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All-TigerNet [10866]
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CPI is nonsense
Mar 27, 2022, 10:47 PM
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Everyone already knows this, but here's a good chart to show it
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Associate AD [838]
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Where do you find all this garbage?***
Mar 28, 2022, 12:06 AM
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Heisman Winner [111388]
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Re: CPI is nonsense
Mar 28, 2022, 12:24 AM
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that looks about right, the price of a new car has remained pretty stable over the last 20 years. The recent price spike is due to demand. When it comes to computers and a lot of consumer electronics, the CPI has moved downwards sharply. Look at computers, televisions, stereo equipment, it is almost exponential in so far as the value proposition compared to 20 years ago.
What is the issue here?
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All-TigerNet [10866]
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That’s blatantly false. The price of comparable vehicles
Mar 28, 2022, 7:24 AM
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Has continued to rise. That’s the whole point. When you compare apples to apples, prices have continued to rise.
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Heisman Winner [111388]
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It is like you have never bought a new car before.
Mar 28, 2022, 10:23 AM
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a base package Nissan Altima retailed at 23.9k in 2003, the same is true today. IF you mix in inflation, an argument can be made that it is cheaper.
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All-TigerNet [10866]
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And the car used to have a bigger engine.
Mar 28, 2022, 11:24 AM
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While many of the interior gadgets may be better, the car had better overall performance and quality then compared with now. They've reduced the quality of the car to keep the price steady, which is the entire #### point.
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Heisman Winner [111388]
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Re: And the car used to have a bigger engine.
Mar 28, 2022, 12:59 PM
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lol, mine was a lemon, lasted 60k miles before the engine failed.
I am not seeing this reported with the 2022 model.
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All-TigerNet [10866]
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You shop for a truck recently?
Mar 28, 2022, 3:04 PM
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comparable v8 truck from 2003 or so to now has gone up $30k. But you can just adjust and get an entry level kia crossover SUV instead.....
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Associate AD [838]
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I had a 2002 or 2003 altima, first year of the larger body
Mar 28, 2022, 10:34 PM
[ in reply to Re: And the car used to have a bigger engine. ] |
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Total lemon and nothing was every covered by the "extended" warranty. Kept it the shortest time of any car I've owned. They are definitely a lot better now.
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Heisman Winner [111388]
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Re: I had a 2002 or 2003 altima, first year of the larger body
Mar 28, 2022, 10:43 PM
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same, I will never get another Nissan. I mean I had just had the thing serviced. I had someone put in another engine I found at a junkyard. That one lasted me another 20 before all the little things started falling apart. At one point the door handle literally broke off in my hand.
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Associate AD [838]
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Re: I had a 2002 or 2003 altima, first year of the larger body
Mar 28, 2022, 10:54 PM
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Mine died on the road twice from failed sensors, but the engine itself was OK. When it died while I was driving to a concert I had been looking forward to, I ditched it the next day.
Didn't get to 60k miles though. Maybe 50k.
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Associate AD [838]
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Every year the average age of cars on the road increases
Mar 28, 2022, 10:43 PM
[ in reply to And the car used to have a bigger engine. ] |
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That's a direct result of increased quality. It's part of why used cars are worth more now and why the price of new cars hasn't risen as fast as the CPI in the last 20 years.
Delusion or ignorance. I can't tell with this one.
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110%er [7073]
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Re: CPI is nonsense
Mar 28, 2022, 10:11 AM
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Agree that there may well be a lot of BS in the CPI, but the Hedonic model for automobile prices may not be the best way to illustrate corruption of CPI data.
Since the Hedonic model is based on comparable 'items' and the value is based on the statistics of buyer / seller prices for those 'comparable items,' then the argument could be made that the newer automobiles (with all of the electronic gadgetry, back-up cameras, fancier braking systems, hybrid vehicles, etc.) are not comparable to the older models.
Therefore, the data of automobile sales is obfuscated by comparing 'new' (e.g., different cars) ... which are not comparable from a driving pleasure / comfort aspect ... to the 'old' automobiles.
Why would the gov't be interested in cheating on the CPI? (Hint: Motivation is a cause of most behavior.)
I-Bonds are one reason. When the gov't admits that the CPI has risen, then they are contractually obligated to pay out higher rates on I-Bonds. The gov't doesn't want their borrowing costs to go up; therefore the gov't is motivated to cheat on the CPI so that I-Bond interest rates stay low. Only recently with the too-fast-to-hide Biden inflation era are I-Bonds starting to pay out a reasonable 'variable component' on those financial instruments.
Once again CharlestonTom®, you've got the big picture right (even if the automobile / CPI / Hedonic price model may not be the 'perfect' way to illustrate the big picture).
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All-TigerNet [10866]
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Regardless of the minutia, you can see the drastic trend
Mar 28, 2022, 11:28 AM
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change when the only variable that changed was the method for calculating the CPI. So any honest person can grasp the reality of the situation.
Sure, there's going to be your typical s***libs who will stretch to any length to argue the opposite, because to them the government is their lord and savior and can do no wrong. But I think the graphic still makes a good point.
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110%er [7073]
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Re: Regardless of the minutia, you can see the drastic trend
Mar 28, 2022, 12:50 PM
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Upon further consideration, your highlight of when the CPI became linked to hedonic metrics does make a good point. Hedonic metrics distort the CPI in a way that gives the calculation of CPI a cloak of legitimacy.
Thanks for pushing me to think a little harder ... I needed that!
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All-TigerNet [10866]
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you have the patience of a saint, lol
Mar 28, 2022, 3:02 PM
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good times
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Hall of Famer [24687]
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The GubMint's explanation... Notice 'seasonal adjustment'
Mar 28, 2022, 12:55 PM
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near the bottom of the page... I think therein lies the 'lies'. They give a further link to pursue.
https://www.bls.gov/news.release/cpi.nr0.htm
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