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Replies: 61
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All-American [581]
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All-In [44043]
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His stock has surely gone down since then.***
Nov 3, 2021, 10:40 PM
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All-American [581]
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Yeah because one season with an elephant or two in the room
Nov 3, 2021, 10:47 PM
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completely outweighs 6 years of unprecedented Clemson success.
But since you brought it up,
2 tournament wins in 11years... I'm just gonna leave that with you.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Yeah because one season with an elephant or two in the room
Nov 3, 2021, 10:51 PM
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How the hell do you justify giving Elliott credit for 6 years?
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MVP [540]
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Re: Yeah because one season with an elephant or two in the room
Nov 3, 2021, 10:58 PM
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How do you not? He was at minimum 50% responsible for our playcalling since 2015.
You're not happy with this year? Fine. There are arguments against Tony for that. But to not acknowledge what the man has done for Clemson is just ignorant.
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Orange Blooded [3184]
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Re: Yeah because one season with an elephant or two in the room
Nov 3, 2021, 11:23 PM
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I’d say more like 33.3%
Jeff Scott- 33.3%
DW4/TL- 33.3%
TE-33.3%
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All-American [581]
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Cool story bro***
Nov 3, 2021, 11:30 PM
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Orange Blooded [4965]
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Lot o points [155901]
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Nope.***
Nov 5, 2021, 10:26 PM
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110%er [6474]
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Legend [17599]
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All-American [581]
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CU Guru [1847]
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Yeah because one season with an elephant or two in the room
Nov 4, 2021, 7:23 AM
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1. Trevor and Deshaun
2. Brent Venables
3. Dabo
4. Jeff Scott (our offense has tanked since he left)
5. Elliott
In order of importance to the team's success. We absolutely do not win any titles without our generational QBs (history has proven the better QB is going to win) or Brent Venables (who is by far our most important coach). Dabo plays a very active role in the offense, including playcalling, more than most of you know. He deserves a lot of credit when the offense is good and a lot of blame when its bad. The biggest issue is that he's brought in so many of his people and they love him so much that they're yes men outside of BV. Scott was our best offensive recruiter and our primary playcaller while here. I don't know what to tell you if you can't see the massive dropoff in our offense since he left.
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All-American [581]
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Another cool story bro.
Nov 4, 2021, 3:06 PM
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Got any facts to back up your numerical attempt to downplay Tony Elliot, or did you just make it all up in your head?
You made it up, obviously.
For one, Jeff Scott was never the primary playcaller. You knowingly fibbed. Since Tony and Jeff were implemented as "Co OC's" in 2015, it has been widely known and backed up by Dabo - Elliott is the eyes in the booth and is the primary playcaller. Dabo and Jeff added input, but at no point were Jeff and Dabo calling plays.
Our offense was the best passing offense (ypg) in Clemson history last year, in 2020. That was Tony Elliott, without Jeff. The offense was #10 in the country the only year without Jeff (you said, "massive dropoff"?), and the reason it wasn't in the top 5 was because the rushing game fell off. Oline issues started in 2019 when a decrease in YPC began, even with Travis Ettienne. That's a separate issue. 2020 saw the best passing offense in Clemson history, but we saw a dramatic decrease in rushing efficiency. The thing is, Jeff was not a rushing game coordinator or an offensive line guru. That's the point.
You're just making things up.
Since you felt the need to name players as the #1 reason for our offense, can you name an elite team who doesn't have great players?
In summary, Elliott is the guy primarily responsible for the greatest offensive system in Clemson history. He's led one of the most consistent offenses in college football since he took over in 2015, and he's widely seen as one of the best coordinators in the country.
Those are the real facts.
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Orange Blooded [2407]
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Re: Another cool story bro.
Nov 4, 2021, 3:13 PM
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Have you and Tony been dating long?
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Freshman [-99]
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Re: Another cool story bro.
Nov 4, 2021, 3:27 PM
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Have you and Tony been dating long?
Why does TE need toilet paper when he has Peppa?
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All-American [581]
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110%er [5287]
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Re: Another cool story bro.
Nov 4, 2021, 5:00 PM
[ in reply to Another cool story bro. ] |
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Jeff Scott is who called the Orange Crush play that went to Renfrow to win the 2016 NC game....just FYI, there's one fact to back it up.
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110%er [5287]
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Re: Another cool story bro.
Nov 4, 2021, 5:03 PM
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https://www.tigernet.com/story/Orange-Crush-15536 Orange Crush Crush. The name will forever be etched in Clemson lore, and Hunter Renfrow's name will always be remembered at Clemson. Crush was the name of the play that secu
Just in case you missed the story that indeed says Jeff Scott is who called the game winning play....
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All-American [581]
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We ran 5626 plays while Tony and Jeff were on staff together
Nov 5, 2021, 3:50 AM
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And you got one play as your "proof" that Jeff was the one really calling plays?
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1st Rounder [645]
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Re: Yeah because one season with an elephant or two in the room
Nov 5, 2021, 8:49 AM
[ in reply to Re: Yeah because one season with an elephant or two in the room ] |
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Name one offensive position group that is as talented as our championship teams. There are none. People love to talk about 4-5* HS ratings as the same as college championship level talent. Like "How can these coaches be so bad when we have all this talent?"
The simplest explanation for this year's performance is our talent is not as good on offense across the board. WR-Williams, Renfro, Higgins, Rodgers. We don't have anyone on the roster as good as those guys. TE-Who compares to Leggett? RB Gallman and Etienne vs. our freshmen. OL the same. QB-Watson and Lawrence.
Often the simplest explanation is the right one. Our coaches haven't forgotten how to coach. They have good talent, but not the super high level of talent they had during the Championship years. You can also see that with the obvious mistakes with penalties, missed assignments, dropped balls, and missed passes. Our talent is just not quite as good this year. Once that is understood and admitted, recognized, it should stop all this fire all the coaches nonsense. It won't, but it should.
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Orange Blooded [2965]
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All-In [44043]
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MVP [540]
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Re: LOL!
Nov 3, 2021, 11:07 PM
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I'm not him but I took it as he was criticizing basketball because you always defend that with everything you have yet, in our first bad year in a long time, you jump all over the football coaches and program.
At best (and still not good), you're proving a point. At worst, your an opportunist that is spiteful and hypocritical.
I used to feel for you in your endless, 1-man defense of the basketball failures. This football season really showed me what you're about.
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MVP [540]
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Re: LOL!
Nov 3, 2021, 11:08 PM
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*you're.
Now I realize why people hate that you can't edit. Autocorrects suck.
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Oculus Spirit [96844]
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People that donate to the site can edit posts...
Nov 4, 2021, 10:30 AM
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just throwing that out there.
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MVP [540]
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Re: People that donate to the site can edit posts...
Nov 4, 2021, 11:10 AM
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Ah. Thank you for the information.
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Oculus Spirit [76921]
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All-American [581]
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Thank you***
Nov 3, 2021, 11:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: LOL! ] |
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CU Guru [1847]
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Re: LOL!
Nov 3, 2021, 11:26 PM
[ in reply to Re: LOL! ] |
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I think you speak for most, but that’s just my guess.
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Recruit [76]
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Re: LOL!
Nov 4, 2021, 10:44 AM
[ in reply to Re: LOL! ] |
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^^^^that^^^^
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Orange Blooded [2965]
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Lot o points [155901]
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stupid spoiled fans and their above-average expectations....***
Nov 4, 2021, 8:19 AM
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CU Guru [1932]
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I don't think Clemson Fans
Nov 4, 2021, 8:32 AM
[ in reply to Re: His stock has surely gone down since then.*** ] |
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have ever been happy with playing .500 football. Even before we were spoiled. I think Dabo is smart enough to know what the problem is and I hope he acts quickly to make repairs. Its almost unthinkable that we could be this bad without any schematic problems though.
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Orange Blooded [2965]
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Re: I don't think Clemson Fans
Nov 4, 2021, 10:24 AM
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I dont know what makes people think they are owed a good team!
But you say this bad, They are currently 5-3 still could it up 10-3 . How is that this bad?
The three teams Clemson lost to are top 25 teams and Georgia is ranked # 1. This bad?
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All-Pro [663]
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Re: I don't think Clemson Fans
Nov 4, 2021, 10:38 AM
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Are you dense? Our offense is that bad. If you can't see that then you are blind or willingly ignorant. Maybe you are letting your homerism get in the way. Going from a top 3 team to the 30th best team in one year is bad. Especially when our head coach continued to tell us all spring and summer how good we were. We could easily have two more losses this year and have squeaked by in several wins that were blowouts last year. And it's not because those teams were drastically improved. It's because we are that bad. I did see some improvement against Florida State though.
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CU Guru [1932]
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All-American [581]
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Good thing we scored more points than the other teams.***
Nov 4, 2021, 4:18 PM
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All-In [44043]
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I’ll tell you why people think they are owed a good team.
Nov 4, 2021, 11:56 PM
[ in reply to Re: I don't think Clemson Fans ] |
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Our head coach makes $8 million a year, near the top of all college head coaches.
Our defensive coordinator makes $2.5 million a year, the highest paid assistant coach in college football.
Our offensive coordinator makes $2 million a year, the highest paid offensive coordinator in college football.
Our coaching staff as a whole makes roughly $15 million a year, the highest paid in college football.
We have one of the most talented teams in college football based on recruiting rankings.
We are widely considered to have the best facilities in college football.
We have among the best fan bases in college football.
Everything is in place to be successful. There is no excuse to be having the season we are having. There is especially no excuse for having one of the worst offenses in college football.
So please spare us the “spoiled fan” bit. If you don’t want high expectations for our team, take it up with the coaches who make so much and the administrators who pay them and provide them with so many advantages.
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All-American [581]
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There you go again.
Nov 5, 2021, 3:42 AM
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In 12 years, Clemson is the 2nd winningest team in college football with more playoff wins and national championships than any other team except one. This staff has proven to be one of the best in the country and has the trophy case to prove it. The football program has succeeded at levels greater than any athletic program in Clemson history. All of them combined in fact. Their historic run is one of the best in college football history. They have earned every single penny, and one rough season (for obvious reasons that can't be fixed with a magic wand) doesn't take away from any of that...
Yet you just keep trying no matter how many times you get corrected. We all know why.
In 11 years, the basketball staff has 2 tournament wins. TWO... in ELEVEN years!
The coaching staff makes more than enough money to coach well. Money doesn't make a coach. A good coach earns his money.
The administration has paid them well and provided them with EVERYTHING they need to win.
There are dozens of staffs with less money but more accomplishments over 11 years.
Our head coach makes over $2 million a year. Would $20 million make him coach better? Of course not.
We have great facilities and a fan base that would LOVE to support a good program. It's been shown time and time again - play quality ball and win, and we pack Littlejohn.
Teams with less on paper talent get coached up and accomplish every single year.
We have had 11 years to build talent. We've had more talent than teams with more tournament wins.
Coaches have done more with less at Clemson and coaches do more with less all over the country.
Everything is in place to be successful. There is no excuse for the utter lack of accomplishments over 11 years. There is especially no excuse for winning only 2 NCAA tournament games in 11 years.
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All-In [44043]
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I’m not sure why you keep posting our football accomplishments.
Nov 5, 2021, 4:57 AM
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Everyone here is fully aware of them.
You are correct in saying that this season doesn’t undo any of our recent accomplishments. Likewise, those successes don’t excuse the subpar season we are having this year.
Our belief/assumption that we have an outstanding coaching staff and elite talent is precisely why this year has been so puzzlingly disappointing.
Again, it would be one thing if our football coaches were up against significant disadvantages (like our basketball coaches are). But they aren’t. Our football coaches have every advantage in the world. That certainly doesn’t mean that they are expected to be perfect, but it does mean that standards will naturally be higher. Sorry, that’s just how it works.
Many of us here would have more sympathy for your cause if our down year this year was less significant. But even our second string shouldn’t be struggling with Georgia Tech, Boston College, and NC State. That’s a problem.
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All-American [581]
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I post them for very obvious reasons.
Nov 5, 2021, 11:19 AM
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Because
1) they COMPLETELY outweigh any momentary struggles we're having, which are for obvious reasons not related to coaching, and
2) they make you look like a fool complaining about football after 12 years of incredible, unprecedented success on one hand, yet you you defend 11 years of nothingness with 2 total tournament wins... with EVERY SINGLE THING NEEDED to do considerably better.
When you admit the basketball coaching sucks, with MOUNDS OF EVIDENCE, then you can say whatever yo want about football, even though you'd still be wrong. Obviously you just want to deflect from the problems in basketball, and EVERYONE sees it.
So get a grip. This isn't hard to comprehend. Just man up, for once, and admit you're wrong. Stop the hilarious dancing.
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All-In [44043]
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So you have decided that I am not permitted to have an opinion
Nov 5, 2021, 5:30 PM
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about football, simply because you don’t like my opinion about a totally different sport.
That’s hilarious!
It’s also completely illogical.
You have officially and completely outed yourself as a troll. No one will take you seriously anymore, at which time you will be forced to get a new screen name and start over (again).
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Asst Coach [703]
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Judge on Target
Nov 5, 2021, 8:12 PM
[ in reply to I’m not sure why you keep posting our football accomplishments. ] |
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Everyone here is fully aware of them.
You are correct in saying that this season doesn’t undo any of our recent accomplishments. Likewise, those successes don’t excuse the subpar season we are having this year.
Our belief/assumption that we have an outstanding coaching staff and elite talent is precisely why this year has been so puzzlingly disappointing.
Again, it would be one thing if our football coaches were up against significant disadvantages (like our basketball coaches are). But they aren’t. Our football coaches have every advantage in the world. That certainly doesn’t mean that they are expected to be perfect, but it does mean that standards will naturally be higher. Sorry, that’s just how it works.
Many of us here would have more sympathy for your cause if our down year this year was less significant. But even our second string shouldn’t be struggling with Georgia Tech, Boston College, and NC State. That’s a problem.
To go one step further on our advantages it does come down to money to some degree. Our budget for football dwarfs every other team in the conference. With that huge financial outlay comes facilities second to none to go along with a recruiting budget and media machine that just does not exist at other ACC schools. That in turn has brought in recruits that are not considering Duke and Wake but rather UGA and Bama. Dabo raised the standard and the standard is best (his words). Don't mind a few losses nor a down season (or even two or three) but to be 114th in offense against a weak ACC schedule is outside the bounds of any realistic outcome, down year or not.
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All-American [581]
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Hall of Famer [24982]
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Lot o points [155901]
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In layman's terms, that's called a
Nov 3, 2021, 10:42 PM
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"poor decision".
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All-Conference [417]
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Re: Reports: Clemson Tigers OC Tony Elliott Turns Down Two NFL Teams
Nov 4, 2021, 12:46 AM
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I can't criticize TE because we are starting a qb that the coaches have to tell what receiver to throw to. We have a qb that can't read a defense and make decisions on his own. Can't blame TE for a historically awful qb.
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Lot o points [155901]
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If only Tony had a QB coach who reported directly to him and
Nov 4, 2021, 8:19 AM
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whose job it was to make sure the QB who had been here a year and a half was game-ready.
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Orange Blooded [3625]
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Re: If only Tony had a QB coach who reported directly to him and
Nov 4, 2021, 11:12 AM
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Thank you and Amen !
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All-Conference [417]
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CU Guru [1074]
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Re: If only Tony had a QB coach who reported directly to him and
Nov 5, 2021, 4:44 PM
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I question Streeter as an appropriate mentor to 5 stars.
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All-American [581]
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All-Conference [417]
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Re: Yeah
Nov 5, 2021, 8:10 AM
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When you have a second year quarterback that you still have to tell who to throw the ball to every snap because they can't make decisions on their own... Yes. That is either recruiting players not mentally capable of playing the position or coaching.
If you are actually defending this you are absolutely delusional.
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All-American [581]
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You are right about the issue.
Nov 5, 2021, 7:33 PM
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There is an issue with the execution, but there is clear evidence there's tons more potential.
It's not that he can't do it, it's that he's mentally blocked. The coaches are teaching and talking and practicing, and he can physically do it, but this is a guy who's struggling mentally. The mental side is dragging down the physical side, and it's really pressing our coaches to be doctors of psychology as much as teachers of X's and O's. Getting his head on straight, that's the biggest challenge.
To me, its just a matter of him settling down and just having fun like he did last year. He is mentally capable and physically capable... there's only so much others (coaches) can do.
Dabo has told us it will come. He's there every day charting every play, and he knows every one of these kids on a personal level. He's said lots of things over the years, and most of them have been absolutely correct.
So with all that said, I do believe things will come together. The question is when.
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Lot o points [155901]
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Ever heard of Occam’s razor?
Nov 5, 2021, 10:25 PM
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It suggests that when one scenario (DJ not knowing our system and being comfortable enough to execute it as a function of poor coaching and preparation) is more likely than another (you psychoanalyzing DJ from afar to determine he has a mental block on excellence and the prescription is simply more fun and he’ll be awesome because the coaches are perfect), the more likely scenario is likely to be correct.
Keep fighting the good fight though. Dabo and Tony will get you a full time job in the AD when you graduate and move you up from intern.
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110%er [5009]
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Re: Reports: Clemson Tigers OC Tony Elliott Turns Down Two NFL Teams
Nov 4, 2021, 11:43 AM
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I wonder how off. Coordinators of teams that do not have multiple 4 and 5 star recruits ever have offenses ranked higher than #100 out of 120 teams. It seems impossible
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Orange Blooded [4559]
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What a misleading thread
Nov 4, 2021, 4:39 PM
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Bring up something from 10 months ago. Anything to stir the Tony Elliott pot I guess.
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Hall of Famer [24982]
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certainly misleading***
Nov 4, 2021, 10:52 PM
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All-American [581]
TigerPulse: 66%
Posts: 752
Joined: 8/8/21
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Its just a copy and paste of the title of the article.
Nov 4, 2021, 11:06 PM
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I gave the original date of the article in the body of the post.
My only point was to highlight the fact Elliott is a known commodity. It's not like 10 months is 10 years, and it's not like Tony forgot it all in one offseason.
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Lot o points [155901]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 65819
Joined: 5/6/13
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You’re a shill and a plant by the AD. You joined here right
Nov 5, 2021, 10:29 PM
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Before the disastrous season many of us knew was coming, and you’ve done nothing but be in damage control non-stop since, spinning your assss off lying for the coaches.
Why don’t you stop lying to us all and just tell us you’re affiliated with the team/coaching staff?
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