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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Anybody else feel like its time to up our total enrollment?
Dec 8, 2012, 9:32 AM
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I just read an article where almost 20,000 applications were sent in this past fall. I understand keeping your standards high (I expect us to do so), but I also see a ton of great South Carolina students getting left behind. These are the same students who will be a part of the school after graduation and donate back. Keep the same enrollment you have been accepting, and then invite 500-750-1000 in state kids who are right on the bubble (right on the bubble for CU is probably 3.0 1100 SAT in state student) that is pretty good for most universities.
Give these kids a chance while also keeping your current acceptance procedures. I don't see why in the world you would not do this.
1. More money for our university
2. Support the in state kids
3. Relatively no drop in standards
4. In state kids give back at a higher level
It is time for us to move into the 21st century and get this done.
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Head Coach [761]
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Re: Anybody else feel like its time to up our total enrollment?
Dec 8, 2012, 9:37 AM
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Good idea. Email Barker and BOT members.
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Legend [15212]
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Ii just dont think we have the
Dec 8, 2012, 9:43 AM
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infrastructure for any more students.
Also, I think a borderline student is more like a 4.5 GPA and 1150 SAT.
My really good friend in HS finished ranked #12 with about a 4.5 GPA and 1080 SAT and did not get accepted. This was in 2004. Standards now must be higher than 2004.
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110%er [6224]
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I assume the satellite campuses
Dec 8, 2012, 9:45 AM
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count for enrollment? I just saw where the Greenville campus is moving to that new building downtown adding a lot of space...
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CU Guru [1895]
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That is just the MBA program.***
Dec 8, 2012, 11:28 AM
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Ii just dont think we have the
Dec 8, 2012, 10:52 AM
[ in reply to Ii just dont think we have the ] |
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Wow. To be honest I graduated in 2001 from high school and 2006 from CU so I do not know what the scales are these days 4.5 GPA? I don't even know how you get that. That is what I am talking about. A South Carolina student who had to go elsewhere and had those credentials.
The infrastructure argument is played out. If you drive around campus you will see a new educational hall being built on every corner of campus. Its time to expand. Its time to get kids who are qualified on campus. If we need to make more hires and build more buildings then so be it. It is time to stop turning away these kids who are going to be a big part of Clemson's future.
When a student gets turned away after having a 4.5 GPA and 1150 SAT to CU something is wrong. Not every student needs to be a Rhodes Scholar. We need graduates who have an attachment to the school. I feel like we are getting farther and farther away from this.
With the plan above you can accomplish both. You can get your Rhodes Scholars and accept potential South Carolina students who will eventually be the ones who give back to your school.
Its not always about the top 100. You have to look at the entire scope of the prospective student. A student from out of state who is a top 100 type kid is more than likely not going to have that same attachment to Clemson as the kid who grew up in SC dreaming of being a Tiger. I would be willing to bet most of the big time donors back to the university are in state grads.
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CU Guru [1895]
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How is the infrastructure argument "played out"
Dec 8, 2012, 11:32 AM
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We hardly have enough space for the students we have now. Along with that many of our academic halls need significant renovations and additions.
I believe Clemson does in the future have plans to expand, but first they need to build the infrastructure. Maybe 10-15 years from now when the central campus and residential living projects are done, but not now.
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CU Medallion [56724]
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Need to add a Veterinary school. More big $ donors.***
Dec 8, 2012, 9:43 AM
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Legend [15212]
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I like the vet school idea. Could keep it small and would
Dec 8, 2012, 9:55 AM
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seem to be an easy transition with everything in place.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Need to add a Veterinary school. More big $ donors.***
Dec 8, 2012, 10:55 AM
[ in reply to Need to add a Veterinary school. More big $ donors.*** ] |
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Tiger_swimmer,
My brother is 2005 CU alum in pre-vet. He had to leave Clemson in order to attend vet school at MSU. I will tell you this. He would have gladly stayed and paid CU 160,000.00 for the education instead of paying that money to a school in Mississippi.
A lot of pre-vet alumni told me the same. These are some very bright people who got into a ton of other schools, but chose CU for pre-vet. Then once they are done they have no choice but to leave.
I completely agree. I know a lot of CU pre-vet alums who are now DVMs would gladly give back to the university if asked.
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CU Medallion [56724]
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It makes so much sense, it must be coot legislators that
Dec 8, 2012, 11:04 AM
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would never let it happen. They know the impact it would have.
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Addict [436]
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Totally and completely disagree.
Dec 8, 2012, 9:57 AM
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I know this is a sports website and all, but it's called Clemson University. And coming from a grad, this is and always should be a school first. A lot more people depend on their Clemson diploma than depend on the football team.
The schools mission is to be a top 25 academic institution. They have done that, and for my career's sake, I want us to stay there.
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110%er [7831]
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As an educated person you must know
Dec 8, 2012, 10:51 AM
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that it is possible to have great athletics and academics. Also you are certain to know that high profile athletic programs bring more exposure of the school, thus getting more applications from high quality students.
I really don't understand the mentality of one or the other.
As to the original poster, I think that is an excellent idea. You should write a letter.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Totally and completely disagree.
Dec 8, 2012, 10:59 AM
[ in reply to Totally and completely disagree. ] |
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CMurra,
When did this become related to athletics. I said nothing about athletics in my OP.
You assumed something and ran with it. Also in regards to "your career's sake" give me a freaking break. Your career or future career is not in jeopardy because of a plan like this.
That attitude is what is killing the University we all love. This is the flagship university of SOUTH CAROLINA. We need to support the kids of this state THAT ARE QUALIFIED. I guess you chose to not read that in my original post.
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Athletic Dir [881]
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Re: Anybody else feel like its time to up our total enrollment?
Dec 8, 2012, 11:02 AM
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There's always the option to try transferring in from USC or another school. The school likes out of state students because of the higher tuition while state funding keeps getting slashed.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Anybody else feel like its time to up our total enrollment?
Dec 8, 2012, 11:10 AM
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Archie,
If that is true then it is very short sighted. The kids from this state are going to be the ones who stay attached to your university and feel the need to give back to whatever program they graduated in.
You want the up front money for out of state tuition, but your losing donations on the back end.
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Orange Blooded [4367]
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my younger brother is a freshman.
Dec 8, 2012, 11:03 AM
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He lives in a two person dorm room with 3 people(including him). As a person who was an RA for two years before finally moving off campus, let me assure you, Clemson is growing enrollment. However, housing wise it can't support its current student enrollment of freshmen while still allowing some upperclassmen to live oncampus. Later this decade the master plan is to tear down Clemson house, the shoeboxes , what's left of jstone, and thornhill and build new housing, we'll see what the capacity is then.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: my younger brother is a freshman.
Dec 8, 2012, 11:13 AM
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johnccalhoun,
If the biggest argument in not inviting a 4.5 1150 student life long Tiger fan from the state of South Carolina is
"we haven't built enough housing"
Wow. That speaks volumes of our leadership. The small JUCO up the road from me just dropped a load of cash on campus housing.
Good information though. Did not know they were planning on building new housing. Why tear down Clemson house and Thornhill though (I get jstone). Why not just build on the land you already have at your disposal.
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Orange Blooded [4367]
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Re: my younger brother is a freshman.
Dec 8, 2012, 11:19 AM
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We actually were supposed to do the majority of this in 2009, but it was suspended because of the market crash. I know Housing has the money to get rid of JStone and build a new building. The problem is now (at least when i worked in jstone in 2010-11, harcombe/the union didnt have enough money yet for a new dining hall. And since remaining johnstone is connected to the union, movement on new johnstone cant take place till mo
ney for a new dining hall was raised. Don't know exactly what the situation is now.
Oh and thornhill is in shambles. Its farther from campus than a lot of off campus apartments, is ratty as h3ll, and costs too much for what you are getting. Im living in a 3 story duplex with my roommates for what thornhill would cost me
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: my younger brother is a freshman.
Dec 8, 2012, 11:30 AM
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Johnccalhoun,
I lived in Calhoun Courts. It wasn't the nicest thing on campus, but you should understand as a student that when you live on campus you are not always going to be living in the Hilton. That being said most of the student enrollment at the time wanted nothing to do with student housing (so this is surprising to hear that we need more housing). We moved off campus after one year mostly due to the fact of cost (like you stated earlier) and keg beer 
Thornhill was alright back in the day. It wasn't that trashed out, and it was like living in your own neighborhood. Pretty cool living area
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Orange Blooded [2217]
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I did the same thing
Dec 8, 2012, 1:23 PM
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It is actually cheaper to have a 12-month lease in a nice apartment complex than live on campus. Plus its more conducive to a social life and closer to downtown
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CU Medallion [51524]
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Orange Blooded [2217]
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We (the students) got an email last year that the Board
Dec 8, 2012, 11:06 AM
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had approved plans to build some new student housing that would add 750 or so more beds. If I recall correctly they were planning on having this done either 2014 or 2015.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: We (the students) got an email last year that the Board
Dec 8, 2012, 11:14 AM
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Good info Born. Thanks for the update
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Orange Blooded [2013]
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No
Dec 8, 2012, 11:26 AM
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Part of what makes Clemson special is that it's relatively small for a major state school. I think you would lose a lot of what Clemson offers if you go to 25,000+ and the atmosphere would change dramatically. Throughout my four years, I have yet to have one class over 40 people and it's nice to see people you know on the way to class--not just a bunch of strange faces.
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Orange Blooded [4367]
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Re: No
Dec 8, 2012, 11:31 AM
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What is/was your major? Im a junior(or a senior getting ready for my victory lap) and all my classes have between 50-150 students. And computer engineering is a relatively small major.
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Orange Blooded [2013]
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Poly sci
Dec 8, 2012, 11:35 AM
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I'm graduating in May but I just looked at my schedule and I'll have my first big class next semester (but it's an elective--human sexual behavior).
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Yes
Dec 8, 2012, 11:38 AM
[ in reply to No ] |
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Sorry bud, but Clemson is not your local private high school. That being said I went to CU from 2002-2006 I think your lying about not having a class of over 40. Either that or you have never been to a class in Brackett Hall. I can tell you right now I had classes with over 200 students in them and did just fine. The professor was great.
You honestly think that the atmosphere changes by adding a couple thousand to your total enrollment? You serious Clark?
If you need a University where you see no "strange faces" then head to Tigerville, SC and enroll at North Greenville. You make your post out to be like everyone at CU knows everyone. I can tell you every morning my walk from Calhoun Courts to class was filled with these so called "strange faces"
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Aficionado [194]
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2014...
Dec 8, 2012, 11:35 AM
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We park in lot 12, behind p-plant, which is where the new student union, dining, post office, jstone are supposed to be removed and new coming in. We were checking as Lot 12 was supposed to be closed several years ago, but ran out of money for the project. They are saying now they will start in 2014-have project engineers working on it now. Have Lot 12 one more year.
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Orange Blooded [3677]
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absolutely not***
Dec 8, 2012, 11:45 AM
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: absolutely not***
Dec 8, 2012, 1:05 PM
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84a,
So your against giving South Carolina students the opportunity to attend Clemson University? Is this what you are saying. Or are you saying you do not want extra South Carolina students at our university who will eventually donate money to support our academic programs. Or are you saying that we need to become Yale.
In the plan above we have just as many "top scholars" as we did before. I am a graduate. If I had to walk to class with a couple more people around me so freaking be it. I would rather do that than somebody in this state who is beyond qualified get left out.
Your view is so narrow minded. You think if CU gets more students a rock concert will break out. Heres a shocker for you.
You think Cal-Berkely is a good school? 26,000 kids go to school there
You think UCLA is a good school? 27,000 kids go to school there
You think UNC is a good school? 30,000 kids go to school there
You want me to keep going? I don't think you do.
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CU Guru [1895]
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Lets look at state populations for a second
Dec 8, 2012, 1:24 PM
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California: 37,691,912
North Carolina: 9,656,401
South Carolina: 4,679,230
So Clemson at 20,000 represents a higher percentage of SC students than any of the schools you used as examples.
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All-In [28802]
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Don't agree at all...
Dec 8, 2012, 1:17 PM
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There are already too many kids going to college, partly because no matter how terrible of a student you are, you can always go somewhere like USC- Aiken. Clemson certainly does not need to lower its standards just because some nice kids can't get in.
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Orange Blooded [4787]
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what do you mean- too many kids going to college?
Dec 8, 2012, 1:48 PM
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are you talking clemson specific or just college in general? because, if it's the latter, you have just opened a whole new topic.
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All-In [28802]
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Out of state kids are actually more likely...
Dec 8, 2012, 1:27 PM
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To have a strong connection to Clemson, partly because they're the ones who come because of athletics
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All-In [28802]
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The in state/ out of state ratio has bee the same for 20 yes
Dec 8, 2012, 1:42 PM
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The perception that we are letting in more out of state kid now to raise our academic profile is wrong.
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Scout Team [153]
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Incorrect...I was at orientation
Dec 9, 2012, 2:08 PM
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This summer with son #2. Clemson now has 38% of its student body from out of state. When I was there in '85 it was probably 18%!
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Starter [363]
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Clemson understands it's niche. It's continued success
Dec 8, 2012, 1:51 PM
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academically will be centered around being the top option for instate students seeking public education.
Also, i'm in favor of the market opening up more alternatives to high level education besides the high priced big university options we have now.
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All-American [591]
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Agree.***
Dec 9, 2012, 9:55 AM
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Legend [15730]
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What are you talking about? Time to get what done?
Dec 9, 2012, 9:59 AM
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http://www.clemson.edu/oirweb1/fb/factbook/Historical%20Enrollment/Enrollment1893topresent.htm
1982 10,150
1992 13,305
2002 13,734
2003 13,813
2004 13,936
2005 14,096
2006 14,176
2007 14,270
2008 14,713
2009 15,346
2010 15,379
2011 15,697
It appears that the current administration agrees with you, resulting in a continuous increase in undergraduate enrollment over the past decade.
What is the issue, here?
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All-Pro [661]
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Re: What are you talking about? Time to get what done?
Dec 9, 2012, 10:06 AM
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I'm a current student and campus is already over-crowded. Buses are full, tough to find parking, Fike is loaded, etc. I hope they work on infrastructure before expanding more.
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All-American [576]
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go to tech for a year and get atleast a 2.5
Dec 9, 2012, 10:12 AM
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than you can prob. transfer in
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All-American [576]
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Re: go to tech for a year and get atleast a 2.5
Dec 9, 2012, 10:13 AM
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easier to transfer in than to apply as a freshman
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Addict [436]
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Re: Re: Totally and completely disagree.
Dec 9, 2012, 10:31 AM
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Palmettoson,
I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. The good news for me is, those who graduated from Clemson (twice in my case) will have much more influence when it comes to petitioning for changes in enrollment.
Lets hope you're just a fan and not an alum.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Re: Totally and completely disagree.
Dec 9, 2012, 1:41 PM
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Cmurra,
Clemson University Graduate 2006
My brother Clemson University Graduate 2005
My father Clemson University Graduate 1977
My mother Clemson University Graduate 1977
Spare me your high and mighty ########. Because that is what it is.
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110%er [8681]
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H3ll no
Dec 9, 2012, 10:46 AM
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students on the wrong side of the bubble already get offered the bridge program where they go to TCTC freshmen year and transfer in sophomore year. BTW I was lucky to get accepted with 3.8 and 28 on the ACT (equivalent to a 1250 on the SAT) in 2010
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Starter [356]
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Re: H3ll no
Dec 9, 2012, 11:01 AM
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I thought the SAT was scored out of 2400 these days.
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Orange Blooded [2896]
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You wouldn't get in today with these credentials and that's
Dec 9, 2012, 12:44 PM
[ in reply to H3ll no ] |
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ridiculous.
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Orange Blooded [2455]
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You'd get in as a bridger
Dec 9, 2012, 1:07 PM
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And that's fine.
A lot of it has to do with what program you apply to. You're going to get rejected bigtime trying to get into our Architecture program with a 3.0 and 1100 SAT, but you'd probably be just fine in any number of other majors.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: You'd get in as a bridger
Dec 9, 2012, 1:46 PM
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When you have 20,000 applicants and a kid who earned a 4.5 GPA and 1150 on SAT doesn't get in something is wrong. I went to Clemson because it was my state school. It had everything I wanted. Great academics, great athletics, and a connection to our state. I never wanted CU to be Princeton. I wanted Clemson to be Clemson.
People take that as "well your just looking to dumb down the school" That argument is so played out. We are turning away in state students who qualify at some of the best universities in the nation. That isn't right.
As far as the guy complaining about the bus being crowded. I apologize that the free transportation provided is too crowded for you. Here is an idea. Get your own car, bike, or moped. Just a thought. Heres hoping you never move to a big city. You will never survive
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CU Guru [1895]
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Its not just the busses
Dec 9, 2012, 11:08 PM
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Everything is overcrowded, which you don't seem to understand. Infrastructure needs to be improved before Clemson can even think about increasing enrollment.
You clearly do not know what you are talking about and look foolish.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: H3ll no
Dec 9, 2012, 1:50 PM
[ in reply to H3ll no ] |
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"on the wrong side of the bubble" So what if this kid who is "on the wrong side of the bubble" is given a chance to succeed and does. Then goes on to open up a multi million dollar industry. Then goes on to donate back to the school he loves in the academic area that got him started.
I am not saying bring in fully functioning retards like scar. I am saying we need to stop turning away top students in state.
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Letterman [294]
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Re: Anybody else feel like its time to up our total enrollment?
Dec 9, 2012, 11:01 PM
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If anyone wants any accurate data about Clemson:
http://www.clemson.edu/oirweb1/FB/factbook/CUfactbook.cgi#
http://www.clemson.edu/oirweb1/FB/factbook/PastCDS.html
I'm an out of state student from Massachusetts - didn't have the greatest grades in high school but took tons of AP classes and got a 34 on my ACT.
To the poster who said that people from out of state don't care as much about Clemson as someone from in-state, that's false. Every summer and spring I drive 16 hours from Boston to attend Clemson and many times I have not been able to go home for Thanksgiving or Fall/Spring Break. I knew that when I was making my college decision and yet I still picked Clemson over other schools like Virginia Tech, Pittsburgh and Purdue because I loved the atmosphere and the concept of the Clemson family. I've probably been to more Clemson athletic events over the past 3.5 years than 98% of the student population.
At least in the northeast, if you are going to look at a top notch university - you are going to be going to a $60,000-70,000 university such as BC, Harvard, BU or other private universities. In addition the in-state public universities are definitely not on the same level academically as Clemson (I think UMass-Amherst, our best public school is ranked around South Carolina's ranking). At least for me, going to an out of state public school is a great way for me to get an excellent education at a still relatively affordable price.
Definitely grateful for the opportunity to be a part of the Clemson family and it's an experience I'll never forget!! Just thought I'd give my perspective as a current out of state student.
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Letterman [294]
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Re: Anybody else feel like its time to up our total enrollment?
Dec 9, 2012, 11:21 PM
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Overall I disagree about having to add enrollment at Clemson. A lot of what makes Clemson special academically is the small class sizes and the focus on undergraduate teaching. Clemson is consistently recognized nationally for the attention professors give to its undergraduate students.
My geotechnical engineering professors son goes to Georgia Tech and he told me that for office hours he would have to chase down his professor in the hallways between classes to get his attention.
Instead of adding enrollment at Clemson's campus, why can't we open new campuses elsewhere or even improve the existing campuses within the University of South Carolina system (this is clearly spoken with no regards for the rivalry......haha), Coastal Carolina, Winthrop . In North Carolina, not only do they have UNC-Chapel Hill, one of the best public colleges in the country but they also have other great options such as NC State, UNC-Asheville, UNC-Greensboro etc.. that are recognized by Princeton Review's Best College rankings every year. Of course this probably won't happen because SC's state government has shown a surprisingly disinterest towards education.
Think UNC's enrollment is similar to ours with 18,579 undergraduate students. North Carolina does cap their out of state enrollment to 15-18% I think, maybe something to look at with South Carolina schools if you do want to retain in-state students.
Also agree with having to improve infrastructure if we do expand. For example, I was at the University of Georgia earlier that year. That campus is HUGE!! I can walk across ours in 10-15 minutes but I had to take a bus just to get from one end of campus to the other.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Anybody else feel like its time to up our total enrollment?
Dec 9, 2012, 11:47 PM
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ptong,
Completely agree on the satellite campuses. Our University needs to have a presence in the low country. So UNC has almost 30,000 (per wikipedia so you know how that goes) and only 18,000 are undergrad. That would mean they have 12,000 grad? That is insane if accurate.
I think CU needs to have at least 19-20,000 undergrads just for the simple fact that we are turning down qualified students from our own state. I could deal with turning away these students if our enrollment wasn't so small. We are not a private school. This is the flagship university of South Carolina.
There was a time when you could say we don't need to take anymore because the pool was not qualified. That is not the case today
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All-In [25381]
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When I entered CU in 1965, there were 4000+ students, and
Dec 10, 2012, 5:57 AM
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during my four years President Edwards often stated that the university would eventually cap its enrollment at 10,000. Of course, the passage of time changes a lot of thinking, for I believe increasing applications (demand) will force increasing enrollment, like it or not. Thus, I fully expect steps to be taken via construction to allow for the increase, although over a long period of time. I would venture that some of you will live long enough to see 30,000+ students at CU...maybe, more!
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