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Hall of Famer [21940]
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This makes zero sense to me
Aug 12, 2021, 10:27 AM
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Why the #### are we asking OPEC to crank out more oil while at the same time limiting various oil production capabilities here in the States?
Can one of you sophisticates give my smooth brain a talking to so I can wrap my neanderthalic mind around this seemingly stupid ### ####### policy decision?
I have plenty of buddies in Oil and Gas, some of which were right there in W Texas when we started stomping the worlds ### in fracking. We have the capability and capacity here to do it. Why not leverage American industries to generate energy, and instead, buy it from halfway across the god #### world?
For you green energy blow hards - explain to me how it's better for the planet to put the oil drilled out from a ####### desert - controlled by racist, mysoginistic, bomb happy ######## - onto a boat, and power that mother ###### all the way across the planet. I'm pretty smooth brained, I get it - probably can't handle these highQ brain teasers and what not - but I'll try to learn.
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All-In [40344]
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Because
Aug 12, 2021, 10:41 AM
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Science
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CU Medallion [73569]
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I hear if you drill for oil in M. East, it
Aug 12, 2021, 10:45 AM
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doesnt hurt the environment if you buy it from there. Only in the US
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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If someone actually leans on environmental
Aug 12, 2021, 10:58 AM
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impacts and/or concerns as the backing for this ####, an open handed slap would suffice as a response.
I'd be losing my ####### mind if I was in the Oil and Gas industry here in the states. Why doesn't the government just stick their thumb right in these motherfucker's eyes and ask em how much they like it.
You're talking tens of thousands of American citizens' livelihoods here. Plus the supporting economic structures that result out of this (towns, suppliers, etc). Plus - you know - cheaper ####### oil. Gaahhhhfuckingdamnit. Such a direct god #### correlation to the inflation issues, and we're god #### outsourcing ####. Unfuckingbelievable.
Chicken #### god #### ##### ### ####### policy that no one can rationally support.
We're going to "save the planet" while outsourcing solid economic output to a 3rd world ####### #### hole (who enslaves their women by the way, you #metoo-er ####### hypocritical #######) and have inflated costs of energy - and you ##### ### peasant Americans are going to ####### like it!
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Hall of Famer [24059]
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Re: This makes zero sense to me
Aug 12, 2021, 10:56 AM
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Well you see, if you cut US production you know OPEC would cut their production to increase profit margin. Then you can piously say, we are green now - we cut oil production. And you can yell at OPEC for increasing oil prices. While at the same time, make a killing off your oil stocks.
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All-In [34589]
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Because Draft-Dodging POS Joe is literally asleep at the
Aug 12, 2021, 11:03 AM
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wheel. This is what you voted for...
If youre not going to give me a reach-around, can I at least have some inflation?
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CU Medallion [73569]
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I also hear its safer for the env. to ship oil across
Aug 12, 2021, 11:06 AM
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thousands of miles of seas/oceans than an oil pipeline on land.
Facts!
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All-In [34589]
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sCiENsE***
Aug 12, 2021, 11:07 AM
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Heisman Winner [137947]
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CU Medallion [50635]
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just asthma***
Aug 12, 2021, 12:33 PM
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Oculus Spirit [83121]
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No, he received student deferments. He was an undergrad
Aug 12, 2021, 12:40 PM
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and in Law school at Syracuse during nam. If you made fairly good grades, a deferment was a given.
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CU Medallion [50635]
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i guess
Aug 12, 2021, 12:44 PM
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Biden received five student draft deferments, first as an undergraduate at the University of Delaware and later as a law student at Syracuse University.
And after a medical exam in April 1968, he received the "1-Y" classification, which meant he could only be drafted in a national emergency.
Biden released his Selective Service records to the Associated Press in 2008. At the time, a spokesperson said he was "disqualified from service because of asthma as a teenager," per The News Journal.
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Lot o points [155913]
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The DOD determined Joe was more useful back home.
Aug 12, 2021, 2:43 PM
[ in reply to I had no idea he was a draft dodger. ] |
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Someone had to dole out justice to community pool bullies. Heroes are everywhere. You just have to look.
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All-In [26507]
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Their oil must have less carbon
Aug 12, 2021, 11:06 AM
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Plus they treat women better
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CU Medallion [73569]
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and gays***
Aug 12, 2021, 11:08 AM
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: This makes zero sense to me
Aug 12, 2021, 11:07 AM
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Hall of Famer [24776]
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See Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Horowitz/etc... Their 9/11 baby.***
Aug 12, 2021, 12:45 PM
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110%er [8984]
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Re: This makes zero sense to me
Aug 12, 2021, 11:15 AM
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*Biden loves 'Murica so much, he is holding onto US energy and burning others
they will be depleted, leaving the US in the dominant world position
or he could just be on the take
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All-In [26507]
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Hunter has a degree from Phoenix U
Aug 12, 2021, 11:20 AM
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On oil painting
Lets ask him
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Hall of Famer [24477]
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All-In [26507]
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Maybe Catahola can explain to us in laymans terms***
Aug 12, 2021, 11:17 AM
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All-In [42169]
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Nah, I'm good, dawg.***
Aug 13, 2021, 7:57 AM
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Hall of Famer [24477]
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The only idea that makes sense - and this would require
Aug 12, 2021, 11:21 AM
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forward thinking not founded on partisan expediency, so no bets here - is that in a world of limited supply, use the other guy's supply first. If there was evidence that someone at the strategic level is thinking this through, okay, I could buy it. But the partisan lurching we are seeing, 80+ executive orders printed by various left wingers, is doing more harm than good. Even the greeners in Canada thought cancelling the pipeline was stupid. My bet is that we have no strategy. But an unintended consequence could be that we have oil when others dont.
Or, just as likely, we could be engaged in just the opposite. If oil has 30 years of remaining value, let the other guy make money from it rather than us, just to make a left winger happy.
Which of those is actually happening, do you think?
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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IF that's the strategy
Aug 12, 2021, 11:57 AM
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huge IF here...that contradicts with the other goals of cutting carbon by 2050. At which point we should be seeing substantial policy in place to incentivize nuclear energy...which we aren't. $15B (which includes other forms of energy R&D) is jack #### compared to the money we're giving away these days.
But I guess my point is, we have enough oil to make it 2050 at the rates seen under 2nd term Obama and Trump. Pre-shale discovery, this argument had more water. Now, no way.
Here's some back of the napkin math:
So if we can keep up, say 10k bbl / day output from here, that puts us around 3.65M bbl / year US output. Current reserves clock us in around 44B bbl. So at these outputs, we can make it ~12k years....
10k bbl / day output domestically will assume ~ 5k bbl import. Currently we're more at a 8k US / 7k import split.
If we move to only US oil dependence, say 16k bbl / day, that's 5.6M bbl / year. Which we'd have capacity to make ~7.5k years.
But wait...there's more...our reserves keep increasing, mostly during the last 11 years (thanks to my boys who spear headed the fracking effort). Shale oil puts us on the top, and no one can touch our ####.
Ran through that math quickly, so feel free to punch holes. Used to trade oil futures way more regularly than I do now, so became very familiar with data available here: https://www.eia.gov/petroleum/
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Hall of Famer [24477]
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Agree. The 'use theirs first' strategy makes the most sense
Aug 12, 2021, 12:21 PM
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if one thinks oil supply will be critical in, say, 2050. IF (IF) that is the strategy, someone thinks alternate energy is more pipe dream than realistic.
If that is not the strategy, failing to make hay while the sun shines, while also failing to develop those alternates we keep being promised, is Clark stepping on those boards in the attic. Watching a Stage 3/4 guy sign 80+ EO's in a day and a half has pretty much convinced me that is what is happening.
I have not seen any answer other than nuclear. Weather based energy has all the downsides one might imagine unless we can store huge amounts of it, and people keep saying batteries will one day do it, but going all in on that before we have them is a dangerous bet, the inside straight.
We spend a trillion here and a trillion there like it was water, a thousandth of which is a billion. If cold fusion was even remotely possible, one would think that a couple hundred billion would develop the process. If yes, do it, if not, we have to discount that, at least for now.
Another way to consider that is this: "If $4 Trillion is being spent on 'infrastructure', shouldn't an energy source come out of all that spending?" If the answer is no, we are a long ways away from anything, it seems.
Meanwhile, if you 'follow the science', there are not enough cons to nuclear to not do it. And a lot of pros. But the left has adopted 'no' as a partisan matter, so we're stuck on this gerbil wheel.
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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another one of my close buddies
Aug 12, 2021, 12:25 PM
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is pretty high up in our nuclear labs. We have the technology and the brainpower to accomplish this. We have antiquated policies and stupid ####### people making decisions preventing us.
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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forgot to whole heartedly agree
Aug 12, 2021, 12:26 PM
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with your statement of all this spending, and no true alternate energy resource as a result is laughably ####### stupid.
chicken #### leadership across the board.
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110%er [5677]
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Re: The only idea that makes sense - and this would require
Aug 13, 2021, 3:11 PM
[ in reply to The only idea that makes sense - and this would require ] |
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Good idea on using their oil first, but it's not like we have a five year supply. Plus the fact that it is a good idea by definition means it could not have originated in the White House.
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Heisman Winner [111599]
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Re: This makes zero sense to me
Aug 12, 2021, 11:32 AM
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only 12% of our current oil imports come from the Saudis, we produce roughly 40% of our own from west Texas and the Dakotas, Latin America, (Mexico and Venezuela), and Canada are the second biggest producers of oil that we import.
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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Right you are, amigo
Aug 12, 2021, 12:00 PM
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So why do we need them to give us more? That was the question - fully versed on how to pull import data.
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Oculus Spirit [78892]
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All-TigerNet [12592]
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Re: This makes zero sense to me
Aug 12, 2021, 11:36 AM
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I'm sure Biden would be able to give a well reasoned answer if asked the question. Sure. It makes zero sense to you, because it makes zero sense.
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Oculus Spirit [83121]
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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What's your point
Aug 12, 2021, 12:30 PM
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relative to that specific article, written in 2017, when we're sitting here in Q3 of 2021?
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Oculus Spirit [83121]
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Yea, just showing the many large U.S. oil companies
Aug 12, 2021, 12:38 PM
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that do business with Saudi Arabia. I googled but can't find anything more recent.
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Letterman [257]
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I haven’t looked into what has been happening this week,
Aug 12, 2021, 12:37 PM
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but there’s a lot of reasons we will continue to import foreign oil and why we should care what OPEC does. For one, oil comes in lots of different types, and different types are used for different purposes. Not all oil is the same. We need some of the types of oils we don’t have here in the U.S. and will continue to need them.
Also, oil is a global market, like everything these days. What OPEC and others do, and the pricing of their oil, affects our domestic oil prices. So if you care about paying less, you should care about what is happening in the global oil market.
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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I agree on the first paragraph
Aug 12, 2021, 2:34 PM
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I think your second paragraph is soft and a little dated.
And first, let me say this to clear the air: #### OPEC.
Now that we got that out of the way, we have the capacity and wells in place to influence the price of oil - which is my point. Instead of asking those #### suckers across the planet, we can do this ourselves.
Why we give these ######## the benefit of the doubt, or any sliver of business moving forward is beyond me. I guess all you old farts forgot what was going down before our boys in Texas and North Dakota hit them in the mouth with blowing this shale oil phenomenon through the roof? Oil was trading at $150 / bbl. Arguably a significant factor in GFC. Opec will never operate in our interests which is why us establishing dominance in this market is paramount.
There's an equilibrium in the market - $50 - $60 / bbl can support $2.00 - $2.50 / gal of gasoline here in the states. As soon as either a) the demand drives the price up or b) those #### suckers cut production to lift prices, we should up our domestic production.
As stated earlier, we've found an equilibrium. Why ask Opec for more oil when we have it right here? Why make oil production here, in this ####### country, more challenging and cost prohibitive, and then a few months later ask these ######## for more? I don't see how that was answered.
Statement from the WH: https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2021/08/11/statement-by-national-security-advisor-jake-sullivan-on-the-need-for-reliable-and-stable-global-energy-markets/
Bush league ####### policy pandering to the god #### arab nations to pump more oil when we could wax their ### at their own game all god #### day.
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All-In [49046]
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Nice try...
Aug 12, 2021, 3:11 PM
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neanderthalic is not even a word.
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Legend [16256]
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Most of OPEC product today is simply a matter of turning
Aug 12, 2021, 3:25 PM
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the spigot more open, the infrastructure and supply are already there. Thus, to address today's gasoline price increases, that's the quickest solution - reversing more of the cuts made last year by OPEC when demand, and prices, plummeted. It is a short term ask to help in getting the economy back to full employment and help curb inflation along the way. Today.
The US has a significant amount of production, and it is still growing. If it wasn't for the progress on this domestic energy production that occurred under the Obama / Biden administration, we would not be close to being in the position of net exporter that we achieved a few years back, nor have the leverage we do today to keep prices overall in check, though not optimal. These things take time. What Biden and the Administration are not allowing today is the addition of new federal lands to be leased out for exploration and fracking, something that would be years away from delivering on. Private lands? Sure. Just no new leases on federal lands for fracking.
Stories and opinion pieces being pumped out today framing this recent request in the manner you are addressing it is just that - red meat to gin up the ill-informed and create fake talking points. US production was predicted last year to recede in 2021, which it has, and then start back climbing again in 2022, which it still seems poised to do. It's in a similar state as shipping, trucking, and other supply line disruptions that came about in 2020.
As America shifts incrementally to more and more electric over gasoline, our demand will begin to wane. There is private land available for development along with the current inventory in place. If in some years out we see that private lands won't be enough to meet our needs and we need to open up more federal lands again for fracking, then that's what we'll likely see, regardless of what party is in charge.
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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Let me say this back to you
Aug 12, 2021, 3:43 PM
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to make sure I'm on the same page. Well written response by the way, thank you. We are in agreement it seems on a lot of points. I called out the advancements in Obama's 2nd term in another response, just for the record.
So you're saying that a quicker avenue to decreasing oil prices on a global scale is to ask the Arab nations for more output? And that's our best solution? I have a hard time grasping this, but if that's the truth then so be it. Is this because we can't ask our guys to do it, or that our guys can't do it as quickly or won't do it b/c of costs?
I guess I'm having trouble understanding prioritizing communications to a foreign entity - who's ###### us over in the past - while we have capable entities right here in our back yard. Referencing CL price action circa 2014 - 2016 when those ######## were going after market share and trying to squeeze us out, for example.
That is one flaw in the shale world, per my buddies, is that our cost / bbl is more expensive. One buddy has sense started his own company leveraging machine learning and automation capabilities for the wells, similar to what we do in my world to help address costs and mobilization. I guess there's never been a push for optimization in this industry due to all the fat margins for so long.
I'm aligned on mobilization and time for market fluctuations based on demand forecasts and weekly inventory trends - agreed there. Won't be overnight.
Strategically - I strongly disagree with going to Opec before American producers. Based on what you're saying I very well could be ####### wrong. But if I am wrong, I'd like to see policy put in place to grant us more flexibility to react to unfavorable market conditions instead of pandering to ####### Opec.
And last point of clarification, I haven't read an opinion piece. Just the WH statement my buddy in Texas sent me. And I will say, our boys in Houston aren't too ####### happy with it.
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Legend [16256]
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Re: Let me say this back to you
Aug 12, 2021, 4:01 PM
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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I passed this theory to my boy in Houston
Aug 12, 2021, 4:21 PM
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his response: #### that ####. we can turn the taps on as quick as they can.
then a number of expletives bout how it's political.
idk man...only time will tell.
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Legend [16256]
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So, who is controlling those well taps down in Houston?
Aug 12, 2021, 7:33 PM
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It isn't Grandpa Joe, is it? Does the Fed have say over how much or when the US oil industry is producing? I know we have a "reserve" and are likely a large purchaser often, along with defense and other interstate logistics and such, but isn't domestic oil and gas extraction and production here owned and run by private enterprise who determine on their own how much they are putting out? OPEC has government (almost all autocratic) ministers dictating the volume and pace for their domains. If your boys in Houston don't have the taps full open, why not? Who is making that call? Are the owners waiting for the price to inch up some to make it more worthwhile?
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Lot o points [155913]
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Better yet
Aug 12, 2021, 7:46 PM
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Why wouldn’t it be a better look for Joe to appeal to them publicly first before going hat in hand to OPEC?
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Legend [16256]
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Who's to say
Aug 12, 2021, 10:45 PM
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he didn't? Not out in public necessarily, but Joe doesn't run his Admin out in the Twittersphere at every turn so there's probably a good portion of things getting attention behind the scenes, like it oughta.
I would find it hard to believe that his Admin wasn't in contact with our domestic producers prior to this official statement being issued. Also hard to comprehend that those powers that be weren't in some kind of agreement on the US request. It was also directed for many of our overseas allies alongside who don't share our domestic asset. Hat in hand is a little strong. Gas is still cheaper today than it's been a number of times over the last 20 years, so it's not like a crisis is at hand. Seemed to be more of a warning. Play nice. Or don't. Either way you're on notice.
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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Not to poke at you directly
Aug 13, 2021, 3:13 PM
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but he kind of already did the opposite. In his first week in office he signed executive orders directly aimed at the oil industry here in the States.
The probability of him now reaching out to them for more production is about as high as me dunking a basketball
Regardless of some of your points on global markets, playing nice, etc. - we have the abilities to do this here, in this country. Why don't we? Everyone's skirting around that question, IMO, and instead offering some BS on why we're reaching out to Opec...
It's a pretty simple answer in my mind, and no one's been able to contradict it. He's pandering to his base on this environmental ######## despite the negative economic impacts. It's a hypocritical position to say we're being environmentalists, then turn around and ask people with less environmental drilling standards than us to then ship us the same product thousands of nautical miles, polluting the #### even more.
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Hall of Famer [21940]
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Pretty nuanced response here
Aug 13, 2021, 3:05 PM
[ in reply to So, who is controlling those well taps down in Houston? ] |
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so I'll do my best to pass along what I'm told...sounds like at a high level theme is that investors are spooked.
The ceasing of new permits on Fed lands greatly affected W Texas and NM - which is our Permian Basin. Exxon and Chevron had most of their on-shore drilling operations there. That caused everyone to shut down (even moreso than they did w/ covid) and pull out of there. There's a double mobilization effort for shale oil - first you drill for about a month, then you frack for about a month. So there's that piece of it which we all kind of agreed on - the mobilization.
The bigger players are hedged pretty well and riding out Delta variant and Biden's policies. The smaller players either went under and are consolidating, or are the ones still running full bore.
In his words (and he's pretty high up in the fracking world) - shutting down a fracked well that's been flowing causes major damage and production will suck. So the strategy was to keep drilling, then cap and wait for favorable conditions to go in and frack to pump oil out. That mobilization isn't occurring due to fears of another shut down and current policy decisions. Prices are fine where they are now for the guys who aren't hedged, but the big boys have hedged well and can still wait it out.
He said Alberta is starting to crank up, but us cutting the Keystone Pipeline has cut us off from their supplies. Another decision that seems really stupid to me...
I asked if Xiden boosted investor confidence and loosened the regulations (instead of pandering to Opec), would that get our guys moving again. He said yes, easily. Almost overnight.
Sounds like to me (granted, I'm siding w/ the American oil industry lol) that we've blundered policy decisions to put us here. Coupled with Covid and the new Delta variant, we got ourselves in a mess.
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