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YOUR BALANCE
The difference in ACC and SEC football
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The difference in ACC and SEC football


Nov 24, 2019, 6:14 PM

The differences I see in ACC and SEC football

The SEC is aggressive about protecting their brand. Whether it’s Greg Sankey or Michael Slive , past SEC coaches or players they go to bat for the teams of their conference. The talking heads love to interview them and get their opinions on all things to do with college football. The last time I can remember seeing John Swofford was standing on the podium as our Clemson Tigers were crowned the best in college football. He probably would have rather been getting a root canal than to be supportive of Clemson, but the allure of that money the conference would make was too much. The only things that can get Swofford out of hibernation is if it has to do with a North Carolina school, a team from the ACC is playing for a national championship with a very lucrative payday or its basketball season.

I’m not one to put much stock into conspiracy theories, but......
I have recorded several SEC games this year (and a few Ohio State) games just to watch some of the game and just see what the competition looks like. I dvr all the Clemson games and also all the South Carolina games and then a few of the bigger games that may have teams that I think we may see in the playoffs. While watching the SEC games it can be pretty obvious that a team that is highly ranked can get the benefit of the doubt much more easily than a team that has no chance of getting into the playoffs. Tennessee/ Alabama, Florida/ South Carolina, Texas A&M/ LSU All seemed to turn due to officials calls or non calls. South Carolina vs Georgia . There was some shall we say questionable calls in that game to even allow it to go into overtime. It’s Seems as the officials gave Georgia quite a few chances to put South Carolina away, but they just were too incompetent to do it. I know Clemson has also benefited from some calls over the last few years, that in years past we probably would not have gotten. I’m just saying as the season gets toward the end when a loss can keep an SEC team out of the playoffs the officials do seem to make their presences known a little more than they do earlier in the season. (Removes tinfoil hat) Just to clarify my motive for recording all the South Carolina games, it’s simple if South Carolina wins the game I delete it. If South Carolina loses a game I will usually watch it to get a chuckle out of their misery.

My third and last thought about the ACC and SEC is this. The SEC usually starts the season before a game has even commenced with a minimum of 5-7 teams in the top 25. The SEC out of conference is usually very weak and normally they go thru those games with no problem, then when they play a conference opponent if the higher ranked team loses they drop a spot or two while the talking heads make excuses for the loss and usually focuses on the lower ranked or unranked team must be stronger that earlier believed. While Clemson plays their worst game of the season against North Carolina and we win by one, there is no mention of North Carolina playing out of their minds it’s all Clemson doesn’t have it this year. We get hit harder than Georgia did for their loss to SEC doormat South Carolina. If you have that many teams in the preseason top 25 if one loses, then move the other team up and you still have the SEC represented in the top 25. It’s a self fulfilling prophecy. The SEC is the dominant conference in college football because they have more teams in the top 25, thus if they lose to another SEC team, the team that won the game shoots up the rankings like a rocket while the losing team slowly drops a spot or two at a time. The other conferences do not get this preferential treatment. The ACC has to fight and claw their way into the top 25 and Lord knows don’t slip up and lose a game or they will be strapped on a rocket going out of the top 25.

I believe Clemson is the best team in the country, but with this ACC albatross of a conference tied around our neck we have to be perfect, no slip ups, none because we have an ACC patch on the front of our jersey. The SEC talking heads are constantly singing the praises of the mighty SEC while our conference members and commissioner slumber away and dream about basketball season.

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Re: The difference in ACC and SEC football


Nov 24, 2019, 6:18 PM

Correct. A+++++



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"Anybody that says Coach Brownell is the best coach to come through Clemson is going to start an argument." -JP Hall


Re: The difference in ACC and SEC football


Nov 24, 2019, 7:07 PM

That’s one of my favorite Christmas story scenes...point for you!

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Yep but the bottom line is they take it more seriously than the ACC


Nov 24, 2019, 6:42 PM

as a whole. Still with that being said Miami, FSU and VT should be putting a much better product on the field. It’s not like the ACC doesn’t have teams who have not been powerhouses before.

The thing about the present situation with the national media narrative that gets me is that no one questioned SOS while Miami and FSU we’re running roughshod over everyone. It was universally understood that they belonged in the same conversation with the nation’s elite. I’ve never seen a program do what we’ve done for as long as we’ve done it only to have a good bit of the media blow our program off.

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Re: Yep but the bottom line is they take it more seriously than the ACC


Nov 24, 2019, 7:02 PM

You are absolutely right. If you would have told me years ago that Clemson was going to be in a conference with Florida State, Miami and Virginia Tech I would think that would be a super conference of football......it just hasn’t happened.

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Correct! And I Agree.


Nov 24, 2019, 7:34 PM

Had you told me that years ago I would have also thought: BC use to end up being a 8 to 9 win team every season as well! Through in NC State who was the best of the N.Carolina schools and you had a really good conference. BC and Nancy use to at least be top 20 to 25 teams fairly consistently.

What happened? IDK, but these things are cyclical.

Big thing that is not spoken on or rather typed on or covered enough is: "the Nick Saban/ Urban Meyer factor"!
When these two coaches entered the SEC it went into another atmosphere where they were winning National Titles or contending for it regularly! Take them away and what do you have though? Take Saban from LSU in 03 and thus the players/schemes he recruited/built in 07. Plus, all the ones he has won at Alabama. Take the two Urban won at Florida where the narrative about how much faster the SEC is over everyone else really blew up!

I think if somehow another Saban or Urban type coach gets to an ACC school that is willing to pay for their services. Back them and give them the facilities and resources they need - you "COULD SEE" a changing of the guard. Big if though.
Spurrier years - had a guy in charge that was ahead of the offensive world! Same with Urban Meyer and his speed option. Think if Chip Kelly had brought his up tempo to say Miami instead of Oregon years ago. Before everyone else started running it thus got better at defending it. The narrative would have been all about speed(more speed at Miami and eventually ACC schools trying to compete would have had to adapt). Or not like SEC schools have not adapted "until LSU this season" to what Alabama was doing!

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Re: Correct! And I Agree.


Nov 25, 2019, 8:52 AM

As to 'what happened' - my theory is CFB is much more of an "arms race" (facilities, etc) the last 15-20 years than it ever was before. And the arms race is won with money. Who has more money - public or private schools? Public. Which conference has the most private schools...and thus less money? The ACC.
Schools' product on the field/court is much less dependent on facilities with baseball, basketball, soccer etc than with football. And those are sports which the ACC dominates.

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Re: Yep but the bottom line is they take it more seriously than the ACC


Nov 24, 2019, 7:39 PM [ in reply to Re: Yep but the bottom line is they take it more seriously than the ACC ]

That might have a lot to do with CLEMSON stomping those teams so badly that they fired their coaches, and did not get better ones. CLEMSON is largely responsible for FSU, Miami, and VT losing their head coach.

CLEMSON is also largely responsible for other teams like UofSuc, GT, and maybe a couple more firing their head coach. Then those teams must try and rebuild while CLEMSON keeps stomping them into oblivion. If CLEMSON keeps meeting Alabama, then Saban is gonna lose his job too. I'm not sure about Ohio State and Oklahoma, but the butt-whippings they endured from CLEMSON did not help cool the seats of those coaches.

Bottom line: If you want to keep your job, try your best to NOT play CLEMSON. And if you have to, try to score in the final seconds of the game against the CLEMSON subs (Muschamp, Jimbo) just to make it look like you were not completely incompetent.

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The conference envy is strong around here.


Nov 24, 2019, 7:56 PM

And I don't get it.

Clemson plays in the ACC. We've won 3 Nattys in the past 38 years. That is a better record on the national level than Kentucky, Tennessee, Georgia, Auburn, Ole Miss, Miss State, LSU, South Carolina, Arkansas, Missouri and Vandy. That record matches the 3 titles won by Florida. Of all the teams in the SEC, only Alabama has won more titles than Clemson over the past 38 years.

How has Clemson been hurt by being in the ACC?

The 'SOUTH' has been dominant in college football for decades. Over the past 40 years, teams in the SEC have won or shared 14 Nattys. That is excellent. But over the same time frame Texas, Oklahoma, Florida State, GT, Miami and Clemson (all essentially Southern teams) have won or shared 14 Nattys
too. You can be a southern school and win big in college football without being in the SEC.

So how has being in the ACC hurt Clemson?


The SEC has a larger fan base than the ACC. That makes perfect sense when you consider how much bigger most SEC schools are than most ACC schools. The SEC has one private school. The ACC has 6 private schools. OK, the SEC has more fans.

How has the larger fan base of the SEC hurt Clemson?

The ACC is unquestionably composed of better schools than the SEC. It isn't close. In the most recent USNWR rankings of national colleges and universities, the top 70 schools includes 11 ACC institutions and 3 SEC institutions. This might not matter to a lot of people, especially SECers, but I like it that Clemson is among the best 70 national universities and so are most of the teams we play from the ACC. That means your chances of getting hit by a thrown bottle or battery are higher in the SEC than in the ACC. SC is a typical SEC school. Clemson is a typical ACC school. Who the hell among us want to be like SC? Clemson has benefitted through the years by being a member of the ACC where athletes are more expected to go to class and be student athletes than in the SEC. I am proud that Clemson Universities in a league full of recognizably solid educational institutions.

I'd sure rather be where we are than stuck with the likes of SC, Ole Miss, Miss State, Arkansas, Tennessee, LSU, Alabama, Missouri and Kentucky.

SEC envy is strong in my home state of South Carolina. Many Sandlappers have listened way too much to those idiots from the University of South Carolina talk about their league what how great it is. What I've noticed is that South Carolina hasn't improved one iota by being in the SEC.

I've been to visit almost all the SEC and ACC campuses. I like ACC campuses and locations more than I like those of most SEC schools. I'd sure rather make the road trips we make than the ones SC makes.

So the SEC envy among Clemson fans is a mystery to me.

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Re: The conference envy is strong around here.


Nov 24, 2019, 8:21 PM

There is nothing wrong with the ACC and certainly nothing wrong with Clemson. You guys let the media control your emotions. Be glad that you support the Clemson Tigers. That’s all that matters.

YOU DO SUPPORT CLEMSON... RIGHT.?

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Well said but I’m not sure “conference envy” would be the correct term here.


Nov 24, 2019, 8:40 PM [ in reply to The conference envy is strong around here. ]

I think the point of the OP and certainly my point is that the ACC should be more intentional about being great at football. I honestly don’t understand why we’re not considering the programs in our conference who have been great before. I don’t envy the SEC at all but I do want our conference to take football more seriously than they do. However I would not want to trade places with the SEC for all of the reasons you have mentioned. It’s true that being in the ACC has not held us back but is it too much to ask for the rest of the league to put a decent product on the field on a consistent basis so the media would shut up about our schedule? The ACC is not as bad as the media would lead everyone to believe but it’s not very good this year.

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Conference Envy


Nov 24, 2019, 10:30 PM

Conference affiliation does nothing to make the football good or bad. The SEC does not put a product on the field. The ACC does not put a product on the field.

Did you see the turnout at the Vandy game on Saturday night? Has the SEC done anything to make South Carolina football worth something? No.

The SEC did not make Bama good. The Big 10 did not make Ohio State good. The ACC did not make Clemson good.

Nothing I could imagine would be more boring than watching Arkansas play Missouri or Tennessee play Vandy. No one but fans of those teams gives a rip about those games. So the SEC has done nothing for those SEC football games. What's that SEC team in Columbia whose colors are Garnet and Aluminum? Is the SEC helping those guys be worth a crap?

In five years if Miami, FSU, VT, Clemson, and Louisville are all in the top ten, the ACC offices will appreciate it. They will have done nothing to make it happen. If Saban quits and Bama hires Willie Taggart to coach The Tide, the SEC will have had nothing to do with Bama going to the dogs.

The SEC love is strong around here. Seems sorta funny/odd to me.

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Re: The conference envy is strong around here.


Nov 24, 2019, 8:52 PM [ in reply to The conference envy is strong around here. ]

I never said that I have any envy for the SEC I was just stating some differences in the two conferences and their approach to football.

How has Clemson been hurt by being in the ACC?

It’s obvious that it hasn’t hurt Clemson, but is that because of the leadership of the ACC or because of the leadership at Clemson?

How has the ACC helped Clemson? I think the way Clemson has climbed to the level that they have is even more remarkable in spite of being in a conference that doesn’t seem as concerned with football as they are in basketball.

Do you think the ACC puts as much time and effort in supporting football as they do in basketball?

Has the ACC helped Miami, Virginia Tech, Boston College, Pitt, or Syracuse who have all had some quality football teams in the past. There are a lot of variables that contributed to the fall of these schools, but it doesn’t appear that their inclusion in the ACC has helped them.

I’m not a conference guy, I’m a Clemson guy. Nowhere in my post did I say we should break away from the ACC and join the SEC. I was just trying to articulate that with Swofford being the commissioner of the ACC and the ACC being so entrenched in the Tar Heel State that football will not be as important as basketball. The SEC seems to back their football and promotes it better than the ACC.

It’s not the ACC per se that I don’t like it’s the leadership or lack there of that I don’t like. I do like the fact that the schools of the ACC are schools with higher academic standards than the SEC.

I hope that with the ACC network we could see some of these teams improving their football programs and improve the league, I just don’t think that will happen anytime soon with the leadership that we have at the top of the ACC.

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Re: The difference in ACC and SEC football


Nov 24, 2019, 8:41 PM

The ACC is a great conference. Dominant accross the board in all sports. I'm proud of our conference for many reasons. Sports being one of them.
Don't be sheep and follow the narrative that's been laid out for you.

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"If a pig had a better personality, he would cease to be a filthy animal."


No Envy. Not even close.


Nov 24, 2019, 8:51 PM

Talking conference is all about - "perception"! I really don't care how strong the SEC is or how strong it is perceived!
I do care when people try and make arguments for keeping a deserving Clemson Tigers out of the CFP; b/c of a "false narrative". Fake News of how bad the ACC is.
The SEC the ACC is not. But, as bad as they try and portray, "no way"! The numbers during bowl season do not show that.
The conference versus other P5 teams during the regular season you ask. "Well show me the match ups not just the numbers"! Were they favorable for the other conference - meaning their best team versus a bottom tier ACC team? I mean, if you had FSU when they were good. Louisville when they were good and Clemson beating up on SEC -- -- Oh ----- wait ------this happened! No one said a word. Kentucky, Florida and South Carolina all got beaten - not a word! No way to fake news that!

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Re: The difference in ACC and SEC football


Nov 24, 2019, 10:40 PM

The SEC did one thing in football that I think has helped them. When they went to divisions, they stuck with an east/west set-up. Yes, I know Missouri is not "east", but that's the lone exception that occurred many years later when they joined the SEC in 2012. That keeps schools that are near each other, and sharing borders in rivalry games...

I wish the ACC would go north/south. I realize that most of the football power would be in the South. But it would make it easier to generate more rivalries and border-wars all around the conference. When we went into the Coastal, we were taken out of the division with our two natural geographic rivals (clemson & fsu). And I think that has hurt football interest in the ACC overall. Seeing FSU & Miami in the same division would make for better games. Same for Clemson & Miami or Clemson & Tech. And the schools up North, Pitt/Cuse/BC, should be in a division together.

I realize no divisional alignment is perfect. But I just wish the divisions were aligned with some sort of geographic split.

And the ACC Network took faaaaaarrr too long. The SEC Network has been around for 6 or 7 years, and the Big 10 network even longer. But we finally have a network. I'm hoping this is the beginning of something special for ACC football.

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North South would work for the ACC


Nov 25, 2019, 8:21 AM

North:

Syracuse
BC
Pitt
Louisville
Virginia
Virginia Tech
Duke


South

Miami
FSU
GT
Clemson
NCSU
UNC
Wake

Lots of football potential in the South. With Cuse, Louisville, Virginia and Duke in the North, they'd have the lead in baseketball. That suits me.

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Re: North South would work for the ACC


Nov 25, 2019, 8:35 AM

Interesting way of looking at this; Division titles, ACC Champs Game wins, Natties (*and claimed)

North:

Syracuse (0 - 0 - 1)
BC (2 - 0 - 0)
Pitt (1 - 0 - 9)
Louisville (0 - 0 - 0)
Virginia (0 - 0 - 0)
Virginia Tech (6 - 3 - 0)
Duke (1 - 0 - 0)


South

Miami (1 - 0 - 5)
FSU (5 - 4 - 3)
GT (5 - 0* - 4)
Clemson (6 - 5 - 3)
NCSU (0 - 0 - 0)
UNC (1 - 0 - 0)
Wake (1 - 1 - 0)

The south would be a insanely powerful divisions and I do not think that NC State will accept being Wake's homecoming opponent. It would also kill off the northern divison's ability to do that Florida recruiting thing. I also think you would have to swap the New Jerseyu State University (Duke) with UNC to keep that UVA/UNC thing going.

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