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110%er [5476]
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What The Yuck Is Going On?
Jun 28, 2020, 11:23 AM
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It turns out that Clemson, U of Suck and MUSC are screaming about President Trump's temporary cancellation of the H1B visa program because they can't fill their professorial, technical and medical needs. Thousands of qualified students graduate every year from these institutes of higher learning. I find it impossible to believe that they would bring in cheap labor rather than hiring from within. I would like for someone to explain this to me please.
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All-In [27366]
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You'll understand it if you call up an old professor in a
Jun 28, 2020, 11:42 AM
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technical major at Clemson and ask them how their classes have changed in the last 25 years.
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110%er [5476]
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Re: You'll understand it if you call up an old professor in a
Jun 28, 2020, 11:46 AM
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So you are saying the dumbing down of America is not a myth.
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1st Rounder [645]
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Re: You'll understand it if you call up an old professor in a
Jun 28, 2020, 12:02 PM
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Did you not believe that the dumbing down of America was occurring? It’s been going on for years!! Clemson is no exception.
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110%er [5476]
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Re: You'll understand it if you call up an old professor in a
Jun 28, 2020, 12:05 PM
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Thanks, for confirming it.
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Legend [16470]
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Orange Blooded [4086]
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Re: What The Yuck Is Going On?
Jun 28, 2020, 12:08 PM
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The foreign students either pay full price (ugrad) or work for free (grad).
They need a degree from the US to easily transition into working in the US.
Lowering the number of people on H1B's will increase salaries.
People will fill the spots at schools.
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Letterman [266]
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My kid just graduated from UCF with a degree
Jun 28, 2020, 1:05 PM
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in Computer Science and is looking for a job at the moment. If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know.
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All-In [40864]
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My kid just graduated and started a job
Jun 28, 2020, 1:23 PM
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with this company. He was a CS major at UNCC. He applied for a job in Orlando and they told him they also had openings in Milwaukee and he chose Milwaukee. He was offered the job in April. I think they hired a bunch of CS types and probably still are.
https://www.fisglobal.com/careers Careers | FIS We invite you to learn about the many exciting career opportunities awaiting you at FIS locations around the world.
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All-In [40864]
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Letterman [288]
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Re: What The Yuck Is Going On?
Jun 28, 2020, 1:33 PM
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I was going to write some words based on my experience hiring people over 20 years in industry but I had to think back and recognize my views are more aligned with the EB1 and EB2 visas and my views may also be more aligned to the dot com era where getting an MBA was much more popular for American citizens than getting an advanced engineering degree and working your way up through the technical ranks of an organization.
Things may have changed some or maybe they have not. In those days to get top technical talent in adequate numbers and in a timely manner you had to mine the pool of international students who wanted to stay in the US. Projects needed to happen and products and services needed to get to the market place and there was limited time to recruit people and if not enough American citizens applied to your posting then you had to hire one of the people who did want to be on the team and fill the available role. I guess in this way it is just like recruiting for sports, you don't have unlimited time or resources and at some point you just have to move forward with the team you can put together.
I think the goal for any of the universities mentioned is to put the best team on the field everyday in every department even if this means having to go outside your backyard to put the team together. Mining the international students has been part of the strategy for years and its become a useful tool in the toolbox.
Would you feel differently if this was a discussion about recruiting QBs or WRs or LBs from outside the Southeast? Would you feel differently if you were having surgery at MUSC and you knew they couldn't hire who they thought was best to work on you?
Hiring US citizens is much easier and in cases where a security clearance or export license is involved it is essentially mandatory. Once those roles are filled then eventually companies/universities/organizations have to make choices on a case by case basis with limited time and I think what they are complaining about is increasing governmental restrictions on their ability to fulfill their missions.
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Legend [16209]
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Part of the America I am in love with most is our All-Star
Jun 28, 2020, 3:14 PM
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nature and history in relation to the rest of the world. The land of opportunity, and leading the world that way.
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110%er [9023]
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Re: What The Yuck Is Going On?
Jun 28, 2020, 1:47 PM
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It's not about opting for cheap labor, it is that the hospitals prefer the cheap labor. They have to hire foreign technical people because the hospitals don't want to pay (they don't mind paying the execs and heads of departments millions).
2nd, all you a holes complain about the generation of kids today, when you're the ones that raised them.
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Orange Blooded [2248]
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Re: What The Yuck Is Going On?
Jun 28, 2020, 2:58 PM
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With medical the medical field, it seems to me that a lot of the shortage is created by the schools. They rarely want to increase the number of students, arguing that it would affect the quality of graduates. Ironically, it creates a need for foreign doctors who often do not have the same quality of education.
With most other organizations,previous posters are right in my opinion that companies are trying to decrease labor costs. Most of the time positions can be filled but more competitive salaries are required. The economy sets what salaries should be. Many companies, however, would rather pay a salary that is acceptable to an immigrant rather than a citizen, and ignore the fact that many immigrants would dang near work for free in order to get their foot in the door.
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Scout Team [182]
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When I was at Clemson 20 years ago
Jun 28, 2020, 3:21 PM
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One of the electrical engineering professors was begging all of us to come back for grad school. He said there were very few Americans in the program. Most of my ta's were from India
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CU Guru [1692]
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Which ECE professor was that? I was a TA there from '98-'99
Jun 28, 2020, 5:51 PM
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so I know exactly what you mean. But there were some great guys that I worked with as an RA that were from India that I still keep in touch with. Really smart guys that I'd hire in a heartbeat if they were American citizens.
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Scout Team [182]
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When I was at Clemson 20 years ago
Jun 28, 2020, 3:21 PM
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One of the electrical engineering professors was begging all of us to come back for grad school. He said there were very few Americans in the program. Most of my ta's were from India
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Scout Team [182]
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When I was at Clemson 20 years ago
Jun 28, 2020, 3:21 PM
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One of the electrical engineering professors was begging all of us to come back for grad school. He said there were very few Americans in the program. Most of my ta's were from India
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Scout Team [182]
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When I was at Clemson 20 years ago
Jun 28, 2020, 3:21 PM
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One of the electrical engineering professors was begging all of us to come back for grad school. He said there were very few Americans in the program. Most of my ta's were from India
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1st Rounder [641]
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110%er [5476]
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Re: We’ve got bigger problems in this country.
Jun 28, 2020, 4:23 PM
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You can take all of your propaganda and shove it!
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1st Rounder [641]
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I know right? It’s crazy that veterans/military families are spreading propaganda.***
Jun 28, 2020, 4:31 PM
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CU Guru [1572]
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Re: I know right? It’s crazy that veterans/military families are spreading propaganda.***
Jun 28, 2020, 8:27 PM
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I am a veteran and I do not support that post!
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All-TigerNet [12029]
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Orange Blooded [4896]
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Look at the PhD candidates in our graduation programs
Jun 28, 2020, 5:31 PM
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The vast majority in science and engineering majors are foreigners. They get a boost in pay if they go back home and it helps them get a job here.
However most US born see little benefit to an advanced degree - a BS gets them in the door of a major employer, often for more $ than they would make as a professor.
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All-TigerNet [12233]
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Re: Look at the PhD candidates in our graduation programs
Jun 28, 2020, 6:33 PM
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"The vast majority in science and engineering majors are foreigners"
It's apparently been that way a long time. When I was an undergrad ('84-'88) at Clemson in Electrical Engineering - I only saw one American graduate assistant the entire time I was there. All the rest of the GA's were foreign (most of which from Asia). Quite honestly it was rather discouraging and at times even detrimental to the learning process.
Every one of my labs was taught exclusively by these foreign GA's. While I'm sure these GA's were brilliant people, their grasp of conversational English was rudimentary at best and most of my lab instruction suffered greatly because of it. If the printed lab materials didn't sufficiently explain all that you were doing then you were screwed because these GA's could not adequately answer or explain things in English.
Looking back on it, I regret that I never went to the department heads regarding this issue. I guess being an 18/19 year old, I was a too timid to go raising a stink to these elderly department heads. If I had encountered this when I was 25, I would have been in the department heads office ripping their a.s.s over this issue. Funny how 6 years of adult maturing and a combat tour can change one's willingness to speak up.
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110%er [5448]
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Same was true in 78-83 in Electrical Engineering...
Jun 29, 2020, 12:07 PM
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I had a class where the GA called roll the first day and students did not recognize their own name.
I did co-op, thus the five year stay. One of the best decisions of my college stay.
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Legend [17215]
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A few foreign technical guys made some major
Jun 28, 2020, 6:07 PM
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science, engineering, space and weapon breakthroughs that have benefited the United States over the years.
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Head Coach [781]
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Because they fill positions that no one wants
Jun 28, 2020, 6:48 PM
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I've spoken with Indian friends here about it and there are not many jobs will hire them because of the H1B process. So this eliminates most bar/restaurant jobs and clerical jobs, which is what about 90% of working students. So they work for Aramark, meaning has on campus food workers and they are usually the best workers. You'll see a PHD candidates flipping burgers in the cafeteria. Aramark is big enough to handle all of the paperwork that comes along with their hiring, whereas a small business will probably pass. The real issue is that they have been overrepresented as grad students which can be correlated to culture. Grad/PhD students basically live in poverty until they graduate, which is usually until they are about 30. Most American students are just not willing to do that anymore. Most Americans with PhDs nowadays got them later in life. The issue is more nuanced.
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Orange Blooded [4896]
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Very true. The returns aren’t there for most “native born” students
Jun 28, 2020, 9:04 PM
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PhDs don’t make that much comparatively. If they were paid a lot better you’d see more US born people getting PhDs - and tuition go up even more to cover their salaries.
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