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Replies: 54
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Trump Haters
Apr 8, 2020, 1:00 PM
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Just a hypothetical here....
Say we get through coronavirus with significantly less deaths than projected. Will you come back and admit you were wrong w/ Trumps response? Or will you just find something else to be triggered at?
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Heisman Winner [137807]
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The answer isn't binary.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:01 PM
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I sincerely hope this helps.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: The answer isn't binary.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:05 PM
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I sincerely hope this helps.
ok. I'm not sure what your opinion is on Trump, but do you think he has handled this pandemic well?
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All-In [42023]
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Therein lies the problem.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:10 PM
[ in reply to The answer isn't binary. ] |
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They don't really get that.
It's also pretty silly to for the OP to insinuate that he will declare victory for Trump with what he sees as acceptable loss of life.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Therein lies the problem.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:24 PM
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They don't really get that.
It's also pretty silly to for the OP to insinuate that he will declare victory for Trump with what he sees as acceptable loss of life.
There goes Catahoula putting words in peoples mouth again.
I didn't say you had to come back here and celebrate his response. I've just seen post after post bashing Trump on his response.
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All-In [42023]
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Re: Therein lies the problem.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:28 PM
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And I say the current loss of life is already enough to not praise Trump at all, regardless of the final outcome. We're past that point.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Therein lies the problem.
Apr 8, 2020, 2:32 PM
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Orange Blooded [2692]
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we didn't have to shut US down in 2017-18 for the flu***
Apr 8, 2020, 2:34 PM
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Rock Defender [53]
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Nice try mental midget but I was addressing this statement
Apr 8, 2020, 2:37 PM
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Orange Blooded [2692]
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oh ok, just trying to help you sort out your feelings, lol***
Apr 8, 2020, 2:39 PM
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: oh ok, just trying to help you sort out your feelings, lol***
Apr 8, 2020, 2:44 PM
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All-In [42023]
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Just try not getting triggered by a message board.
Apr 8, 2020, 2:58 PM
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Particularly since the comment made to you wasn't that bad and you start ranting "mental midget" like a child.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Just try not getting triggered by a message board.
Apr 8, 2020, 3:25 PM
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All-In [42023]
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Ever notice how...
Apr 8, 2020, 11:27 PM
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Whenever you really get called in a thread, you start calling people stupid or other names similar?
That's just you admitting defeat. Have a discussion and stop getting triggered.
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All-In [42023]
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Re: Therein lies the problem.
Apr 8, 2020, 2:57 PM
[ in reply to Re: Therein lies the problem. ] |
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-Rate of death
-Rate of spread
-Amount of time those people will die
-The flu happens every year and we take measures for it... it doesn't spread like this virus, there's a vaccine, and it doesn't spread like this, either.
And 61,000 died of the flu that year.
We saw this coming and had a chance to take some early steps. We didn't.
Stop comparing this to any other illness. All of you who do this look foolish.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Therein lies the problem.
Apr 8, 2020, 3:02 PM
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All-In [42023]
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Hold up
Apr 8, 2020, 3:09 PM
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You're using another year when Trump was president to compare data.
So am I supposed to praise Trump then? Or not praise him?
I'm praising him for neither. Comparing this to the flu of any year in recent history is apples and oranges.
I posit he has made the problem worse with coronavirus. No, I will not outline those reasons as I've already done that in this thread and others.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Hold up
Apr 8, 2020, 3:13 PM
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All-In [42023]
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Who has done a better job at what?
Apr 8, 2020, 11:29 PM
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Containing this thing? What, are we giving a medal to the toddler who made the smallest mess?
What would I have done differently? For starters, take it seriously and listen to the early reports from my advisors instead of calling it a Dem hoax, comparing it to the flu, looking to Fox News for guidance, etc.
All those things.
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All-In [34486]
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IDK, you kinda seem triggered.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:02 PM
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You see, disagreeing with or criticizing public officials isn't being triggered.
Being so offended by that criticism that you make a post like this is.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: IDK, you kinda seem triggered.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:04 PM
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I asked a question and you didn't answer. I am not triggered. I am genuinely curious.
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All-In [42023]
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Nah. You are.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:08 PM
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And that's kind of the hallmark of people in love with Trump. Any criticism at all sends y'all into anger. Y'all actually elicit angry responses and emotions.
Criticism and scrutiny of public leaders is healthy. It's normal. It's necessary, especially in times like this. It's American.
Exhibiting anger at any and all criticism of a politician you adore is none of those things.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Nah. You are.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:21 PM
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And that's kind of the hallmark of people in love with Trump. Any criticism at all sends y'all into anger. Y'all actually elicit angry responses and emotions.
Criticism and scrutiny of public leaders is healthy. It's normal. It's necessary, especially in times like this. It's American.
Exhibiting anger at any and all criticism of a politician you adore is none of those things.
Why do you assume that everyone who doesn't hate trump, loves him?
I am a Republican that didn't vote for Trump and don't like his antics or past. However I am not shielded by TDS and I don't blame everythign on him like Dems do.
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All-In [42023]
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Re: Nah. You are.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:27 PM
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Because you praise everything he does and attack anyone who criticizes him.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Nah. You are.
Apr 8, 2020, 3:13 PM
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Because you praise everything he does and attack anyone who criticizes him.
I criticized him in the post you are responding to. hmmmmm
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All-In [42023]
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I'll flip that around
Apr 8, 2020, 1:06 PM
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Let's say we don't have significantly less. Will you admit you were wrong about Trump's response?
Because here's the problem. Are we going to shoulder all of the credit or blame on Trump? I predict that if we have less, you'll come in here claiming it was all Trump and he saved us, and if it continues to be a disaster (which it is at the moment), you'll keep claiming it wasn't his fault at all.
So what is it? You can't have it both ways.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: I'll flip that around
Apr 8, 2020, 1:19 PM
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I think Trump has handled the pandemic very well thus far. He has worked really well w/ Cuomo and Gavin Newsom. He has been transparent the whole time and has relied on his experts on the corona task force. He has fielded hard hitting questions from reporters every single day.
His best moment was banning travel to and from China in January when other high ranking democrats were encouraging people to go to China Town, restaurants, not canceling mardi gras, etc.
He has aided in coordinating the 2 navy ship hospitals as well as building hospitals in NY
The only thing I would be critical of is the limited testing capacity at the beginning. Although I'm not sure that is on Trump.
To answer your question though, I would say yes. If coronavirus ends in a total disaster and Trump could have prevented it, then I would criticize his response.
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All-In [42023]
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Guess we see it differently...
Apr 8, 2020, 1:27 PM
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-He's put blame on the states and demand they take the lead.
-He didn't take the virus seriously at first and pushed the dangerous talking points in Jan. and Feb.
-He's contradicted medical experts.
-He's flipped out and pitched fits at reporters over tough questions, including losing it when someone just read back his quotes.
-He fired the inspector general who oversaw the stimulus spending.
-He fired the Navy captain who spoke out about his troops.
-He bragged about being #1 on Facebook during this.
-He hasn't worked very well with Cuomo and even spread misinformation about the ventilators in NY.
-As you mentioned, dropped the ball on the testing. Even lied and said everyone would get a test.
Has everything he done bad? No, of course not. I'll give you the ships and such. But overall, the leadership hasn't been good and has, at worst, made the situation worse. Most presidents in our lifetime would have handled this much better, and that's a bipartisan statement.
Also, your mention of travel from China and eating at Chinese restaurants... those aren't related.
Either way, we've lost too many lives. So it's already a loss. Hopefully it isn't a blowout loss.
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All-Conference [404]
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Re: Guess we see it differently...
Apr 8, 2020, 1:34 PM
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The world would be a better place without idiots like you in it.
It blows my mind that during times like this all you can do is look for a political victory by finding a way to criticize the president.
And this is coming from someone who didn’t vote for him.
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All-In [42023]
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Cool, thanks JHOP.
Apr 8, 2020, 1:51 PM
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Shall we dive into your catalogue of absolute nutjob posts?
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: Guess we see it differently...
Apr 8, 2020, 2:57 PM
[ in reply to Re: Guess we see it differently... ] |
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Do you realize that, when presented with a list of facts, you don't retort them, but ad hominem instead?
Says a lot.. lol
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Guess we see it differently...
Apr 8, 2020, 4:43 PM
[ in reply to Guess we see it differently... ] |
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-He's put blame on the states and demand they take the lead.
He wants the states to lead. His tone and putting "blame" have nothing to do with the current crisis. I don't like his tone in most ways. I certainly wouldn't count this against him in his response.
-He didn't take the virus seriously at first and pushed the dangerous talking points in Jan. and Feb.
This is fair, but he did ban travel and I do think that was a big deal. Not many people predicted how bad this would be and it doesn't help that we were being lied to by China and the WHO.
-He's contradicted medical experts.
He has held hours upon hours of press conferences. He's obviously brash in his responses. Of course he's going to contradict what others say. I don't think this statement affects the response.
-He's flipped out and pitched fits at reporters over tough questions, including losing it when someone just read back his quotes.
Nothing to do with the response
-He fired the inspector general who oversaw the stimulus spending.
Don't mind this
-He fired the Navy captain who spoke out about his troops.
He did not fire the Navy captain. The Navy captain was irresponsible as well in letting the troops venture into Vietnam. It still has nothing to do with the overall response
-He bragged about being #1 on Facebook during this.
Nothing to do with response
-He hasn't worked very well with Cuomo and even spread misinformation about the ventilators in NY.
Cuomo has said the opposite. S
-As you mentioned, dropped the ball on the testing. Even lied and said everyone would get a test.
Sure
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All-In [34100]
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What you refer to as Trump's "best moment":
Apr 8, 2020, 4:03 PM
[ in reply to Re: I'll flip that around ] |
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The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention on Jan. 21 announced the first travel-related case of novel coronavirus in the United States. Trump unveiled his plan 10 days later, making the restrictions effective Feb. 2. (On Jan. 17, the CDC had begun health screenings of passengers on direct or connecting flights from Wuhan, China, the epicenter of the outbreak.)
Trump barred non-U.S. citizens from traveling from China, but there were 11 exceptions, and Hong Kong, Macao and Taiwan were not included. U.S. citizens and permanent residents could still travel from China but were subject to screening and possible 14-day quarantine. Some flights were immediately suspended, but others continued for weeks, at the discretion of the airlines.
Some analysts at the time predicted that Trump’s action would be ineffective at preventing the virus from taking hold in the United States.
“All of the evidence we have indicates that travel restrictions and quarantines directed at individual countries are unlikely to keep the virus out of our borders,” said Jennifer Nuzzo, associate professor and senior scholar at Johns Hopkins University’s Center for Health Security, at a congressional hearing Feb. 5.
“We don’t have a travel ban; we have a travel Band-Aid right now,” said Ron Klain, the Ebola “czar” during the Obama administration, at the same hearing. He added that monitoring everyone carefully “is the only practical thing we can do.”
The New York Times calculated that at least 430,000 people arrived in the United States on direct flights from China since Jan. 1, including nearly 40,000 in the two months after Trump imposed restrictions. Moreover, screening proceedings of travelers from China have been uneven and inconsistent, the Times said. |
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/04/07/trumps-claim-that-he-imposed-first-china-ban/
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Legend [15492]
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Re: I'll flip that around
Apr 8, 2020, 5:06 PM
[ in reply to I'll flip that around ] |
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Let's say we don't have significantly less. Will you admit you were wrong about Trump's response?
Because here's the problem. Are we going to shoulder all of the credit or blame on Trump? I predict that if we have less, you'll come in here claiming it was all Trump and he saved us, and if it continues to be a disaster (which it is at the moment), you'll keep claiming it wasn't his fault at all.
So what is it? You can't have it both ways.
If it's less, Trump is a hero and a genius. If it continues to be a disaster, it's the fault of the
states because Nebraska didn't adequately prepare for a Pandemic. FEMA doesn't do Pandemics, they only
do Hurricanes and Tornados. The Governor's, they're to blame.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: I'll flip that around
Apr 8, 2020, 5:15 PM
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All-In [38514]
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I've got no issues with his actions, especially after
Apr 8, 2020, 1:09 PM
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the task force was created. I also can't say that anyone else would have necessarily acted better before that point.
The issue with Trump is his rhetoric and contradictory statements that are often at odds with the actions that he and the task force are actually taking.
But I think the overall response by the administration has been good despite him.
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CU Medallion [56005]
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I'll give credit where credit is due.***
Apr 8, 2020, 1:11 PM
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Orange Blooded [2692]
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no, because he deflected it all to the states
Apr 8, 2020, 1:12 PM
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If Trump admits that his job was to be the "backup", why should I give him any credit at all for the work that was done on the ground by local and state governments.
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Orange Blooded [2692]
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does it look like he has been taking it seriously?
Apr 8, 2020, 1:28 PM
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He was notified that this was a "cataclysmic threat" back in early January.
I like golf too, but if you take your job as President seriously, and the lives of 300 million Americans seriously, maybe you'd put the golf on the back burner, eh?
https://trumpgolfcount.com/displayoutings Trump Golf Count Trump Golf Count: Tracking President Trumps golfing so you don't have to!
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All-In [48078]
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Re: Trump Haters
Apr 8, 2020, 1:33 PM
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Nobody would be wrong about his response. He will just have dodged a bullet. Either way his response was not quality.
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Oculus Spirit [97676]
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You assume Trump supporters think exactly what he thinks
Apr 8, 2020, 1:42 PM
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about the virus. Let me rephrase that. You assume his supporters think what he says is true. Every politician right down the line from Iran to China to Italy to France to England to Russia to whatever......they've all lied about this. Trump's right up there. CDC and WHO are also both right up there.
I could care less what Trump says really.
If the body count is less, I'll jump for joy. But I sure as heck won't thank Trump or anyone else. I'll thank God maybe. Governors. The national guard. Churches. Food banks. Medical staff and hospitals. But that's about it.
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All-In [48078]
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Re: You assume Trump supporters think exactly what he thinks
Apr 8, 2020, 1:56 PM
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I think the body count will be less. I always thought that. I may be wrong, but I sure hope not.
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Oculus Spirit [97676]
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I think it will eventually be in that range he gave
Apr 8, 2020, 3:15 PM
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recently. Maybe more. Eventually. We may very well "peak" under that, but this isn't going anywhere. Looking at Australia, it may subside during summer, and we may get back to somewhat normal, but it will reemerge and another outbreak will happen, and then another peak. The only natural way this can end, minus a vaccine or some super effective treatment, is when 50% of people get it....and recover.
The Spanish flu came in 3 waves, over a nearly 2 year period. Each wave taking advantage of those unexposed to it previously. The first wave was small, relatively. The middle one was the worst, and the third split the difference between the first and second in severity. Now, everyone hears the "fatality rate" of the Spanish flu in 1918 was 2%. That's not accurate. 2% represents the percentage of the total population dropped on Earth. 2% of an entire country. The fatality rate for people who GOT the Spanish flu was probably closer to 10%. 500 million people got it, 50 million died.
Now think of the covid cases. Imagine if this was 1918. No ventilators. No supplemental oxygen. Basically nothing to preserve life like we have today. This virus is actually every bit on par, if not worse, than the Spanish flu if you take into account 1918 medical care versus 2020. To try and determine the 1918 equivalent, you can assume the vast majority of people who end up needing even mild doses of supplemental oxygen with this, would have been a death in 1918. This virus itself is likely deadlier than the Spanish flu. The Chinese estimated 20% of cases needed supplemental oxygen. In 1918 the death rate for those infected with covid (enough to record as in people clearly sick with it) would be somewhere close to 20%. With oxygen and respirators, we have that number down to 2.5% to 10%, in that range. So we get a worse virus, but a similar death rate for those ill with it. Without our modern treatments, covid could easily be deadlier. Now, you then have to figure out that Congo, Sierra Leone, and impoverished third world countries will be wholly unable to keep that death rate down and in those countries it could rise to 20%. Overall, in 2-3 years, this will impact the planet's population at least as much as the 1918 flu, as a percentage. As a total number of deaths, it will be staggering and unprecedented.
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: Trump Haters
Apr 8, 2020, 2:56 PM
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I mean there isn't a black and white answer here. He clearly already ###### up by not taking it seriously at first. I guess you can judge that separately from how he handled it from he point where he did start taking it seriously.
Either way, I hope the least amount of people get infected/succumb to this.
Trump is a moron either way lol.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Trump Haters
Apr 8, 2020, 3:15 PM
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I mean there isn't a black and white answer here. He clearly already ###### up by not taking it seriously at first. I guess you can judge that separately from how he handled it from he point where he did start taking it seriously.
Either way, I hope the least amount of people get infected/succumb to this.
Trump is a moron either way lol.
He took it more serious then the highest ranking democrats in the senate and house.
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Standout [347]
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As of right now, how many die don’t affect my opinion.
Apr 8, 2020, 3:50 PM
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His response in the beginning was poor, then he finally took it seriously and started heeding the advice of his advisors and has been doing a much better job since then.
It’s been refreshing watching our child president grow up into a teenager before our eyes. Still a long way to go, but back by steps.
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Standout [347]
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Baby steps******
Apr 8, 2020, 6:01 PM
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110%er [6208]
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Wait...how, exactly, has he handled this well?
Apr 8, 2020, 4:50 PM
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By calling it a "hoax" and ignoring it? Or by getting behind a podium everyday and acting like a petulant child? His response has been a disaster, pure and simple. If he was on top of this and had taken it seriously, he would have tested immediately at the borders and points of entry. He didn't and now we've got a crisis.
You people are incredible with your blind loyalty to the worst President (and arguably the worst person) in US history.
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Rock Defender [53]
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If you notice
Apr 8, 2020, 4:55 PM
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110%er [6208]
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Re: If you notice
Apr 8, 2020, 5:02 PM
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Well, OF COURSE it's gotten better...how on Earth could it get any worse??? What was he going to do? Continue to do NOTHING? So, if you're saying his performance in the face of this crisis has improved (on a scale of 1-10) from a 0 to a 2 , then I would agree with you... But for the love of God, a 2 ain't real good.
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Legend [15492]
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Re: Trump Haters
Apr 8, 2020, 5:02 PM
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Just a hypothetical here....
Say we get through coronavirus with significantly less deaths than projected. Will you come back and admit you were wrong w/ Trumps response? Or will you just find something else to be triggered at?
I think the better question is are you going to give Trump credit for American's following the advice of Drs Fauci and Birx?? Let's be clear. Social distancing and staying at home were not Trump's ideas. He didn't like them and wanted to end them by Easter...remember? He was more worried about the economy.
Now, if those measures bring down the number of dead, you're going to give Trump credit? Not Fauici and Birx? Is Trump going to give them credit? Or claim that he's saved the country? I say most likely the latter rather than the former.
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Standout [347]
TigerPulse: 84%
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I get what you’re saying but all presidents have advisors
Apr 8, 2020, 6:04 PM
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that give them most of their ideas, or at least figure out to execute on good ideas. Pick any president and anything good they’ve done, their advisors probably had a lot to do with it.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
TigerPulse: 81%
Posts: 8366
Joined: 8/12/14
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Re: Trump Haters
Apr 9, 2020, 8:56 AM
[ in reply to Re: Trump Haters ] |
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Just a hypothetical here....
Say we get through coronavirus with significantly less deaths than projected. Will you come back and admit you were wrong w/ Trumps response? Or will you just find something else to be triggered at? I think the better question is are you going to give Trump credit for American's following the advice of Drs Fauci and Birx?? Let's be clear. Social distancing and staying at home were not Trump's ideas. He didn't like them and wanted to end them by Easter...remember? He was more worried about the economy. Now, if those measures bring down the number of dead, you're going to give Trump credit? Not Fauici and Birx? Is Trump going to give them credit? Or claim that he's saved the country? I say most likely the latter rather than the former.
Wait, you don't want the economic shut down to end?
Trump said that it was hopeful and a goal, but that doesn't mean he doesn't care about american lives and all he cares about is the economy.
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Oculus Spirit [93612]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 95387
Joined: 12/25/09
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I believe the projections are propaganda.
Apr 8, 2020, 6:19 PM
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I also don't believe in the accuracy of the numerator or the demonator in the calculations of death rates due to the chinese plague.
I'm not saying the virus isn't deadly for it certainly is but we are falling victim to government lies, hyperbole manufactured by bureaucrats, elites in education, political figures (including Trump) and media whether liberal or conservative.
We need Diogenes more now than ever.
I hope this offends everyone so if I missed offending anyone then just let me know. I'm sure I can come up with something.
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Legend [15492]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 18413
Joined: 12/10/14
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Re: I believe the projections are propaganda.
Apr 8, 2020, 6:29 PM
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I also don't believe in the accuracy of the numerator or the demonator in the calculations of death rates due to the chinese plague.
I'm not saying the virus isn't deadly for it certainly is but we are falling victim to government lies, hyperbole manufactured by bureaucrats, elites in education, political figures (including Trump) and media whether liberal or conservative.
We need Diogenes more now than ever.
I hope this offends everyone so if I missed offending anyone then just let me know. I'm sure I can come up with something.
Me! Me! I wasn't offended! Offend Me!
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