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Replies: 63
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1st Rounder [603]
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Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 1:53 PM
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College football stopped being a purely amateur student athlete setup a long time ago. Football players don’t even interact with the rest of the student population that much apart from taking some classes. For a while now it’s felt like they’re more like employees of the university that also get the benefit of taking classes rather than students that play football as an extracurricular activity. Maybe with the latest rulings there will be more chance of things being done transparently above board.
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Oculus Spirit [81934]
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"more chance of things being done transparently above board"
Jun 23, 2021, 1:55 PM
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Heisman Winner [139823]
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Compensation has been transparent for years...
Jun 23, 2021, 1:58 PM
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CU Medallion [51520]
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All-TigerNet [10822]
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MUH COLLEGE FOOTBALL PURITY!
Jun 23, 2021, 1:59 PM
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Tigernet thinks all college players are only in it for the love of the game. It’s tarnished forever now that the FIRST players are going to get paid
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CU Medallion [51520]
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College football was perfect. I've been watching since
Jun 23, 2021, 2:23 PM
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the 1998 season. I fell in love with College football at the 2000 Clemson/UofSuC game. I've been hooked ever since. Change can only hurt it.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: College football was perfect. I've been watching since
Jun 23, 2021, 2:30 PM
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How so? Not all change is bad. Some change is good. I’ll be the one to say it, I think this will change college football for the better. Winners will adapt and losers will not. Just look at it this way, you only have to be in the top 12.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: College football was perfect. I've been watching since
Jun 23, 2021, 2:30 PM
[ in reply to College football was perfect. I've been watching since ] |
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How so? Not all change is bad. Some change is good. I’ll be the one to say it, I think this will change college football for the better. Winners will adapt and losers will not. Just look at it this way, you only have to be in the top 12.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: College football was perfect. I've been watching since
Jun 23, 2021, 2:31 PM
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And I would love to to know why every time I post it double post my comment
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Heisman Winner [133464]
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do you stutter?
Jun 23, 2021, 3:13 PM
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Letterman [257]
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All-In [37389]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 2:24 PM
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I hate what it's going to do to the overall product. Haven't you ever watched pro sports? We are about to get a mouthful of the same in college sports now. It will continue to evolve until college sports are nothing more than the minor leagues for the professional sports. I said this was going to happen when they took the first step by giving out stipends to college players. I knew it would continue to evolve (everything does). Football and basketball will be the hardest hit by this movement, but other sports will also be affected as it continues to evolve.
Personally, I'm just gonna go with the flow... there's no fighting city hall.
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Team Captain [473]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 2:34 PM
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I try to never make a blanket statement, but a lot of the comments I have seen appear to come from a selfish place. That the product we view on tv and love to keep up with is going to change. Comes from a self-serving place, not one that considers the athletes. Honestly, I believe they are right, it will change the way recruiting works, and kids are gonna go to "flashier" locations. Again I will say, I know not all fans have this reasoning, but a lot of folks I have interacted with do.
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All-In [37389]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 3:26 PM
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It is good for "some" of the players. My fear is that it is going to cause problems with the word "team". I'm sure you have always heard there is no "i" in "team". Well... now there will be a capital "I" in "team". As much of a pain as the transfer portal is now, just wait until free agency starts for the elite players. It will really be a mess. College basketball is already screwed up before this even happens with the "1 and done" players and the transfer portal.
I hope I am wrong, but I was right with where the stipend would lead to. If there was ever an end in sight for what the players "deserve", people would be ok with it. Unfortunately there will never be an end to what is deemed "fair". College sports has turned into a monster that is out of control.
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CU Guru [1694]
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you are 30 years late if you think stipends began about
Jun 23, 2021, 9:34 PM
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3 - 5 years ago... they might not have been called stipends, but athletes have been getting money as a part of their scholarship allocation since I was at Clemson in the mid 80's... LOL
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All-TigerNet [13031]
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In general, people don't like change unless it benefits them
Jun 23, 2021, 2:41 PM
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These changes aren't likely to benefit CFB fans so they are against them. It's pretty much as simple as that.
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Team Captain [473]
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Re: In general, people don't like change unless it benefits them
Jun 23, 2021, 2:43 PM
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This was a much more efficient way of saying what I was trying to say haha
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110%er [6873]
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All-TigerNet [13031]
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That's not a legitimate argument for keeping things the same
Jun 24, 2021, 8:41 AM
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though.
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Orange Blooded [3034]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 2:59 PM
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Some, like myself, believe the athletes are getting a piece of the pie. That piece is a free college education, and there seems to be less and less value placed on it. My son graduated from Clemson last year. In addition to a free college education, they are allowed to hone their skills to one day make millions.
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Associate AD [832]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 3:00 PM
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Because it might ruin it at one point. Its great as is.
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All-In [43979]
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They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 23, 2021, 3:29 PM
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As it stands now, they get:
-A full scholarship, regardless of whether or not their academic performance in high school warrants it
-Special facilities just for them to hang out, study, play mini golf, etc. that regular students don't get
-All meals paid for, including special food and dining hall that regular students don't get
-Customized nutrition plans that regular students don't get
-Academic advising/tutoring that regular students don't get
-Athletic training, including weight lifting plans/supervision and injury treatment/rehabilitation, that regular students don't get
-Free healthcare, well beyond what regular students get
-Better housing options than regular students get
-Class scheduling preferences that regular students don't get
-Special accommodations made for tests/exams that regular students don't get
-Clothing/accessories that regular students don't get
-Counseling/advising that regular students don't get
-Golf cart rides to class that regular students don't get
Oh, and of course they get expert coaching and instruction specific to football to prepare them for success on the field and possibly a career in professional football.
And let's not forget that they also get to make valuable connections as a result of their status as a football player, which can serve them extremely well in their future careers (football or otherwise).
All of the above are a tremendous value, yet we are led to believe that they are "slaves" who are treated unfairly. Give me a freaking break!
College football players are treated like ROYALTY. If they feel so disadvantaged, and want a "slice of the pie" when it comes to money, then let's start treating them more like regular students:
-If you want to go to college, you must meet the academic requirements of that school. No exceptions made just because you play football.
-You get no housing preference. You stay in all of the same dorms your peers stay in.
-You get no scheduling preference. Your classes are scheduled just like other students.
I'm fine with them getting sport-specific nutrition, weight training, medical care, and clothing/equipment needed.
Oh, and they are also going to need a lot of guidance regarding finances, accounting, etc. if they are getting paid. Clemson shouldn't provide that to athletes anymore than Clemson provides it for regular students who have jobs (i.e., Clemson won't provide it - you obtain that advice on your own).
If you want things to be fair, then my suggestions should be acceptable.
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110%er [6873]
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Amen. What is the total monetary value of all that?***
Jun 23, 2021, 3:33 PM
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Letterman [274]
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Re: Amen. What is the total monetary value of all that?***
Jun 23, 2021, 10:31 PM
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Everything that you just listed cost the schools pennies on the dollar in what they are making. The argument is not that they don’t reap some benefit but do they reap fair value for what they bring in. The answer to that is heck no. A normal student does not usually make the school millions either. Some of these athletes due. Have the things you listed sponsors provide at no cost to the school. WHY? Because it makes the company money. Guess who gets to reap that benefit of that contract, The SCHOOL. Nike pays Clemson Millions. 58 million over 10 years. But they get a couple thousand in free nike gear.
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Orange Blooded [2987]
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Re: Amen. What is the total monetary value of all that?***
Jun 23, 2021, 11:29 PM
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58mil doesnt pay for their food, housing, healthcare, surgeries, travel, weight training, etc, etc, etc. That's only $5.8 mil per year. That Nike contract is for basketball, soccer softball, baseball, football, etc. Your thoughts of how far money goes is truly skewed. These players are basically making $200k+ annually with all the special care they get. At 18yrs old, by golly I would love $200k a year.
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All-In [37389]
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Re: Amen. What is the total monetary value of all that?***
Jun 24, 2021, 9:15 AM
[ in reply to Re: Amen. What is the total monetary value of all that?*** ] |
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I have gotten where I hate the word "fair". Please remember that many of these players would be flipping burgers if not for these unfair colleges. All of the advantages the players now have is because of big TV money. Without it there would be no great facilities to enjoy. ESPN changed sports forever, and I'm not sure it was for the best.
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110%er [7448]
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all revenue whether it is from Nike, TV, tickets goes right
Jun 24, 2021, 1:19 PM
[ in reply to Re: Amen. What is the total monetary value of all that?*** ] |
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back out the door except for a % that goes to reserves that would cover things like COVID, Coaching changes, etc. It's a non-profit business. Almost 100% of the expenditures are already made to benefit the athlete via scholarships, coaching, facilities etc. If you increase the cost(paying players) without additional revenue(seems to be maxed except for the image and likeness for a handful of players) then other things will start to be cut that currently benefit the players. Facilities will start to decline, coaching, etc. Most programs will start to rot. The survivors will be those with billionaire donors who are willing to up the $ or large markets who sellout to the corporations. Those are extremely few so the others may just throw up their hands and say we're out of the business. In the end, who will be harmed, the individuals claiming that are claiming or have been convinced they are being mistreated and the future individuals/athletes who lives are in a similar situation because their opportunity will be gone. Not mention the damage to school identities, cultures and communities. The easy fix is would be for congress to enact some exemptions. Recognize that athletes have a choice - it's pro or college. Don't allow the pro orgs to limit accessibility like the NFL does or let 18 and over leagues form that force the NFLs hand to change. Remove the 1 year of college basketball rule. Let the best skip college all together.
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All-In [37389]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 23, 2021, 4:00 PM
[ in reply to They already get a ton of perks. ] |
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Harrumph!!! Harrumph!!!
Let's not forget they get the biggest stage to show their skills to future employers.
The regular students are getting the shaft if you look at it from a "fairness" standpoint.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 23, 2021, 10:32 PM
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Students also get the chance to showcase their skills for future employment. It’s called grades and the acknowledgement of being an elite student under school X’s name..
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Legend [15730]
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There's a reason one-and-dones go to Duke instead of the
Jun 24, 2021, 9:22 AM
[ in reply to Re: They already get a ton of perks. ] |
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D-League. The exposure is fantastic. They "create their brands" in college.
The amount of value that college athletes get is astounding. For the overwhelming majority that will never play at the next level, the free ride, all the perks listed by JK, and connections with alumni are all huge. For the ones that are going to go on to the pros, they get three or four years of huge publicity, some level of education to prepare them for their soon-to-be wealthy status, and the best training, facilities, etc., that money can buy. It's a great deal for all of them...which, as I always say, is why no program...no matter how lowly...is out on the street corner begging for a kid to take their football scholarship. Kent State? Full roster. UL Monroe went 0-10 last year? They'll turn away a thousand kids who would have taken the last scholarship they had available. And kids will gray shirt and walk on just to be on the team. Because it is, at the end of the day, a heck of a deal.
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All-TigerNet [10589]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 23, 2021, 4:14 PM
[ in reply to They already get a ton of perks. ] |
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Excellent JK!
Why can't some of these posters get it through their thick skulls this is not just about football. I don't know how universities will be able to discriminate against women rowers, soccer players, and track and field (both men and women). Of course they won't. It might be manageable if it were only about football, even though I might not like it.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 24, 2021, 10:27 AM
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That’s what you don’t understand. College sports is about money now. It will be for the foreseeable future. Lower sports like rowing volleyball etc will likely end. Also if you think everyone will be paid the same that’s laughable. Football players will make more period. Sure the school might pay them all the same but what about donor x that has 15 dealerships and pays football star z millions to do his commercials.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 24, 2021, 10:27 AM
[ in reply to Re: They already get a ton of perks. ] |
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That’s what you don’t understand. College sports is about money now. It will be for the foreseeable future. Lower sports like rowing volleyball etc will likely end. Also if you think everyone will be paid the same that’s laughable. Football players will make more period. Sure the school might pay them all the same but what about donor x that has 15 dealerships and pays football star z millions to do his commercials.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 24, 2021, 10:27 AM
[ in reply to Re: They already get a ton of perks. ] |
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That’s what you don’t understand. College sports is about money now. It will be for the foreseeable future. Lower sports like rowing volleyball etc will likely end. Also if you think everyone will be paid the same that’s laughable. Football players will make more period. Sure the school might pay them all the same but what about donor x that has 15 dealerships and pays football star z millions to do his commercials.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 24, 2021, 10:27 AM
[ in reply to Re: They already get a ton of perks. ] |
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That’s what you don’t understand. College sports is about money now. It will be for the foreseeable future. Lower sports like rowing volleyball etc will likely end. Also if you think everyone will be paid the same that’s laughable. Football players will make more period. Sure the school might pay them all the same but what about donor x that has 15 dealerships and pays football star z millions to do his commercials.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 24, 2021, 10:27 AM
[ in reply to Re: They already get a ton of perks. ] |
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That’s what you don’t understand. College sports is about money now. It will be for the foreseeable future. Lower sports like rowing volleyball etc will likely end. Also if you think everyone will be paid the same that’s laughable. Football players will make more period. Sure the school might pay them all the same but what about donor x that has 15 dealerships and pays football star z millions to do his commercials.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 24, 2021, 10:27 AM
[ in reply to Re: They already get a ton of perks. ] |
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That’s what you don’t understand. College sports is about money now. It will be for the foreseeable future. Lower sports like rowing volleyball etc will likely end. Also if you think everyone will be paid the same that’s laughable. Football players will make more period. Sure the school might pay them all the same but what about donor x that has 15 dealerships and pays football star z millions to do his commercials.
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Letterman [274]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 24, 2021, 10:28 AM
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Sorry for the multiple post I can not figure out why it’s doing this
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Rock Defender [50]
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Orange Blooded [2987]
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Hall of Famer [22155]
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Re: They already get a ton of perks.
Jun 24, 2021, 10:03 AM
[ in reply to They already get a ton of perks. ] |
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Judge, wonderful post.
I don't even mind them getting special housing and class preference. (Having wo work their class schedule around practice is essential.)
But, I'm sick and tired of hearing people talk about how poorly the athletes are treated. They are living the lifestyle that only kids who have parents making a high six figure income could afford to give them if it came out of their pockets.
And, one thing that you mentioned that nobody wants to talk about is the "free" coaching they get. How much would a kid have to pay to get coached by Dabo and Brent? To give a slight comparison, how much do high school kids have to pay for private golf lessons by Butch Harmon or David Ledbetter. (Check out how much it costs to go to IMG Academy and play golf.)
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110%er [5121]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 3:43 PM
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First off, the NFL and NBA really should create/improve their own developmental leagues. They use college sports as a farm system. It would be best if kids could go straight to a pro team and get a paycheck without needing to go to college, if that’s what they want. If baseball can do it, so can the others.
That said, If they are employees then treat them like employees. Give them a paycheck. Take out taxes, FICA, etc. Require them file/pay income taxes. Let them buy their own food and pay their own rent. Pay for their own medical expenses, insurance and training. If they want to attend classes they can apply like everyone else. Don’t be surprised if you get fired for poor performance, a bad attitude, or other things that get you fired in the real world.
If they are students then treat them like students. Give them scholarships, housing, food, medical care, etc. Support their learning and preparation for a future outside of sports.
My $0.02.
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All-TigerNet [10822]
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This would be worse for the sport than paying players
Jun 23, 2021, 10:56 PM
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IMO
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All-TigerNet [12233]
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I'm wondering what this is going to ultimately do
Jun 23, 2021, 3:59 PM
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to the price of attending a college football game. Thirty years ago it was relatively cheap to attend a college football game compared to what it is today. I think it is a given that schools will ultimately raise donor requirements and ticket prices in order to try to keep their profit margins with the increased compensation to players. I guess that some of us will just get priced out of the whole thing (darn near reaching that point now between IPTAY minimums, season ticket costs, travel expenses etc...).
College football has already gotten to the ridiculous price point when it comes to a lot of the bowl and playoff game prices. The new player compensation landscape is probably going to accelerate price increases and I wonder if at some point it creates an environment where a lot of people lose interest.
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All-American [550]
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Re: I'm wondering what this is going to ultimately do
Jun 23, 2021, 4:20 PM
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Ultimately these disadvantaged will unionize= you aint seen nutin yet!
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Legend [19276]
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Re: I'm wondering what this is going to ultimately do
Jun 24, 2021, 11:10 AM
[ in reply to I'm wondering what this is going to ultimately do ] |
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I agree 110% - priced me out of season tickets years ago. I used to be an IPTAY member, but not now. My parents used to have four season tickets and a numbered parking space, but I can't justify the expense now. I just hope I can afford the (out-of-state) tuition if my daughter can get accepted to Clemson one day.
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All-In [26464]
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Should players even have to go to class?
Jun 23, 2021, 4:29 PM
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That will be the next question posed
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Orange Blooded [3459]
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Re: Should players even have to go to class?
Jun 23, 2021, 9:25 PM
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That will be the next question posed
Many don't attend now. That's why hear, "Hey, Man, me and friend ------"
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Orange Blooded [2848]
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Hall of Famer [24159]
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Asst Coach [731]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 4:45 PM
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So, you either have a draft or bid for players if they still get to choose their own school. How are we going to stack up in the bidding process vs. Texas or A&M or UGay or Florida or a dozen other mega-rich schools / markets? How can you have a draft and force 18 yr. old kids to move wherever away from home they are drafted? You can't. The other option is to set pay for players....based on what? Number of stars? Production on the field? Wins and losses by their team? Have you thought through what you're saying?
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All-Pro [654]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 24, 2021, 9:09 AM
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How are we going to stack up in the bidding process vs. Texas or A&M or (redacted) or Florida or a dozen other mega-rich schools / markets?
We've already proven that Clemson, who was most often a middle-of-the-pack team in the league, can compete with billionaires and the richest programs in college athletics to become a consistently elite-level football team for over a decade now & in an era with more nationwide competition than ever.
I understand a lot of cynicism over these new changes with the Supreme Court & NIL.
What I don't understand is how much of it is coming from Clemson's culture & fans. We are legitimately unique & a laser-cut example of how the right PEOPLE and culture can compete & win over money alone. If anyone can do it right, Clemson can.
I don't love all of these new changes either, but I can't imagine Clemson in particular doesn't surprise us all with how well they implement them. Hopefully we'll continue to keep that bar raised extremely high (& frankly I don't doubt it one bit).
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Orange Blooded [4193]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 7:33 PM
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Have you ever had to pay for your kid to go to school? Do you know the sacrifice it takes to do that? Its not easy then to see these kids get room board food all free...come get real!!!
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Orange Blooded [4193]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 7:39 PM
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Have you ever had to pay for your kid to go to school? Do you know the sacrifice it takes to do that? Its not easy then to see these kids get room board food all free...come on get real !!!
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Orange Blooded [4707]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 7:39 PM
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Some people consider an all expense paid college education a valuable piece of the pie. Its become obvious many don't value education in the least and would prefer to receive a few bucks right out of HS that they can squander and then go back to wherever they came from, no better off than when they left. And make no mistake, the entire concept of the student athlete will ultimately go out the window and all the players who never go pro will be degree less and infinitely worse off than they are under the current system. This will make agents, and a whole host of other hangers on, better off but not most players.
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Orange Blooded [3459]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 9:23 PM
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They already do.
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110%er [9023]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 10:01 PM
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UGHEY got Herschel because they got him the T/A before we did.
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Rock Defender [53]
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They can get all the pie they want
Jun 23, 2021, 10:06 PM
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110%er [9023]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 10:07 PM
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I may be interpreting it wrong, but I think the issue is that they are being exploited by the NCAA who reaps YUGE financial benefits from CFB. So, while the players get terrific benefits (as JK so eloquently points out) they have no say in anything.
My view may be jaded by my own experience. I'm not a fan of the NCAA - they penalized my daughter for transferring from WVU's train wreck of a track program. She lost a year of eligibility because she chose self preservation over athletics. Thank the Lord Covid got that year back for her at her new school.
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110%er [9638]
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I manage to feel a connection to the teams because I make
Jun 23, 2021, 10:10 PM
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myself believe they chose Clemson and fell in love with it as I did.
I'll have to see if I still feel the same way about players who chose Clemson because it offered the best chance for them to make money playing football.
Pay 'em. But I don't think I'll feel the connection and the pride...
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Orange Blooded [2848]
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Re: Why are people wound up about players getting a slice of the pie?
Jun 23, 2021, 11:21 PM
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Here are my concerns. Mind you some pertain to the fact that I think Clemson may be put at a disadvantage with all of this.
1. This totally muddies the water with players getting cash from all kinds of places. Highest bidder wins. This puts Clemson at a disadvantage against the Ohio States, Texas A&M’s, Norte Dame’s etc. of the world.
2. This will further destroy any parity in CFB by making it harder for many schools to compete. This is BAD for the overall game and fans will become disengaged. Case in point the men’s basketball tournament is nothing like it used to be. I have not watched it outside of Clemson playing in years.
3. The transfer portal will become even more of free agent market place and tampering will be rampant.
4. This is going to open up a land mind of equity issues across the board. What sports will remain after all is said and done.
5. Not so sure that paying players is as much of an issue as the new transfer rules. You cannot just transfer from an NFL team as you are under a contract. Which is kind of like signing a letter of intent.
6. There will be many team dynamic issues that come from certain players getting more than others.
7. Do they become hired guns that do not have to attend class or get an education. If so, this would be damaging for kids that could use the education to move up and change their lives.
If this truly becomes a thing, I think the colleges are going to have to come up with some kind of system like the NFL salary cap to keep some semblance of a level playing field. The players will unionize and it would be needed. Ultimately it will completely change the look, feel and competitiveness of college football. Thus, leading to less interest, attendance and viewership. I really really hope I am wrong.
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110%er [7134]
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wish there was a way to make it all uniform payment while
Jun 24, 2021, 10:38 AM
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in school (so there is no incentive to go to a large market based on yearly pay being better) and you only get the extras/bonuses (based on value hierarchy)after you played your 4 years of eligibility and received your degree. That way all the NCAA and school contracts are fulfilled by the student and at the same time the student athlete is set on the best path forward because they would walk away with a fulfilled college degree to fall back on if they can't play one day.
Did they incentivize any of this based on academic performance or is this all just subjective based on who the student is? I mean the NCAA is giving them the platform to become marketable. Someone like Lamar Jackson was a nobody until he was a somebody. The NCAA gave him the means to be on TV every week and play against upper echelon competition to get his brand more legs. So just paying a kid because he's good is really one sided. Alot has to happen to get him there. Which is why they should require the kid to graduate or play four years to get his increased market dividend.
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All-In [30751]
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Bull...***
Jun 24, 2021, 12:08 PM
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110%er [6095]
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my selfish take
Jun 24, 2021, 12:22 PM
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I'm about to shell out 200k for two kids in college after paying my wife's tuition 20 years ago. I would have given my eye teeth to have the body, ability, facilities, training etc... that these players get. 98% aren't going to make a dime in the pros. They get A LOT already. Nobody is holding a gun to their head to play. Many of them couldn't sniff the door of a college except for their athletic ability. That being said, they should have lifetime health insurance after college because I realize the toll it takes on their bodies.
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