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Hall of Famer [22387]
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What do you really think is wrong with this President?
Mar 8, 2017, 11:10 AM
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He obviously has some psychological disorder or something of the sort that prevents him from thinking logically and rationally and in depth.
Is it just that he has an attention deficit disorder and he can't focus on complex issues?
Is he simply an extreme narcissist?
Is he simply egomaniacal?
Is he simply a pathological liar?
Or, is he just not very smart?
Is it some combination of the above?
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All-In [34108]
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All of those things except
Mar 8, 2017, 11:12 AM
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maybe not an "extreme" narcissist. Could just be a regular one.
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Lot o points [155907]
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I think he is as shrewd as the day is long.
Mar 8, 2017, 11:13 AM
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I also think he isn't very intelligent, at least in the traditional sense of the word.
I think this leads to him making some moves that just appear inane, because they are, and also pulling off some wins that leave people shaking their heads wondering how the he!! he pulled it off.
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Hall of Famer [22387]
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He's an excellent marketer because he believes that any
Mar 8, 2017, 11:31 AM
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publicity, no matter how negative or embarrassing it would be to others, is good publicity and he's willing to say anything, no matter how divorced from reality it may be. He has no shame or conscience.
But, if you notice, he uses the same schtick over and over again and has for his entire adult life - a one trick pony with no depth or intellectual curiosity.
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All-In [38514]
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The only thing that I can identify that he's good at is
Mar 8, 2017, 11:38 AM
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marketing his name.
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Hall of Famer [22387]
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Agreed. He's the antithesis of Dabo Swinney.
Mar 8, 2017, 11:41 AM
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He's not smart, organized or prepared. The job of being President is far too complex and fast moving for him to keep up.
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Oculus Spirit [81061]
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For you, does it really matter who he is?
Mar 8, 2017, 11:45 AM
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He could make it rain gold coins and you complain about hail damage and devaluing gold.
Just admit he has the wrong symbol behind his name (regardless how much of a republican he really is or isn't), and there is practically nothing he can do that will please you.
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Hall of Famer [22387]
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If Trump had a (D) by his name I would not vote for him.
Mar 8, 2017, 11:57 AM
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He lacks the temperament, intellect, demeanor, organizational skills, etc. etc. etc. to be president. He's not a quality of human being.
That's before you even begin a discussion of his "policy" ideas.
Should he ever do anything good or anything I agree with I would support it. Haven't had that situation come up yet though. I don't anticipate that happening, based upon the 70 years of history that we have on him.
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Oculus Spirit [81061]
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I tend to doubt all of this.***
Mar 8, 2017, 11:59 AM
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Hall of Famer [22387]
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Unlike you, I have never voted for Donald Trump and I never
Mar 8, 2017, 12:39 PM
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would. So, there's that.
Evidently you haven't noticed my aversion to racism, sexism, misogyny, xenophobia, homophobia, religious bigotry and pathological lying. I can't tolerate it for political expediency.
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Oculus Spirit [81061]
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I have noticed your seeming endless lean toward jumping
Mar 8, 2017, 1:47 PM
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to conclusions based solely on slim to no evidence.
I still get a laugh about your weak, incorrectly concluded article you posted about slavery a few months back.
And how do you know who I voted for, or if I even voted at all?
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110%er [7026]
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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He seems to have started this healthcare bill off all wrong.
Mar 8, 2017, 11:55 AM
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He usually starts from a position of power but this time he started with weak sauce. I guess he's trying to be pragmatic letting the rinos start the show instead of the real conservatives.
That's going to leave many on the far right wishing we didn't agree with liberal on the value of the changes to the healthcare insurance system.
That puts me back to square one, everything the government fixes get more screwed up.
So yeah, maybe he's more concerned with repealing Obamacare than fixing out heath insurance like it should be fixed. That pragmatic motha...
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All-TigerNet [14233]
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The correct thing to do is repeal the entire law
Mar 8, 2017, 11:57 AM
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but Trump insists on keeping parts of Obamacare.
This will lead to disaster for him.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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No, he'll be politically acceptable to most Americans.
Mar 8, 2017, 12:00 PM
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Liberals, socialist and libertarians won't like it but most American will be OK. BTW, some libertarians will probably vote for him again if the dems don't find somebody who isn't sprinkled with socialism.
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Hall of Famer [22387]
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There are only 3 options. 1. Go back to the old system.
Mar 8, 2017, 12:06 PM
[ in reply to The correct thing to do is repeal the entire law ] |
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2. Keep Obamacare and make changes to improve it. 3. Go to a single payer system which is the most efficient method of healthcare delivery.
Republicans are now beginning to realize this fact, which is why they can't agree on a plan. It's not possible to do what they have promised - lowers costs and insure more people. They've let their mouths write checks their ##### can't cash.
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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#3 with Congressionally mandated cost controls... Healthcare
Mar 8, 2017, 12:11 PM
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should not be the capitalist noose for the US..
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Hall of Famer [22387]
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I agree, but that won't fly with ideological conservatives.
Mar 8, 2017, 12:52 PM
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It's why Obama went with Romneycare - he thought it was an improvement over the old system and one that Republicans would support because it was an idea hatched by conservatives and implemented by a conservative governor. But, for some reason, Republicans changed their minds.
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Mascot [18]
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Re: He seems to have started this healthcare bill off all wrong.
Mar 8, 2017, 12:22 PM
[ in reply to He seems to have started this healthcare bill off all wrong. ] |
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This is a guy who campaigned on 'repeal and replace' and promised something 'great', 'better than Obamacare', with no specifics of how he would keep the parts most people wanted while lowering costs and getting rid of the individual mandate.
3 weeks into office he realized "healthcare is complicated".
He is a fool who is a good salesman.
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Oculus Spirit [83119]
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I think he's a terrible human being who could end up
Mar 8, 2017, 11:57 AM
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being a good president.
All the craziness aside, he will eventually be judged on the economy.
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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So Nixon sans Watergate...?***
Mar 8, 2017, 11:59 AM
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Oculus Spirit [81061]
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Looking back at Watergate now
Mar 8, 2017, 12:00 PM
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A lot worse has been done to the American people for a lot less payback.
He did get us out of a war everyone hated.
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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Very pragmatic regardless of the methods...***
Mar 8, 2017, 12:03 PM
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Hall of Famer [22387]
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You do know that Nixon sabatoged the peace process extending
Mar 8, 2017, 12:29 PM
[ in reply to Looking back at Watergate now ] |
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the war from 1968 through 1973, don't you. A peace deal was reached in 1968 to end the war, but Nixon and Kissinger sabotaged the deal to prevent Hubert Humphrey from winning the election.
Tens of thousands of American soldiers died between 1968 and 1973 and millions of South East Asians as a result of Nixon's treasonous acts.
Giving him credit for ending the war seems a bit odd, to say the least.
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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There's a lot of money in bombs and opium - Kissinger***
Mar 8, 2017, 12:33 PM
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Oculus Spirit [81061]
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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Cutesy ad hominem... Too shallow to respond, so attack... No***
Mar 8, 2017, 1:57 PM
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Oculus Spirit [81061]
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It wasn't an ad hominem, and I wasn't responding to you
Mar 8, 2017, 2:03 PM
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so..ok.
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Legend [15749]
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Extreme arrogance. A lack of respect for
Mar 8, 2017, 11:59 AM
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the role he has been elected to. A lack of appreciation for what he represents. Naive.
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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Haven't seen you mention it and not to characterize you, but
Mar 8, 2017, 12:02 PM
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you seem to have a 'libertarian' slant... Maybe...?
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Legend [15749]
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Oh that's fine. I agree with the libertarians
Mar 8, 2017, 12:31 PM
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and the Conservatives both on most issues. Both want smaller government...they differentiate on social issues mostly, and there I respect both perspectives and don't consider either to be a "deal breaker" for my support.
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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Sans the healthcare debate, I'm probably a so-so libertarian
Mar 8, 2017, 12:36 PM
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I'll NEVER be some devout Party lemming...
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110%er [7026]
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I am the same way.
Mar 8, 2017, 2:11 PM
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I'd venture to say that there are a LOT of us that are just lumped into one thing or the other by the extreme sides of both "teams".
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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Yep... Unfortunately, there are currently only two options..***
Mar 8, 2017, 2:15 PM
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110%er [7026]
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Re: Yep... Unfortunately, there are currently only two options..***
Mar 8, 2017, 2:19 PM
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Only because of the "wasted vote" nonsense.
And the fact that libertarians, or any third party option really, only show up once every 4 years instead of trying to get people elected on local levels to get the brand actually out there..
Then they'll do great in a debate, espousing small government, personal freedom, etc.. Then they'll pull a Ron Paul and go crazy old man "These effing stoplights can't tell me what to do, why should I have to bend to the will of a government issued stoplight"..
And everyone goes What?????
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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I think it should start with a clearly defined but limited
Mar 8, 2017, 2:36 PM
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platform with mention of possible negotiated alternatives... Currently, Congress has lobbyist lawyers writing the laws and donating for votes.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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I can make the case that Obama was exactly the same.
Mar 8, 2017, 12:06 PM
[ in reply to Extreme arrogance. A lack of respect for ] |
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Were I to attempt that I'd start by pointing out that he had executive orders that were unlawful according to the judicial branch of government. That is the first measure of a president disrespecting the office.
I'm not arguing that Trump shows the proper respect but he is following a wrong precedence.
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All-In [26968]
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I wouldn't consider the judicial branch finding
Mar 8, 2017, 12:15 PM
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an action unconstitutional to be a sign that one has "disrespected" their office. Sometimes you don't know if something is wrong, until someone tells you it is.
The judiciary finding an executive action to be unconstitutional should hopefully not be frequent, but it should be normal, and not a sign of something or someone nefarious.
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Lot o points [155907]
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Re: I wouldn't consider the judicial branch finding
Mar 8, 2017, 12:21 PM
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All-In [26968]
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Does that mean you disagree?***
Mar 8, 2017, 12:24 PM
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All-In [38514]
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I assumed that means he's really tired.***
Mar 8, 2017, 12:24 PM
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Lot o points [155907]
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Yes, there's no way to know if something is "wrong"
Mar 8, 2017, 12:31 PM
[ in reply to Does that mean you disagree?*** ] |
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aka unconstitutional.
If only a President had taught and studied Constitutional law, or had advisers, or access to legal experts......
They know darn well in advance if something is likely constitutional.....what they don't know is if they can get away with it, thus the reason they try in the first place. The forgiveness vs permission dynamic rules the day...that's any modern President.
But no, there's no "oh gosh, gee, I just never thought that might be unconstitutional, did I do that?"
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All-In [26968]
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Well, I think if they know it is unconstitutional, and
Mar 8, 2017, 12:42 PM
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do it anyway, that would not be good.
To me, it's the judiciary's job to determine that stuff. I'm OK if a President is not as good at it as they are.
If Congress passes a law, and the President vetoes it, did Congress disrespect their offices? To me, it's the same thing.
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All-In [26968]
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Lot o points [155907]
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No, because he probably had a case that it was
Mar 8, 2017, 12:56 PM
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constitutional....still remains to be seen. He'll have his own moments of constitutional disrespect, this just wasn't one of them, IMHO.
Whether it's Obama with ACA, or Bush with Patriot Act, I think it was more of "it's possibly unconstitutional, but let's see if we can get it through." In this case, I think there was a level of disrespect, despite their attempts being validated by being allowed to stand.
That's the thing about disrespect....it's all in the eye of the beholder....there's not a universal standard.
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All-In [26968]
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Sure. So it sounds like you agree
Mar 8, 2017, 12:59 PM
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that a blanket statement of "if a president's action is found to unconstitutional, he has disrespected his office," is not really true.
Like, say if the President didn't sign a new travel ban, and instead chose to fight in courts for the old one, would you be waiting to see whether he "disrespected his office" or not, based on what the court decided?
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Mascot [18]
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No, just checking boxes 1, 3, 4 and 5 in the OP
Mar 8, 2017, 3:21 PM
[ in reply to Do you think President Trump disrespected his office ] |
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He can't appreciate the complexity of implementing something like his travel ban properly, then he shot himself in the foot by throwing it out there anyway with no preparation for the ICE, the airlines, etc.
He was too egomaniacal to get decent independent counsel on how to word it, shooting his other foot when green card holders with sympathetic stories couldn't come home from vacations or business travel.
He lied again, attempting to say it wasn't a 'Muslim' ban after campaigning on that very thing, picking countries with large Muslim populations, and adding a religious minority backdoor for Christians.
He was not smart enough to see any of the problems coming. Then, he was egotistical and foolish enough to say a new improved version would be out in a few days before taking several weeks (or was he just lying again?).
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All-In [49046]
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There are not that many bright line constitutional questions
Mar 8, 2017, 1:20 PM
[ in reply to Yes, there's no way to know if something is "wrong" ] |
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To begin with, both sides of the existing court operate under rubrics for reaching decisions that are completely different and are completely reliant on differing personal views and selected writings of various founders.
Obama didn't decide to pass something he thought was unconstitutional and then pretend he thought it was. He decided to pass something that he thought was constitutional and other people disagreed with him.
The entire bill of rights is rife with arguments about scope and intent. The first amendment says congress shall make no law restricting free speech or the press, and yet there are restrictions on those things by congress all the time that just fall into judicially created carve outs for hospital zones and disturbing the peace, etc.
Conversely, the second amendment has a qualifier about a militia and Scalia says they just threw that in there it really doesn't mean much.
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Hall of Famer [24768]
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+1 for "rubrics"...***
Mar 8, 2017, 1:22 PM
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All-In [26968]
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Lot o points [155907]
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It's possible to think something is the right thing to
Mar 8, 2017, 1:33 PM
[ in reply to There are not that many bright line constitutional questions ] |
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do, without being sure of it's constitutionality. I think that's probably the dynamic that many far-reaching executive initiative occur within.
Like anything in life, if the courts agree, you're the hero, if not, you're the goat.
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Legend [15749]
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I'd agree. I've always said that Obama was an amazing
Mar 8, 2017, 12:28 PM
[ in reply to I can make the case that Obama was exactly the same. ] |
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combination of amateurism and arrogance. Trump is perhaps more amateurish and arrogant, but it might not be as shocking. Of course he's an amateur...he's never worked in DC and he was elected on a populist wave. And yes he's arrogant, but at least he's actually accomplished something to draw arrogance from.
I think Obama understood the gravitas of the office far better than Trump does, which isn't saying much.
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110%er [9093]
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Are you asking about the previous one?***
Mar 8, 2017, 12:37 PM
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CU Guru [1482]
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Re: Are you asking about the previous one?***
Mar 8, 2017, 1:51 PM
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I don't think Donald really thought he'd get this job, and I don't think he really wants it.
But here he is, here we are. Hopefully he'll crack a book or something.
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Orange Blooded [3590]
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And the Dems are in denial.***
Mar 8, 2017, 2:15 PM
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