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I mean, whomever wrote the New Testament was
Mar 25, 2020, 8:10 PM
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Familiar with the old. That’s hardly a confirmation of prophecy. Of course they would continue the myth.
Why an all powerful god would choose to “reveal” himself only by book is beyond me.
It would be trivial to give us evidence
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110%er [8981]
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Re: I mean, whomever wrote the New Testament was
Mar 25, 2020, 8:12 PM
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why do you care, did Jesus twist your #######?
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: I mean, whomever wrote the New Testament was
Mar 25, 2020, 10:04 PM
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Lol angry much?
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Rock Defender [53]
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: llort, thou dost protest too much
Mar 25, 2020, 10:28 PM
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Here’s where i get invited to the cult
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Lot o points [155750]
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I’m sorry T3, but I can’t allow
Mar 25, 2020, 8:10 PM
[ in reply to Re: So are the miracles parables too? ] |
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The word “ironic” to be abused like that. That’s no more ironic than a traffic jam when you’re already late.
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All-In [49159]
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Literally.***
Mar 25, 2020, 8:21 PM
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Oculus Spirit [81019]
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A no smoking sign, on your cigarette break?
Mar 25, 2020, 9:01 PM
[ in reply to I’m sorry T3, but I can’t allow ] |
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10,000 spoons when all you need is a knife?
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Legend [16240]
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I believe there was nothing
Mar 25, 2020, 8:48 PM
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and something, it banged, and we are its babies.
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Legend [15492]
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Re: How many of you believe there once was absolutely nothing,
Mar 25, 2020, 9:05 PM
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just a big empty nothing, and then a ginormous exploooosion (from nothing...you have to assume nothing exploded) completely and totally ignored the laws of conservation of matter and energy and just farted the whole universe into existence in a matter of pure happenstance and chance with the end result that we're sitting here having meaningless debates today that will change no ones' minds?
I've always seen the Big Bang as confirmation of God's creation. Something out of nothing is, in itself, supernatural.
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Lot o points [155750]
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agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 9:10 PM
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From a logical standpoint, I get someone rejecting modern religious doctrine. I don’t get someone thinking critically back as far as possible and completely ruling out a creator somewhere along the line. The alternative is that everything simply happened, and that’s far more illogical to me.
It’s like seeing a potato on the kitchen counter. Who doesn’t assume that at some point someone put it there?
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All-TigerNet [10134]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 9:48 PM
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From a logical standpoint, I get someone rejecting modern religious doctrine. I don’t get someone thinking critically back as far as possible and completely ruling out a creator somewhere along the line. The alternative is that everything simply happened, and that’s far more illogical to me.
It’s like seeing a potato on the kitchen counter. Who doesn’t assume that at some point someone put it there?
It is completely useless arguing with these guys. The fact is that science can not disprove the existence of an intelligent creator. Take Llort for example, he laughs at the fact of a talking snake, but he is completely okay with an entire universe, it’s inhabitants and even the most complex living organisms just poofed out of thin air one day like a magic trick. As far as the existence of Jesus goes, there are more than one culture and country documented his existence. Even the Roman Empire has his existence written.
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 10:11 PM
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I don’t think everything just “magically poofed into existence” we have a clear understanding of how the universe and humans evolve AFTER the big bang.
The key difference here is that my ideas are back by a rigorous data-driven scientific process whereas you seem happy to believe what men (who understandably thought there were gods) wrote down
I don’t know what caused the big bang or if anything was before that but I’m comfortable just saying i don't know in that situation.
Believe it or not, I'm not opposed to the idea of a creator there is simply no evidence for one is all.
Btw, i grew up conservative/christian so i see both sides of the logic
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All-TigerNet [10134]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 10:26 PM
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Big Bang =Poof!
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 10:31 PM
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We have evidence the big bang happened though, kind of the opposite of “poof” no?
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All-TigerNet [10134]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 10:29 PM
[ in reply to Re: agree completely ] |
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Where is the evidence that there is not ?
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 10:30 PM
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You can’t prove a negative guy.
Can you prove santa doesn’t exist?
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 10:06 PM
[ in reply to agree completely ] |
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Ok but by that logic i could simply ask where the creator came from.
If a creator can come from nothing (or always exist) then logically so could the universe.
In fact, doesn’t adding in a creator make it more complicated?
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All-TigerNet [10134]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 10:38 PM
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Not really. If you see a vehicle on the road it is easier to explain how It came to be there. Someone produced it. Wouldn’t it be harder to explain how the car got there simply appearing out of thin air?
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 10:43 PM
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That’s not the same argument though. We are asking about the very first thing. I.e. where did the human who made the car come from, who created him... etc...
Either god had a beginning or he didn’t; same logic is sound with a natural universe.
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All-TigerNet [10134]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 11:06 PM
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It’s the exact same argument. Throughout everyone’s existence, objects are known to exist. The only way we know they exist is because someone put it there. Every thing you see every day. Why would the universe existence be any different?
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 26, 2020, 7:37 AM
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So ill ask again then, where did god come from?
If you say “he always existed” the i can say “the universe always existed” using the exact same logic
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All-TigerNet [10134]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 25, 2020, 11:15 PM
[ in reply to Re: agree completely ] |
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Again, nothing you’ve said has convinced me that there is no creator and I’m sure likewise for you. You are asking a question absolutely NO ONE (including science) can answer. Do you think the people on here could get a deity to present himself to you just to prove he exist? Are you that special compared to everyone else who had asked the same question? Including Christians?
To believe you first have to know the definition of the word FAITH. And that’s why call it just that. If I’m right then I might be okay in his mind. If I’m wrong what am I losing from it?
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: agree completely
Mar 26, 2020, 7:47 AM
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I’m not really trying to convince you, I just enjoy these discussions. I know you can’t flip someones entire worldview with just a few arguments on an internet forum. It took me years of critical thinking about why I believe what i did. It was a very gradual change mot an instant one.
Faith literally means belief without evidence so that doesn’t surprise me at all that it’s required to be religious.
I’m not asking to be special, It’s just that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence and I've never seen a god reason to believe in anything supernatural.
It is odd to me that you would dismiss the work of scientists but for some reason believe the guy in the pulpit. Do you think he knows something you don’t? Of course not, he believes because it was passed down to him, not because of anything logical.
Also, what you just described is known as “Pascal’s Wager”. The problem is that you can apply this to any other religion too, why don’t you believe in Zeus just in case?
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All-In [42119]
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Re: How many of you believe there once was absolutely nothing,
Mar 25, 2020, 10:04 PM
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Well, the big computer simulation has to start somehow.
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Lot o points [155750]
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You jest well, but in all seriousness,
Mar 26, 2020, 12:20 AM
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Thinking we are in a sim seems to me a more logical position for someone to hold than that this all just “happened” via phenomenal chaos theory.
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Oculus Spirit [83064]
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Orange Blooded [3516]
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Re: How many of you believe there once was absolutely nothing,
Mar 26, 2020, 12:15 AM
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I honestly don’t think the human mind is truly capable of grasping the concept of ‘nothing’...so to speak.
To try and understand it ultimately takes both logic and faith. Said another way, the engineer in me certainly embraces the science explaining the Big Bang...but I also can’t exclude the possibility of an intelligent design/catalyst.
So...do I really believe there was once nothing? I can believe it...but I can’t imagine it.
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All-In [40925]
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The big bang was not an explosion
Mar 26, 2020, 1:21 AM
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it was an expansion of space-time. Its not at all like a star exploding or anything else that you can think of exploding.
One of the many weird things is that space-time seems to be accelerating.
Nothing can travel faster than the speed of light, but there is nothing in Einstein's theory that says that space-time itself can not expand faster than the speed of light. We have no way of ever knowing what is beyond the observable universe.
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CU Guru [1405]
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Re: The big bang was not an explosion
Mar 26, 2020, 7:10 AM
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Thank you. It's so tiring hearing the "How did something come from nothing" question. It didn't come from nothing, it was there in an infinitely small speck.
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Lot o points [155750]
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Ok....where did the speck come from?***
Mar 26, 2020, 8:32 AM
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All-In [34102]
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We don't have the technology to know.
Mar 26, 2020, 8:43 AM
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The evidence points towards a single location from which the universe emerged, but our information is limited by the speed of light, because information from too far away cannot get to us. There could be an entire other collection of stars, planets, etc. that emerged from another point, but it's so far away we can't see it.
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All-In [34102]
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We also can't see into the singularity...
Mar 26, 2020, 8:43 AM
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...which is the point from which the universe emerged. We can only get at some small amount of time after the big bang.
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Lot o points [155750]
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point being spoon, I get it that the origins of everything
Mar 26, 2020, 8:47 AM
[ in reply to We don't have the technology to know. ] |
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Could go back farther than our imaginations can fathom, but i think some people focus solely on the “how” and write off “why” as silly. You can extrapolate every theory you like, but there’s a beginning point somewhere, and something simply doesn’t come from nothing. It happened for a reason and it was created by something for a reason.
Not trying to be argumentative....I love thinking about things like this.
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All-In [34102]
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Your point was what?
Mar 26, 2020, 8:52 AM
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I just saw the part where you were asking where things came from.
I'm unclear on the distinction between the “how” and the “why” in terms of the origin of the universe.
You can extrapolate every theory you like, but there’s a beginning point somewhere, and something simply doesn’t come from nothing. It happened for a reason and it was created by something for a reason.
Maybe, maybe not. Maybe time doesn't have a beginning, especially if you're right that something can't come from nothing. A fundamental problem is that we don't know what anything is to begin with. This whole thing makes no sense, don't you agree?
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Lot o points [155750]
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What I’m saying is that the “purely scientific” origin
Mar 26, 2020, 9:02 AM
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Theorists ultimately have to go where you have and say that perhaps it’s something we can’t envision or comprehend at this point, at which point you are on equally solid ground saying that we are this science fair project of some supreme master race alien 7th grader.
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All-In [34102]
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Re: What I’m saying is that the “purely scientific” origin
Mar 26, 2020, 10:54 AM
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That's an odd view or maybe I'm just misunderstanding you. We know the answer is something we haven't discovered yet. Saying "I don't know" is sometimes (often) the right answer, and on more solid ground (because 100% accurate) than picking an answer based on what one hopes is true.
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Lot o points [155750]
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nossir, zero hope involved in this particular
Mar 26, 2020, 5:22 PM
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Exchange. I’m trying to discuss pure unfiltered logic.
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All-In [34102]
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Was referring to the science project theory.
Mar 26, 2020, 5:28 PM
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That theory is on shakier ground than "I don't know."
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Lot o points [155750]
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In fairness, “I don’t know” isn’t on any real ground
Mar 26, 2020, 10:41 PM
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At all.
I guess when you think about it, there’s two ways to look at it. Our current reality either is completely independent and the only existence there is, springing from nothing Into being wholly on its own, or our existence is a subset of a much greater existence, whether thats a creator Making the universe, us being some sort of sim, or the current universe being a microcosm of a much larger system that we aren’t even aware of, much less capable of understanding (and one that still has an origin story somewhere).
The bottom line for me is the latter seems logical, the former illogical to the point of impossibility. Either way, thanks for indulging the discussion.
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All-In [34102]
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Re: In fairness, “I don’t know” isn’t on any real ground
Mar 27, 2020, 9:22 AM
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I understand the logical strangeness of a universe that just "sprung from nothing." But I haven't suggested it did. Maybe it has always existed in some form or other, and the big bang was just a recent event following others of which we have no knowledge. Hence I return to my sold-ground answer: I don't know.
Your "larger system," by the way, is not the more logical answer. Problem is, it suffers from the same logical issue: namely, whether the larger system sprung from nothing or is part of an even larger system. We end up in a reductio ad absurdum, making your second category just as logically difficult as the first.
Hence, I don't know.
Thanks to you for the discussion as well.
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Oculus Spirit [81019]
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Lot o points [155750]
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It is sort of funny to think that some giant alien child
Mar 27, 2020, 10:14 AM
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picked us up at their version of toys r us. "Kids, collect the whole universe!"
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Oculus Spirit [81019]
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Its no funnier to think that than some invisible sky
Mar 27, 2020, 10:18 AM
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daddy creature one day just said "all this stuff will happen", and it just happened.
Maybe aliens from other galaxies were trying to populate a recently created star system. I have no idea. Its no more crazy than other suggestion, IMO.
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Hall of Famer [20538]
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Re: What I’m saying is that the “purely scientific” origin
Mar 26, 2020, 12:06 PM
[ in reply to What I’m saying is that the “purely scientific” origin ] |
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Yeah, but how do we know anything?
When the Big Bang banged, or God Created the Heavens and the Earth, of the Earth-Mother Gaia gave birth to the world, or whatever your particular belief is, the furthest I myself can get is: I wasn't there.
Empirically, I'm not really qualified to have an opinion. And unless they know something I don't, neither, as far as I can tell, is anyone else. How is anyone supposed to get any further than: "I dunno, man. Above my pay grade, here."
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All-In [40925]
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why does there have to be a reason
Mar 26, 2020, 7:09 PM
[ in reply to point being spoon, I get it that the origins of everything ] |
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math leads to the big bang and singularity, but no cosmologist will tell you that they know for sure and every single one is open to other theories, because they don't know. Time and Space are the same thing. The big bang may have been the start of time or may not have been.
The thing about Einsteins theories is that every time they are tested they pass. His theories point to singularity. Singularity makes about as much sense as quantum mechanics.
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Lot o points [155750]
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In scientific terms, cause and effect.***
Mar 26, 2020, 9:39 PM
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CU Guru [1405]
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Re: How many of you believe there once was absolutely nothing,
Mar 26, 2020, 7:11 AM
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The theory is not that it came nothing. The universe was there, the big bang is simply the point at which expansion truly began.
Search for singularity if you're interested in learning.
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Oculus Spirit [93639]
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Faith works that way.***
Mar 26, 2020, 7:12 AM
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Heisman Winner [111488]
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Re: How many of you believe there once was absolutely nothing,
Mar 26, 2020, 8:12 AM
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people with simple minds tend to believe simple stories. It helps them sleep at night and not worry about the things they will never have any understanding of.
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Lot o points [180960]
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Turtles all the way down.***
Mar 26, 2020, 10:20 AM
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All-In [35541]
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All-TigerNet [10134]
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Re: Kinda like the explosion that just happened recently in
Mar 26, 2020, 6:16 PM
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Whaaaaaaa? A scientist discovers stars and their behaviors? Who would have thought that?
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Orange Blooded [2692]
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That is par for the course in the quantum gamecock world
Mar 26, 2020, 7:09 PM
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The chicken and egg weirdness of quantum mechanics means that events can happen without a set order, For instance, in a Quantum Gamecock World, the chicken and the egg can actually exist simultaneously via indefinite causal order.
Take the example of Coach Spurrier and Coach Muschamp. In a Quantum Gamecock World, they can both lose games horribly, yet still declare victory through some causal SEC connection to the Alabama Crimson Tide.
All of these heartbreaking, horribly lost games can happen first,
Unfortunately, winning football in Columbia isn't something that we can really observe in our everyday life.
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Hall of Famer [24728]
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Somebody in the next universe over poked a hole in the
Mar 26, 2020, 7:50 PM
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balloon... Ba-Ba-Ba-Bang!!!
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All-In [46814]
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Science and religion both seek to answer questions
Mar 27, 2020, 10:25 AM
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If science can't find the answer then it says I don't know and keeps collecting information until it does know. Or understands there are some things we will never know but keeps discussing it.
Religion if it can't find the answer shrugs and says "god works in mysterious ways" and ends the discussion
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Lot o points [155750]
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If only.....
Mar 27, 2020, 3:16 PM
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Those who believe science can answer anything and everything, after saying "I don't know all the details but I have an idea", look at those who are religious and say "I don't know all the details but I have a belief" and say
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