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YOUR BALANCE
Depth chart for 2019
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Depth chart for 2019


Jun 17, 2019, 4:16 PM

I got bored. Came up with a projected depth chart and also listed the national ranking for each player. Just in case anyone was hungry for that information.

Defense:
Justin Foster (156)
KJ Henry (14)
Justin Mascoll (142)

Xavier Thomas (3)
Logan Rudolph (339)
Logan Cash (419)

Nyles Pinckney (327)
Tyler Davis (137)
Etinosa Reuben (474)
Darnell Jefferies (560)

Jordan Williams (167)
Xavier Kelly (100)
Ruke Orhorhoro (746)
Tayquon Johnson (447)

Isaiah Simmons (451)
Baylon Spector (609)
Keith Maguire (443)
Bryton Constantin (170)

Jamie Skalski (680)
Jake Venables (455)
Kane Patterson (330)
Greg Williams (550)

Chad Smith (230)
Mike Jones Jr (210)
Vonta Bentley (272)

AJ Terrell (55)
Mario Goodrich (114)
Andrew Booth (23)
LeAnthony Williams (203)

Derion Kendrick (26)
Kyler McMichael (56)
Sheridan Jones (130)

Tanner Muse (706)
Denzel Johnson (1318)
Joseph Charleston (149)
Ray Thornton (617)

K’Von Wallace (1504)
Nolan Turner (NR)
Lannden Zanders (782)
Jaylin Phillips (449)

Offense:
Trevor Lawrence (1)
Chase Brice (393)
Taisun Phommachanh (216)

Travis Etienne (213)
Lyn-J Dixon (258)
Chez Mellusi (241)
Michael Dukes (928)

Tee Higgins (19)
Diondre Overton (197)
Frank Ladson (39)

Justyn Ross (45)
Cornell Powell (159)
Joe Ngata (52)

Amari Rodgers (117)
TJ Chase (223)
Brannon Spector (523)

JC Chalk (525)
Jaelyn Lay (296)
Davis Allen (808)

Jackson Carman (17)
Blake Vinson (362)
Kaleb Boateng (942)

John Simpson (150)
Matt Bockhorst (240)
Mason Trotter (NR)

Sean Pollard (290)
Cade Stewart (2021)
Hunter Rayburn (486)

Gage Cervenka (893)
Chandler Reeves (809)
Will Putnam (101)

Tremayne Anchrum (486)
Jordan McFadden (819)

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Hard to believe our linebacker recruiting considering we


Jun 17, 2019, 4:22 PM

have the premier defensive coordinator in the land and he was a LB.

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Last 5 years - Total Defense


Jun 17, 2019, 4:40 PM

http://www.cfbstats.com/2014/leader/national/team/defense/split01/category10/sort01.html


Clemson

2014 1
2015 10
2016 8
2017 4
2018 5


When BV was introduced at Clemson he talked about showing "Johnny Five Star" the door, instead going with a guy that made the perfect football move once, because he could teach that person to do it consistently.

They're no good to him if they can't or refuse to play his scheme, if they don't like hard coaching or don't care for getting their ear bent - that's how he recruits and he doesn't consider some fancentric site's rating.

The afternoon BV jerked Stephone Anthony off the field, maybe the highest rated LB to ever sign with Clemson and replace SA with Spencer Shuey, I knew BV wasn't effing around and didn't give a rip about hurting some "Johnny Five Star's" feelings. Spencer proceeded to perfectly dissect the play and turned a tight, 38-31 game with his safety, into a 2 score lead.

Spencer was a lowish 3 star, ~700ish nationally, named a permanent captain on Clemson's 2013 team and bludgeoned OSU going out.




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Probably fair to say LB has been our weakest position on


Jun 17, 2019, 5:33 PM

defense during that time frame though. If you want to break the position groups up further i would probably say safety, but i think, overall, our DBs have been stronger than the LBs.

DT (DE seems to get more pub, but Wilkins, Lawrence, Watkins, Reader, Garrett, etc)
DE
CB
LB
Safety

Interestingly, we've had two really, really good players at the hybrid position.

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Even if I agree with your rank, it doesn't make LB "weak".


Jun 17, 2019, 6:00 PM

You don't throw up those defensive numbers with weak or limited or lesser linebacker play and/or some of the leaders that have risen above the rest in the linebacker ranks.

Personally I don't care about NFL draft, but no doubt it'll be difficult for any to match what Clemson's produced along the DL - that's fantastic stuff and should only continue to build. The forced rank is more a result of others being other worldly, not a knock on LB.

One thing that might always hold Clemson LBs back[under BV] as far as the NFL's concerned, BV seems to prefer smaller players at SAM[for some obvious] & WILL. Kendell Joseph was a fantastic college linebacker, player and leader - not going to win many hearts or walking off the bus blue ribbons, with his size though and it continues with the incoming class.

Simmons is terrific and I <3 DoD, he found a nice fit at KC, but even he's a tweener of sorts and situational.

BV's got his work cut out this year with short numbers, short XP, losing Smith seems a blow for now. Should be fun.



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Re: Even if I agree with your rank, it doesn't make LB "weak".


Jun 17, 2019, 6:53 PM

good points, I agree the nfl draft doesn't prove a thing about how good your team was. Plenty of crazy good college players who aren't nfl type players.

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I think Venables has done a very good job at taking LBs


Jun 17, 2019, 9:33 PM [ in reply to Even if I agree with your rank, it doesn't make LB "weak". ]

with obvious strengths, but also very obvious flaws, and gotten the most out of the strengths while also scheming to minimize the weaknesses. We haven't had many complete LBs.

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Yes, he took a 5'10", 220 lb kid that Steele didn't want


Jun 17, 2019, 10:01 PM

because of his size and turned him into the Jack Lambert Award Winner. Almost if not all the front-liners have been All-ACC performers, they've had few weaknesses in the college game, certainly not BV's defense, there's none more demanding - he's the best, and they've been stellar manning as much a cerebral position as is on the field.

All that talent along our DL with one Hendricks Award winner, that's just where the buzz has been because the NFL loomed, not happening for a bunch of 5'10ish", 225-230ish LB guys, but none better in BV's defense and really, that's all that matters.

The numbers prove it out, they're not hiding anything in the college game.




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Re: Yes, he took a 5'10", 220 lb kid that Steele didn't want


Jun 18, 2019, 8:01 AM

Well, some things like attitude are immeasurable...



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Absolutely.***


Jun 18, 2019, 8:21 AM



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I do think he did a good job letting Boulware attack the LOS


Jun 18, 2019, 8:24 AM [ in reply to Yes, he took a 5'10", 220 lb kid that Steele didn't want ]

and largely keeping him out of coverage and out of space.

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He made plays all over the field.***


Jun 18, 2019, 8:32 AM



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Re: Probably fair to say LB has been our weakest position on


Jun 17, 2019, 9:59 PM [ in reply to Probably fair to say LB has been our weakest position on ]

TigersAndCubs I agree with you! That being said, like you, I wouldn't trade any of the groups of LB or S we have had since BV has been here.

But, yeah, it's interesting regarding BV having been a LB himself. Going back to his days at Oklahoma; his DL play on his defenses have been outstanding. Same with CB. LB and S have been hit or miss! Again, I wouldn't trade any of them. Just being a LB you would think that would be his "baby"! Like Dabo's as he puts it, "natural coaching position" is WR's. Saban has the DB's as his favorite position to coach. Jimbo - QB's along with Spurrier!

Not complaining - I want him to keep it up; because it's working great! I just find it interesting!

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Re: Last 5 years - Total Defense


Jun 17, 2019, 6:00 PM [ in reply to Last 5 years - Total Defense ]

I agree with you DSP. One more point to illustrate your post ... Johnny (Shaq Smith) Five Star.

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I don't know, I'm still surprised about Smith, but I imagine


Jun 17, 2019, 6:03 PM

he watched a lot of his friends leave Clemson, which made it easier to head back home?

I do wish he'd stayed.

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Re: I don't know, I'm still surprised about Smith, but I imagine


Jun 18, 2019, 2:39 PM

Our LB play has always been a pretty weak spot in our defense, they're smart and control the whole defense but athletically we've always been a little behind the ball there. Example being that TE's tend to have a field day on our LB's typically because BV goes with a bigger and heavier LB at times that struggles in coverage against a more athletic TE. Simmons is a taller leaner (more modern) LB to today's game and he's flat out dominant and can break into coverage with ease guys like Boulware and Lamar had a very difficult time with this. LB has been our weak spot athletically but behind the scenes I believe they're our strong suit as you can watch this consistently as they control where the defense is lined up and where they move the traffic, I remember after the 2016 game an Alabama player stated that when they would line up Ben Boulware would yell out what play they're running and who was going where and they'd have to change the play and rush because he knew most of the plays that they're running. Venables is a mastermind and expects that kind of preparation from his players and he will take a mind over pure athleticism that only runs where it's told any day.

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I've never seen so many people contradict themselves...


Jun 18, 2019, 2:54 PM

in a way, they do EXACTLY what they are asked to do, you can't do it any better and BV sat our modern day Tarzan, Stephone Anthony, on his arse because he could not do what was expected of him, while a 3 star "nobody" could. The game is won between the ears and all that goes with it.

All the fantastic linebackers Clemson has had, only one Lambert winner? - a 5'10" 225lb wrecking ball.

It's not hard, until you over think it. BV is the best, let the rest fight over 2nd and because he does it his way, not some "modern" bull crap way.

I get what you guys are cooking, dont get me wrong, but it's pretty funny watching anyone trying to demean in anyway, what has been accomplished and because of, not in spite of, the linebacker play.

And really, the NFL draft has nothing to do with their college career, just because they don't meet the height requirement for the ride - amusement park style.

You do what BV wants or you don't play at Clemson, they've done it in spades.

Again, I hear you, and my goodness, I'll love the next 6'3, 245lb, 4.5 40 Stephone Anthony as much as the rest, and glad the young man didn't sulk, but went back to work. That's a BV linebacker, all over.

Go Tigers!

This conversation is just more of the same, Seth, nothing against you or Leon. Be well both of you.



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Re: I've never seen so many people contradict themselves...


Jun 18, 2019, 3:42 PM

Yeah but.... We don't have 4.5 245 lb linebackers and no you don't see it as I'm saying Venables chooses the right players as their mentality controls the field and makes our defense dominant but not their actual performance..

JD Davis 229lbs ran a 4.89
Judah Davis 242 lbs 4.95
Kendall Joseph 233 lbs 5.03
Tre Lamar 253 lbs 4.97
Boulware 238 lbs 4.85
D OD 223 lbs 4.61 Only one to get drafted I believe

Isaiah Simmons 230 4.3-4.4 speed projected 1st rounder great in coverage and can do just about anything, Stephone Anthony 240 with 4.53 speed and a dominant LB but outside of those two no we don't have athletic LBs just very smart line backers that take coaching well and mold into the definition of what we need to fit our defense.

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No, we have great football players; I was mimicking..


Jun 18, 2019, 4:07 PM

Stephone Anthony's measurables and if another comes along, with the acumen to play at BV's required level, then good lowered that's fantastic.

And no, it is their actual performance, that's just silly to say otherwise. They have football speed, football acumen, they dissect the play and are where they are supposed to be, the right read[hat up, hat down etc..], right fit, right leverage - that's performance and 40 track time be damned, does not remotely equal football speed.

You play quickly in BV's defense, because he's a fantastic coach, teaches you where and when to put your eyes and where and when to be as a result - that's performance.

Simmons has work to do and has been a work in progress, his measurables will likely get him a look, even drafted, perhaps high, if his slope continues upward and on it's current path. But that in no way takes away from Ben Boulware being the best linebacker in all of college football and he was, because of his performance.

It's really pretty simple, unless you chose otherwise by muddying the waters with NFL talk - they ain't at Clemson to play in the NFL, they're at Clemson to perform highly for BV and staff - after that, good lowered bless them with whatever life holds, I'm sure they'll win and perform highly at it as well.





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Re: No, we have great football players; I was mimicking..


Jun 19, 2019, 3:09 PM

I loved Ben Boulware for his heart and brains but by no means was he or was he close to being the best LB in CFB, and if it's his "actual performance" then he still wasn't even close to the best LB in CFB in his best year. BV puts the right players that we have in the right places and makes them play at an elite level which has on partial to do with how good the player is and mostly how good the coach is but you're failing to understand this and you say things like their measurables don't matter or track speed isn't football speed which is correct in technicalities but can you tell me our last LB that had good football speed but a slow 40? I'll wait because BB was torched all year by Tight Ends and RB's that made receptions but was wonderful at directing traffic and was the captain of the defense because of his brain and heart not his athleticism and that's obvious.

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I'm sorry, The Jack Lambert Trophy says different.


Jun 19, 2019, 3:50 PM

Please, feel free to take it up with the Foundation.

And earnestly, it's times like this I question if Clemson is really a football school.

Good luck, have a nice day.

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Re: Hard to believe our linebacker recruiting considering we


Jun 17, 2019, 9:24 PM [ in reply to Hard to believe our linebacker recruiting considering we ]

2012: TJ Burrell (transferred)
2013: O’Daniel and Boulware (undrafted)
2014: Korie Rogers (retired), Joseph (undrafted), Williams (undrafted)
2015: Chad Smith, JD and Judah Davis
2016: Lamar (undrafted), Smith, Simmons, and Skalski
2017: Baylon Spector
2018: Mike Jones Jr and Jake Venables
2019: Contantin, Bentley, Patterson, Maguire, and Williams

It’s pretty crazy that our defense has been so good, despite not ever having an elite LB core. I do believe LB recruiting has gotten better though. 2016 was a good class. Lamar doesn’t really translate to today’s NFL. Smith was a bust. Simmons and Skalski have developed nicely. The jury is still out on 2018. I think 2019 and 2020 are really good. So he’s definitely been able to recruit better since we’ve been on this historic run. That’s why Dabo is right when he says “the best is yet to come.”

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No it's not, they're not at Clemson to be NFL players...


Jun 17, 2019, 9:50 PM

they're at Clemson to make Clemson better and they have - a lot better.

The NFL draft doesn't mean a damn thing to their Clemson performance - Boulware won the Jack Lambert Award, Travis Blanks a Freshman All-American before injury took him, Stephone Anthony was a mess between the ears, could have quit, but BV turned SA, Goodson, DoD, Joseph into All-ACC performers, some Academic as well.

It's about the team, not individuals, but great football players that love the game, great football minds, able to put their eyes in the right place, make fast, decisive reads and play accordingly. BV continues to churn out top 10 performances - it's not luck, it's by design and the players he's recruited have fit HIS bill, the only one that matters.

And for the FYIs, Steward, Goodson & Anthony were drafted.

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Re: No it's not, they're not at Clemson to be NFL players...


Jun 17, 2019, 11:53 PM

BV didn’t recruit Steward, Goodson, or Anthony. Which is why I didn’t include them. And again, BV has not had an elite LB core yet, even though we have had an elite defense. LB recruiting has improved in recent years. 2019 and 2020 are really impressive LB classes.

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I know why you didn't include them, but don't agree


Jun 18, 2019, 6:56 AM

with their omission. They, Shuey and others were BV's linebackers for the first 3 & 4 years of his tenure. BJ redshirted, Tony injured and SA a mess, benched in game 6, 2012. Their college careers are BV's responsibility[75 & 80% of their time] and BV's defenses' ascension are theirs. It would be akin to not giving theChad Morris credit for Tajh breaking all those records, records he still owns.

And really, any premise that doesn't include the best LB in all of college football, the Jack Lambert Award winner, as elite has issues.

You do not have elite defenses without elite linebacker play, so maybe your definition needs fine tuning[?], because the NFL has nothing to do with their college career - really, nothing, nor does their position in some jerk-off fansite coming out of HS. Kendell Joseph was nothing short of stellar, 3 year starter, 2 National Championships and called the best linebacker at Clemson during Dabo's tenure, but unfortunately for Kendall, he's a little short in the breeches, same for Boulware.

It's a nice list you put together in the OP, it's appreciated, but Clemson's linebacker play has been fantastic, we ain't Clemson without it and BV ain't BV, the best in the business.




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Re: I know why you didn't include them, but don't agree


Jun 18, 2019, 9:45 AM

I use the word “elite” in context of the players’ future in the NFL. Clemson has elite WRs. Clemson has elite defensive lines. Clemson has elite QBs. Our LB core has never been as “elite” as those positions. Let’s use our WRs as an analogy. Imagine the LB equivalent to Ross, Tee, and Amari. Two first rounders and another player that goes high in the draft. We haven’t had a LB core that “elite” since I’ve been alive. I’m not saying that we’ve had bad LBs. I’m saying that we haven’t had multiple high draft picks at the position playing together.

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I understood and again, BV don't give a crap...


Jun 18, 2019, 9:56 AM

it's a flawed premise as to how they performed in college[or where some fansite rated them in HS]. NFL has their own concerns, not remotely BV's. Plenty of drafted LBs in 2016-17, none of them the Lambert Award winner.

There was a great interview with Coach Dan during Dabo's golf outing, he was chatting up his boys, when he talked about Josh Watson getting bad advice, ballooning to 320ish coming into his RSJr year. First, he hurt himself which was attributed to his added weight, 2nd he was told by Clemson's staff they wanted him at 295ish playing weight, because they preferred movement over mass. Coach Dan went on to say that if the NFL wanted Josh at 320, good for them, Clemson did not - end of story.

Same goes for LB and anyone else[see the ridiculous STS HERPDERP article], it's all about their play in Clemson's scheme and they've been stellar, no question about it.



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Re: I understood and again, BV don't give a crap...


Jun 18, 2019, 1:02 PM

Yes, it’s all about scheme. It’s just surprising that we haven’t had more NFL draft picks at the position. I think that is changing because our recruiting is getting better. It’s like Dabo said “the best is yet to come.”

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2016 & 2018 National Champions, it doesn't get any better...


Jun 18, 2019, 1:18 PM

save more of the same; fantastic college play, linebackers included.

Simply stellar.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlMJZP58EJ4




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Re: 2016 & 2018 National Champions, it doesn't get any better...


Jun 18, 2019, 1:54 PM

I’ve said that we’ve had good LBs. Shuey was good, just not elite. Nuk, Sammy, Mike, Tee, and Ross are elite WRs. We haven’t had as many elite players at LB like we’ve had at WR. Just look at our Dline. All 4 of them got drafted, 3 in the 1st round. That was an elite group. We haven’t had a group like that at LB, yet.

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And their college play was stellar, not remotely affected


Jun 18, 2019, 2:04 PM

by the NFL, it has nothing to do with their fantastic play at Clemson - nothing.

Not one tackle, not one catch, not one throw ever credited to the NFL - elite defense, elite play from the linebackers, simply stellar.

More to come and if an SA comes along, has what it takes between the ears for BV, the NFL decides he measures up, that's terrific.




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Re: And their college play was stellar, not remotely affected


Jun 18, 2019, 3:00 PM

I’ll take the LB equivalent of Justyn Ross over Spencer Shuey.

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I'll take winners in life & on the field, Ross is included..


Jun 18, 2019, 3:02 PM

Shuey, Kendall, Ben et al are Clemson men, students & players, they made the grade the only place it matters, with our staff.

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Re: I'll take winners in life & on the field, Ross is included..


Jun 18, 2019, 4:47 PM

No doubt. I’d still take a 1st round talent over them. Or players like Simmons and O’Daniel.

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Good & it still has nothing to do with BV's elite defenses..


Jun 18, 2019, 4:56 PM

elite play by our linebackers, including Ben Boulware et al. nor any fansite placement coming out of HS.

Their performances have been stellar on the college football field they were recruited to play.

Have a good night Leon.




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Re: Good & it still has nothing to do with BV's elite defenses..


Jun 19, 2019, 11:09 AM

I hate these "Its the size of the fight in the dog" arguments. Clemson's one of the best teams because of our better athletes not because of the lb's who have heart. Trevor Lawrence is a great Qb because he's one of the most gifted athletes to ever play the position. Idc what you say ill take trevor Lawrence's athleticism at the position than ben Batson with whatever heart youre talking about any day. Same with LB yes we win with the guys we have but There isn't a football position where being a more gifted Athlete doesn't help. So please stop saying having Linebackers 6'3 running 4.5 wouldn't be any more helpful than linebackers 5'10 running 5.2's. I love those players but athleticism matters in the game of sports okay.

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And I "hate" those that don't give full credit that's due...


Jun 19, 2019, 11:51 AM

clearly miss what they think I'm writing about, inference incorrectly or try to diminish the accomplishments of great football players, because that's what our staff recruits - those that can help this team win at the highest level, not how they project in the NFL, but how they help them win college football games - that's our staff's job on the field. There's a reason Dabo's said, numerous times, he doesn't believe they'll ever win a National Recruiting Title, because they don't parlay Rivals. They parlay the best people that are great football players that help Clemson, not those individuals potential in the NFL.

Stephone Anthony could sit down, smoke a cigarette while having a cup of coffee after banging your mother and still beat Spencer Shuey by 10 yards in the 40. The problem for Tarzan, he could not beat Spencer from point A to B, after diagnosing a play through the wash from the middle linebacker spot, because he wasn't a better college football player than Spencer - so his arse found pine because of it. He was not only lost is space, he lost his starting gig as a result.

When you understand what's in front of you, the game slows down and you play faster - that's football, especially true in the college game we're discussing.


https://www.postandcourier.com/sports/a-year-after-trading-time-at-middle-linebacker-shuey-and/article_0a5fd3ee-5dad-5ddd-bc9a-ea0d39c2ebed.html


The sidelines & graveyards are full of those with potential, Dabo/BV parrot the first constantly and until those with other worldly potential realize ALL that it takes, that's where you'll find them, just like SA. Shaq Smith another, Tarzan in his breeches, Boy in his heads as far as the game's concerned.

So why don't you take it up with the man that sat SA on the bench, not me, and I'll continue to recognize great football players and appreciate all they've done for Clemson, including the best linebacker in all of college football, 2016, Ben Boulware.

Kendall, Spencer et al included as their lack of NFL status does not remotely diminish how great they were at Clemson.



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Re: And I "hate" those that don't give full credit that's due...


Jun 19, 2019, 2:30 PM

I'll take 3 LBs with Isaiah Simmons' and Dorian O'Daniel's ability every single day. I'm sure Jalen Williams had a ton of heart, and I'm sure we could have still won a national title with him at LB. But, I'm awfully glad that we had Isaiah Simmons starting instead. Why? Because he's more talented. And he's a far more gifted athlete.

Perfect example. In the 2014 class, Clemson really wanted Raekwon McMillan. We ended up with Kendall Joseph, who was a really good player for us. But, let's be honest... Who was the better LB? And who would you have rather had? The coaches really wanted McMillan, but he committed to Ohio State. He ended up being a 2nd round draft pick. We missed on that guy, and I wish we didn't. He would have started at Clemson, over Joseph btw. I want more Raekwon McMillan's. And there's nothing wrong with saying that.

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Good for you, & I wished you a good night, now a good day.


Jun 19, 2019, 3:37 PM

You can not remotely prove your example, not remotely. I like Raekwon, he was a really good college player, great young man[see Jeff Scott], wish he'd been a Tiger and would likely have logged a lot of snaps at Clemson should he have gotten BV's defense, but while you deal in conjecture, I CAN PROVE BV sat down our 1st Round Tarzan for Shuey, and not some silly 2nd Rounder. Kendall was nothing short of fantastic, just not 6'2+, 250ish.

You-this are boring, monochromatically redundant, erringly so, not particularly sharp, sorry, as now you've gone down the path of fantasy role play, which is fine if that's how you get your kicks - I'm not here to judge.

BTW, this is the nobody that beat out Clemson's 1st Round Tarzan: Plyler on Shuey: "This is another throwback kind of player. Shuey is a tough, run-stopping middle linebacker. I had no idea who he was until the Shrine Bowl and it did not take long to recognize this defender. If you wanted to find Shuey in the Shrine Bowl all you had to do was watch the guys getting up from the pile. He was terrific in stopping the run between the tackles. Shuey has a nice frame and may grow into a defensive end but his toughness would help at MIKE."


Good luck, I mean that, go take this up with brrntaylor & BV as well, BV'll likely laugh at you, Go Tigers! and now, goodbye.




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Re: Good for you, & I wished you a good night, now a good day.


Jun 19, 2019, 5:06 PM

BV wanted Raekwon for a reason. It wasn't to sit the bench. You keep bringing up Stephone Anthony, a player that BV didn't even recruit, to prove your point. I will leave it at that, unless you need me to elaborate further.

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He wanted Korie Rodgers & Kendall Joseph too, both committed


Jun 19, 2019, 5:49 PM

long, at least 6 months[haha] before Raekwon and they damn sure weren't recruited to sit the bench. So NO, BV/Clemson did not "end up" with KJ, just more off target from you - it's a really bad habit.

As for SA, BV didn't recruit Spencer Shuey either[Dabo recruits ALL OF THEM], he simply plays the best, always has, that's the point-regardless of HS stars, hopefully that never changes and he'll continue to recruit the best that fit Clemson & his defense - regardless of HS stars, because they don't give a crap what Rivals thinks[or the NFL], no matter how loud you scream, stomp your feet, roll around on the floor, they give a crap what they see with their own eyes, how these young players fit into Clemson and the program while winning at the highest level. And you know what, they're the best at it.

And really, it's a good thing Spencer fit Dabo's Clemson culture, he was far too nice to tell 5 STAR, Tarzan to hold his beer, while Spencer took his job.

And really, give your self a break, you can't clearly elaborate your own way, you're not nearly bright enough to attempt to elaborate mine.

Now...I said good day Sir!

Oh, and PS: @cutigerbob® probably has the warming oils if you want to run some of your fantasy, dream a little dream with him? I'm not here to judge.



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Re: No it's not, they're not at Clemson to be NFL players...


Jun 18, 2019, 7:51 AM [ in reply to No it's not, they're not at Clemson to be NFL players... ]

They are at Clemson dreaming of the NFL one day.

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They dream about it? Of course they do as do players &


Jun 18, 2019, 8:19 AM

others that never see a college sideline. I'd be worried about them if they didn't and if they make it, good lowered bless their little cotton socks, I'll be happy for them as will Clemson, staff, nation et al - I'm sure.

But if they don't, that doesn't take away in the least from their stellar play at Clemson, that's why they're recruited. CFB is littered with broken hearts and dreams, ~1% of HS players will ever see an NFL practice field save as a fan? It's a HUGH leap as is HS to college, D1 at the highest pinnacle.

CFB is littered with fantastic players that never know the NFL, thousands eligible, 254 drafted spots? It just doesn't diminish their college career, not remotely.

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Re: They dream about it? Of course they do as do players &


Jun 18, 2019, 9:25 AM

True. They have such a great opportunity no matter what happens. Didn't Richard Yeargin leave with his masters?

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I think you're right and so many others with their degrees.


Jun 18, 2019, 9:33 AM

Not a bad time in Clemson football, community & life, not a bad time at all.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 17, 2019, 4:27 PM

Excellent work. If I wanted to see the ranking for players who've already moved on, where can I find that?

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 17, 2019, 4:29 PM

52 of 'em are in the top 500, which is really excellent. One out of every ten in the top 500 come to Clemson.

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not exactly, that's the top 500 from 5 different classes


Jun 17, 2019, 4:34 PM

One out of 50.

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The Dude abides


Re: not exactly, that's the top 500 from 5 different classes


Jun 17, 2019, 4:53 PM

Darn. Knew it was too good to be true.

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What happens while Rodgers is out? Kendrick to the slot?


Jun 17, 2019, 4:31 PM

Ladson and Ngata are not going to sit on 3rd team for long. Alot of talent at CB, can they play at that level?

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The Dude abides


Re: What happens while Rodgers is out? Kendrick to the slot?


Jun 17, 2019, 5:08 PM

Overton was getting work there in the spring

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DK didn't play slot, he was at 2 & it seems he's BV's now?


Jun 17, 2019, 5:11 PM [ in reply to What happens while Rodgers is out? Kendrick to the slot? ]

Dabo went as far as to say at Spring's end, if they were kicking it off that day, Kendrick would be starting CB, opposite AJ.

Clemson's site has him listed, CB/WR. Seems they were cross-training Overton at the 5 last I read, but a lot of time before GT.


https://clemsontigers.com/sports/football/roster/

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Re: What happens while Rodgers is out? Kendrick to the slot?


Jun 17, 2019, 9:31 PM [ in reply to What happens while Rodgers is out? Kendrick to the slot? ]

I’ve always maintained that Amari will be ready quicker than people believe. He has incredible work ethic. Chad Kelly tore his ACL in the spring game, but was ready by the opener. That injury just doesn’t take as long to rehab like it used to. And given Amari’s work ethic, I think we’ll see him back either for the opener, or at least in September.

I think when Amari gets back, Overton moves back outside permanently. This is his last year. If he wants any chance of playing in the NFL, he can’t get beat out by a true freshman, no matter how talented they are. I think Ngata’s path to playing time will be easier given his position. Ladson will play a ton, I just don’t know if he ever takes the #2 spot from Overton.

Sheridan and Booth could both be in the two deep by the end of the season. Sheridan looked really good in the spring game. He also graduated high school a year early. He probably would be a 5 star CB prospect if he had stayed in the 2020 class. Sheridan and Booth are definitely the best duo that Mike Reed has signed. Future is bright at that position for sure.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 17, 2019, 4:32 PM

is there a way to adjust their national ranking to show what it would have been if they had committed to an SEC school?

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"Anybody that says Coach Brownell is the best coach to come through Clemson is going to start an argument." -JP Hall


Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year***


Jun 17, 2019, 4:34 PM

.

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Don't put too much stock in a 5th year senior's high school


Jun 17, 2019, 4:36 PM

ranking.

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The Dude abides


Re: Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year***


Jun 17, 2019, 4:55 PM [ in reply to Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year*** ]

yep woe is us

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LB looks shaky, but we will be better at safety than LY***


Jun 17, 2019, 5:36 PM [ in reply to Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year*** ]



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Re: Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year***


Jun 17, 2019, 9:38 PM [ in reply to Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year*** ]

This could be the worst LB core Venables has had so far. There just isn’t a lot of experience. Simmons has 1st round potential. I think Skalski will have a really good year. I’m not sure about Chad Smith though. I wouldn’t be surprised if Mike Jones Jr is the starter by the end of the season. The depth is definitely worrisome.

I think we will be completely fine at S though. We get all 4 from the two deep last year back. And all 4 of them have a lot of experience now. Tanner is a 3 year starter. K’Von has been pretty consistent his whole career, although not spectacular. It is imperative that some of those freshmen get playing time. Joseph Charleston has to play a lot this year. Losing 3 seniors in the two deep is tough to replace. We need at least two of the freshmen safeties to see significant playing time.

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Re: Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year***


Jun 18, 2019, 7:00 AM

"Tanner is a 3 year starter. "
- Maybe I'm wrong on this, but does anyone else notice that Tanner usually does not prevent someone from making the catch, only to tackle them immediately? Sometimes I wonder if he allows them to make the catch on purpose just so he can punish them with the immediate tackle. Tanner is one of my favorite guys to watch when it comes to making textbook tackles. But I seldom ever see him prevent the receiver from making the catch, other than a couple of INT's. Maybe I'm totally wrong, but that's just what I see when I re-watch the games.

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Re: Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year***


Jun 18, 2019, 9:47 AM

He had a decent pass breakup against N.C. State. His weak point is obviously in coverage, but I think he made strides in that area from him sophomore season to his junior season. He just can’t get matched up 1 on 1 with WRs like Jerry Jeudy.

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Re: Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year***


Jun 18, 2019, 2:45 PM [ in reply to Re: Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year*** ]

I do believe that Nolan Tanner and K'Von have both outplayed those old rankings and contributed. I remember so well the moaning and groaning when Nolan was given a scholarship.

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We have the same 2 deep depth chart at safety as last year.


Jun 17, 2019, 9:49 PM [ in reply to Looks like we will be pretty weak at LB and S this year*** ]

Care to explain yourself further?

We have 4 incoming safeties with the last signing class!

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null


High school stars. Not enough stars to compete with sec


Jun 18, 2019, 6:47 AM

schools

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 17, 2019, 9:35 PM

It’s interesting that out of that whole depth chart we have 13 players that were ranked in the top 100. So far in the 2020 class we have 10 of the top 100 committed and we are in on three or four more. That puts the quality of this class in perspective.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 17, 2019, 9:43 PM

Clemson has done a really good job of developing players. We have missed on so many recruits, especially early in Dabo’s era. But that isn’t the case anymore. Recruiting is really starting to take off. The 2017 class was small, but had elite players. The 2018 class was insane. The 2019 class was deep, with some elite talent matched with developmental guys. The 2020 class will be the best Dabo has had so far. It’s crazy to see what we have done with worse recruiting rankings. I can’t wait to see what we do with the classes we are signing now.

“The best is yet to come.” - Dabo Swinney

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 17, 2019, 10:11 PM

Vonta Bentley - if he adjust to college life and speed of the game and gets in the playbook will see major minutes. He has that "it" to him.
I love our DE group! They recruited speed and kids who "want it"! You have to have that on the edge.
DT - not worried about this group! The young guys will have to grow up quick; but under Coach BV tutelage I have full confidence they will get there. And, most of them have been on campus since January(a huge plus especially b/c we will be relying on them early).
CB is probably the 2nd deepest position on the entire team in terms of quality depth. You have guys listed in the 3 deep who could start for most other FBS schools in the CB group! WR group being the deepest i.m.o.

LB - besides Bentley I am excited to see what Mike Jones Jr. can bring. Skalski will be that break out star I think this season.
Safety honestly isn't as big a concern with Muse and Wallace back! We just need to develop the guys behind them!

I look forward to another top 10 defense.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 18, 2019, 12:04 AM

Bentley is really stiff and needs to work on his hips and coverage ability. He has good closing speed and is a violent hitter. He’s very physical. He will be a good one at Clemson. He has a lot to work on if he wants to play in the NFL though.

Bryton Constantin has the highest ceiling out of the 2019 LB haul, in my opinion. He’s really athletic. Good speed. Good in coverage. Good tackler, though not as violent as Bentley. I think he will develop into a really good Sam. Dorian O’Daniel type potential.

Kane Patterson is really impressive in my opinion. I think he has a chance to develop into a really good LB. He will struggle to get off of blocks at first, so a redshirt sounds like a great idea. But I love his potential.

Maguire has a great football IQ. Really instinctive player. Really great ball skills. His 40 is a little worrisome. He only ran a 4.91, which isn’t great.

Williams probably gets moved to DE at some point in his career. And sooner rather than later.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 18, 2019, 1:07 PM

@leontrotsky what is your assessment of Mike Jones Jr.? Fits coach V smaller size LB at the least.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 18, 2019, 3:03 PM

I think Jones Jr is the prototypical LB against today’s offenses. He can play well in space, he’s fast, and he will be good in pass coverage. I think he has a chance to be really good. Bryton Constantin has a chance to be special as well. Him and Jones Jr are exactly what you want in a LB today.

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1/2 point for your analysis and 1/2 point for


Jun 18, 2019, 8:17 AM

spelling "bored" correctly ;)

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Re: 1/2 point for your analysis and 1/2 point for


Jun 18, 2019, 9:48 AM

Thank you, comrade

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nice job!***


Jun 18, 2019, 10:54 AM



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I don't see Overton staying ahead of Ladson, and for sure


Jun 18, 2019, 4:12 PM

Ngata will pass Powell. Or my name ain't Mel Kiper.

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Re: I don't see Overton staying ahead of Ladson, and for sure


Jun 18, 2019, 4:52 PM

I could see that happening. This is Overton’s last year, so he has something to prove. We’ve all been waiting for Cornell to become a factor. I’m banking on both of them staying in the two deep because of their experience. Ngata and Ladson will play a lot though, and I wouldn’t be surprised if they get in the two deep. O would be a little disappointed in Overton and Powell though.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 18, 2019, 4:44 PM

For S&Gs, I did a projected depth chart for 2020 as well. Could be the most talented team in Dabo’s era. Obviously we don’t know who leaves early or will transfer. So I just made an educated guess.

KJ Henry (14)
Justin Mascoll (142)
Bryan Bresee (2)

Xavier Thomas (3)
Logan Rudolph (339)
Myles Murphy (7)

Nyles Pinckney (327)
Tyler Davis (137)
Tre Williams (62)

Jordan Williams (167)
Demonte Capehart (26)
Tayquon Johnson (447)

Bryton Constantin (170)
Baylon Spector (609)
Keith Maguire (443)

Jake Venables (455)
Kane Patterson (330)
Sergio Allen (156)

Mike Jones Jr (210)
Vonta Bentley (272)
Kevin Swint (229)

Andrew Booth (23)
Mario Goodrich (114)
Fred Davis (30)

Derion Kendrick (26)
Sheridan Jones (130)
Kyler McMichael (56)

Joseph Charleston (149)
Ray Thornton (617)
Tyler Venables (NR)

Nolan Turner (NR)
RJ Mickens (49)
Lannden Zanders (782)

Trevor Lawrence (1)
DJ Uiagalelei (13)
Taisun Phommachanh (216)

Lyn-J Dixon (258)
Demarckus Brown (17)
Chez Mellusi (241)

Justyn Ross (45)
Frank Ladson (39)
EJ Williams (105)

Joe Ngata (52)
Xzavier Henderson (98)
Will Swinney (NR)

Cornell Powell (159)
TJ Chase (223)
Brannon Spector (523)

Braden Galloway (858)
Jaelyn Lay (296)
JC Chalk (525)

Jackson Carman (17)
Blake Vinson (362)
Walker Parks (88)

Matt Bockhorst (240)
Paul Tchio (119)
Mason Trotter (NR)

Cade Stewart (2021)
Hunter Rayburn (486)
Bryn Tucker (202)

Will Putnam (101)
Mitchell Mayes (92)

Jordan McFadden (819)
John Williams (367)
Kaleb Boateng (942)

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 19, 2019, 12:08 PM

Bowmen will not be second string in 2020 and Lyn J will not be starting. Dukes or Mes will be starting.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 19, 2019, 12:37 PM

Wow! I have seen some posters "suggest Lynn J could push Travis" for the starting job on tnet. And, you are saying, he will be playing behind our two new comers!
I hope you are right, because it would mean the coaches have found more diamonds in plain sight!

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 19, 2019, 2:14 PM

Lyn-J is starting in 2020. There really isn't much to say other than that.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 19, 2019, 2:47 PM

I don’t believe so. It’s his position to lose nothing is given . Everyone has to come in and compete. Stars don’t mean jack when you get to college. Seen 5 stars turn into dim head lights. Then I seen no stars turn into bright head lights.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 19, 2019, 5:10 PM

Are you implying that Lyn-J doesn't want to compete? Saying "star don't mean jack when you get to college" is irrelevant. In fact, Chez was the 241st ranked player while Lyn-J was the 258th. They were pretty evenly rated coming out of high school, both were 4 stars as well. Lyn-J showed what he is capable of last year. He was 2nd on the team in rushing yards, but 4th in attempts. He's only going to get better, but his explosiveness is something that can't be taught. He's going to shine next year. And he will be the starting RB in 2020, barring injury.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 19, 2019, 5:29 PM

Lyn J got most of his carries in garbage time he has the chance to prove himself worthy of being the starter next year. Now with that being said don’t be surprised if an in coming freshmen sees more carries and playing time than Lyn J this year.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 19, 2019, 8:23 PM

They won’t. Lyn-J is going to be the clear #2. Chez and Dukes aren’t even on campus yet. I’m sure both of them will play, and one of them will likely redshirt with the 4 game rule. Lyn-J is special. He’s not quite as explosive as Etienne, but he has better moves in the open field.

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 19, 2019, 12:55 PM

I would like to mirror the comments regarding: "the unknown commodities"! I remember everyone wondering how would an Austin Bryant and Clelin Ferrell replace the guys they replaced? Pretty darn well, I would say. The only folks who are asking now must not be big on keeping up with recruiting!
Or know much about how this staff has taken players ranked out of the ESPN 300 and made them house hold names! In short, I feel this team is set up to do phenomenally well.
A-Types - most of these guys with enough audacity to think they can play at a national title contender like Clemson "believe beyond any doubt they belong"! All these guys have a chip on their shoulder and it makes us a even more dangerous team for it. They will all set out to show "the college football world" they are just as good or better than the guys they replaced. Which is going to be a problem for opponents!

Go Tigers!

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Re: Depth chart for 2019


Jun 19, 2019, 2:43 PM

I think it's reasonable to wonder how well our DTs and ILBs will play. I'm not worried, but I think we can at least state the obvious. Christian Wilkins and Dexter Lawrence are a better DT duo than Nyles Pinckney and Jordan Williams. Losing Wilkins, Dexter, Tre Lamar, and Kendall Joseph will hurt the interior of our defense. I think Xavier Thomas will have an All-American type season, and be as productive as Clelin. And I'm optimistic that Justin Foster and/or KJ Henry can fill the void left by Austin Bryant. However, I highly doubt that Pinckney, Williams, Chad Smith, and Skalski will be able to replace their predecessors fully. I believe that they will be really good, but they won't be as good as what we had last year. Isaiah Simmons is a different story. I think he is going to be an All-American this year. And I think he will play his way into a 1st round draft pick.

I also believe that our secondary will be better. Having two seniors at safeties help. Returning Denzel Johnson and Nolan turner is great. We get all 4 of our safeties back. I think we will be better at CB too. We'll definitely have more competitive depth. AJ Terrell, Derion Kendrick, Mario Goodrich, Kyler McMichael, LeAnthony Williams, Sheridan Jones, and Andrew Booth make up a really talented group. I'm excited to see how well our corners play this year.

So, in conclusion, I think DE production will be about the same. XT/Rudolph and Foster/KJ can replicate the production that Clelin and Austin left. I think we will be worse at DT and ILB. Isaiah Simmons will be one of the best LBs in college football. And I believe that our secondary will be better.

Plus, our offense will be incredible. Can't wait to win another national title. I just hope we finally get our Heisman winner this year.

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I like***


Jun 19, 2019, 5:53 PM



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