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CU Guru [1381]
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most of yall have heard about the trump/Woodward
Sep 9, 2020, 8:17 PM
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interviews.
can't wait to hear you pubs spin this one. lol
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All-In [34536]
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no need to...the great American hero Dr. Fauci says Woodward
Sep 9, 2020, 8:19 PM
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is full of dog sh*t
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CU Medallion [56821]
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whoops.***
Sep 9, 2020, 8:48 PM
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Orange Blooded [2780]
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All-In [34536]
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time to move on back to dickthroat schiff***
Sep 9, 2020, 8:20 PM
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Orange Blooded [2203]
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Re: most of yall have heard about the trump/Woodward
Sep 9, 2020, 8:23 PM
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Man is that your body you put Trumps face on? If it is please cover it up.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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no need for spin***
Sep 9, 2020, 8:23 PM
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CU Guru [1381]
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Re: no need for spin***
Sep 9, 2020, 8:29 PM
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you are fine with a Feb interview where he admits this virus is 5 times more deadly than the flu, then goes out in interviews to the public and says its no big deal, just like the flu and will go away very soon?
its a bald faced lie, along with the other lies, to misguide the public early on
someone posted that trumpers are a cult...I'm starting to actually believe that
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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yes***
Sep 9, 2020, 8:30 PM
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CU Guru [1381]
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Re: yes***
Sep 9, 2020, 8:33 PM
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just out of curiosity, coz I find this fascinating lol
what is your line with trump? do you have one? or does it matter what he says/does?
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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this is probably the most defendable of...
Sep 9, 2020, 8:35 PM
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all recent accusations. I'm not going to try and "spin" it for you.
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CU Guru [1381]
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Re: this is probably the most defendable of...
Sep 9, 2020, 8:39 PM
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easiest defendable, yet you didn't hmmmmm interesting
perhaps the defense is we already know trump is a lier and POS, so him getting caught in a lie is totally fine. he gets my vote
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All-In [34536]
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dude, the press picked up the slack in the panic pron***
Sep 9, 2020, 8:42 PM
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All-In [42026]
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But how?
Sep 9, 2020, 9:11 PM
[ in reply to this is probably the most defendable of... ] |
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His downplaying of the virus paved the way for millions to shun any seriousness about the virus, to go on these crazy conspiracies about masks and shut downs, and turn it all into a political mess that ultimately cost lives. People called it a conspiracy to make him lose the election.
How about the constant attacks on Fauci because he contradicted the president? Threats on his life? Turns out he was right all along and Trump knew he was right.
This isn't a "Oh, I thought it would create a panic so I kept it quiet" smart leadership move. This move cost lives and could have been shut down months ago.
If Trump had come out and been honest, he could have stopped all of that from his people.
Hell, there are people on this board who need to be held accountable for claiming conspiracy to defeat Trump, slamming Fauci, screaming about civil liberties and rights and the economy ONLY--and I mean ONLY--because Trump pushed that envelope. He knows how stupid his supporters are. He should have known better.
He could have helped this just by being honest.
I can't think of a more telling reason not to vote for him than this.
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Lot o points [155706]
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Quick question.
Sep 9, 2020, 10:45 PM
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Do you believe that over the entirety of the post-WW2 era, the populus has been completely informed with no filter by our leaders on the danger and severity of every threat we've faced?
Or perhaps have things...many, many, many things....been softened in their presentation to the public to alleviate panic and maintain an ability to control the masses?
Trump showed no great people leadership skills during all this, a big dearth of it actually, but are you really naive enough to believe that every other leader has given us the straight scoop every time on everything? I don't think you are, but then again, if you don't believe that, then you've presumably been voting for people who violated your deal-breaker trust with no repercussions from you prior to Trump. We get manipulated with great frequency by our "leaders", and more often than not it's because they (often correctly) don't trust how we'd handle the straight poop.
As for what would or wouldn't have been different, I don't know and you don't either. You assume things would be far better, I think it's impossible to know, but all things considered, we are coming out ok (and please don't insult my intelligence by pretending I'm cavalier about those who did die from Covid). You can't give a report card to something when it's not even over yet and there's a lot of variables that are still unknown to us. See below for example.....a month ago much of the EU was being held up as a model of how to handle things based on daily cases....a month later and, 
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All-In [42026]
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TLDR
Sep 9, 2020, 10:56 PM
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Ha! Just kidding. I read it all. People who "TLDR" need coloring books.
No, of course I don't believe that. Obviously there's stuff kept from the public for their own good or the nation's good. I mean, they need to straight talk us on the aliens but whatever...
The problem is that you can't really compare those other situations to this. Sure, we don't need to know everything during a war to protect troops or maybe we keep a foiled terrorist attempt quiet to calm hysteria.
That isn't the issue here. COVID was already out of the bag and we knew it was coming. Trump had a chance to get a bit Churchillish with us. He could have laid out the honest assessment of the danger, but assured us that together we would team up and beat it in the long run.
Instead, what's the BS we got? It's not any worse than the flu. It's a hoax. It's a ploy by the Dems. Masks are stupid. Dr. Fauci is stupid. We can reopen the economy by Easter. We can't shut things down. Kids don't really get it. We're fighting it better than anyone. Reopen the schools.
Those lies do more harm than the truth. Because they're lies pushed by a man already established to be unfit to lead us, and a man who knows he has followers who would stick cucumbers up their ######## if he told them it would heal hemorrhoids.
That's the problem. He lied when we needed him to be honest, which created whack-a-doodle politicization of the virus (to which many here are guilty and are now either sitting silent or trying to spend this as a good thing he lied about it) and divided over something that should have never divided us.
You want to lie to me that a terrorist nuke made it into the Charleston port but we stopped in time? Fine. Let me keep drinking with blissful ignorance. But don't turn half my neighborhood into morons who think this virus is nothing when you really know they're putting people's lives at risk.
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Lot o points [155706]
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LULZ, needed the laugh, thanks....
Sep 9, 2020, 11:22 PM
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and I read all yours as well, as always. Love you boo.
Anyways, gettin tired and turning in soon....couple more counterpoints (and an agreement).
1) I firmly believe there would have been rioting in the streets if, in March, the American public (Trump supporters or not) had been told they would likely be working from home if they had jobs in September, and flip a coin on if their kids would be in schools. I'm not debating whether those moves are correct, but they're where we are, and people wouldn't have stood for it. Those moving-target, overly-optimistic timelines, while a bit "how to boil a frog"-esque, absolutely worked in that regard.
2) This is probably more of a 1B, but the primary institutions that really did do full blown lockdowns in this country are the senior living facilities. Personal opinion, but I think it's criminal in many cases how those lockdowns have affected the residents and their families. I'm not trying to strawman you, because I'm not totally sure how much more you'd have wanted Trump to shut things down, but there's a level you reach as a person and the cure is as bad as the illness. I think the US (with or without leadership at many levels) has maintained about as good a balance as we are going to get between freedom of movement and precaution. I think large additional measures may have resulted in only minor improvements.
3) I still can't get a firm intellectual grasp on what's right and what's not in all this, and I read a lot on the topic and hopefully grasp and retain more of what I read than not. Lots of things screw with my ability to ascertain the "right moves". Studies are now showing that a vitamin D deficiency leads to 77% increase in likelihood of catching virus---you get that deficiency from being inside. The country has been inside more than ever this year. Studies show masks help, equally impressive studies from legit sources show they're good for mental comfort and that's about it...blah blah blah, you get what I'm saying. I'm not sure I've seen such a scenario like this where good (read non-BS) data from multiple sources completely counters other similarly good data.
4) My agreement with you is in leadership. Trump isn't Churchill. Those early press conferences were such a good chance to interact with the country, and there was so much "me-me-me, I-I-I" in them that he just completely blew the opportunity and moment with narcissism.
With that said, I'm optimistic that we may just come out of this about as well as we could have hoped for, when the final analyses are done with the benefit of hindsight. If I'm right, it could be dumb luck on Trump's part as much as anything, but I'll take it.
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Hall of Famer [24695]
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Your #4 basically explains it all; before, now, and forward***
Sep 10, 2020, 12:19 AM
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All-In [42026]
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Re: LULZ, needed the laugh, thanks....
Sep 10, 2020, 8:04 AM
[ in reply to LULZ, needed the laugh, thanks.... ] |
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1. ####, it seems people just want to riot anyway. But in all seriousness, I don't think he had to paint a picture that dire. I think he again takes the Churchill approach: This is gonna suck, but we can fight it. Nut up, everyone, and work together. Set reasonable, attainable goals, agree with Fauci publicly, and assure the American people that there is nothing political or overblown about the virus.
Can you imagine what his approval numbers would be if he had pushed that message and we had all put a clamp down on this thing? He'd win November in a landslide.
2. I think the level of shutdown was adequate (and while I get your concern over nursing homes, I don't think there was much choice there given the residents' risk). My issue is that it should have been done longer, and Trump knew it should have. Instead, he pushed a message that the whole shutdown was absurd. And then Americans just decided on Memorial Day weekend that we were tired of the virus, so let's just get back to normal.
3. I still can't get a firm intellectual grasp on what's right and what's not in all this... Yeah, me too. I'm exhausted from the months of back and forth of what's supposedly right. I do see how it could come out this virus isn't as bad as we thought. I do know there have been a lot of lies pushed about how it isn't bad at all, and Trump helped in fomenting those lies. He could have shut that #### down early.
4. Yeah, I know. That was the best example I could think of. Hell, I would settle for Dubya-level or Carter-level at this point.
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Oculus Spirit [97677]
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Knew it was a lie then. Nothing new.
Sep 9, 2020, 8:36 PM
[ in reply to Re: no need for spin*** ] |
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But it is the biggest reason for his tanking numbers. Everyone knows.
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110%er [5854]
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Re: most of yall have heard about the trump/Woodward
Sep 9, 2020, 8:53 PM
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They don't care. Trump could disband Clemson football, sell New Mexico to China, steal their kids bikes and shoot their mom's in the head and they would still support him.
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CU Guru [1381]
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Re: most of yall have heard about the trump/Woodward
Sep 9, 2020, 9:00 PM
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its gonna be interesting to see how historians look at all this.
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Lot o points [155706]
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All-TigerNet [13027]
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Re: most of yall have heard about the trump/Woodward
Sep 9, 2020, 10:23 PM
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Libs try to downplay their riots and Marxism, but I don’t believe them.
Why are people that do not believe a word trump says, so butthurt over this?
Ahhh the blame game. Mommy, the president made me sick...
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