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All-Conference [439]
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Let the "woke" players walk
Aug 3, 2020, 11:57 AM
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According to this article written by NCAA there's 8 million high school athletes and only 500,000 end up playing in the NCAA
http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/probability-competing-beyond-high-school Probability of Competing Beyond High School Many boys and girls grow up dreaming of playing sports in college and the pro ranks. But of the nearly 8 million students currently participating in high school athletics in the United States, only 495,000 of them will compete at NCAA schools. And of that group, only a fraction will realize their goal of becoming a professional athlete.
That leaves a lot of potential athletes to fill the spots. At the end of the day, which may be a hard lesson for some of these kids to learn, college athletics is a business. And like most businesses a huge determining factor of "pay" is what is someone else (equally qualified) willing to do your job for.
And I do understand the elite players wanting to profit off their name and likeness, I'm an entrepreneur who owns and operates my own business. I believe in free market capitalism as much as anyone. But these athletes demands are erroneous. They were not forced to go to college and agree to the NCAA stipulations. Like every job the employer (universities) offers pay and benefits (scholarships, meal plans, training, facilities, etc) to the employee (athletes) in exchange for a contractual agreement for labor provided. If you feel your labor is worth more than the pay being offered you are free to seek employment elsewhere.
CFB is for entertainment. And while it is more entertaining to have the best athletes on the field it isn't a necessity. If every D-1 college was full of 2 star players and the field was still relatively equal the level of entertainment wouldn't drop significantly.
I knew when I was 15 my football career was going to end after high school as I was not going to be good enough to play D-1 and going to a D-3 school wasn't worth it to me. I would have gladly taken the scholarship to Clemson and would be in a much better place today, earning the same degree for free not having to pay off student debt and I'm pretty positives there are plenty others out there that would gladly fill the rosters.
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All-In [43979]
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I agree.***
Aug 3, 2020, 12:00 PM
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All-In [27361]
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Re: I agree.***
Aug 3, 2020, 12:32 PM
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And I agree. Money will kill amateur sports if we allow it to happen
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Orange Blooded [3044]
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Re: I agree.***
Aug 3, 2020, 12:37 PM
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I don't like us having to compete moneywise against the high cost of living places.
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CU Medallion [55607]
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Money has already ruined college sports and the pros.
Aug 3, 2020, 12:50 PM
[ in reply to Re: I agree.*** ] |
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This happens in cycles. There will be reform. But there is too much money at every level of sport.
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110%er [6825]
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Re: Let the "woke" players walk
Aug 3, 2020, 12:40 PM
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I disagree (and agree)
Right now, there is little to no alternative to college football as a development league, especially as the level of exposure and resources available (counter point minor league baseball - or basically global soccer development).
Where I disagree- The three year rule, while logically sound from a physical need logic, really forces kids to the college teams. There isn't a real option for someone like TL16 to basically sit out or recieve inferior instruction for 3 years until he is NFL eligible.
Keep in mind, there are DII, DIII, SAIA leagues as well. But if any kid has any hope at playing at the next level, then they really only have one logical choice. There are positives but even back in the 1800s, college football was a *business* and education was secondary. We really never got past that. We changed the rules but basically it is the same item.
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Orange Blooded [4947]
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Re: Let the "woke" players walk
Aug 3, 2020, 1:03 PM
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Sounds like you agree and that this is not a NCAA problem. I'm still not sure how we are not pointing a finger at the NFL to resolve this issue. The NFL created the rule and college athletics are suffering the consequences. Every player has the right to make money, it is the NFL that is denying them that right not the NCAA who has made it clear their investment in you is in the form of a scholarship.
I do think 4 year scholarships and some healthcare considerations are long overdue. Anything outside of the armature or student athlete model should be taken up with professional leagues.
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110%er [7451]
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The 3 year is on the NFL- College players can sue the
Aug 3, 2020, 2:22 PM
[ in reply to Re: Let the "woke" players walk ] |
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NFL if they feel there is some sort of discrimination. The NFL could easily shift to the MLB or NBA model - they just don’t want to- they enjoy having college dev players for free for them. It’s not the colleges job to force the NFL to change that - it’s the job of the players to go after the NFL to change it
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110%er [7451]
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The 3 year is on the NFL- College players can sue the
Aug 3, 2020, 2:22 PM
[ in reply to Re: Let the "woke" players walk ] |
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NFL if they feel there is some sort of discrimination. The NFL could easily shift to the MLB or NBA model - they just don’t want to- they enjoy having college dev players for free for them. It’s not the colleges job to force the NFL to change that - it’s the job of the players to go after the NFL to change it
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CU Medallion [55607]
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careful what you wish for...***
Aug 3, 2020, 12:48 PM
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Orange Blooded [3839]
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I agree with Coach Dabo
Aug 3, 2020, 12:58 PM
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If you could link the money to earning your degree then you deserve the money of your NIL. They are currently receiving a free education, meals, stipend, clothing. That isn't free to the average student. So you can't convince me that they don't get paid for playing currently. You must get your degree to benefit from the NIL.
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CU Medallion [55607]
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I'd be fine with that, but college itself is a racket too.
Aug 3, 2020, 1:09 PM
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I am about to send my oldest off to college. It is absolutely ridiculous what colleges list as tuition these days. Public or private. It is a racket.
Luckily, we are already seeing change and reform in the college racket. Many schools are dropping standardized tests. Many have cut staff and faculty. Some will go out of business (small, non-elite private schools mostly). COVID has been an extinction event for higher ed.
There is no way college football won't also be part of this.
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110%er [6825]
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Re: I agree with Coach Dabo
Aug 3, 2020, 1:10 PM
[ in reply to I agree with Coach Dabo ] |
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Yes/no.
Any other average student can sell their likeness or profit from their extra curricular activities. The issue for the athletes is simple: the compensation is inadequate considering the revenue generated. No one is arguing the degrees are worthless unless you attended UNC BUT the compensation is up to debate.
I personally feel that the NFL created a semi-closed shop and is involved in age discrimination.
Per the NFL: To be eligible for the draft, players must have been out of high school for at least three years and must have used up their college eligibility before the start of the next college football season... Before the draft, NFL Player Personnel staff members confirm the eligibility of draft prospects; that means researching the college backgrounds of approximately 3,000 college players each year. They work with NCAA compliance departments at schools across the country to verify the information for all prospects. They also check the rosters of college all-star games to make sure that only draft-eligible players play in the games... Once players have become draft-eligible or have declared their intention to enter the draft early, the Player Personnel staff work with teams, agents and schools to clarify the players’ status. They also work with agents, schools, scouts and teams to enforce league rules for Pro Days (where NFL scouts come to colleges to observe prospects) and private workouts.
It is literally on their webpage https://operations.nfl.com/the-players/the-nfl-draft/the-rules-of-the-draft
The NFL and NCAA are in bed together. College athletes have no power within the NFL - but with the NCAA - they have some but limited options. The NCAA is by-design, a development league whereby the "management" is able to force and control compensation under the guise of "academics".
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All-Conference [439]
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Re: I agree with Coach Dabo
Aug 3, 2020, 2:59 PM
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"The issue for the athletes is simple: the compensation is inadequate considering the revenue generated"
I agree with what you're saying except this statement.
My question is, says who? Until the vast majority of the 8 million high school athletes decide the current benefits aren't worth their time/labor commitment that statement isn't true.
You said it yourself 99.99% of D2/D3 students have no chance of going pro, they're already completely fine playing for much much much much less than the majority of D1 schools offer and its even less than what the top D1 schools offer in terms of facilities, experience, better education, better coaching, etc.
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110%er [6825]
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Re: I agree with Coach Dabo
Aug 3, 2020, 3:46 PM
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Yes, but it isn't just D1 as a whole, it is the 1% of players the revenue generating sports. The NBA (one and done) and NFL are basically in league with college sports. There is no (realistic) other option for the top talent (think TL16 level). Not only that, but TL16 or a Zion (in basketball) is generating bank for the likes of the "management" and the Pro are getting free resources and schools are getting revenue. Win/win for everyone but the players. While the college education is good (lets say 60K in compensation per year) that is a BIG potential paycut compared to rookie salary after the 1/3 year rule. While I think players should receive whatever fair share they wish, a lot of schools looking to be competitive would lose out (clemson would likely be one - tv market size) and thus compensation would be equally split in order to keep the smaller schools like Clemson happy. Personally, I would be fine with a true 18yo+ developement league otherwise I dont think the NBA/NFL can or should restrict recruiting or contacts. If the Falcons wanted to put TL on retainer as young as 16 or sign him at 18yo, then they should be able to do it. But the league prevents this and it is all about minimizing their risk. Since the NCAA will not stand up to the NFL (or anyone) about this well, the players can force change on this post-entry closed shop.
FYI, a few D3 schools have better facilities etc than a lot of D1 schools. Competition there is just harsh if not more than a lot of DI schools. There is a whole other side to the grey areas around DIII and "alumni or academic" scholarships going to a disproportionate number of athletes.
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All-In [27366]
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Yank their schollies and let 'em deal with the real world
Aug 3, 2020, 1:04 PM
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...wherever that is now.
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110%er [6321]
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PAC-12 might be full of Colon Kapernicks....
Aug 3, 2020, 2:13 PM
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....if they let them get away with this...
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110%er [7451]
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It’s going to be funny when the IRS becomes
Aug 3, 2020, 2:32 PM
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woke on taxing the players for the $150k a year or whatever $ it was that Drad mentioned in his congressional testimony regarding the total value on the package they get.. It’s going to seriously mess up 97% that aren’t going to be able to cover that bill. I wonder when the leadership from that 97% is going to wake up that they are being led by the 3% and their lawyers, and agents who stand to benefit from that 3% vs the 3% doesn’t give a #### about the 97%.
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All-In [48078]
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Re: Let the "woke" players walk
Aug 3, 2020, 2:40 PM
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I would let them walk, but the top can't be replaced.
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CU Guru [1204]
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Re: Let the "woke" players walk
Aug 3, 2020, 3:13 PM
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Yes they can. Anybody can be replaced.
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Hall of Famer [22127]
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Re: Let the "woke" players walk
Aug 3, 2020, 4:29 PM
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We've often heard the old saying, "opening up a can of worms". What we are seeing now is much more than a can. If the Pac10 schools agree to the demands of the malcontents, college football will be changed forever and I don't see any of this as being an improvement over what we now have. College football is a business. It generates a tremendous amount of those US dollars. But those dollars support not only the football scholarships, they cover the cost of most of the other sports as well. Vast sums are spent on facilities, such as the Reeves Center, catering to the football players. Add in the indoor practice facility, the outdoor practice facilities, the stadium, etc and we're talking big money. Some coaches make big money, based primarily on their records, but they provide personalized instruction to each player that would cost the player a wad of money if he were to receive that training in the free market place.
From all appearances it seems to me college football is headed in the direction of professionalism and I have already lost interest in professional sports. I suppose I am somewhat different from most college football fans, I don't buy the jerseys or other items of a particular player, I buy the CLEMSON stuff.
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