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Orange Blooded [2361]
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For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 5:28 PM
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in college baseball? I was recently told it was common at S Car - is it common elsewhere? Is that how we run our baseball program?
Thanks in advance.
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110%er [5912]
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Re: For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 5:31 PM
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Yes at usc. No at other places, but shuffling the 11.7 scholarships is an annual ritual.
usc is notorious for grossly oversigning and then "cutting" as in players don't get scholarships during fall tryouts/practice.
Ask deroberts to explain it.
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Orange Blooded [2361]
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Yet another argument for anti over-signing rule by NCAA.***
May 26, 2014, 5:34 PM
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CU Medallion [67659]
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Re: For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 5:34 PM
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everyone here thinks they are in the know on baseball but almost no one is.
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Orange Blooded [2245]
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Re: For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 6:03 PM
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I beg your pardon, sir! We know all about not only baseball but also football, basketball, which coaches to hire or fire, AD's to hire and fire, presidents to hire or fire, which conference to belong to, when we will join that conference, how to recruit in all sports, we know when our team gets a bad call from refs and umps while we are 200 miles away from the game, we know how conference presidents and athletic directors should vote on (well anything).
WE ARE, TIGERNET! 
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Orange Blooded [3257]
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Yep, that about sums it up!***
May 26, 2014, 10:12 PM
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CU Medallion [55284]
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Re: For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 5:52 PM
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To be honest, I don't have a clue of how many players the coots sign. But if they are over signing, I can promise you that they are kicking players they already have to the curb. I don't think that they have a problem telling a college athlete that they no longer have a scholarship.
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Asst Coach [713]
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Re: For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 6:01 PM
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You know the topic stated for those in the know! At every school there is the mysterious transfer to be closer to home. To be closer to girlfriend to get more playing time.
If it involves your school it is just normal kids and their ability to adapt. If it is anyone else it is them kicking them to the curb.
Those in the know understand the numbers always work themselves out and it is a big deal to manage it in every sport
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Asst Coach [713]
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Re: For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 6:04 PM
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By the way I am not in the know just stating an opinion.
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Orange Blooded [2609]
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Re: For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 6:13 PM
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Well Lknchkn thats a first
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Legend [16900]
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Re: For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 6:06 PM
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I know that there are kids who have been recruited to play baseball at SCar that have not survived roster cuts to make the team. They've discussed some of these kids on coot friendly radio programs here in columbia. What I've never figured out is how this ties to scholarship restrictions? Do you really have kids getting partial baseball scholarships not making the team? They're already on campus going to school. How would the NCAA possibly track it?
I've kept this one under my hat awhile, but a parent of a child in my son's class has an older son at SCar. She was proud to mention that her son was on "full scholarship" to play baseball. I politely inquired if he had earned an academic scholarship as well since, as I understood it, baseball was almost always a partial scholarship sport. Her response, as matter of factly as could be, was that no one on that baseball team pays a thing to go to school and she doesn't know how they work it out but she doesn't pay a cent.
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110%er [5093]
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Wouldn't surprise me
May 26, 2014, 6:12 PM
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I would imagine most schools do anything they can to work around those scholarship limits.
I know Vanderbilt is extremely lucky with their needs based financial based system, they can offer almost every kid a full ride rather easily.
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Orange Blooded [2361]
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Re: Reasonable limits (~25?) for baseball are long overdue***
May 26, 2014, 6:41 PM
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Trainer [47]
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Re: Reasonable limits (~25?) for baseball are long overdue***
May 26, 2014, 7:42 PM
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NCAA rules limit the number of kids that can be on scholarship to 27. Each of those must receive at least a 1/3 scholarship. When those 27 enroll in the fall they are on the roster for the full academic year.
The school is allowed 8 walk ons to be on the 35 man roster. Tryouts are held in the fall for these 8 spots. If a scholarship player is hurt before rosters are set in the fall and will be out for the year a school can name a walk on fill his roster spot. But once the 35 man roster is set you cannot drop or add even for season ending injuries.
Walkons can not earn scholarships once they are on campus for that academic year. So it is crazy to cut a scholarship player during the year. You can' t then give that scholarship to a walk on like you can in football.
What Tanner and Holbrook have done is make sure that every kid in this state who has any possibility of playing college baseball is aggressively recruited to try out. Typically they will have 25- 40 kids trying out for those 8 roster spots. A lot of kids try out 2 or 3 different times.
Jack has done very little to foster relationship with HS coaches or players in this state. He has not been encouraging to non scholarship kids to come and try out.
The other piece to the puzzle is Ray and now Chad recruit JUCOS. A lot of the kids who tried out and didn't make the team are then guided to JUCO or Division 2 schools and monitored. If they develop guess where they transfer to?
USC has spent 15 years doing this unchallenged by Jack and his staff. They have a plan and relationships that will take Jack and his staff 5 years to compete with , IF they even choose to do so.
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Addict [418]
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Re: Reasonable limits (~25?) for baseball are long overdue******
May 26, 2014, 7:52 PM
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Addict [418]
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Re: Reasonable limits (~25?) for baseball are long overdue******
May 26, 2014, 7:55 PM
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Win lose makes a valid argument. During my time, Jack wasn't very friendly to the walk on process. Other than his own boy (was one no matter how you shake it) can't think of one that made the 35 or played in a game. I may be wrong, but i can't remember I new face joining after recruiting was over.
At other schools, it's more similar to football but not at Clemson. Walk on tryouts were a joke hosted after a practice. Few grounders, catch this and throw it there, and here's 15 pithes split between 3 at bats.
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Letterman [268]
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I am very close to someone who was a walkon member of the
May 26, 2014, 10:04 PM
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baseball team in 2010 and 2011. This individual played at a juco, graduated from there got into Clemson on his own, then talked to Coach Leggett about a tryout. Ithe tryout was more involved than you described, but was done in one afternoon. He was called back a couple of days later and told when to report. He got a few AB's and played a few innings in the field.
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Trainer [47]
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Re: Reasonable limits (~25?) for baseball are long overdue***
May 26, 2014, 7:55 PM
[ in reply to Re: Reasonable limits (~25?) for baseball are long overdue*** ] |
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And another thing: USC has had stability for so long that they are having a lot of ex players enter the HS coaching ranks. Tanner has been very willing to make phone calls and lobby for his ex players in this state. Thus the circle completes itself.
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Addict [418]
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Re: Reasonable limits (~25?) for baseball are long overdue***
May 26, 2014, 8:10 PM
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On that point. Rather have ex players entering the pros though but get what you're saying.
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Addict [441]
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Sounds legit.***
May 26, 2014, 11:40 PM
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That's why I haven't brought it up before but you can check out my post history. I don't go around spreading a bunch of wild rumors. I'm not going to share names, but her son is a member of the current team. She said it not me, and yes she simply might not understand how his scholarship / financial aid is being broken down. But, if a parent has a child in college and doesn't know how his financial affairs are being facilitated then something outside the intentions of the NCAA scholarship limitations is going on.
And I know, according to the official radio station of Gamecock athletics, that scholarships players have failed to make the 35 man roster. No mention of injuries was made, but that doesn't mean they don't claim them for the purpose of making everything look on the up and up. It's actually a pretty good system. Use a scholarship to get a kid on campus and promptly cut him before the season begins. Encourage him to transfer to a junior college where you'll "monitor" his progress. Keep your active roster stocked with upperclassmen and transfer back over the junior college kids who have shown the most progress. You keep more talent away from the opposition while essentially building your own farm league.
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All-In [34518]
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CU Medallion [64517]
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In addition to Lottery money for the in-state kids***
May 27, 2014, 8:14 AM
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CU Guru [1679]
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Re: For those in-the-know: Is over-signing and cutting common
May 26, 2014, 6:12 PM
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It is so common in the SEC that the SEC Director issued a statement that the SEC would stop it. That hasn't happened. Tennessee had something like 34 or 35 signees last year. You have to assume that somebody is going to get "fired."
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110%er [5912]
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They signed 22 players.
May 26, 2014, 6:20 PM
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They have 12 juniors and 2 (TWO) seniors on the roster.
DO THE MATH!
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