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All-In [42136]
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Lemme put the TCU thing to rest right now.
Aug 3, 2015, 11:34 AM
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TCU is a private university. Protection under the First Amendment for students does not apply there like it does at a public school.
Case closed. No need to debate it.
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Oculus Spirit [79428]
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Little chickenshits like that Kelsey person need to be
Aug 3, 2015, 11:46 AM
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beaten though.
I do think we're to a point now where the Universities feel like they own the students. Punishing them for incidents off campus, etc. They like to stick their noses into every facet of your life that they can while you're enrolled.
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All-In [42136]
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Well, aside from the suggestion...
Aug 3, 2015, 11:50 AM
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That a college girl should be beaten for expressing an opposing opinion, yeah, I agree that universities try to overstep boundaries with students. Universities have long behaved like they're their own fiefdom and can operate as they please. Clemson is no exception.
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Oculus Spirit [79428]
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She did a lot more than expressed an opposing opinion
Aug 3, 2015, 11:53 AM
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from what I read. Sounds like she's the one who couldn't handle opposing opinions, considering she promoted going after his personal life by having people contact the university. People like that need a taste of their own medicine from time to time.
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All-In [42136]
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I'm sure she sucks
Aug 3, 2015, 11:54 AM
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And probably pretty uptight, too. But it is what it is. TCU can do as they please in this case.
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Oculus Spirit [79428]
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Well yeah, I'm not arguing that
Aug 3, 2015, 12:01 PM
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Little Kelsey's name ought to be published though, I just can't stand people like that.
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Orange Blooded [3590]
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First Amendment rights do not apply? C'mon, now.***
Aug 3, 2015, 11:49 AM
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All-In [42136]
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If you attend a private school
Aug 3, 2015, 11:51 AM
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That receives no public funds, yes, you do not have First Amendment protection when they punish you for your speech.
First Amendment applies to government abuses of speech. Can you tell me where the government got involved here?
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: If you attend a private school
Aug 3, 2015, 11:56 AM
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A public university could rightfully do the same thing though. Just as your boss could fire you for saying something on twitter. The government won't get involved but your school or employer sure can.
The kid has a right to post whatever he wants on twitter, doesn't mean the school can't react public or private.
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All-In [42136]
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A public school would not be able to do this.
Aug 3, 2015, 11:58 AM
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Not without risking a lawsuit.
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Oculus Spirit [81049]
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All-In [28802]
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OT would probably know a lot about this***
Aug 3, 2015, 2:03 PM
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All-In [42136]
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I thought they had reviewed and did away with them.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:09 PM
[ in reply to Doesn't Clemson have "free speech zones"? ] |
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I see it still applies for people not affiliated with Clemson. I guess they don't want folks busting up in a classroom and protesting, which makes sense.
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Oculus Spirit [81049]
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I'm sure thats part of it.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:19 PM
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But not all of it.
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All-In [31887]
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CU Medallion [73569]
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the only problem I see here is
Aug 3, 2015, 11:54 AM
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when blacks start ranting to kill cops after say ferguson killing. Will that get the same treatment.
The main point here is, they have just gone down a slippery slope as social media police. This will be brought to light now. Wait til a football player says something at tcu on social media like that. They will be in an awkward position for sure.
I think its unwise for a school to start policing social media of all it's students. Think of how many students say stupid #### on twitter and buddybook. Again, slippery slope.
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All-In [42136]
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What same treatment?
Aug 3, 2015, 11:56 AM
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If a TCU student advocates killing cops, they won't get the same treatment? Doubt it.
There is no slippery slope. Private schools have been doing this for years. When it wasn't social media, it was print speech and spoken speech. They're private. They can do as they please. This isn't some new anomaly.
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CU Medallion [73569]
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you know what i mean
Aug 3, 2015, 12:00 PM
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a school gets into policing social media, you better be fair from here on out or there will be some serious outrage from the students. It will get ugly if they choose to pick and choose what they choose to punish and are not fair about it. Just this one incident is already causing outrage. People will be scouring social media now to report this crap just for fairness.
never said they did anything wrong in the eyes of the law, but this will get ugly down the road imo.
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All-In [42136]
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They probably won't be fair about it.
Aug 3, 2015, 12:05 PM
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And their punishment is pretty ridiculous. My point is that they're free to do it. Homeboy shouldn't have gone to a private Christian school if he wanted rational actions from his admin.
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All-In [31887]
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Because Christian school admins can't be rational?....
Aug 3, 2015, 1:17 PM
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is that because they're Christian?
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All-In [42136]
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All-In [42136]
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I remember the first time I operated a message board.***
Aug 3, 2015, 1:36 PM
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All-In [31887]
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Ahh...but you have no problem....
Aug 3, 2015, 2:26 PM
[ in reply to I mean, there's a bit of a history. ] |
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believing many on here think that all Muslims are terrorists.
Makes perfect sense!
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Orange Blooded [3590]
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Censorship and no protection under the Constitution?
Aug 3, 2015, 12:18 PM
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If you, as an employee, make statements that reflect badly on your employer, I see the logic. But two students, who have know each other since grade school, getting into a tizzy on social media?
I hear the ACLU's footsteps.
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All-In [42136]
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I don't know how much clearer I can make this
Aug 3, 2015, 12:20 PM
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Violation of the U.S. Constitution and First Amendment rights has to come from a government entity or a publicly funded institution. Like Clemson, for example.
TCU is a PRIVATE university. It is not attached to the government. The First Amendment does not apply.
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Orange Blooded [3590]
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So blacks can be discriminated against at private u's?***
Aug 3, 2015, 12:30 PM
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All-In [42136]
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Are you arguing that's a First Amendment issue?***
Aug 3, 2015, 12:31 PM
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Orange Blooded [3590]
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No, I was speaking of Constitutional rights. You are correct
Aug 3, 2015, 12:48 PM
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in that universities are protected from the govt, but students are not protected from the universities. But this is changing. More and more lawsuits are slowly breaking down the power of the universities over students' free speech.
Seeing as how it is enlightened universities we are talking about, it shouldn't even be an issue.
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All-In [42136]
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Again, I'm not sure you're getting....
Aug 3, 2015, 12:53 PM
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The difference between a public and private university.
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Orange Blooded [3590]
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I am saying that none of our freedoms should be denied
Aug 3, 2015, 2:25 PM
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by any public or private organization.
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All-In [42136]
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And while I agree...
Aug 3, 2015, 3:40 PM
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I believe due to the legal matter here, not much, if anything, can be done.
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All-In [34105]
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Legend [15747]
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Way to put it to rest.***
Aug 3, 2015, 1:03 PM
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All-In [42136]
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Well, I guess I was foolish
Aug 3, 2015, 1:35 PM
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In thinking everyone here understands the difference between public and private institutions.
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Legend [15747]
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It's not possible that the issue is broader than the
Aug 3, 2015, 1:37 PM
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Constitutionality of the actions by TCU?
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All-In [42136]
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Legally, no.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:05 PM
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Look at the responses in the previous thread. People gnashing their teeth over legality and making crazy like "this is how Nazi Germany started".
It's a private school. Their actions may not be rational, but they're within their right to do it.
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Legend [15747]
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Okay, so when you said you were going to put the
Aug 3, 2015, 2:11 PM
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"TCU thing" to rest, the "TCU thing" was the application of first amendment rights considerations, and nothing else relating to the situation?
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All-In [42136]
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That'll teach me to use a vague word like "thing".***
Aug 3, 2015, 2:12 PM
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Legend [15747]
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That'll learn ya! Now...back to the topic...I would agree
Aug 3, 2015, 2:50 PM
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with you that this is not an issue of "Freedom of Speech". I also share your frustration at how often people throw around that term and...honestly...sound like idiots.
BUT...just because it's not a First Amendment issue does not mean that there are no legal implications. Just because the university is private doesn't mean they can do whatever they want. I would be surprised if a court didn't find them well within their rights if the kid sued them, but he could try to claim that they didn't follow their own stated procedures (for example, issuing a punishment before a required review/hearing format), and if the punishment resulted in damages (slander, loss of opportunity to get the education that he was paying for, etc), it wouldn't be out of the question that he could win. That is NOT to say that I think he SHOULD win...I don't like the fact that we live in an overly-litigious society, but that doesn't change the fact that we do.
And of course, my original point is that the legality of TCU's actions, and certainly the constitutionality, are small parts of the overall issues coming from this event. Cyber bullying, hypocrisy, bias, race relations, the role of higher education in promoting freedom of thought over the quality of thought, or vice versa. The case is, in my opinion, far from closed.
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All-In [42136]
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Point.***
Aug 3, 2015, 3:41 PM
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All-In [31446]
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Yeah... So
Aug 3, 2015, 1:24 PM
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This is eerily similar to something I went through a few years ago as a result of something I posted on this very website. Somebody went after my personal life, and emailed posts and personal information to the deans office at my medical school that subsequently led to the school suspending me for a year.
There is NO justifying what that girl did to this guy, or the university's response. Going after the personal life of someone you disagree with or have some stupid argument with is petty, cowardly, and unforgivable.
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Legend [15747]
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I can't believe that happened. That's awful.
Aug 3, 2015, 1:28 PM
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Sorry to read it. Unquestionably things have gotten out of hand with this righteous outrage stuff. Anyone who would pull something like that...don't kid yourself. You're not out for justice. You're just a bully.
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All-TigerNet [13605]
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Re: I can't believe that happened. That's awful.
Aug 3, 2015, 1:30 PM
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This^^
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110%er [9107]
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I remember that. Guy was a #####.
Aug 3, 2015, 1:31 PM
[ in reply to Yeah... So ] |
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No justification for that, and regardless of whether you have the legal "right" to do something, that doesn't always justify it or make it right.
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All-In [42136]
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You are correct, sir.
Aug 3, 2015, 1:34 PM
[ in reply to Yeah... So ] |
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Tigernet has a few of those failures in life, and some of them occupy the P&R forum. Most lurk, though.
And I also agree with you about TCU. I don't like the university's response, but legally, they didn't cross a line.
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Oculus Spirit [81049]
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My thoughts are the one who did that posts occasionally.
Aug 3, 2015, 1:45 PM
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Used to be much more prolific however.
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All-In [42136]
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Drop the name, yo.***
Aug 3, 2015, 2:07 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93650]
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Re: Drop the name, yo.***
Aug 3, 2015, 2:09 PM
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Drop the scok when you get it, tmails?
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All-In [42136]
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I say post it publicly.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:11 PM
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Sounds like the guy deserves public shaming.
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All-In [31446]
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don't give him attention, he'd probably enjoy it***
Aug 3, 2015, 2:13 PM
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Oculus Spirit [81049]
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I can't prove it.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:16 PM
[ in reply to I say post it publicly. ] |
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It's just this poster mentioned doing something eerily similar a year or 2 later, and I picked up on it immediately.
If I told you who I think it is (and I won't, cause I can't 100% prove it), you'd probably be like yeah, that guy seems to be that much of a pr!ck to do something like that.
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Oculus Spirit [78865]
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and after that
Aug 3, 2015, 1:37 PM
[ in reply to Yeah... So ] |
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did you even enjoy the trip?
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CU Medallion [56059]
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Did anything ever happen to the POS who pulled that?
Aug 3, 2015, 1:46 PM
[ in reply to Yeah... So ] |
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Did he just get band and then come back all, "What is a scok?"
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Oculus Spirit [81049]
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I don't think he was ever banned.***
Aug 3, 2015, 1:49 PM
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All-In [31446]
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No, I let it go.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:01 PM
[ in reply to Did anything ever happen to the POS who pulled that? ] |
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Anyone psycho enough to do that probably wouldn't stop with my school if I did anything about it. It's in the past now, I didn't suffer long term for it, and maybe learned something valuable as well.
Just gets under my skin to read similar stories. What it boils down to is that you just cannot write anything that could be construed as even modestly controversial on the Internet or social media. I mean for christs sake the guy on this forum hated me because of a band I like. There are awful people who don't think twice about ruining someone's life over such small things. Unfortunately there are also schools and employers who won't have your back either.
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Oculus Spirit [81049]
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So much this.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:12 PM
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Thats part of why no buddybook, instagram or anything else that would moderately let people know anything about me.
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All-TigerNet [12066]
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Need some clarification
Aug 3, 2015, 2:30 PM
[ in reply to No, I let it go. ] |
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Is the band Nickelback or Rascal Flatts? If so, you deserve to die and I hope you burn in hell
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All-In [28802]
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What's sad is the mob following along w/ these people
Aug 3, 2015, 1:59 PM
[ in reply to Yeah... So ] |
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I think I read where something like a few thousand people retweeted this horrible girl, and that's probably what led the TCU's cowardly punishment. It's amazing to me how callous some of these social media mob justice warriors are about other people's lives. They clearly don't think of the people they encounter on the internet as real people, with real lives like their own. They just want to get the attention they think will give them power over other people, and abusing social media is the easiest way for them to do it.
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All-In [31446]
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It really is sad.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:04 PM
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Probably says something about how devoid of empathy our culture is now.
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Oculus Spirit [93650]
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Re: It really is sad.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:16 PM
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I thought it was how emotional control is lost when passionate politics is questioned. I remember you roughing up a few here, perhaps even playing not nice at times. I'm in no way giving you blame or relieving the perp from the horrible act. There's no excuse for fuking with someone personal life over something so trivial as politics or religion.
Actually, it goes against everything I believe and one of the two Laws to which Christians are commanded to obey. What he did wasn't the act of a Christian. I've never been mad at anyone long enough to carry out even the shortest deviant plan.
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CU Medallion [56059]
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Oculus Spirit [81049]
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The joys of social media.
Aug 3, 2015, 3:01 PM
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In the end, nothing good ever comes from it. Unless divorces, the Kardashians and fake celebrity are good things.
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All-In [28802]
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Oculus Spirit [93650]
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Absolutely.
Aug 3, 2015, 2:05 PM
[ in reply to Yeah... So ] |
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The summbich cost you a year of maximum income. Just over some stupid political bullchit. What a chickenchitmofo!
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All-In [31887]
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Am I the only one left that doesn't know who did it?***
Aug 3, 2015, 2:30 PM
[ in reply to Yeah... So ] |
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All-In [42136]
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Nope.***
Aug 3, 2015, 3:39 PM
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CU Medallion [50635]
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Oculus Spirit [83073]
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Are you sure? I'm assuming TCU receives federal
Aug 3, 2015, 5:25 PM
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financial aid funds.
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All-In [42136]
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I'm afraid not.
Aug 3, 2015, 6:02 PM
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The private institution is not considered any part of the government.
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Oculus Spirit [83073]
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Of course they aren't part of the govt. but they do receive
Aug 3, 2015, 6:32 PM
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federal financial aid.
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All-In [42136]
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Are you talking about financial aid available to students?
Aug 3, 2015, 7:15 PM
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Because that's different than state government providing funding for the university's actual operations. Either way, federal financial aid for students doesn't disqualify a school's private status and doesn't require them to operate under First Amendment rules.
You can get federal financial aid at Bob Jones and they can still subject you to all of their rules that would be unconstitutional at a public university.
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