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YOUR BALANCE
Front Page Story: Five years in, Swinney has program pointed in the right direction
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Front Page Story: Five years in, Swinney has program pointed in the right direction


Oct 16, 2013, 11:22 AM

 
Five years in, Swinney has program pointed in the right direction

Clemson head coach Dabo Swinney took over as the interim coach five years ago last Sunday. In that time, he has made the Clemson program relevant again, and he has the program pointed in the right direction. Full Story »


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Re: Front Page Story: Five years in, Swinney has program pointed in the right direction


Oct 16, 2013, 11:53 AM

I don't think anyone could have done more for Clemson. Dabo has delighted me with his attitude, character, and coaching.

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I love how people try to demean Dabo....


Oct 16, 2013, 11:59 AM

...outsiders, he!!, even our own people. He is as far from some in this business as a coach can get (the negative side), while still getting results. I hope he stays a long, long time.

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"The traditional gift for a five-year anniversary is wood"


Oct 16, 2013, 12:12 PM

I thought that was every year?

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Re: "The traditional gift for a five-year anniversary is wood"


Oct 16, 2013, 12:38 PM

a "Thumbs-Up" for you. Well played

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Re: "The traditional gift for a five-year anniversary is wood"


Oct 16, 2013, 1:33 PM [ in reply to "The traditional gift for a five-year anniversary is wood" ]

I wondered who would be the first to mention it...

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I see what you did there. +1***


Dec 6, 2018, 10:21 AM [ in reply to "The traditional gift for a five-year anniversary is wood" ]



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"Dabo crushed my soul." --- Classof09


Other '08 hires so successful they moved up. Dabo hired '09.


Oct 16, 2013, 3:27 PM

There were 18 FBS head coaching changes in 2008, including Kevin Sumlin, et al. (See links below.) Seven (not 6) of those HCs are still at the same school. (Ken Niumatalolo is still at Navy overseeing some of Navy's best success in decades.) But it’s misleading to only look at the coaches who are still at the same school when at least 3 of those 18 coaches (Kevin Sumlin, Jerry Kill, and Larry Fedora) were so successful that they moved up the ladder to bigger jobs— and Sumlin instantly turned Texas A&M around into one of the nation’s elite teams.

Dabo was hired in 2009, not 2008, so it's also odd to pick 2008 for comparison. Then again, two of the head coaches that were hired in 2009 along with Dabo (Gene Chizik & Chip Kelly) played each other for a national championship one year after being hired, the same year that Dabo went 6-7. And Chip Kelly was so outstanding that NFL hired him away from Oregon.

No doubt that Dabo is doing a good job now and has the program headed in the right direction, but Dabo made lots of unnecessary newbie mistakes over the first couple years of on-the-job training, and as a result the team underperformed, losing to way more than their fair share of underdogs and less-talented teams-- culminating in the disastrous 6-7 season of 2010. Unlike the terrible situations that Cutcliffe or Briles (the miracle worker) inherited at Duke & Baylor, Dabo inherited excellent player-talent (including future NFLers like Spiller & Ford) facilities, & support, at a football school. If Clemson had hired a good, affordable, seasoned coach, like Kevin Sumlin, could Clemson have done better, SOONER? Seems very likely. Could Clemson have hired a worse coach? Sure. There were some stinkers hired in '08 & '09 that got canned. Does this article paint an incomplete picture? Yes.

2008 Head Coaching Changes:
http://www.collegefootballpoll.com/coaching_changes_2008.html

2009 Head Coaching Changes:
http://www.collegefootballpoll.com/coaching_changes_2009.html

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And you're still bitter about it I see.***


Oct 16, 2013, 6:16 PM



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"I know, I know: The Southeastern Conference is the greatest conference in the history of sports, and the talent is far superior to the Pac 10 and Big 10 and NFC West combined."


Pointing out the article's bias means I'm bitter? How odd.***


Oct 16, 2013, 6:47 PM



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No...


Oct 16, 2013, 9:45 PM

Pointing it out once does not mean you're bitter. Pointing it out repeatedly for 5 years now means you're bitter.

Let's not pretend this is a singular occurrence. I've seen you post your opinion on the Dabo hire numerous times here and at other sites. That's your opinion and that's fine; but at least admit you have your own bias.

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"I know, I know: The Southeastern Conference is the greatest conference in the history of sports, and the talent is far superior to the Pac 10 and Big 10 and NFC West combined."


For 5 yrs. I cited the bias in an article published TODAY???


Oct 17, 2013, 1:07 AM

That makes no sense. I pointed out how this article cherry-picked data by picking a subset of the 2008 coaching hires and pointing out that this article chose to compare 2008 hires when Dabo was hired in 2009. Since the article was published today, obviously I haven't done that before, and certainly not for the last five years.

You want me to admit that I have bias? Of course I do. Everyone does.

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Don't be absurd.


Oct 17, 2013, 1:00 PM

We both know I was referring to your disagreement with the Dabo hire. Your response to the pro-Dabo article was just the most recent example of you getting on your soapbox again.

And if it's so obvious that everyone has bias, then what was the point of your original post? To state that an opinion piece had bias? Wow, very insightful; great contribution.

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"I know, I know: The Southeastern Conference is the greatest conference in the history of sports, and the talent is far superior to the Pac 10 and Big 10 and NFC West combined."


I provided balance, pointing out errors & cherry-picking.


Oct 17, 2013, 2:20 PM

But for some reason you called me "bitter" for providing balance and pointing out the errors & cherry-picking. Yet you didn't insult the article's author for his errors and cherry-picking, nor did you insult the other posters of sunshiny comments. Apparently your bias causes you to insult people who express differing views. I have my biases, but at least I'm tolerant and respectful of others' views. If I disagree with a post, I make a civil counterpoint, not a juvenile insult.

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Re: Other '08 hires so successful they moved up. Dabo hired '09.


Oct 16, 2013, 6:24 PM [ in reply to Other '08 hires so successful they moved up. Dabo hired '09. ]

Sumlin is as overrated as a coach could possibly be. He is Gene Chizik getting a second year of Cam Newton. No legitimate serious football program would put up with his complete disregard of defense. Add to that, without Johnny Football, his offense is barely above mediocre.

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Jstone D329 - “ It’s ok to want a coaching change”
Brownell @Clemson: 8 seasons ranked 50th or worse by Sports Reference’s SRS
1-29: Brad Brownell road record against ranked ACC opponents
142, 161, 294, 307, 293, 166, 225, 180, 260, 164, 141, 72, 68 - assist rankings amongst all D1 programs during Brownell's tenure


So Sumlin's success at Houston was all just luck?***


Oct 16, 2013, 6:43 PM



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Re: So Sumlin's success at Houston was all just luck?***


Oct 16, 2013, 7:01 PM

Are you comparing the challenges of Conference USA to those of a BCS conference school? He allowed mediocre teams to score buckets of points against his Houston teams. I believe it will catch up with him big time in the next year and he'll get to battle with the Mississippi schools for worst team in the west. Plus, he only really had one good year at Houston. They were terrible in 2010 and lost 5 and 4 games in 2008 and 2009.

Edited to add- A&M is currently 96 in Scoring Defense and 113 in Total Defense. This is a career long deficiency.


Message was edited by: viztiz®


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Jstone D329 - “ It’s ok to want a coaching change”
Brownell @Clemson: 8 seasons ranked 50th or worse by Sports Reference’s SRS
1-29: Brad Brownell road record against ranked ACC opponents
142, 161, 294, 307, 293, 166, 225, 180, 260, 164, 141, 72, 68 - assist rankings amongst all D1 programs during Brownell's tenure


Re: So Sumlin's success at Houston was all just luck?***


Oct 16, 2013, 8:45 PM

Sumlin's Houston was 12-1 in 2011 and 10-4 in 2009, so I'd say he had 2 good years, not one. But my point was that the article limited the analysis to 2008 coaches who were still at the same school, which is silly when the only reason that a guy like Sumlin isn't at the same school is that he was so successful that he landed a bigger job (and in Sumlin's case he's been successful at his new job).

You may be right about Sumlin's Ds, but if his Os can outscore his opponents' Os, he'll get W's and be considered successful. Typically teams with high-scoring quick-strike offenses have poor defensive stats because their Ds spend more time on the field. There have been numerous analyses showing this.

It's hard to imagine that Sumlin is so stupid or disdainful of defense that he wouldn't hire a good DC. But in any event, my point wasn't that Sumlin is the greatest coach ever. My point was that the article cherry-picked data to paint a rosy picture.

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Can't take your reply seriously when A. You include Gene


Oct 16, 2013, 7:19 PM [ in reply to Other '08 hires so successful they moved up. Dabo hired '09. ]

Chizik the one hit wonder, B. You say Dabo "inherited" great players like Spiller/Ford when HE recruited them and C. You include A&Ms coach who's success like Chizik's is tied to one player. I'd call you a coot but I'm sure that's been done. I'll just call you a bitter wannabe, and you can call Dabo and eat your crow after we whip the Seminoles on Saturday!!!

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Can't take your reply seriously when you didn't grasp mine.


Oct 16, 2013, 9:10 PM

My point was that the article cherry-picked data to paint a rosy picture. The author limited his 2008 HC hires to those still at the same school, and the author chose 2008 even though Dabo was hired in 2009. I assume that's because if the author had compared Dabo to the HC hires of 2009, he'd have to point out that 2 of those coaches played for the national championship in their 2nd season. My point wasn't that Gene Chizik is the greatest coach.

By "inherited" obviously I meant that Dabo took over a talented team, unlike Cutcliffe or Briles. Obviously Dabo was one of the recruiters. Duh.

If Sumlin's success is only tied to one player as you claim, then how do you explain Sumlin's success at Houston? Did Manziel play there too?

It seems that you either completely missed my point or you didn't like me pointing out the bias in the article so you grasped at straws and insulted me. Lame.

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One word: Continuity


Oct 16, 2013, 7:30 PM [ in reply to Other '08 hires so successful they moved up. Dabo hired '09. ]

I'll take those rookie mistakes the first two years over and over if Dabo can consistently field the kind of teams he has the last two years. If he's still got a ways to mature, that means we're only seeing the tip of the iceberg right now. By that logic, the best is yet to come.

I'm not sure Dabo leaves until his dream job comes knocking. I like that a lot better than having a revolving door of up-and-comers using us as a stepping stone.

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Inherited? You mean the talent he & the other coaches


Oct 17, 2013, 2:46 AM [ in reply to Other '08 hires so successful they moved up. Dabo hired '09. ]

brought here? Of course he was gonna make newbie mistakes, he was a new coach. The year Ellington was out for half the season & our sophomore qb played hurt every game, yea we had a bad season. Then the next year we won the conference, beat VT twice to win the conference. Yea we got our ##### handed to us in the Orange Bowl, but that was Kevin Steele's problem. Dabo fixed the problem, brought in Venable's who was by far the best defensive coordinator in the BEST offensive league in the country. We're number 3 in the country now, #### Dabo SUUUUUCKS

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Glad he said, "A chance to be relevant again."


Oct 16, 2013, 7:15 PM

Eyes on the prize.

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My favorite: "There is no finish line."


Oct 17, 2013, 2:04 PM

Continuous improvement!

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