|
Replies: 33
| visibility 1
|
All-TigerNet [14921]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 12314
Joined: 3/28/06
|
Derrick Henry YPC
Dec 12, 2015, 11:03 AM
|
|
Not making the case for Watson as much as the case for not-Henry, and I know I'm beating a dead horse here, but I was kind of blown away to see how far down the list of RBs based on YPC (at 5.86) Henry is.
In terms of YPC this year, he's ranked 34th!! That's very telling IMO of not being a necessarily great RB but a durable RB...
He's behind, among others, these guys on top 25 teams:
- Dalvin Cook (FSU), 2nd with 7.86 ypc
- Royce Freeman (Ore), 8th with 6.64 ypc
- CJ Prosise (ND), 9th with 6.62 ypc
- Elijah Hood (UNC), 13th with 6.53 ypc
- Leonard Fournette (LSU), 18th with 6.42 ypc
- Ezekiel Elliott (OSU), 20th with 6.38 ypc
- Marquise Williams (UNC) (QB), 27th with 6.15 ypc (LOL)
- Samaje Perine (OU), 28th with 6.12 ypc
FWIW, McCaffrey is 41st with 5.79...
http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/individual/907
Fournette is the interesting guy to look at. He has about 250 fewer yards total than Henry but has played 2 fewer games (LSU's first game cancelled and SECCG) and has about 70 fewer carries than Henry. Fournette had a bad game in their head-to-head matchup and was as a result banished from the Heisman Island by ESPN but he's by far the better running back IMO.
Henry has a ton of yards, no doubt, but he has by far more carries than anyone else as well. If you give me the ball 45 times a game I'll probably have pretty decent numbers too. Is he a great RB? Sure. Is he the best RB in the country? I'm not so sure. For my money, it's either Cook or Fournette. Is he the best player? Nope.
GO TIGERS!! GO WATSON!!
|
|
|
|
 |
Orange Blooded [2132]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 1841
Joined: 1/24/14
|
Thats what I have been saying for awhile......
Dec 12, 2015, 11:18 AM
|
|
Being a durable back doesn't make you a Heisman Trophy winner. You named some good backs and if they have gotten the ball the number of times as Henry their numbers would make Henry's look pedestrian at best. Yet Henry is ESPN's darling and they are going to push him to the top no matter who's in the way. I can't blame ESPN in that if I had an invested interest in a conference that I spent hundreds of millions of dollars on I would push that player from that conference when it comes to the Heisman, yet ESPN tries to deny that they don't treat the SEC like the goose that lays golden eggs. Yeah ok ESPN, you spend millions upon millions on the rights of the SEC yet there isn't no bias oh and I'm taking Kate Upton out on a date tonight....
|
|
|
|
|
|
Standout [316]
TigerPulse: 31%
Posts: 963
Joined: 12/9/15
|
Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile......
Dec 12, 2015, 11:38 AM
|
|
But they didn't get the ball as much as Henry so that's a moot point. In reality, Henry broke Herschel Walker's record with 1,986 yards and tied Tim Tebow's single season TD rushing record at 23. Btw, his Doak Walker Award says hello.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3362]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 3342
Joined: 10/6/02
|
Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile......
Dec 12, 2015, 11:43 AM
|
|
BTW...3-8 says hello. So do all the recruits jumping ship. You guys have a boatload of 2 star talent though so there's that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Standout [316]
TigerPulse: 31%
Posts: 963
Joined: 12/9/15
|
Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile......
Dec 12, 2015, 11:45 AM
|
|
I really don't understand folks on this forum. Too much bias. Take off your orange colored glasses and see the world of CFB for what it really is. Every time I speak out on something I get called a coot.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3311]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2370
Joined: 10/29/14
|
Every time you speak out?
Dec 12, 2015, 11:54 AM
|
|
You mean since two days ago? Missed your bowl game so trying to push the Bama/SEC agenda now huh? Oh how far we've come!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2828]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1926
Joined: 1/9/11
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [585]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 911
Joined: 8/20/03
|
Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile......
Dec 12, 2015, 12:24 PM
|
|
He is a useless capon.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5887]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 4884
Joined: 10/21/07
|
|
|
|
|
|
Athletic Dir [881]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 730
Joined: 10/30/05
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2883]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2224
Joined: 3/7/06
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [53716]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 43532
Joined: 11/17/03
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3405]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 5216
Joined: 1/26/09
|
|
|
|
|
|
Commissioner [932]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 1544
Joined: 6/4/12
|
Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile......
Dec 12, 2015, 2:43 PM
|
|
Henry is lucky to be invited IMHO.
If you're starting a college all star team who would be your first pick?
DW4 every time.
Being a workhorse RB is nice, but Henry should not be mentioned in the same breath as Herschel Walker no matter how many extra games Henry had to break his record.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Standout [316]
TigerPulse: 31%
Posts: 963
Joined: 12/9/15
|
Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile......
Dec 12, 2015, 2:48 PM
|
|
You mean McCaffrey is lucky to be invited. He has faced 0 defenses in the top 10 and only 1 defense in the top 25 and he gained a whopping...89 total yards.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Trainer [46]
TigerPulse: 95%
Posts: 60
Joined: 9/21/15
|
Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile......
Dec 12, 2015, 11:55 AM
[ in reply to Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile...... ] |
|
I don't think its very impressive he broke Herschel Walkers record. If I can remember right, Walker had a few less games than Henry. So why would it be impressive if Henry had more games to play in?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Scout Team [193]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 275
Joined: 10/21/13
|
Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile......
Dec 12, 2015, 12:03 PM
|
|
Hershel and George Rogers. Two heisman trophy winners with a combined 140+ carries against us and NEVER saw the end zone.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5249]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 7625
Joined: 3/5/12
|
Why is tying a QB's rushing TD record a great metric?
Dec 12, 2015, 11:56 AM
[ in reply to Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile...... ] |
|
And getting more carries isn't a moot point. It allows for more opportunities for yards. Do you not see how Fournette would have surpassed Henry if he were given those same opportunities?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Standout [316]
TigerPulse: 31%
Posts: 963
Joined: 12/9/15
|
Re: Why is tying a QB's rushing TD record a great metric?
Dec 12, 2015, 11:59 AM
|
|
It's a moot point because it's an assumption. It didn't happen so you can't use it in an argument. Fournette folded every time he played against a good defense.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5249]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 7625
Joined: 3/5/12
|
No, it's you saying total yards is more important than YPC
Dec 12, 2015, 12:23 PM
|
|
Which can be your stance, fine, but don't dismiss that metric either. That looks to me, on any given play Cook, Fournette, even Hood, perform better.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [14921]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 12314
Joined: 3/28/06
|
That's not an assumption, it's a logical extrapolation of
Dec 12, 2015, 12:28 PM
[ in reply to Re: Why is tying a QB's rushing TD record a great metric? ] |
|
their statistics.
If player X gets an average of 7 yards everytime he touches the ball and player Y gets 6, if you give them the ball the same amount of times player X will have more yards.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5887]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 4884
Joined: 10/21/07
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [14921]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 12314
Joined: 3/28/06
|
Well is it an award for best stats, breaking records, or
Dec 12, 2015, 11:59 AM
[ in reply to Re: Thats what I have been saying for awhile...... ] |
|
winning the most post-season awards?
I'll concede that the Heisman criterion seems to be a moving target every year but it boils down to the "best player in college football." I think Watson is the most valuable, McCaffrey is the best football player, and Henry is one of the best, but not the best RBs.
If I was picking RBs for my team, purely RBs (excluding McCaffrey), I'd take Cook and Fournette over Henry in a heartbeat.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [4718]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 3330
Joined: 11/18/05
|
Re: Derrick Henry YPC
Dec 12, 2015, 12:24 PM
|
|
Interesting tidbit to add (great post btw)
Deshaun Watson averages 5.44 ypc, not far behind Henry. Watson also loses every sack he takes.
Gallman 5.48 ypc
just sayin...
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [4249]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2926
Joined: 12/2/03
|
My 2 cents worth.
Dec 12, 2015, 12:39 PM
|
|
Like Watson, Henry has carried his team on his back and put them in a position to win a nationa title. That can't be discounted, even if others have better stats. Truly, any of these three young men are more than deserving of the award. Like all of you, I want nothing more than to see our own DW win. I want to see it for him, for Tiger nation, and because that is the ONLY thing the coots have on us. Would love to see that taken away as well.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [93618]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 95392
Joined: 12/25/09
|
That's sweet.
Dec 12, 2015, 12:42 PM
|
|
Take away the supporting staffs of Henry and DW and say that again. DW is worth about 3 Henrys.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [4249]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2926
Joined: 12/2/03
|
Re: That's sweet.
Dec 12, 2015, 1:13 PM
|
|
I'm not sure exactly what you are saying so I hesitate to argue. Take away any player's supporting staff and they're no good. To me, DW is the best choice, but Henry is as important to AU as DW is to us. Same as Mac for Stanford. I will be as disappointed as anyone if DW doesn't win, but I I won't say Henry didn't should he win.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [4249]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2926
Joined: 12/2/03
|
Re: That's sweet.
Dec 12, 2015, 1:14 PM
|
|
*didn't deserve it
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [93618]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 95392
Joined: 12/25/09
|
Does anyone believe that Bama wouldn't swap henry for...
Dec 12, 2015, 12:40 PM
|
|
DW, Cook or any of a half a dozen other running backs? I'm not talking about the emotional bullchit they pump I'm talking about a practical trade.
Henry won't be a high draft pick. He may not go as a primary running back.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [4718]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 3330
Joined: 11/18/05
|
Re: Does anyone believe that Bama wouldn't swap henry for...
Dec 12, 2015, 12:52 PM
|
|
as much as I don't think Henry deserves the Heisman, I think he's the perfect RB in the eyes of many NFL teams.
Big back driving into the middle of the line time after time. So many NFL franchises seem to love that.
Fred Jackson while CJ was at Buffalo a prime example and that's who Henry reminds me of.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [4659]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 6063
Joined: 10/20/15
|
Re: Derrick Henry YPC
Dec 12, 2015, 2:49 PM
|
|
Exactly. And this furthers my point on another thread about the heisman not being a statistical award despite the media's desire to make it so.
Look at Fournette. Statistics aside, look at his character. Selling his jersey to raise money for flood victims in another state? No one has ever done that as far back as I can remember. It wasn't imposed on his by his college or coaches... It was self-imposed, voluntary. When you study the award and was it was intended as being, the ideal that it stands for... It has so much more to do with the intangible qualities and leadership of a player than it does about their stats. It was a shame the way one bad game took him completely out of the conversation and the only body of people that one could blame is the media.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tiger Cub [14]
TigerPulse: 44%
Posts: 52
Joined: 12/5/15
|
Re: Derrick Henry YPC
Dec 12, 2015, 2:57 PM
|
|
One thing worth of note is what Henry did this season. Yes leading the nation in rushing, which is impressive.But in all but 4 games he ran for over 100, four games over 200, and two of the sub 100 yard games were over 90 yards. 23 touchdowns and at least 1 td in every single game. Cant knock consistency. He's probably the best pure rb, but this award is for most outstanding player, and that might be mccafrey with his rushing, receiving and returning.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [4659]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 6063
Joined: 10/20/15
|
Re: Derrick Henry YPC
Dec 12, 2015, 3:07 PM
|
|
I personally believe that it's between Watson & MacCaffrey myself... But knowing that it's only gone to a RB once since 1999, I still like DW's chances the most.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2772]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 3736
Joined: 1/15/13
|
Re: Derrick Henry YPC
Dec 12, 2015, 2:53 PM
|
|
But but but he plays for "Bammer"...
His stats are skewed by perceived greatness. Just ask anyone who works for ESEC..PN.....
Whatever!!! Go GET IT DW!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Replies: 33
| visibility 1
|
|
|
50
