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Zealot [738]
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Why again did we let OP leave?
Feb 7, 2013, 7:48 PM
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I realize he left us and all, and I like BB but at least for a while under OP we were competing to be 3rd-4th best team in the ACC.
Sure wish we could go back to that time.
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Hall of Famer [22381]
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We didn't "let" him leave. He wanted out and there was no
Feb 7, 2013, 7:51 PM
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stopping him.
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Orange Blooded [2441]
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Unfortunately, this is true.***
Feb 7, 2013, 7:54 PM
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Zealot [738]
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I realize that, I was half kidding with the letting him
Feb 7, 2013, 7:55 PM
[ in reply to We didn't "let" him leave. He wanted out and there was no ] |
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but at the same time we could have kept him if we were really determined to. It might not have been reasonable but there are things that could have been done to keep him. Making steps to improve the facilities would have prob. helped. In this day and age schools are building new arenas and new practice facilities, all we did is a reno on Littlejohn.
OP saw the writing on the wall that he had taken Clemson as far as he could IMO, but that was in part due to the commitment Clemson had put into the program (or lack there of).
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CU Guru [1559]
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How is he doing at Depaul????????***
Feb 7, 2013, 7:52 PM
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Orange Blooded [2441]
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Who cares? He did just fine here.***
Feb 7, 2013, 7:54 PM
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Trainer [40]
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Orange Blooded [4504]
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Are they still pressing the entire game??? Man, at least
Feb 7, 2013, 7:57 PM
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we don't have to watch that every game.
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Orange Blooded [2441]
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Can't tell if you're joking but I'd rather watch that
Feb 7, 2013, 7:58 PM
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than this.
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Trainer [40]
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Orange Blooded [4747]
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Re: Why again did we let OP leave?
Feb 7, 2013, 7:54 PM
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3rd in the ACC and a first-round exit in the tourney every year. Honestly, I'd rather just have a sucky team all year than be cock-teased.
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Zealot [868]
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Re: Why again did we let OP leave?
Feb 7, 2013, 8:00 PM
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That's an odd perspective.
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Orange Blooded [4747]
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Re: Why again did we let OP leave?
Feb 7, 2013, 8:07 PM
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We all knew exactly what was going to happen come March with OP. We knew we would lose to an inferior opponent because OP's strategy was a gimmick and wouldn't work with tournament-caliber teams. To me, it's easier as a fan to deal with what we have now than the false hope of winning a tournament game under OP.
That being said, I don't think we'll be this bad forever. I think Brownell is a good coach and just needs time for his guys to mature and play consistently.
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Zealot [738]
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We lost to Villanova, Michigan, and Mizzou
Feb 7, 2013, 8:17 PM
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all of which have a bit more history than Clemson in basketball, Vil ended up making the sweet 16 that year I believe and Michigan won two games. That Mizzou team was really strong also.
Regardless we were building upon making the NCAA 3 years in a row. Its a long way from where we are now, the level at which we competed then is no where close to where we are now. There is no way around this fact. Saying OP would have never gotten us past the first round is pure speculation and I assume easier to claim and hurts less than saying we all wish our program was there again.
Like I said I actually like Brownell and think he is a good coach but at what point do we admit something is wrong. We have had some good coaches over the past 20 years, and a few that have shown us moments of turning the corner but we have not been able to keep either coach that gave us brief moments of greatness. Clearly we need to invest in the program more, and maybe that would help Brownell get the quality of player he needs to have success here. Because, clearly what is happening now, is not working.
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Orange Blooded [4747]
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History means jack in the tournament.
Feb 7, 2013, 8:27 PM
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Do you really think that just because Michigan had the Fab Five that we got scared to play them in 2009? "History" helps in recruiting, but we were better than them. Villanova was a 12 seed. Missouri was a 10 seed, and they have as much history in athletics as SCU.
OP has yet to win a tournament game. He's a great rebuilder of programs, but not good enough to get over the hump. The way that he left Clemson gave us what we have now - a team with two seniors and a load of freshmen and sophomores with no consistency.
There isn't going to be a quick fix for the basketball program. I think if nothing has changed in a couple of years, let Brownell go and find someone who can recruit better. But knee-jerk reactions are just going to make it even more difficult to change the culture.
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Zealot [738]
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I am not suggesting fire Brownell
Feb 7, 2013, 8:38 PM
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More just saying we clearly need something to change. We need to figure out what can get us more competitive.
I think the teams OP lost to in the tournament had some big time talent on the teams, that is what wins tournament games. Clemson had no one on their team that was as talented as some of the guards they faced. Those teams were able to get top rated talent even if it was just a few players and that was a big difference in those games.
If Clemson was able to get a few top rated players even one or two 4 star type guys that the rest of the ACC offered than I think things would be very different. Instead we do not have that quality of talent.
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Zealot [738]
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3rd in the ACC is better than what we have this year
Feb 7, 2013, 8:01 PM
[ in reply to Re: Why again did we let OP leave? ] |
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getting bounced out of NCAA in first round was getting old but, at the same time you have to believe if we stayed the course at some point that was going change. You have to start somewhere.
At that time we were just happy to get to the tournament, you have to work your way up. At one point it seemed like we were making improvement and becoming a factor in the basketball scene.
I like BB and think he is a great coach, but at this point we have to realize maybe the problem here is us, not the coach. We had one coach that had us on the verge leave for whatever reason, and now have a great X&O's coach that can not get the talent we need. At what point do we look in the mirror and realize that maybe the reason is the lack of commitment we have made to the program to get us on a level playing field with the rest of the conference, and other major power conference teams?
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Legend [19352]
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Re: Why again did we let OP leave?
Feb 7, 2013, 7:57 PM
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OP was too busy cheating on his wife to move our program along.
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Zealot [738]
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If by claiming OP was cheating on his wife makes you feel
Feb 7, 2013, 8:08 PM
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better about where we are right now with our basketball program compared to where we were, than fine you win.
Honestly, its not my problem how good of a husband he was or was not. He seemed like an alright guy, and handled himself with class from what I can tell. He never did anything to make Clemson look bad, so what he did in his personal life is his business. He won games, and made Clemson relevant that what I care about.
Sorry some of you do not want to admit that fact.
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Legend [19352]
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Re: If by claiming OP was cheating on his wife makes you feel
Feb 7, 2013, 8:36 PM
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Not a claim it was a pretty well known fact that is one of the big reasons he left the way he did.
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Fan [81]
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because other schools pay their basketball coaches***
Feb 7, 2013, 7:59 PM
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110%er [5298]
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Re: Why again did we let OP leave?
Feb 7, 2013, 8:08 PM
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It's looking like it is too bad we didn't keep Shaka Smart, if that was even an option. He is doing well at VCU. His team played both Duke and Mizzou very close this year. They are 18-5 with a win over #19 Memphis.
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Recruit [75]
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Re: If by claiming OP was cheating on his wife makes you feel
Feb 7, 2013, 8:59 PM
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It was OPs wife. Under the circumstances she was not going to stay in a small town given his poor choices and quite frankly I don't blame her. Basically came down to her or Clemson and he made a choice.
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110%er [8095]
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Brownell is a better coach. Give him time & PLAYERS***
Feb 7, 2013, 9:02 PM
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