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Replies: 66
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Editor [∞]
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TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 8:00 AM
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CU Medallion [64890]
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Waiting and hoping that the ACC will do what is best for
Jul 7, 2022, 8:05 AM
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CLEMSON is beyond foolish. The Tobacco Road run ACC has NEVER done anything to purely benefit Clemson. They HAVE done specific things to HURT Clemson, though.
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110%er [6857]
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Hopefully Clemson is just nodding and smiling at the ACC
Jul 7, 2022, 8:11 AM
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While plotting their departure behind closed doors.
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CU Guru [1344]
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Re: Hopefully Clemson is just nodding and smiling at the ACC
Jul 7, 2022, 8:53 AM
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Clemson should join the SEC. Just take care of Clemson! B1G is poison for Clemson…
SEC may also want to pick up FSU, Miami, possibly GT, UNC, VT, UVA, NC State.
ND, Pitt, possibly UNC, VT end up in the Big 10.
It all depends on the money the conferences generate. NCAA gets their. Money from basketball.
If invited, Clemson will do fine in the SEC.
Our only other choice is to stay in the ACC at a disadvantage.
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All-American [587]
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Re: Hopefully Clemson is just nodding and smiling at the ACC
Jul 8, 2022, 9:35 AM
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Clemson/FSU/Miami get picked up by SEC.
B1G won't bother with the leftovers. This isn't a situation where every current P5 team gets picked up by either the SEC or B1G.
No, there are going to be about 40-50 schools that make the cut and the rest are going to be left for dead
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Orange Blooded [4095]
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If Clemson And FSU leave, the ACC could add William and Mary
Jul 13, 2022, 3:11 PM
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and perhaps some other school.
William and Mary is real close to the Atlantic Ocean.
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Rock Defender [53]
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At this point there is not even any move that would help
Jul 7, 2022, 8:17 AM
[ in reply to Waiting and hoping that the ACC will do what is best for ] |
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Adding ND would be a very short term win and only be a band aide on a broken leg. There is no combination of teams we could add that would make us anything more than what the PAC 12 used to be, the bottom league and barely hanging on to relevance. Leaving for one of the new big boys is the best option. That said, no matter what happens if Clemson goes 12-0 they will make the playoff every year regardless of conference or the strength of the conference we are in— history has proven this… so what else is there to say besides… Go Tigers!!!
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All-In [48020]
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Re: At this point there is not even any move that would help
Jul 7, 2022, 10:24 AM
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A bandaid that won't happen. As stated above, I hope Dabo and Neff have a secret plan. ACC wrung hands on a wish thinking the B1G was going to honor the alliance. How incompetent.
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Oculus Spirit [82955]
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CU Medallion [56606]
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Duane Heydt, for one.***
Jul 7, 2022, 8:30 AM
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Oculus Spirit [82955]
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Lutz. The ACC and Tobacco Road conspired
Jul 7, 2022, 8:45 AM
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against Clemson by assigning him to 2016 Pitt game knowing at the time if we lost it could knock us out of the 2016 CFP?
Yep, they didn't want an ACC member to compete for or win a NC.
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All-In [32570]
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If you think historically that the ACC hasn't done all
Jul 7, 2022, 10:11 AM
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it could to shore up tobacco road while minimizing efforts to help those hicks in SC, you are either young or dumb.
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Oculus Spirit [82955]
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List what they have done to specifically hurt us?***
Jul 7, 2022, 10:26 AM
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All-In [32570]
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Extra year of probation, Lenny Wertz & the like shoring
Jul 7, 2022, 10:41 AM
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up basketball every chance they had - probably still goes on but our basketball sucks so bad, I don't watch much anymore (or care - until we get serious about doing better in basketball) - moving the baseball tourney from Greenville - where it was supported with great enthusiasm - to wherever it is in tobacco road now . . . . should I go on ?
The ACC shooty hoops tourney in Greensboro every year to maximize tobacco road support, the extra scrutiny the ACC brought on whatever we were doing in practice regarding helmet shells or jerseys or whatever that month-long stink was, I guess I could say them not stepping in & forcing the semiholes to play us when we had done all the proper protocol regarding covid testing a couple of years back . . .
There are tons more over the last 40 years - a bias towards tobacco road teams and against us and probably others not on tobacco road - but I don't care about them or keep up with their stuff.
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Oculus Spirit [82955]
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You've bought into the mange conspiracy idiocy
Jul 7, 2022, 11:02 AM
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hook, line, and sinker. The extra year of probation was voted on by the school faculty reps. It didn't involve the ACC leadership.
Sure we got f u k e d a few times by basketball refs over the years. The reality is that star teams with star coaches get a few calls. See MJ, Bird, LeBron. It ain't no conspiracy against Clemson by the ACC leadership.
The ACC tourney in Gboro was voted on by the school presidents. It was just more profitable there being so close to 4 ACC schools.
It's all mostly BS. Always has been.
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All-In [32570]
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The mange has not existed for all the years I have
Jul 7, 2022, 1:21 PM
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seen this.
So keeping the bball tourney where it is profitable (read "tobacco road") is different than moving the baseball tourney from a profitable place to a much less profitable place because it gave Clemson too much of an advantage.
The mange doesn't add or take away from my opinions of things I have seen myself. Just like me responding isn't going to change your opinion either.
G O T I G E R S ! !
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110%er [6153]
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ACC “leadership” was directly responsible for adding the
Jul 7, 2022, 5:56 PM
[ in reply to You've bought into the mange conspiracy idiocy ] |
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extra year of probation to Clemson’s already harsh NCAA penalty.
School faculty reps are part of ACC leadership, otherwise their vote would have had no authority to impose a year of athletic probation on Clemson.
There is absolutely no way to make a persuasive argument that the ACC as a conference, did not conspire to punish Clemson in a completely arbitrary manner over and above that which the recognized national collegiate governing body had already put into effect.
You can split hairs all you want about “faculty reps versus athletic reps” making the call, but the call was made by the representatives of the other member schools of the ACC and to the detriment of Clemson.
Nothing like this had ever been done before nor has it been done since.
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Heisman Winner [139839]
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Oculus Spirit [82955]
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That was done by the faculty reps from each school
Jul 7, 2022, 10:50 AM
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voting not the ACC leadership.
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CU Medallion [61369]
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They agreed to it.***
Jul 7, 2022, 10:52 AM
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Heisman Winner [139839]
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Oculus Spirit [82955]
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What you're missing is that the ACC leadership
Jul 7, 2022, 12:02 PM
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are just figureheads doing what the members tell them to do, be it a committee of presidents, ADS, or faulty members on a majority vote.
What am I missing?
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Heisman Winner [139839]
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I'm not sure what is happening here, but...
Jul 7, 2022, 12:32 PM
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you asked for a specific example of what the ACC has done to hurt Clemson. I provided an example, the ACC added additional time to the probation the NCAA gave us after the 1981 football season. I also provided two links, one to the Washington Post which reported the ACC tacked on more time and a tnet article in which former ACC commissioner John Swofford discusses the additional time the ACC tacked on. If you feel the ACC did not punish Clemson, in addition the to the NCAA punishments, please provide some kind of evidence. I am always eager to learn. But it sounds like you are saying the ACC did not hand down punishment, and your evidence is "the ACC leadership are just figureheads doing what the members tell them to do, be it a committee of presidents, ADS, or faulty members on a majority vote." But I know that can't be your evidence, because it doesn't make any sense.
Message was edited by: Francis Marion®
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Oculus Spirit [82955]
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You are correct if you mean the ACC"s members and
Jul 7, 2022, 12:42 PM
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not the leadership.
I was under the impression that the OP in this thread was aimed at the ACC leadership not the schools in the ACC.
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Orange Blooded [3738]
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Re: What you're missing is that the ACC leadership
Jul 7, 2022, 2:17 PM
[ in reply to What you're missing is that the ACC leadership ] |
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Logic, brains, or the willingness to be honest enough to admit when you are wrong.
Take your pick. Personally, I think you habe proven the 3rd option. The proof has been shown, yet YOU won't admit you,are wrong, or at least, you misunderstood.
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110%er [6153]
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Faculty reps ARE conference leadership. Otherwise
Jul 7, 2022, 6:01 PM
[ in reply to That was done by the faculty reps from each school ] |
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there vote on an athletic matter would have been moot.
The ACC is a conference made up of representatives from each member school. There is a commissioner, but he works on behalf of the member schools.
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Orange Blooded [3738]
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Re: What specifically have they done to hurt Clemson?***
Jul 7, 2022, 12:44 PM
[ in reply to What specifically have they done to hurt Clemson?*** ] |
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You must have forgotten no ACC baseball, basketball, etc. Championship games in SC. There are other instances, but you don't want to check into it.
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Oculus Spirit [82955]
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Voted on by school members.***
Jul 7, 2022, 1:15 PM
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110%er [5926]
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those school members
Jul 7, 2022, 3:12 PM
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are part of THE ACC yeah???? So, yes THE ACC screwed us. maybe im in the minority, but I have hoped for nothing but failure for every team in the ACC. every single one of them thinks they are better than Clemson, so screw em.
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CU Medallion [55267]
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Re: Waiting and hoping that the ACC will do what is best for
Jul 7, 2022, 12:26 PM
[ in reply to Waiting and hoping that the ACC will do what is best for ] |
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IMHO, Clemson has been put is a position to look out for Clemson's interest above and beyond all others, and doing so by playing their cards in their pocket, and not letting the left hand know what the right hand is thinking about doing at any moment. In other words, if and when Clemson has to play it's hand, when they lay their cards down, let it be a total shocker to everyone around the table bc, Clemson's future in college sports has been put in a sink or swim position!!!
Message was edited by: allorangeallthetime52®
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Standout [317]
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Standout [317]
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110%er [9656]
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How much money do they think fans can spend to attend games?
1
Jul 7, 2022, 8:13 AM
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Or do they really care?
(I think I know the answer to this one)
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Walk-On [117]
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Re: How much money do they think fans can spend to attend games?
Jul 7, 2022, 8:35 AM
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Quite frankly they do not care about fans in the stands anymore. Its all about TV money. Why do you think the bowls games still exist when there is less than 25% of the stadiums are full. Because ESPN pays them more then they will ever make on ticket sales. Unfortunately the fans in the stands experience has been sacrificed on the alter of tv money.
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MVP [524]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 8:25 AM
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If Clemson's future is teathered to the floundering ACC, we're screwed, plain and simple. The best path forward is the SEC, if that is offered, and that's a big 'IF'. The day that happens, I'll run through my neighborhood cheering, wearing nothing but a champagne bottle. ??
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Orange Blooded [2399]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 9:29 AM
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We'll be waiting on pics!
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MVP [524]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 11:30 AM
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Ha ha, you'd like it! ??
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Letterman [262]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 8:41 AM
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ACC is toast. They are slow to move and getting out positioned by the SEC, BIG-10 and stuck in a reactive position which is bad news. I fully believe that the main three ACC Charter Schools - Clemson, UNC and Duke all agree to make a move together at which point the ACC is toast. All three have huge brands across the country and deep athletic department funding. I could care less what FSU and Miami do quiet frankly as they are newbies anyway.
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Orange Blooded [2030]
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I'm hoping both UNC and Duke get
Jul 7, 2022, 8:57 AM
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donkey punched after it all shakes out. Never again will they get to dominate in basketball at another conference. For the past 50 years they've screwed over everyone to ensure their basketball teams were positioned to win in the NCAA tournament. Mack Brown ain't gonna live forever and UNC football go back to sucking like Duke football. They better hope they get in the SEC and pray that their father's brother's cousin's let them win at basketball like they did in the ACC.
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Orange Blooded [2471]
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Great post +1. I have a feeling Duke basketball is about to
Jul 7, 2022, 12:45 PM
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nosedive just like UNC football after Mack finally retires. You just can’t replace a guy like coach K. And what kind of a name is Mack anyway? He looks more like a Robert to me lmao
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Oculus Spirit [96772]
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110%er [8515]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 8:58 AM
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Honest reporting would state that the ACC has never been "on par," as you say, with the revenues the BIG10 and SEC have been getting. My old mind is not great, but I don't think the lack of revenue will take away our football Championships in 16 and 18, the record we have had the last 10 years, or our soccer Championship last season. Neither Clemson, the ACC nor the world will end if we stay where we are and have a much, much better chance at continuing to win football games.
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CU Guru [1034]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 10:46 AM
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The ACC used to be on par with the SEC and Big Ten. Before Miami and Virginia Tech were added, the ACC had the highest payout of any conference.
That was mostly due to basketball. At the time, the ACC's basketball contract with Jefferson Pilot paid more than the SEC's football contract. I understand that was long time ago, and obviously the market has changed. I'm just illistrating the point that all the decisions and developments are not as cut and dried as people now believe, with 20/20 hindsight.
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Hall of Famer [22155]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 9:23 AM
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Good article. Two quotes sum it up for me.
"as the powers that be wheel and deal in secret" (emphasis mine)
"Until we know, however, it's sit and wait and hope for the best."
I love reading the speculation. I spend an hour or more every day just scanning the net searching for articles and videos with speculations about it. But, I understand, all that speculation is written by people who know nothing about what is actually going on in secret.
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Legend [17507]
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In Secret
Jul 7, 2022, 10:54 AM
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Well said again bretfsu® ... and thanks DavidHood® for your honest reporting and educated opinion.
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All-In [48020]
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Re: In Secret
Jul 7, 2022, 1:44 PM
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Well said again bretfsu® ... and thanks DavidHood® for your honest reporting and educated opinion.
Well said as usual @SocMan2. It's actually amusing to see some of the creative writings. True that no one knows what's going on but I do agree with the majority - the ACC in general has not been proactive over the past decade. 2. We tried to expand, or did expand TV market based solely on basketball markets. Our only chance to strengthen football was missed badly on ND.
Clemson should have never agreed to the GOR and should have bailed then.
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Walk-On [104]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 9:35 AM
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Not so fast, David! The ACC is not doomed.
Agree with the post Conference underrated, and needs better marketing.
Chaotic following of other leagues makes no sense. (See LIV and golf)
I am very confortable where we are, and think lots more of us are as well.
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Orange Blooded [2336]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 9:43 AM
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If I get $50,000.00 to drive a truck, You think I wouldn't jump at the chance to drive for another company for $200,000.00.
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Scout Team [166]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 10:31 AM
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Sounds like Liv Golf
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Orange Blooded [4020]
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All-In [27164]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 10:23 AM
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ACC is on life support. Either we bolt for the SEC or we choose to be relegated to irrelevency.
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Scout Team [166]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 10:30 AM
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What happened to the alliance that the ACC did with the Big 10 a year ago or so? what was that all about?
Why on earth would Swafford make a contract until 2036? That was a terrible move. As much as I like the teams in the ACC I think Clemson needs to move on. I personally, since I live on the West Coast, like the idea of a partnership with the Pac 12 so I could travel to more games. But the best move is obviously the SEC. No Doubt. I just wish they'd pick up a home and away with Stanford or USC
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All-TigerNet [10480]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 10:57 AM
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I’m not inclined to spend time worrying about things that I can’t control.
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CU Guru [1034]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 10:58 AM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world ] |
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Swofford didn't make the contract. The presidents of the member universities (including Clemson) did. As I've pointed out before, the SEC signed all of its TV rights to ESPN until 2034. I understand the are getting more money, but they signed for a similar amount of time. Also, they weren't getting as much money then as they are about to, after adding Texas and Oklahoma.
The fundamental problem isn't/wasn't Swofford. The problem is that the ACC is made up of relatively smaller schools, which have relatively smaller fan bases. That translated into smaller following and ratings, relative to other conferences, less internal support in terms of donations and facilities, and thus smaller TV contracts. People thinking Swafford, Phillips, or anyone else can just wave a magic wand and make these problems magically disappear are just fooling themselves.
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CU Guru [1098]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 11:06 AM
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It has always started and ended up out Clemson. The BOT and Neff have to do what’s best for our brand….the Paw is as strong as it has ever been and it is their duty to keep it that way. CDS and his staff have done their part. I know the other sports are important, but not like football……we need to leave the ACC…..SEC is the only one that makes sense. Natural region rivals and way better football than the big10.
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Hall of Famer [21545]
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This moment will define Graham Neff for his entire career.
Jul 7, 2022, 11:08 AM
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Get us to the SEC and be a legend. Get us to the BIGwhatever and at least were still in the game.
Do neither of these two things, settle for the leftovers, and probably get fired in a few years.
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Orange Blooded [3723]
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Joined: 11/30/14
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 11:56 AM
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After reading DHoods take, I’m thinking Clemson should seriously consider bolting along with FSU, Miami and GT.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 12:51 PM
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Agree with sentiment that CU needs to go to SEC. Not sure Big10 or PAC-12 would do it for us in the long run. Since our recruiting base is mainly out of Ga, it makes logical sense. I can’t imagine how hard Dabo’s recruiting effort is compared to equal SEC schools. Just shows you how good he is. No matter what, this season is very very important. Go Tigers
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Oculus Spirit [96772]
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Joined: 9/14/05
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Nice first post...
Jul 7, 2022, 1:15 PM
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coot
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Trainer [27]
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Joined: 4/28/20
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 12:20 PM
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A very real possibility is that, because of a bad TV deal with the ACC, Clemson’s future as a national powerhouse hangs in the balance?
Like the Ol time crooner Ferlin Husky use to sing “Lovin May make this world go round but money greases the wheels.”
Can we move on to the SEC already? I’d love to form new rivalries with the likes of TN, Ole Miss, and of course Alabama. Honestly I’m tired of the like of Wake and Duke for football. Our ACC regular season hasn’t seduced me in YEARS!
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Trainer [27]
TigerPulse: 82%
Posts: 22
Joined: 4/28/20
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 12:20 PM
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A very real possibility is that, because of a bad TV deal with the ACC, Clemson’s future as a national powerhouse hangs in the balance?
Like the Ol time crooner Ferlin Husky use to sing “Lovin May make this world go round but money greases the wheels.”
Can we move on to the SEC already? I’d love to form new rivalries with the likes of TN, Ole Miss, and of course Alabama. Honestly I’m tired of the like of Wake and Duke for football. Our ACC regular season hasn’t seduced me in YEARS!
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Mascot [24]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 28
Joined: 6/1/22
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 2:10 PM
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If we leave the ACC I’m sorry but the gathering at the paw after home football games has to stop because they will fine the university millions of dollars every time it happens. The SEC and the Big 10 both fine fans for rushing out onto the field if I’m not mistaken so this will have to stop.
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CU Guru [1602]
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 2:53 PM
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Swofford hurt the ACC in so many ways. This GOR was probably the worst. I was glad to see the change in tge commmish.
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Orange Blooded [3454]
TigerPulse: 79%
Posts: 6200
Joined: 9/13/00
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 7, 2022, 8:32 PM
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Here’s another obscure one. In 1984, Clemson was pre-season #1. This pissed off everyone since we were in our final year of probation. The NCAA passed a rule stating that any program on”conference probation” (even though not on NCAA probation was now banned from winning the national championship.
Additionally, the ACC (just for that one year) instituted a rule which applied a 10 yard penalty to the kicking team for any kickoff that went through the end zone on the fly.
Which team do you suppose had the only kicker who could do that? I’ll give you a hint: “Kick That Piggy Iggy!”
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Orange Blooded [4415]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 6283
Joined: 10/26/05
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Clemson to the SEC! I'll help pack the bags!***
Jul 7, 2022, 5:41 PM
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All-In [46410]
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Posts: 13719
Joined: 7/18/12
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If I was the SEC It would be the best markets/team combined
Jul 8, 2022, 1:30 AM
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If I were the SEC I would look where I could expand market and improve competition with teams fans support.
The best in the ACC would be Florida State, rich tradition, great fan support, big market and they fit the SEC footprint.
Clemson great program, incredible fan support, rich tradition, not bad market with nation wide fans because of success in football and we fit the SEC footprint.
Virginia Tech good tradition, very good fan support, good market and they stretch the footprint of SEC.
Miami good tradition, fan support not so strong but huge Market for TV.
North Carolina or North Carolina State good fan support, good tradition/basketball, good market and one will expand the SEC footprint..
Pittsburgh has decent fan support, good tradition in football & basketball, great market and expands the TV market/footprint.
Clemson, FSU, VT, Miami, North Carolina or North Carolina State make the most sense along with Notre Dame to give them 6 more teams.
Hopefully we are actively ready to make the best move. I believe most of these moves have already been decided and we will soon see it play out.
I believe Dabo has been involved in helping us make a great move no matter what they decide.
We have great fans, IPTAY that has helped us stay at the top, great facilities, the best university, the best coach/coaches and we sow great seeds by doing right things right in our amazing family.
Clemson’s foundation is strong will be fine and will stand tall when others crumble all around us.
Let’s go Tigers Fight Fight Fight!
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Commissioner [954]
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Joined: 11/22/04
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Re: TNET: The ACC and Clemson's future hangs in the balance of topsy-turvy world
Jul 9, 2022, 12:43 PM
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College football conference realignment has been reshaping the sport for the last 20 years and olympic sports have suffered silently in the background.
It’s time for D1/BowlSubdivision college football to break off into its own alignments and allow BBall and olympic sports to resume regional conferences.
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