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CU Guru [1534]
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Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 28, 2022, 5:21 PM
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Let's set aside for a second the Saudi human rights abuses... just for the purpose of this discussion.
Let's say the Saudi money was purely oil sourced (which it is btw), assuming we believe in capitalism which 100% of the PGA Tour board and tournament sponsors do, what is their beef with the players who've gone to LIV?
Wouldn't Jay Monahan go be the LIV commissioner for $100m if offered??
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110%er [8534]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 28, 2022, 5:28 PM
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So is Monahan and Greg Norman walked in a room, who would you recognize? That is your answer.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 28, 2022, 5:39 PM
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Jack Nicklaus said they offered him the gig for big bucks but he turned them down.
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All-TigerNet [10460]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 28, 2022, 9:09 PM
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According to Norman, they offered Tiger Woods a “high nine figure” contract to sign and he turned them down.
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CU Medallion [65382]
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That alone should tell you how serious they are about
Jun 29, 2022, 8:13 AM
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toppling the PGA Tour. I fully expect them to keep "raising the ante" until other top stars pull a Brooks Koepka, and defect.
But, the good news is, at some point, they will have signed so many people that they either will have to have more tournaments, or start having tournaments with cuts, where your performance matters again to some degree. Only then will it start to resemble golf as we have known it.
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Orange Blooded [2336]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 28, 2022, 5:39 PM
[ in reply to Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour ] |
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If the PGA tour was not worried they would not be making all these changes. Maybe, just maybe Phil was right.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 28, 2022, 5:36 PM
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He well might do it. Just don’t understand the LIV tours end game. No way as it sits right now they recoup anything off of their investment. I’m good with players leaving if that’s what they want to do but I also agree that they should lose their PGA membership. They have a lot to work out. Ryder Cup, President’s Cup, world ranking points. Not sure what all the non sanctioned events will do(Majors). Most don’t give away millions in exchange for nothing. Sure more will come out in the future on what their intentions are.
Sergio mentioned that he would finally get paid what he is worth. Dang man you hit a white ball for a living and get paid by your performance. Used to like that guy but seems to be a whiny baby.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 29, 2022, 8:09 AM
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It’s to soften the image of the Saudis, they don’t care about money, they have over 300 billion. They tried to do the same a few years ago when they tried to buy the premiere league, but got over ruled in the purchase.
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Freshman [-99]
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Why should you lose your PGA tour card?
Jun 29, 2022, 8:30 AM
[ in reply to Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour ] |
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Lots of players hold multiple tour cards. There are guys on the European tour that also play on the PGA Tour. Guys on the Asian tour that also play sometimes on the PGA tour.
If the PGA were to start yanking cards it would only hurt the PGA.
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110%er [8273]
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Your first sentence reminds me of that time
Jun 28, 2022, 5:47 PM
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Marion Barry, mayor of Washington DC, said “if you take away the murders, this city is one of the safest in the country “
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All-TigerNet [10904]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 28, 2022, 8:49 PM
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Not many business's or companies make money the first few years. A lot of capital is spent to get it going and competitive. After LIV gets some high paying sponsors and advertisers they will probably make money because unlike the PGA they won't be giving money to charites. The money will go to pay the player's contracts and purses with anything left over banked. IMO, three to five years will tell the tale. The Saudi's have too much money to fold after a couple seasons. Heck, even the original USFL made it 3 years.
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Orange Blooded [2140]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 28, 2022, 9:46 PM
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All they need is viewership. Ratings bring cash. I just don't see the concept gaining in popularity
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Orange Blooded [3571]
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CU Medallion [65382]
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LIV is different than any other sports entity that has ever
Jun 29, 2022, 8:36 AM
[ in reply to Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour ] |
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been launched. It veritably CANNOT FAIL DUE TO LACK OF MONEY. The Saudi oil camel jockey barons have an unlimited pool of money they are willing to throw at this thing. Now, if it ultimately fails to accomplish its real objective, which is to raise the worlds opinion of them, then it could fail just because of them withdrawing support. But, it will never fail due to lack of money as long as they are backing it.
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Freshman [-99]
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The statistics are staggering
Jun 29, 2022, 9:28 AM
[ in reply to Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour ] |
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Although it would help if small businesses weren’t the most affected by government fees, government regulations, taxes, etc.
According to lending tree
18.4% of private sector businesses in the U.S. fail within the first year. After five years, 49.7% have faltered, while after 10 years, 65.5% of businesses have failed.
And of course everyone wants to open a restaurant, but if you want to know why banks won’t give you money, read this statistic from CNBC.
60 percent of new restaurants fail within the first year. And nearly 80 percent shutter before their fifth anniversary.
That’s why most people refinance their house, max out credit cards, and get other high interest rate loans to open a restaurant and of course when these restaurants fail they go bankrupt.
The food truck revolution has been a boom to food and culture. But of course the regulations are insane and it cost probably at least twice as much money as it should to start a food truck because of the government!
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Commissioner [922]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 29, 2022, 7:48 AM
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Where did the PGA suddenly get all this money from to raise event purses?
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110%er [5121]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 29, 2022, 9:04 AM
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The PGA is just pissed that they have a real competitor…with very deep pockets and a player-centric philosophy. Their monopoly is being threatened.
That said, you don’t need to “set aside” anything…
If our government can have friendly relations with the Saudis, even sending our head guy over to try to kiss up to them over oil production recently, why can’t golfers?
If anyone really cared about things the Saudis have been accused of then we wouldn’t be importing gazillions of barrels of oil from them…it’s easier to get on a high horse about golfers than to take the same stand and endure a 70’s style gas shortage, I guess.
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Freshman [-99]
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This story amplifies the hypocrisy of the media and Democrats.
Jun 29, 2022, 9:19 AM
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Saudi Arabia is a POS country for sure. Most of the Middle East is. But let’s be honest, they’re nothing compared to China. The vast majority of people living in Saudi Arabia are free and prosperous compared to China. Yet the left, especially Hollywood and other elites, flock to Saudi Arabia and Dubai.
The Dems constantly defend Islam despite the fact that they cut off little girls parts, treat women like second-class citizens, kill women that are raped or commit adultery, throw homosexuals off rooftops, and kill anyone that mocks or jokes about Islam or Mohammed. Yet they’re still defended by the Democrats. You should see the clip on YouTube of Ben Affleck losing his mind yelling at Sam Harris and Bill Maher after Sam Harris said that Islam is the mother lode of bad ideas.
This video clip is why the left and the Democrats must be stopped! They are irrational lunatics & fanatics. This is how woke progressive elites react to non woke progressives trying to have a rational fact based conversation.
https://youtu.be/vln9D81eO60
The woke sports media attacks anyone that questions the NBA and their relationship with China and of course label them racists! Idiots like LeBron James constantly talk about how oppressive America is while making hundreds of millions in China.
NFL athletes make a fortune in endorsements from companies whose products are made in China while constantly crying about oppression in America.
Yet God forbid the owner of Chick-fil-A give $1000 to a Christian organization. Libs in America go crazy and organize a massive protest against Chick-fil-A!
China pretty much owns Hollywood. But of course Hollywood celebrities constantly scream about the oppression in America.
No one makes movies in Hollywood and California anymore. Most TV shows and movies are made in Canada, the south, especially Georgia, and European countries. Why? So those virtuous Hollywood millionaires, the ultra elites and uber woke, can make their movies cheaper faster and easier without unions and onerous regulations. But they love voting for Democrats that created and support those corrupt unions and onerous regulations and of course want to tax and spend America into the dirt.
Saudi Arabia creates the LIV tour and the sports media loses its collective mind. Let’s be totally honest shall we? If these weren’t a bunch of privileged white predominately conservative athletes the media wouldn’t care. If the PGA Tour was predominantly black the media would be sitting on their hands. They wouldn’t say a peep!
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110%er [5512]
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Re: Splain me something about the PGA Tour
Jun 29, 2022, 9:45 AM
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He's making a business decision, and it's a solid one especially considering the contract language of the members of the Tour.
If a player skips a PGA event to play an event on another tour, he's in violation of his contract. It would be like you not showing up to work so you could go work a different job instead, then expecting to come back to work the next day like nothing happened.
It's a competitive clause meant to keep the field strong and avoid players from detracting viewers - and money - from a PGA event to a competitor event.
Will he be successful with this strategy? Time will tell...I think there will eventually be some relaxing of the rules or blending of the tours in some way. You've already seen the PGA adjust their prize purses, qualification rules, and end-of-season tournament to try to compete with the LIV $$$$$.
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Freshman [-99]
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PGA players pick and choose which events they want to play all the time.
Jun 29, 2022, 3:51 PM
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PGA tour players often play on other tours around the world especially in Europe.
If you’re in the top 125 on the money list you’re exempt for the next year and can play whichever event you want except for events you have to qualify for such as some of the FedEx events and the majors.
I have never heard a player having a contract with the PGA. A contract that requires them to play events. These guys are independent contractors. They own their own business which is themselves. They skip events all the time. And if they had a contract then they would get paid just to show up. The PGA doesn’t pay players just to show up. They don’t make a dime if they don’t make the cut. They may get money from their sponsors of course but not the PGA. For a contract to be legally binding there has to be offer and acceptance. If there’s no exchange of money you don’t have a legal contract.
Please provide something from a reliable source that says PGA players have a contract with the PGA.
You have European players and Asian players that play in events on the PGA tour which sponsor exemptions.
You have guys that only play certain events because of different rules for qualifying or sponsorship exemptions because they don’t have their full two or card for not finishing in the top 125 the year before.
If they do have a contract it is the most convoluted unenforceable contract ever written.
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110%er [5512]
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Re: PGA players pick and choose which events they want to play all the time.
Jun 29, 2022, 4:41 PM
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PGA tour players often play on other tours around the world especially in Europe
If there is not a conflicting PGA event the same weekend, this is allowed. If there is a PGA event, a release is required. The Tour is not issuing releases for LIV events, so those players that played got kicked off the tour for violating the rule by skipping a PGA event for a LIV event.
If you’re in the top 125 on the money list you’re exempt for the next year and can play whichever event you want except for events you have to qualify for such as some of the FedEx events and the majors
This is now the top 70, not the top 125. The remaining 55 have to compete in additional events for an exemption.
I have never heard a player having a contract with the PGA. A contract that requires them to play events. These guys are independent contractors. They own their own business which is themselves. They skip events all the time.
Correct - but they cannot skip an event AND play in a different event the same weekend without approval.
Please provide something from a reliable source that says PGA players have a contract with the PGA.
Maybe "contract" is the wrong term. As a PGA Tour member, there a rules. You have to play 15 events to retain membership, and you cannot play in a competing event without an approved release. If you do not meet those requirements, you lose your membership. Read this article.
https://www.golfdigest.com/story/pga-tour-sgl-ban
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Freshman [-99]
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Interesting.
Jun 30, 2022, 1:26 PM
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Thanks for the reply.
Haven’t had a chance to read that article, but I will.
In reference to the information you provided, and I’m assuming it’s accurate, then the PGA is acting like a monopoly. Unless they have an exemption from Congress to act as a monopoly the way the NBA, NFL, MLB, and some other organizations, their contracts are not going to be constitutional and legally binding. And given the fact that there are so many other golf tours I don’t see how you could reasonably and rationally expect the PGA to get monopoly status exemption.
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110%er [5512]
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Re: Interesting.
Jun 30, 2022, 1:36 PM
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The article touches on the legality of the PGA's stance - the general consensus is that their argument would stand up in court and they are within their rights to operate this way.
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