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All-TigerNet [11934]
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Actually keeping a legit 5-star hoops player home would be
Jan 4, 2018, 8:17 AM
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a monumental achievement for Clemson.
Even if it's only for one year, Zion could set a new standard for our hoops program.
From Pete Maravich, to Xavier McDaniel, to Kevin Garnett, to Raymond Felton ... historically, the Palmetto State has only produced a few guys who were real difference makers coming out of high school.
They all either went pro immediately (back when it was legal) or went out of state to play college ball.
Zion can change history on "Decision Day" ...
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All-In [30831]
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Milton Jennings***
Jan 4, 2018, 8:28 AM
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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Re: Milton Jennings***
Jan 4, 2018, 9:46 AM
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Legitimate ... difference maker?
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All-In [30831]
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Is zion?***
Jan 4, 2018, 2:40 PM
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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Zion is on a different level than Milton Jennings***
Jan 4, 2018, 1:09 PM
[ in reply to Milton Jennings*** ] |
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All-In [30831]
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Orly?***
Jan 4, 2018, 2:41 PM
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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Yes. Jennings was a fringe 5 star. Zion is the #2 overall
Jan 4, 2018, 3:24 PM
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recruit (guys that usually go to UK, Duke, UNC, UCLA, Kansas, etc) and is already projected as a high lottery pick in next year's NBA draft. Not saying he will be, but he's the kind of player that can come in and be the best player in CBB next year. Milton was highly rated, but he was never THAT.
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110%er [7488]
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Ricky Jones***
Jan 4, 2018, 9:21 AM
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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Re: Ricky Jones***
Jan 4, 2018, 9:47 AM
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Legitimate ... difference maker?
Ricky got hurt so we'll never know for sure if he was one.
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110%er [7488]
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No. The point is though that each of
Jan 4, 2018, 10:43 AM
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These guys being named had about the same hoorah as Zion and were labels difference makers before they arrived. . It would be a huge get but until he's made a difference you can't call him that either. Jones was labeled potentially the next MJ.
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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Zion is a bit different ...
Jan 4, 2018, 10:51 AM
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I can agree with Ricky Jones if he hadn't gotten hurt. Dean Smith actually coveted Ricky and made a personal in-home visit in Pendleton. He's the one that probably should have set the trend for Clemson, but he hurt his shoulder and was never particularly effective after that.
Milton Jennings of course, was never a legitimate 5-star guy to begin with and the proof is that he was not offered by a single one of the true blue blood programs. His McDonalds AA game performance was not impressive.
Clarke Bynum was solid in high school and was offered by Kentucky, but he had nowhere near the hype that Zion is getting.
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110%er [7488]
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Jennings chose Clemson over UCONN, UF, and UCLA- UF
Jan 4, 2018, 12:18 PM
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was coming off back to back National Championships and UCONN had just won won it a few years prior and then won another while Jennings was at CU. UCLA is basketball blue blood. I don't know about UNC, Duke, or Kentucky- they may have offered and he cut them early from the list or they were convinced he wasn't leaving the state. We were on a good run at the time. It's easy to say he wasn't a legit player in hindsight but that certainly wasn't the case back when he signed coming ot of HS.
"He was a second-team Parade All-American and played in the 2009 McDonald's All-American game in Miami. He also played in the Capital Classic for the U.S. All-Stars. He was rated as the nation's #23 prospect by Scout.com, #25 by Rivals.com, and #26 by ESPNU. He was named to All-Tournament team of 2008 Chick-fil-A Classic, posting 25 points and 14 rebounds playing against Duke signee Mason Plumlee in the championship game. He posted 24 points and 12 rebounds vs. No. 1 Oak Hill Academy in the 2009 ESPN RISE National High School Invitational."
I hope Zion avoids injury and is as legit as he sounds but I've hoped as much for others as well. The fact is we have had some great ACC/NBA players roll through but those guys weren't that highly recruited. I hope Zion changes that.
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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He was all those things and yet not offered by UNC, Duke, KY
Jan 4, 2018, 12:47 PM
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or NC State, or Wake, or ... the list is long for schools nearby that did not offer a 5-star McDonalds AA.
Just saying.
Generally, our great players have developed into greatness after arriving at Clemson.
We've never, ever successfully recruited a guy as highly regarded as Zion.
That's my only point in the whole thread.
Getting Zion to sign with Clemson would be unprecedented.
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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The problem with Milton is that he was basically a stretch
Jan 4, 2018, 1:17 PM
[ in reply to Jennings chose Clemson over UCONN, UF, and UCLA- UF ] |
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4 (or maybe in 5 in HS) that couldn't shoot once he got to college. I watched him play several times at Pinewood and he was a very good outside shooter. I don't know what happened when he got to Clemson - maybe he couldn't adjust to having to take contested looks when he was accustomed to just shooting right over the top of little 6 foot white kids. He was also skinny, not strong enough to bang inside, and not very athletic. He needed to be a 35+ % 3-point shooter to be effective and his best seasons were 32 and 33%.
Zion's game is going to translate. He's big and strong and extremely athletic. He's a bull. Oh and Milton was timid... Zion is the polar opposite of that. He plays with a fire Milton never had.
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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Orange Blooded [4854]
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Re: No. The point is though that each of
Jan 4, 2018, 1:39 PM
[ in reply to No. The point is though that each of ] |
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MJ was not the biggest basketball player in high school since LeBron James.
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CU Guru [1241]
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Re: Actually keeping a legit 5-star hoops player home would be
Jan 4, 2018, 9:32 AM
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clarke bynum.
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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Re: Actually keeping a legit 5-star hoops player home would be
Jan 4, 2018, 9:48 AM
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Legitimate ... difference maker?
Good solid player. Not a difference maker.
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All-In [48078]
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Not sure where he was from, but was Robertin a 5 star?****
Jan 4, 2018, 10:34 AM
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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He was a "Legend" but that's about it.
Jan 4, 2018, 10:43 AM
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All-TigerNet [14488]
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All-In [48078]
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Think what a curse t would be like to look like Legend...
Jan 4, 2018, 10:52 AM
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and for everyone to assume you must be a great basketball player playing on some sort of elite level, only to suck. Everywhere he goes people probably ask him basketball questions non stop.
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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"Legitimate" is the key word in my post ...
Jan 4, 2018, 9:50 AM
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... players who were true difference makers.
So far, y'all are bringing up highly-rated players who were not difference makers in college.
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All-In [48078]
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Who was the truly last diference maker? Trevor Booker maybe?
Jan 4, 2018, 10:35 AM
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nm
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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Re: Who was the truly last diference maker? Trevor Booker maybe?
Jan 4, 2018, 10:42 AM
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I don't know that we've ever recruited a guy who was universally recognized as a program changer.
The consensus on Zion is that he's a real franchise player.
Trevor was definitely a difference maker, but he was not a particularly highly regarded high school player. We got him mainly because he was not sought by the UNCs, Dukes, and Kentucky's of the world.
My point in all this is that the "truly recognized difference makers" rarely stay in state and they never choose Clemson.
So far ...
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All-In [48078]
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Exactly. Morever, how often does the state even have them..
Jan 4, 2018, 10:45 AM
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anyway? They are rare to even exist.
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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Re: Exactly. Morever, how often does the state even have them..
Jan 4, 2018, 10:55 AM
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Not too often for sure.
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Orange Blooded [2332]
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Re: Who was the truly last diference maker? Trevor Booker maybe?
Jan 4, 2018, 2:24 PM
[ in reply to Re: Who was the truly last diference maker? Trevor Booker maybe? ] |
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Not an in-state player, but Skip Wise in 1975 was the best difference maker Clemson ever had on campus, even if for only a year. Young fans would have to watch tape to understand.
Go Tigers!
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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Re: Who was the truly last diference maker? Trevor Booker maybe?
Jan 4, 2018, 4:05 PM
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Oh absolutely ... Skip Wise ... best ever! He definitely made a difference.
The whole group that Tates Locke brought in were decidedly NOT the usual Clemson caliber recruits and they made a huge difference.
Even though Skip was gone after one season, Tree, and Stan Rome, and Colon Abraham, etc., continued to help Clemson win a lot of games while on probation.
But, how we got those guys, and what happened afterward are best left in the past.
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All-TigerNet [14488]
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Well
Jan 4, 2018, 10:46 AM
[ in reply to "Legitimate" is the key word in my post ... ] |
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we don't know if they are "legitimate" until they have finished their college career, right? So how do we know Zion is or not yet? For all we know his game may not translate to high-level ACC play or not.
Obviously I'm just playing devil's advocate. But you can't assume he's going to change the world before he even steps on a college court
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All-In [48078]
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I know TL will "change the world" on the football field...
Jan 4, 2018, 10:49 AM
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and he hasn't played at Clemson yet. Anyway, how is Zion's shot? Does he have a nice jumper yet?
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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He may be a bust ... but the TOP programs want him and
Jan 4, 2018, 10:55 AM
[ in reply to Well ] |
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that's a better barometer for Zion's potential than anything he did in high school.
Duke, Kentucky, and UNC etc. did not covet most of the guys we've brought in who had some nice high school stats.
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All-TigerNet [14488]
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I certainly don't think he will be a bust
Jan 4, 2018, 4:49 PM
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But at this point, all the comparisons to other "highly rated" signings are somewhat valid...although you are right, we will have NEVER signed a guy as highly rated as ZW before.
FWIW, I DO think ZW will be a "difference maker" that could potentially change the trajectory of Clemson hoops...hope we are right! 
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Freshman [3]
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Re: Actually keeping a legit 5-star hoops player home would be
Jan 4, 2018, 10:23 AM
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We are a football school, he isn't coming
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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Close your eyes and watch ...***
Jan 4, 2018, 10:32 AM
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You were a fan of a basketball school just last year. Remember?
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All-In [48078]
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All-In [44048]
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I agree, it would be huge for our basketball program.
Jan 4, 2018, 1:53 PM
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Zion would be our best basketball signee ever, by far. He is the top player in the nation according to some, and in the top 2-3 according to others. He is absolutely a program-changer, not as much in terms of wins, since he would likely only be in college for one season, but in terms of showing other recruits that Clemson is a legitimate basketball destination.
We would obviously need to get other five star recruits on a consistent basis to be in the upper echelon of basketball programs, but we are certainly trending upward even without Zion. Brad is consistently getting four star recruits these days, with the three star players being quite capable. It seems that the days of us getting players with no other major offers are long gone. Brad and his staff have worked very hard to build relationships, and the new facilities help a ton.
For those equating Zion to Milton Jennings or Clarke Bynum - that is ridiculous. While those were very good high school players, they were nowhere near the talent level of Zion Williamson. We have only had a few McDonald's All-Americans in our basketball program ever. Jennings was obviously a bust, and the top programs recognized that. He had no interest from the Dukes, UNCs, and Kentuckys of the world. Prior to Jennings, I believe Sharone Wright was our last McDonald's All-American. He had a nice career for us, and was the #6 pick in the NBA Draft after his junior year, but he was nowhere close to Zion in terms of high school performance or accolades.
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Orange Blooded [2721]
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Re: Actually keeping a legit 5-star hoops player home would be
Jan 4, 2018, 2:47 PM
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Stanley Roberts and Ray Allen probably could make this list as well. (plus a couple guys that skipped college all together)
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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... and Jermaine O'Neal***
Jan 4, 2018, 4:07 PM
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CU Guru [1421]
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Alex English...back in the 70's***
Jan 4, 2018, 4:31 PM
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CU Guru [1421]
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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He was definitely a strong performer for Frank McGuire
Jan 4, 2018, 4:34 PM
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I don't know much about his high school career or his status as a national recruit. Was he highly sought after nation wide?
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CU Guru [1421]
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I would assume so, but I don't think recruiting was as widely discussed then
Jan 4, 2018, 5:06 PM
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The Post and Courier did a story on the greatest SC high school players, but with thebbenefit of hindsight. It should have been titled SC High School players who had the greatest subsequent careers.
For the record, the names were Alex English, Larry Nance, Tyrone Corbin, Xavier McDaniel, Stanley Roberts, Larry Davis, Kevin Garnett, Jermaine O'Neal, Ray Allen, Raymond Felton, Khris Middleton.
It remains to be seen if ZW will be in this league or will be another Seventh Woods.
Message was edited by: bassdogmwp
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Orange Blooded [2721]
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Re: ... and Jermaine O'Neal***
Jan 4, 2018, 4:45 PM
[ in reply to ... and Jermaine O'Neal*** ] |
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Jermaine was a monster. He is exactly who I was thinking about. Was he at Lower Richland or Spring Valley? My memory is fading...
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Orange Blooded [2721]
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Re: ... and Jermaine O'Neal***
Jan 4, 2018, 4:47 PM
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Nevermind. I was wrong on both accounts. He went to Eau Claire.
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