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Topic: Graph of Clemson football success through the years
Replies: 21   Last Post: Aug 20, 2019 10:35 AM by: Harley®
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Graph of Clemson football success through the years

[2]
Posted: Aug 19, 2019 10:33 AM
 

https://twitter.com/ESPN_BillC/status/1162720681051787264/photo/1

Some observations (nothing we didn't already know but it's all illustrated well here):

-Frank Howard did a lot for Clemson but he wasn't a very good football coach

-Having also just looked at the Florida graph, Charlie Pell was a little before my time but dang he was a dirty, win-at-all-costs coach. Drastically improved both Clemson and Florida in a short period of time and then left them both to burn with major sanctions

-The decline after Ford left was realllly drastic

Here is the Florida graph showing the rapid improvement under Pell and then the effect of the 59! sanctions.

https://twitter.com/ESPN_BillC/status/1163129886384578560/photo/1


CDS didn't sell cars, he was a shopping center leasing agent***

[3]
Posted: Aug 19, 2019 10:37 AM
 



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After Ford was forced out...

[1]
Posted: Aug 19, 2019 10:43 AM
 

the University made two consecutive unbelievably stupid coaching hires (Ken Hatfield and Tommy West) which led to the decline.

The University of Arkansas and Frank Broyles are still sending Max Lennon Christmas cards every year as an thank you for taking Hatfield off their hands.

Tommy West, although a great guy, was totally completely and entire unprepared for the head coaching job at Clemson. He simply did not have the coaching or recruiting experience to lead a major Division 1 program.

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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Hatfield was 55-17-1 at a Division I school (Arkansas) and

[1]
Posted: Aug 19, 2019 11:12 AM
 

ran a squeaky clean program, so I wouldn't call it a "stupid" hire. In hindsight we would have probably gone with a different person, but at the time the administration thought it was a good hire.

Agree 100% on TW -- he did not have the requisite experience needed for the Clemson job.

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The administration did not think it was a good hire...


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 11:16 AM
 

Max Lennon made the unilateral decision to hire Ken Hatfield.

In fact, there were numerous people within the administration who were adamantly opposed to hiring Ken Hatfield including Bobby Robinson.

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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Given the facts available, why would they have been against


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 11:19 AM
 

hiring Hatfield? What did they know?

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I think most of the heartburn...


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 11:26 AM
 

stemmed from the fact that Lennon was largely acting unilaterally coupled with the fact that Danny Ford was an immensely popular coach.

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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Yeah i don't think Hatfield was a bad hire at the time it

[1]
Posted: Aug 19, 2019 11:34 AM
 

was made, it's just difficult to make great hires in CFB. Even quite a few coaching hires that look like sure things don't work out. That's why you don't run off a great coach when you find one. That was ultimately the mistake made at Clemson much more than the hiring of Hatfield.


Re: Yeah i don't think Hatfield was a bad hire at the time it


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 12:29 PM
 

When I heard the Hatfield announcement I screamed at the TV, "They've hired the only coach in America more conservative (on offense) than Danny Ford!"


Up until a year or so ago Nick Saban was extremely


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 2:20 PM
 

conservative offensively.


Re: After Ford was forced out...

[1]
Posted: Aug 19, 2019 11:23 AM
 

My first home game as a student was 1994 versus NC State. We came into the game ranked but got smashed by an unranked Pack team. Students were screaming to "bring back Hatfield" which of course was a joke because we didn't want him either. Later got crushed by UGA and the coots.

The next year we were a little bit better. Went into the bowl game against Syracuse and got punked by Donovan McNabb in the rain. All I remember is Brian Dawkins chasing guys all over the field as our defense could not stop them and Priester couldn't gain a yard. What a miserable experience.

West was way in over his head. I think Clemson thought they may get lucky and find another Assistant like Danny that could energize the program.

I thought the Bowden hire was a good one at first and that did not last long. Only thing that kept his job was beating the coots almost every year and had one fantastic finish to a season where we beat FSU and Tennessee. Other than that his tenure was full of underachievement.

Then TDP hires Dabo. Can't say I saw that coming at the time, but I remember my coot brother asking me what I thought and I figured he could do no worse than Bowden. Dabo has surpassed every expectation I ever had for Clemson football. I would have been happy just having a solid program that could pull an upset and win some bowl games. Heck no, we hire a guy that had much bigger plans than that and how awesome it is!!


Good post but if you were around in the 80s like me

[2]
Posted: Aug 19, 2019 11:52 AM
 

you should’ve never let go of the fact that we could and should be an elite program especially when we stand head and shoulders above everyone else in the ACC (except FSU) in terms of attendance and fan support. That being said Dabo has taken us far beyond my expectations that were based off of what Ford was able to do. Great time to be a Tiger!

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Frank Howard *actually was* a fine football coach ...

[1]
Posted: Aug 19, 2019 11:21 AM
 

... his tenure began just as WWII drained Clemson of manpower, then he had some really nice seasons in the 1950s before the ACC pulled the rug out from under Clemson and the other conference programs for the rest of his time as Tiger Head Coach.

The truth is that for at least half of his career he was coaching with one hand tied behind his back.

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Re: Frank Howard *actually was* a fine football coach ...

[1]
Posted: Aug 20, 2019 10:35 AM
 

Between 48 and 59 Clemson under Coach Howard played in a couple of Orange Bowls, a couple of Gator Bowls, the Sugar Bowl and the Blue Bonnet Bowl. During those years Clemson was a very small southern military school who ranked among the top 20 winningest football programs in the nation. When the ACC was formed in 1953, Clemson had no better than the 4th best football program behind Maryland, Duke, and UNC. When Howard retired no team had more football conference championships than Clemson and Howard had won 3 titles in his last 6 years as head coach.

Coach Howard laid the foundation for modern Clemson football, was an entertaining personality that brought media attention to the school and he was the dean of ACC football coaches. He operated the last decade of his career under ACC academic restrictions that put the league in almost Ivy League status. Additionally he was approachable and always had time to talk to any student who went to see him in Fike.

It is absurd to suggest Howard was anything but an excellent college football coach. Or so I think.

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Re: Graph of Clemson football success through the years


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 11:40 AM
 

I really like how the cookie ultimately crumbled. Ya'll?

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If you like these sorts of graphs (I do)

[1]
Posted: Aug 19, 2019 12:13 PM
 

here's the "non-squished" version
http://www.winsipedia.com/clemson


Good stuff there!***


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 12:42 PM
 



2019 white level member

Yeah except for the inaccuracies.***


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 1:21 PM
 



2019 white level member

He's doing them for pretty much every P5 program and


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 2:23 PM
 

i think some others as well, so it's probably unrealistic to expect him to get every single detail 100% correct.

What are the inaccuracies here?


Re: Yeah except for the inaccuracies.***


Posted: Aug 20, 2019 9:37 AM
 

Whats inaccurate? may be more complexities or more subtle points but the data is correct...

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Re: Graph of Clemson football success through the years


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 12:42 PM
 

Started in '72 (Hootie Ingram), have seen the good, the bad, and the ugly, and then here comes Dabo! Remember, it didn't happen overnight, but we've been elite now for 8 years! Remember when Dabo told the BOT "I want Florida , Michigan, Alabama, et all to to be saying they want to be more like Clemson?" Well, guess what, he made it happen; now they want to be like us! Let's enjoy the golden age of Clemson Football folks, savor every moment! Kudos to TDP and the Administration / BOT for their belief and support. We're now more like the SEC than the SEC!


No! No we're not at all like the SEC!


Posted: Aug 19, 2019 2:32 PM
 

Clemson have ethics and morals and character. Otherwise.... Nope, Clemson is Clemson...period.


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