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Topic: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?
Replies: 13   Last Post: Oct 27, 2021, 12:37 PM by: TigersO
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Replies: 13  

Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?

[1]
Oct 26, 2021, 9:57 PM
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Every once in a while a player has a game or two where they play well above their head. Maybe it’s a particular defense, maybe we schemed better for them, maybe that day they woke up on the right side of the bed.

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Re: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?

[1]
Oct 26, 2021, 10:07 PM
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Or maybe they had a month to rest up and recover from injuries and maybe Oklahoma stunk that night. But I do like the way the Tigers steamrolled the Sooners in that game.

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Re: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?


Oct 26, 2021, 10:10 PM
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My guess is they didn't have any film on him. All the plays were scripted so very few reads. He didn't run, no QB designed runs.

Had more cohesive oline and 2 stud receivers as well as Spector and etn. We got ETN in space a lot. ETN at al knew our scheme and helped DJ in that regard. Tons of yac. Amari and ETN both excellent at route running, and like BC, not much pressure... But both and Cornell could make redic catches. Kinda like the last drive of Pitt game. Not much pressure.

But in ot, ND put pressure on DJ and you kinda saw what we've seen this year. Jmo

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Re: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?

emoji_events [8]
Oct 26, 2021, 10:22 PM
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As a guy who's coached more kids than I can remember, I have a different take on that...I actually think that was the actual Cole Stoudt. That wasn't the first time we saw that guy. We saw him play like that in a Spring Game, once...he killed it. Chad Kelly didn't...and spontaneously combusted, he'd been outplayed so bad. He came out in the UGA game in 2014 flinging like a guy who knew his business. And then...The Chad happened. The Chad really wanted to coach Deshaun Watson.

Players don't play "above their heads". When you see them have a really good game, that's not an accident...what they've actually shown you is their ceiling.

If they're not playing to that, there's something in the way, and that thing is invariably in their heads.

The real question is, as a coach, can you get that thing out of their heads? Or worse, did you put it there?

I don't know DJU nearly well enough to know what's going on with him, but the dude has shown us his ceiling. What he's showing us right now is dysfunction. What the root cause of that is, I can only speculate. But the talent's there, we've seen it. And I suspect that's also why Dabo has pretty much refused to give up on the kid. Giving up on people is not a thing he does easily, or quickly. It's probably both his best attribute as a human, actually.

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Re: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?

[2]
Oct 27, 2021, 12:07 AM
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Sorry, while I respect your posts. Always TU. Definitely have the knowledge above me but I respectively have to disagree with your assessment of both stoudt and DJ in the ND game.

I'd urge everyone to go back and watch the ND game. The DJU we have now is the DJ you saw in the overtime. Cornell made one heck of a catch in first OT and fought for the extra yardage. Time and time again ETN and mainly Amari is what got us points. DJ was erratic in that game too. The plays we could run in that game got us first downs because yac. We run those now, it's 3rd down punt, or a dropped ball or an errant pass.

Our oline played good. But the play calling was much better. And the WR play because of the respect of ETN was open. ND played soft.

In addition, our D played lights out and ND could and probably should have beat us handily. They stopped themselves and settled for fg when they probably shouldn't. They fumbled a sure TD and a similar bad pitch by DJ gave them a pick 6. We got just enough good yardage from ETN and Amari bubble screen to get into ND territory where bt potter could come through on field goals.

I could be way wrong, but that's what I saw in the first ND game.

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Re: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?

[4]
Oct 27, 2021, 9:44 AM
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This is where I think you are missing what DJ has been doing lately.

DJ's numbers at the end of games look awful. For someone only stat checking (I know you are not) and not watching the games he looks like the worst QB in the country and appears to be making no improvement.

Here's the hidden story to those who aren't paying close attention.

DJ would have been a 70% passer against Syracuse without the 4 drops by his teammates. He also lost roughly 75 yards passing to those drops (only counting yards in the air and not any possibility of YAC).

DJ would have been a 68% passer against Pitt without the 5 drops by his teammates. He lost roughly the same number of air yards passing vs Pitt as Syracuse but with the guarantee of about 40 YAC from Shipley.

What's worse, those 9 drops I'm counting are only counting clear drops and not situations where the WR didn't do his part to fight for the ball where he could have made a nice catch to help out even more. These are the plays you are referencing from last season that made DJ look like a Heisman contender. Even without them, DJ has played like a winning QB for the last 2 weeks at a minimum.

In just the last 2 weeks DJ has lost 15-20% completions and roughly a minimum of 200 yards passing to drops alone.

Every QB makes errant throws during every game, but if the net result of catchable balls is near 65-70% it's hard to say the QB is not carrying his weight and playing well.

Many people, and I am including you in this at the moment, are not reassessing the situation with Clemson's offense.

DJ was a major problem early in the season, but while still not perfect it appears DJ shook off the rough start for at least the last 2 weeks and his teammates completely let him down.

I hope we get to see DJ playing well combined with some skill players helping him out moving forward with the season.

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Re: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?

[1]
Oct 27, 2021, 10:22 AM
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Thanks. I get wordy and confused, especially midnight. But I thought I was expressing a similar sentiment as your post here. And that is we're not seeing a different DJ now vs last year's games. Just stating his support staff last year was soo much better than what he has this year. In the ND game, he could dump to his outlet Amari or ETN and they'd juke peeps to move the chains. Now, he does that and we drop the pass, don't block etc and we end up having to punt.

So I'm saying he's the same DJ. Also what ND did to him in 2nd OT is exactly what uga and to a lesser extent, NC st did. Brought pressure and blew up the plays. I totally agree with your assessment. I do think he's getting better...

Where I do disagree, in rewatching the ND game, he had much more decisive plays (quick plays) that Elliott called. The last drive in the Pitt game, he did that. Bottom line, to Elliott, open it back up like ND game. More play action, let DJ rip it down the middle and trust your receivers a la Powell and Amari make the play. If the current received don't and it gets int, so be it, that's on wrs. Now that ship is back, send him on wheel route and trust he'll catch and or fight for yac.

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Re: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?

[1]
Oct 27, 2021, 11:17 AM
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I would not dare defend anything DJ did in the UGA or NC State games with the exception of throwing what should have been a TD to Ross on 1st down in overtime vs NC State.

My point was to say he has examined what he was doing wrong and is making progress in those areas.

He is not currently "2nd overtime vs ND DJ", but I agree that he was against UGA because in similar fashion his oline gave up some pressure that was so quick anyone would panic. In the UGA game he started expecting the failures when they weren't there. He didn't have time to see ghosts in the ND game because the game ended.

In reference to your suggestion to Elliott and DJ of "move forward and let it rip and trust his WRs", I think that's a great plan.

I thought he did that to start the Pitt game.

Then his skill players showed him that he couldn't trust them with 5 drops and a WR taking a dive instead of trying to break up a pass that was intercepted.

We started the year with a ton of the blame needing to be placed at DJ's feet. The last 2 weeks, with the exception of the shovel pass, I'm not sure that much of the blame can be sent DJ's direction.

I hope he keeps it up with the positive direction of his play.

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Yup. The wide receivers making the "50/50" play and in

[1]
Oct 27, 2021, 11:32 AM
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reality making OUTSTANDING catches are why we won the NC in 16 and why we won a lot of games with TL at the helm. DJ got that play last year. This year, there have been lots of drops, and not as much awesome. Now there has been some, like Ngata and Ross vs. Syracuse, etc. I think DJ is errant on some of his throws downfield, and flat blows it on some of the short stuff. That combined with pedestrian WR play, and you end up with three losses!

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Re: Yup. The wide receivers making the "50/50" play and in


Oct 27, 2021, 12:37 PM
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Sometimes the throws people are calling "errant" from DJ are right on the money.

For example one of DJ's "bad throws" as dubbed by one of the announcers in the Pitt game was a problem with Ross and not with DJ.

We had a 3rd and 7. Ross lined up wide to the left. There was some pressure on the play and DJ had to get rid of the ball quickly.

The ball sailed out of bounds 8 yards downfield.

Ross decided to run his stop route to 12 yards.

Most people, including the announcer, saw a bad play by DJ who got rattled by the pressure.

The problem with that line of thinking is that I've never heard a coach teach a WR to run a 3rd down stop route 5 yards past the line to gain.

Now if Ross was running a go route and DJ threw it short then it's poor communication and either DJ or both are to blame. The problem is Ross ran the route that DJ was throwing for, but he didn't run it to the marker or even stay within a yard or two of the marker.

This doesn't go in anyone's book as a drop, but the WR metaphorically dropped the ball on the play.

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And play calling on the last three and out was terribly

[1]
Oct 27, 2021, 11:28 AM
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conservative, or maybe just plain terrible. Gave the ball back to ND and they marched down the field as they had done all night.

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Re: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?

[2]
Oct 26, 2021, 10:52 PM
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I guess one more time in remedial class is needed. Etienne, Rodgers and Powell are all gone and oh by the way, we lost that game.

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Re: Was ND 2020 like Stoudt’s Oklahoma?

[1]
Oct 27, 2021, 11:04 AM
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Nope the difference was that ETN always had ND’s complete attention

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Interesting analogy. Perhaps.***

[1]
Oct 27, 2021, 11:14 AM
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