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All-In [26968]
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All-In [26968]
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Sorry, I thought it would do some kind of preview...Here.
Jul 11, 2019, 1:04 PM
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The ‘Billy Graham Rule’? Candidate refuses to meet with women unless a man comes along
BY SIMONE JASPER
JULY 11, 2019 12:08 PM, UPDATED 45 MINUTES AGO
A Mississippi candidate who refused to meet alone with a woman says he’s following the “Billy Graham Rule” — and he’s not the first politician to do so.
Robert Foster, a Republican running for governor in The Magnolia State, invoked the policy on Tuesday when explaining why his campaign told female reporter Larrison Campbell to bring a male colleague with her if she wants to cover his candidacy.
“Before our decision to run, my wife and I made a commitment to follow the ‘Billy Graham Rule’, which is to avoid any situation that may evoke suspicion or compromise of our marriage,” he wrote on Twitter. “I am sorry Ms. Campbell doesn’t share these views, but my decision was out of respect of my wife.”
Billy Graham — a late evangelist with roots in Charlotte, North Carolina — in 1948 worked with his staff to come up with rules, including one that called on each worker to not spend one-on-one time with a woman who wasn’t his wife.
Since then, similar comments have gained national attention.
Before he was vice president, Mike Pence in 2002 told The Hill he “never eats alone with a woman other than his wife.”
In the recent Mississippi case, Campbell was told she couldn’t join Foster on the campaign trail alone, her media outlet reports.
Campbell, a journalist with Mississippi Today, said there was “inherent sexism — not only in his request, but just the Billy Graham rule in general,” according to Poynter.
On his Twitter page, Foster says he’s doing it to respect his marriage and his Christian values.
“I refuse to change my moral stance on any issue because it’s not popular among the radical left,” he said. “My wife and the State of Mississippi deserve a governor who doesn’t compromise their beliefs, and I’m sticking to my guns.”
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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Seriously, Prod? That is the most backwards
Jul 11, 2019, 1:24 PM
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a z z thinking out there and it reflects poorly on Christians as a whole. Notice his comment on the "radical left"? What is radical is not recognizing the equality of women in today's world. If that is your choice, fine...but this guy is doing it to make a political point that plays well in MS.
And before everybody jumps in and says, "Heez doin' outta respek fer his wife". BS. How many political reporters are women? How was this not an issue before Pence brought it up?
I had lunch the other day with a women who was not my wife, did I feel bad about it? Noooo, she was our new Associate Pastor and it was nice to meet her. Grow up people.
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All-In [26968]
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I'm not big on him talking about the "radical left"
Jul 11, 2019, 1:27 PM
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As that does make it sound political. But, to me, this is just a good, common sense, way to behave for a married man. It doesn't have to be anything "Christian".
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Oculus Spirit [78823]
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why is a married man able to mean privately with a man?
Jul 11, 2019, 1:37 PM
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Couldn't the married man be bi-curious and hit on the other man?
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All-In [26968]
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Well, I don't have a problem with that, since I'm not
Jul 11, 2019, 1:39 PM
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homosexual.
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110%er [7183]
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So can you be alone with a lesbian?***
Jul 11, 2019, 1:42 PM
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All-In [26968]
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I can be anything...I choose not to be alone with a woman.
Jul 11, 2019, 1:43 PM
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Lesbian or otherwise.
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Oculus Spirit [78823]
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CU Medallion [54758]
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I'd rather be alone with TWO lesbians, tho
Jul 11, 2019, 1:55 PM
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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Addressing appropriate behavior for a married man...
Jul 11, 2019, 1:39 PM
[ in reply to I'm not big on him talking about the "radical left" ] |
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why do you think his stance is common sense. Is temptation too much of the issue here? Also, is my lunch with the new associate pastor a nogo because she's a woman?
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All-In [26968]
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I guess I'd say it's common sense if
Jul 11, 2019, 1:43 PM
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the desire is for the marriage to be above any reproach. You don't lose out on anything. In fact, it'd make it more fun if my wife came along for a meeting like that.
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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Why is the thought pervasive in your mind that someone
Jul 11, 2019, 1:59 PM
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may question your intentions in having, say, a business meeting with a female colleague? If she asks to meet with you and your response is, I can't for (insert your reasons here), how poorly does that reflect on her? How poorly does that reflect on you? You may have insulted a person whom you had no intention to, yet you did. You may think you are treating her and your marriage with respect, but it's just the opposite.
I know it's a made up scenario, but we live in a civilized society here and this reluctance to treat women as equals is dragging us back to cultural ridiculousness.
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All-In [26968]
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I'd say,
Jul 11, 2019, 2:04 PM
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"Ma'am, I have the utmost respect for you and this is not a comment toward you in any way, but I would like my wife to join us for this meeting. Is this OK?"
I bend over backwards to avoid offending people, but if that is offensive, then it will just have to be. The potential cost is too great.
Again I say, this is not a matter of treating women as equals. This is about putting my wife on the highest possible pedestal I can. She's the one that's important.
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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Outside of a business setting, I'd say do what you want
Jul 11, 2019, 2:08 PM
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You are going to make people uncomfortable, no matter how much you say you respect them. But in a business setting, would you take your wife to meet with a customer to discuss engineering plans?
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All-In [26968]
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If I can't do that in a business setting,
Jul 11, 2019, 2:11 PM
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I'd have to find another business. I know it may sound extreme. I think my intentions to do as right as possible would be rewarded by the Lord, and he would supply a different job.
You could argue, then, that this politician should find another line of work. But the thing about elected officers is, if the problem is big enough, that's kind of taken care of for you in voting booths.
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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I have no doubt you are trying to do as right as possible, I
Jul 11, 2019, 2:19 PM
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don't think that would ever be in question. Your reputation in the lounge and the values you speak of are respectable and forthright. My opinion leads me to the conclusion that behavior such as this, especially in the politician's case, are demeaning and disrespectful to women no matter how you couch it. To me it reflects poorly on how someone values their fellow man, in this case woman, and reflects a cultural norm that is more prevalent in less civilized societies.
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Standout [345]
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Re: I'm not big on him talking about the "radical left"
Jul 12, 2019, 7:57 AM
[ in reply to I'm not big on him talking about the "radical left" ] |
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I don’t get it.
I’m not worried about my wife being alone with a man because I trust her and she isn’t worried about me being alone with a woman for the same reason.
Bottom line, if you can’t control yourself around a woman and do the right thing then you are a POS to begin with and using Jesus is a crutch to avoid and address that shortcoming is weak.
None of the other possibilities make sense either. If it is more a concern of being accused of something then tell her you are taping the meeting and do so. If it is out of concern that others might talk then either they are extremely shallow or have a weak relationship that others can ruin easily.
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All-In [26968]
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Think of it this way
Jul 12, 2019, 10:11 AM
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Let's say there's a magic button somewhere, that has two possibilities when you press it. Let's say there's a 99.99999% chance that when you press it, it will spit out one dollar. There's a 0.00001% chance it will explode and kill you and your family. Do you press the button? Why wouldn't you?, there's very little chance that something bad will happen. The reason is that if that remote chance comes true, the worst possible thing in the world happens. And if you don't press the button, all you lose out on is one dollar.
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Standout [345]
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Re: Think of it this way
Jul 12, 2019, 11:15 AM
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I get what you are saying and honestly it really shouldn’t bother me, or anyone else, as it doesn’t harm anyone. Furthermore, if it makes those involved feel better then why not. However, as a personal pet peeve, I hate that people always have to assume/pan for the worse and that a man or woman is just out to get them or somehow people aren’t fully capable of not devolving into an instant boning session the second they are left alone together.
This is only a big deal in society because we let it be one. There are plenty of places that don’t think like this. Places where no one gives a second thought to intermingling as it just isn’t an issue. It just seems like a self-made problem on our part that could be corrected if we choose to do so.
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All-In [26968]
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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Do you feel like you can't be around a woman
Jul 11, 2019, 1:37 PM
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without thinking impure thoughts?
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All-In [26968]
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I feel like I can do that today...
Jul 11, 2019, 1:41 PM
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But who knows what I might be thinking on any given day? I'm not impervious to it. And further, I must be above reproach in this matter. I can't have anyone even thinking that I might be doing something. I choose to make it as unlikely as possible for me to be accused, either outwardly, or just within the mind of an observer.
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CU Medallion [58367]
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I probably couldn't in many cases - I don't think
Jul 11, 2019, 3:41 PM
[ in reply to Do you feel like you can't be around a woman ] |
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anybody can honestly say that; but I can guarantee with 100% certainty that I would not act on it or behave inappropriately.
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Lot o points [155615]
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I'm thinking you haven't been in corporate America in the
Jul 11, 2019, 1:45 PM
[ in reply to Seriously, Prod? That is the most backwards ] |
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last 5-10 years.
Ethics be dammmmed, it's almost a mandatory CYA move in the business world for a man in any position of power, and politics is big business, just dirtier.
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Oculus Spirit [78823]
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so that's is not because of marriage butt
Jul 11, 2019, 1:49 PM
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because of sexual harassment claims
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Lot o points [155615]
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Off the cuff, I feel like I've seen multiple accusations in
Jul 11, 2019, 1:52 PM
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the past few years of reporters accusing men in power of making advances.
The accusations alone do significant damage.
If they're true, and many are, shame on the men.
If they aren't, and many aren't, shame on the women.
With a third party present, neither the former or the latter would have happened.
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Oculus Spirit [78823]
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we can fix this by all wearing body cams 24/7***
Jul 11, 2019, 1:54 PM
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All-In [26968]
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Yeah, that's a totally separate thing for me.
Jul 11, 2019, 1:52 PM
[ in reply to so that's is not because of marriage butt ] |
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And not something I'll comment on, except to say, doing this for the marriage reason would obviously cover that, too.
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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I'm in the pharmaceutical industry, I've had plenty
Jul 11, 2019, 1:51 PM
[ in reply to I'm thinking you haven't been in corporate America in the ] |
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of experience in corporate America, so much so, I'd like to get out of corporate America. CYA is one thing, but not allowing a reporter to cover you because she wears a skirt is BS. And if you want the BS CYA ethics to come to an end in corporate America, politics, or whatever arena; you need to call it what it is....BS. And in this case, it keeps a person from doing her job. So, eff that guy.
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Lot o points [155615]
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Maybe it's for the reason he says, maybe it's for the
Jul 11, 2019, 1:53 PM
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reason I say.
If it's CYA, I imagine "It's out of respect for my wife" is easier to communicate than "you could be some crazy money grabber who makes a wildassed accusation 5 years from now".
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All-In [26968]
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I think the preferable request would be, instead of
Jul 11, 2019, 1:53 PM
[ in reply to I'm in the pharmaceutical industry, I've had plenty ] |
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asking the reporter to "bring a man", that I bring my wife. Then hopefully the reporter doesn't feel in any way inadequate.
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Lot o points [155615]
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What if you just asked them to bring another woman?
Jul 11, 2019, 1:54 PM
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Oculus Spirit [78823]
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Lot o points [155615]
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It's not difficult actually in the modern era, he just needs
Jul 11, 2019, 1:57 PM
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to have a) Polo model good looks and b) have played DI athletics.
He's got those two checked, right?
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Oculus Spirit [78823]
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so he has some of my looks, so yeah butt
Jul 11, 2019, 1:59 PM
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no D1 athletics experience though
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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Oculus Spirit [78823]
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he is not looking for a sales job
Jul 11, 2019, 2:44 PM
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.
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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It's unreasonable to expect at least one person you know...
Jul 11, 2019, 2:02 PM
[ in reply to I'm in the pharmaceutical industry, I've had plenty ] |
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and trust to be with a politician when they are being interviewed? You guys think a rumor can be removed as easily as a tumor.
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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Do you play with rattlesnakes too?
Jul 11, 2019, 1:57 PM
[ in reply to Seriously, Prod? That is the most backwards ] |
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I mean, uranium is fun to use for home projects but there is a particular amount of risk in being alone with a woman too. It's like snakes, sometimes they will stand before congress and claim that SCOTUS nominee raped them 30 years ago but if you play with a rattlesnake the venom will eventually find it's way into your veins.
Don't be foolish. Preachers attempting to behave properly and thereby give no quarters to rumors have refused to be alone with women throughout my lifetime. Graham wasn't the first and isn't the last. Pence had it correct and no one accuses him of being a cad with women.
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All-In [26968]
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Yes, this has been practiced by many men I know
Jul 11, 2019, 1:59 PM
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Long before I ever heard of who Mike Pence was.
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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That is true with all the deacons and elders of the church..
Jul 11, 2019, 2:05 PM
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and also everyone in authority such as SS teachers, Disciple Training personnel and choir members. It's SOP in a Southern Bapt church and all the Independent Bapt churches I've visited. There is no rule that I know of but it standard everywhere I've been.
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All-In [26968]
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We practice it every time we visit someone
Jul 11, 2019, 2:07 PM
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related to church business. If the husband isn't home, or if the church person's wife doesn't come, we don't go.
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Oculus Spirit [80968]
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Are they all married?***
Jul 11, 2019, 3:45 PM
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All-In [26968]
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Yes, at least all I can think of.***
Jul 11, 2019, 4:53 PM
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Legend [15730]
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I see nothing wrong with this. In this hypercharged
Jul 11, 2019, 5:03 PM
[ in reply to Seriously, Prod? That is the most backwards ] |
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environment, where an accusation can ruin a political career, best to err on the side of caution.
I also see nothing wrong with being alone with a woman in a professional environment, but I don’t have a public career.
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Oculus Spirit [80968]
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Wait until one accuses you of something
Jul 12, 2019, 11:10 AM
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There are those who are looking for a paycheck, and don't care whose career they ruin in the process.
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Heisman Winner [137762]
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Wouldn't it be easier to just
Jul 11, 2019, 1:50 PM
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wear a sign that says "I can't be trusted"?
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All-In [26968]
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I'd hope that wouldn't be a true statement.
Jul 11, 2019, 1:51 PM
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I think a woman can trust me. But that's not reason enough to make it OK, to me.
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All-TigerNet [12098]
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I’m Biblically rusty but I think Jesus met with women alone
Jul 11, 2019, 1:56 PM
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Isn’t He our role model?
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All-In [26968]
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When I'm like Jesus, I'll meet with a woman alone.
Jul 11, 2019, 1:58 PM
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Until then, I won't.
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All-TigerNet [12098]
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Well, I’ve got to give you that one
Jul 11, 2019, 2:07 PM
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Although I think you probably sincerely come as close as you can.
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All-In [26968]
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I try, as much as someone
Jul 11, 2019, 2:08 PM
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falls on their face out of the starting gate in an attempt to win a marathon. But thank you for your kind words.
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Heisman Winner [137762]
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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Hahahahaaha!! Was thinking the same
Jul 11, 2019, 2:29 PM
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She showed me a picture, all I could do was stare
At that freak in his sandals with his long pretty hair
They must think that I'm stupid or I don't have a clue
Ill bet hes a commie, or ever worse yet a Jew
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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All-In [26968]
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Talk about someone being falsely accused.***
Jul 11, 2019, 2:05 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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Actually, He was guilty of being God.
Jul 11, 2019, 2:10 PM
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I do not believe most people who participated in convicting Him of heresy knew it but He plainly said it. He was also guilty of rubbing shoulders with the common folk of the day, the poor, outcast and even the demon possessed.
He was obligated to offer salvation to all just like John. Both knew what to expect, I believe.
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110%er [7020]
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I don't think it really has to have anything to do with
Jul 11, 2019, 2:37 PM
[ in reply to I’m Biblically rusty but I think Jesus met with women alone ] |
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religion. Especially in today's poundmetoo culture.. Even more especially in politics.. All it takes is one claim and you're ruined, whether it's true or not.. I'd #### sure have a third party with me at all times..
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All-In [38514]
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My wife and I do not follow this rule.***
Jul 11, 2019, 2:08 PM
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CU Medallion [54758]
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time to schedule a meating!***
Jul 11, 2019, 2:12 PM
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Heisman Winner [137762]
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I'm assuming your wife knows you're going to start talking
Jul 11, 2019, 2:15 PM
[ in reply to My wife and I do not follow this rule.*** ] |
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about running and fences and karate, thus ruining any shot you might have had at cheating.
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All-In [38514]
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You think my wife doesn't know that no one else wants me?
Jul 11, 2019, 2:18 PM
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She's an intelligent woman.
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Lot o points [155615]
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All-In [38514]
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Posts: 47162
Joined: 10/28/02
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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Lot o points [155615]
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Yeah, but Ms. Tdrake loves it in Djibouti.***
Jul 11, 2019, 3:26 PM
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All-In [38514]
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Who doesn't?***
Jul 11, 2019, 3:38 PM
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Oculus Spirit [80968]
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Obed is 100% correct.
Jul 11, 2019, 2:42 PM
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I'll never have a closed door meeting alone with a woman, nor will I be alone in any business situation with a woman.
I'm certainly not going to do anything, because I'm old, and simply don't care anymore. But many women will treat that as a chance at an early retirement.
I'm not ready to lose my job due to an accusation. And folks can take that however they would like. I was on a mgt team that went through that a job or so back--I'll never give anyone an opportunity for it to occur again.
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110%er [7020]
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This. I don't think it has anything to do with some sort of
Jul 11, 2019, 3:26 PM
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moral high ground or religious belief.
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All-TigerNet [11132]
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The "Billy Graham" rule has nothing to do with
Jul 11, 2019, 3:54 PM
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religious beliefs or moral high ground? C'mon, man. Granted, Foster is running in MS, so the political motivations can't be dismissed, either. Rattlesnakes get nervous on Sunday in that state.
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CU Medallion [58367]
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If being alone in a room with a reporter evokes
Jul 11, 2019, 3:22 PM
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suspicion or compromises your marriage, something is bad wrong with your marriage. There is always the possibility that some nutjob will falsely accuse you of something, but that's a different thing altogether.
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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I don't think one has to be alone with a woman to...
Jul 11, 2019, 3:23 PM
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cause trouble for himself.
signed
Blasio-Ford
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Oculus Spirit [80968]
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Well, if others are present, they can corroborate my
Jul 11, 2019, 3:38 PM
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actions or words. Without that, its a me against her scenario, and in the current climate, being a male is the deciding factor that makes me guilty.
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All-In [38097]
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All-In [26968]
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I'm not a Billy Graham guy, really.
Jul 11, 2019, 4:55 PM
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I don't have anything in particular against him, but I haven't been a "follower".
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Legend [15730]
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The outrage to this policy is absolutely hysterical.
Jul 12, 2019, 8:35 AM
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This is his personal policy designed to either make his wife happy, protect his career, or both. He’s not introducing a law prohibiting married men from being in the room with another woman. He’s making a personal choice and probably a prudent one. Don’t blame him...blame human nature. Blame the fact that men in elected office seem to stray too frequently, and even when they don’t, they can be accused of it.
If it makes you feel better, instead of the Graham Rule you can call it the Kavanaugh Rule, or the “Guilty until Proven Innocent” rule.
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All-In [26968]
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There's so much criticism, rightfully so,
Jul 12, 2019, 10:05 AM
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of men harassing and assaulting women, and when a man takes steps to make sure it cannot happen, that's no good, either. Hmph.
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