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YOUR BALANCE
Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set
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Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 10, 2015, 12:16 AM

The 2 Back Shotgun formation for how OU uses it will stress our D. This is a really smart looking set up and advantage for the offense.

I think this is a really great look to throw at people. I hope our Co-OCs take a look at how Clemson can use this. We seem to use more 1 back set with DW4. Not much pistol formation anymore.

I watched some You Tube Ok U highlights and the 2 RB Shotgun set really played well for zone read and misdirection. It looks like it could cause a lot of problems in terms of spreading the defense and gaining leverage against them.

Found this interesting presentation from a high school coach
Inside Zone and Variations from Two Back Shotgun Formations
http://www.glazierclinics.com/content/content/215/Inside%20Zone%20and%20Variations%20from%20Two%20Back%20Shotgun%20Formations.pdf

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Shoo fly...err Boomer or cOOt


Dec 10, 2015, 12:22 AM

No #1 Team and their coaching staff is NOT gonna change up at this time. Don't be stupid.

-Doc

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I've been wrong two times, but this isn't one of them.


Re: Shoo fly...err Boomer or cOOt


Dec 10, 2015, 12:52 AM

Uh, Doctor 'I like to flex my Internet anonymous bravado", what an excellent reply for you sir. Congrats. Perhaps puff up your chest. Maybe smack it like you are tough, like when you win at one of your POV shooter or sports games. Now say BOOM!!!! and strut around to fulfill the stereotype.

But let me educate you a little more:
I am a Clemson grad.
I am a lifelong Clemson fan, but really love Clemson basketball and Clemson football.
I married a Clemson girl.
My daughter's middle name is Tiger.
I actually saw the 1981 Clemson National Championship game live.
I am not a gamecock or a OU Sooner fan.
I appreciate good smart football, so I respect my opponent.
I know and understand both the word and concept 'respect'.
I know that there are many things to learn.
I appreciate other perspectives and seeking continuous improvement.

So let's break it down for you. Take a gander, take a walk within the Internet. It is OK. You will not need to actually exert yourself or get out of your chair. You can still play your video games too.

But you can start by going to Dictionary.com and researching 'respect' or 'courtesy.'
Then maybe research Heliocentrism. It is OK if you just go to Wikipedia. The USA Today version of learning.
Then as you get more comfortable with expanding your horizons and not simply believing you are supreme, visit a link like http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/03/120307132206.htm

Go ahead. Expand your mind. Step away and perhaps cease from only listening to your own voice. Because as Ian Fleming wisely stated, "If I wait for the genius to come, it just doesn't arrive."

Enjoy your evening. Go Tigers... all of them, even you.

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Go Tigers! Beat the Sooners!


Dec 10, 2015, 1:50 AM

All the Way Tigers!

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"I've been working since I was 15 continually until now. I worked 40 hours a week at 15, when it wasn't even legal for 15 year olds to work that many hours."


Wait


Dec 10, 2015, 8:26 AM

what are you doing here!?

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That is perhaps the greatest post I've ever seen


Dec 10, 2015, 8:35 AM [ in reply to Re: Shoo fly...err Boomer or cOOt ]

this week anyway. Well done sir!

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"IDIOT POSTER OF THE MONTH SO FAR...GWP-- You have won IPM Award for your failure to completely comprehend a clear post & then choose to attack someone who points out your ignorance. While you are not yet in the same No Class Catagory as deRoberts, ClemTiger117 & Tigerdug23, you are getting closer to the Sewer Dwellers." - coachmac


Re: That is perhaps the greatest post I've ever seen


Dec 10, 2015, 11:55 PM

Whoa, I got kudos from GWP?

Aren't you on the Mount Rushmore of Tnet?

Thank you, sir.

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your daughter's middle name is "Tiger"?


Dec 10, 2015, 10:04 AM [ in reply to Re: Shoo fly...err Boomer or cOOt ]

I've officially heard it all.

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Re: your daughter's middle name is "Tiger"?


Dec 10, 2015, 11:53 PM

Yes sir. Actually it is a family name on my wife's side, but it fits as we are all Clemson grads.

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I agree with your assessment. However,


Dec 10, 2015, 1:02 AM

it only works if you're not being disrupted by outside variables (i.e. Shaq, Watkins, Boulware, etc.) For CBV, that's football 101. CBV has seen every set imaginable I'd assume. He's coached against Big12 O's and ACC O's (Ga Tech to UNC is about as far as you can get) 15 times. He's watching their tapes, and he'll be ready, as will our rested D.

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Re: I agree with your assessment. However,


Dec 10, 2015, 1:30 AM

As long as our front 3 or 4 are getting up field , gobbling up space and staying home that set is no better than any other. Our DB's are very good at coverage , and OU found that out last year.

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DB23


Re: I agree with your assessment. However,


Dec 10, 2015, 1:58 AM [ in reply to I agree with your assessment. However, ]

Yes you are right.

I went and looked NCAA defense team stats to see what OU has played against.
1. We are far and above the absolute best D they will face.
2. They have faced exactly 4 teams who are ranked in top 50 stats of at least 3 of the following categories: team D, rush D, pass efficient D, pass yds allowed, 1st down D, 3rd down conv and TFL.
Akron, Tennessee, Wst Virginia and TCU. The first three were in first 4 or 5 games of season. TCU was next to last game.
3. Clemson is best team per the categories above that OU will face. Far and above and significantly the best. TCU is possibly 2nd best D OU faced, especially after they adjusted their offense after first few games into the season.

But the QB improve scramble ability and OU's crossing routes will test Clemson D.
Would be nice to shut down or minimize OU's run game and have Clemson O keep field advantage.

I also like Clemson's most recent history of many weeks to prepare and playing as underdog/disrespected team.

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Re: I agree with your assessment. However,


Dec 12, 2015, 3:31 AM

+1. I agree on your point of us executing well off of breaks. Plus it never hurts for s D that's played 8 or 9 games in a row to rest, healthy, and focused.

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Brent Venables stresses our D.


Dec 10, 2015, 4:48 AM

I don't think anyone is worried about much OU does when Brent is on their case.

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In a 2 back set, you have to take out a WR or TE


Dec 10, 2015, 4:53 AM

I agree with you....having a 2 back set for some formations is not a bad idea and worth our coaches taking a look at it for situatational usage.

But, you can't play with 12 on the field.

So, next year, if we go 2 back with Gallman and Choice (as an example), who ya pulling out from WR/TE?

Cain, Scott, McCloud, Leggett? Don't forget about Mike Williams.

Not trying to be a jerk...but those 5 above need to be on the field more snaps than a 2nd RB when looking at Clemson's personnel.

You want your best 11 on the field. I'm not sure a 2nd RB would be our best 11.

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Re: In a 2 back set, you have to take out a WR or TE


Dec 10, 2015, 5:53 AM

The second running back would be Feaster. He is almost as good a receiver as he is a runner. He would be someone's nightmare to defend.

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Re: In a 2 back set, you have to take out a WR or TE


Dec 10, 2015, 6:36 AM [ in reply to In a 2 back set, you have to take out a WR or TE ]

Great point. I was thinking more of running Gallman out to offer as a screen, or you could put Cain or Ray Ray in RB spot for a formation. Or put Feaster(sp?) And Gallman in backfield at same time for a formation.

Makes a D have to watch too much movement right at snap.

OU looked like they ran two different zone read plays at same time for QB to choose. I think Watson would be brilliant at that. See the advantage presnap and make decision on fly.

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Don't forget about Feaster....


Dec 10, 2015, 8:23 AM [ in reply to In a 2 back set, you have to take out a WR or TE ]

assuming, of course, Muschamp doesn't flip him to $CU (ROFL) !!!!

Geez I crack myself up.




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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 10, 2015, 7:35 AM

Clemson is built on Hybrid players so we can run fast. The better the Dual Threat the better the offense because we don't have to sub to run another style of play. Lots of different plays out of the same formation means the D can't read it. Used to O's tried to Formation you to death so that the D would get confused.

Watson - Throw/Run
Gallman - Run/Catch
Scott - Catch/Run
Peake - Catch/Block
Leggett - Block/Catch
Cain - Catch - Screen/Vertical
Olineman - All cross train except one
Crowder - Hulk Smash

So from the same formation we could have 3 run options with 8 blockers up the middle or Horizontal with pullers. or 4 vertical with receiver out of the back field. Or any combo of the 2 with run action or throw action and there are hardly any presnap reads

It forces man to man and then Deshaun does his thing. Zone is just a slow death. ie. 96 and 97 yard drives against UNC

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Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 10, 2015, 8:26 AM

I think it could work next year if Gallman stays and Feaster arrives and/or another of our backups proves to be starter material.

It works so well for them because they have 2 legit threats at RB in Perine/Mixon. Teams have to know that you're willing to run it with all 3(qb included).

The last bit of the season our backup RBs haven't gotten many carries and haven't looked very good at times. That will likely change with Feaster/Choice/Dye arriving/getting healthy and Fuller having another off-season under his belt. The other issue is that you lose a blocker when running the triple option out of that set.

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"Clemson has been historically better than Carolina. That's pretty obvious." - Classof09

"No one knew we were overhyped until the season started." - Classof09


Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 10, 2015, 11:57 PM

Good point. I agree with you as I was thinking Coaches look at for 2016.

It looks like a fun formation for Clemson.

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Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 10, 2015, 8:27 AM

Only problem with a two back set is it takes one of your slots out of the game. We would then (to keep the spread scheme) have to abandon our TE play. With an athlete like Jordan, you just don't leave him on the bench. While it is good for misdirection and/or option plays, it makes the defense stack the box a little more which puts extra pressure on the run game and takes weapons out of the passing game. The way our team has recruited WR and the talent we have at the skill positions, it is in our best interest to keep working with WR-TE sets such as 5-0, 4-0 1 back, or 3-1 one back.



Non technical answer: With Watson in the backfield it is a two back set :)

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I like your funny words magic man


Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 11, 2015, 12:02 AM

True with DW4, but you could also set our TE off the line more and let him live across the middle.

I just think that 2 back set allows a team like Clemson to run to separate plays one moving left and the other moving right.

QB reads where to gain leverage and goes with it...
- Zone read left
- Zone read right
- QB run up middle
- QB pass wherever

How would a Defense not either be steps slower (i.e. freeze and wait) or overpursue and guess where the ball is?

With the smart decision making of DW4, he eats defenses alive.

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Brent was asked the difference last year during the


Dec 11, 2015, 12:48 AM

Season and said "OU had never seen a front seven as big and athletic as Clemsons".

I dont think he was being critical of OU because he talked about the coaches were like family. He was ask what was the difference in the game. Unless OU retooled the there offensive front with bigger more athletic guys I would put my faith in our defensive front seven. Our secondary has been the most improved part of the defense. Again, our defense will do what championship defenses do. Our offense keeps a fresh defense along with our depth on the d-line.

If either team turns the ball over 2+ times the other team will win. Both teams know how to put away an opponent after turnover and they both are built to run clock to win. Both Clemson and OU are better than the other two teams. Alabama has the best star talent and will be a tough out but the spread offenses don't allow defenses to substitute. I believe the winner of OU vs Clemson will win the national championship. This matchup will have swings and will be the best game by far.(bammer will kill msu)


If we turn the ball over like OU did last year it will be a long night. I hope we stay loose and have fun.

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We keep getting better & better everyday, in every way!
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Let’s Go Tigers!


Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 10, 2015, 8:30 AM

I like this formation against Clemson for a number of reasons. First it keeps your all everything end at home and playing honest against one of the first run read options - it keeps the middle linebacker close to the line to prevent against the QB running, it allows the WR to run off the CBs and opens up the middle of the field for the TE to drag across the middle (Which most Sooners fans will tell you was the Achilles heal of a BV defense). It means a safety will have to chase our TE across the field and in the first half with Green gone, it could open up the game. It also means that your other two LBs have to run with the backs coming out because both are pass catchers, and if your CB or safeties cheat to the RB pass option, well then Shepard is open. I would not be surprised to see this and variants of this formation a lot in the 1st half with Green gone.

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Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 10, 2015, 8:35 AM

Green isnt gone (1st half penalty).... You gave up a TE or slot receiver to put 2 in the backfield and there isnt a reciever on your team that we cant go man on. All of this means we will probably blitz at least one (or spy) and we will always have one safety back. Not a good combo for you...

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Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 10, 2015, 9:11 AM

> Green isnt gone (1st half penalty).... You gave up a
> TE or slot receiver to put 2 in the backfield and
> there isnt a reciever on your team that we cant go
> man on. All of this means we will probably blitz at
> least one (or spy) and we will always have one safety
> back. Not a good combo for you...

At the end of my post I did say Green was gone in the 1st half. In the formation Shepard & Westbrook are the receivers with Andrews at the TE, so we keep our three best receivers on the field, with Mixon, Perine and Mayfield.

If you blitz from the edge then you leave the backs as pass options in the flats and I would take my chance there 1:1 with your safeties in coverage, if you blitz up the middle then you leave at least one of the receivers in 1:1 coverage on Westbrook or Shepard and you free the middle for the TE dragging across, if you spy on Mayfield he can use his feet to move the spy and open up space for receivers. I am not sure but you guys might be under estimating Mayfield throwing ability and decision making, he has 35 TDs and only 5 ints this year. By comparison TK9 threw three ints in last years 40-6 debacle. I am not sure if BV has changed philosophically, but his aggressiveness and how he uses in LBs created problems for him in the B12 where true Air Raids dinked / dunked themselves to success.

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I wish you were as smart as your child...


Dec 10, 2015, 9:58 AM

Green's penalty was in the first half of the Unc game... Therefore, he will not miss any of the OU game.

You are used to seeing the weak big12 D vs your updated triple option attack. You are used to watching sub-par athletes try to run zone defenses (because they don't have the personnel to cover Shepard and Co with man). We do have the athletes to leave them on an island. That leaves 8 in the box to protect against your triple option and turns out job into simple assignment football. So anytime our D-line can beat your o-line your ply is over. I expect to see a lot of quick slants, screens and counters to make sure we are playing our assignments. Your theory of something is always open is flawed and it is all about Clemson doing their job. If your Wrs and TE can beat our DB's one on one that is what you will have to do, but I expect us to try to take away both RBs and pressure BM into quick reads.

For the record I like your WRs, just think they are the 3rd-4th best WR corps we have seen.

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Its just triple option from the shotgun


Dec 10, 2015, 8:31 AM

Not that smart, but could be effective.

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Re: Its just triple option from the shotgun


Dec 10, 2015, 10:03 AM

It's like Novocaine. Give it time and it always works.

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I like your funny words magic man


Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 10, 2015, 9:02 AM

UNC ran the 2 back set as well, don't think they did it against us a whole lot. I expect that the main advantage going for OU would be to spread us out. We are very strong in the box and when we are disciplined teams cant run on us. Shutdown GT and let Syracuse run all over us. Handled Cook for 3 quarters with the exception of a few plays after the long TD. I wouldn't worry too much about the defense. I also wouldn't worry too much about the offense because of Deshaun.

Any offense looks good when it is executing and has good players. Any offense can be stopped when a defense is executing and has good players. On an even playing field the most dynamic variable in being able to affect the outcome of the game is a QB. We have the better QB.

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That's where matchups are the biggest factor


Dec 10, 2015, 9:12 AM

what are the weakest parts of the defense vs the strengths of the offense.

Our defense struggles when the nickel or LB's have to cover in space. Can OU force into those matchups? We also occasionally bust in run fits and let a guy through for a big gain. That is OU's wheelhouse. Their rb's are gone if they get to the 2nd level.

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Our biggest difficulty will be actually tackling Mayfield


Dec 10, 2015, 9:09 AM

little dude is quick as a squirrel, and has good balance.

But the biggest key is their running game. They don't grind it out, they hit big plays with it. The passes are more 10 to 20 yards, rarely more. The rb's are home run hitters. Lots of strikeouts but about 1 of 10 carries is 40+ to the house.

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Re: Take a look at Ok U's 2 back shotgun set


Dec 11, 2015, 12:43 AM

They use that two back set to block as well to compensate for that sh*tty OL.

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