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All-TigerNet [12197]
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OT: this is why i have zero sympathy for teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 4:36 PM
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These teachers make almost 40,000 a year and are going to protest for 5,000 more. Another Teacher's Union in Chicago has been on strike for over a week. I get that you want more money.....but in America you are only worth what somebody is willing to pay you. If you don't like the pay find another job. What makes this whole thing real shi*** is that the kids are really the ones losing in this one.
I can guarantee you there are tons of people in this country who would kill right now for 40K a year salary
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Varsity [223]
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Plus they only work 9 months a year***
Sep 14, 2012, 4:43 PM
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110%er [8015]
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You're out of your mind.
Sep 14, 2012, 4:46 PM
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Teachers are constantly working to improve. Its a year round job. They attend meetings and conventions to learn new methods, and on their own dime.
Teaching is far from being a walk in the park job.
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Orange Blooded [3405]
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Re: You're out of your mind.
Sep 14, 2012, 4:58 PM
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LMAO!!!!!!! I know MANY teachers and they are all going on several vacations during the summer months each year. No teacher I know attend conventions on their own dime. I'm an architect and my firm does a lot of work in public schools and I can't count how many times I was at the schools until 5 or 6 at night and the parking lot was empty at 3:30.
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110%er [8015]
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Like I said...fine line between being good and great.
Sep 14, 2012, 5:00 PM
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And giving anything less than great to a student is a robbery of their education.
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Orange Blooded [3405]
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Re: Like I said...fine line between being good and great.
Sep 14, 2012, 6:16 PM
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This is why I have no sympathy for teachers. At the end of this post is a link to the salary of every person employed at my local High School. The first page is administrators, but the last person on the second page is the first teacher. She teaches GYM and makes 108,000 a year!!! We have 26 teachers that are making over 90,000 a year, and 52 making over 80,000 a year. On top of the high salaries for working 9-10 months a year they have "Cadillac" health plans where they don't have to pay anything for them or their families. On top of that they can retire at 55 years old (a decade before most private workers). If they do make it to 65 and worked 40 years their pension is 72% of their average salary from their last 3 years of employment.
So lets use the said gym teacher who is making 108k after working for 29 years. If she stays another 10 years and gets an average 4% a year raise in that time frame she will be making about 150k a year. Her average for her last 3 years would be about 140k. That means her retirement pay will be 100k a year for the rest of her life PLUS the occasional cost of living increase that is applied to pensions every few years.
This is why I have no sympathy for the profession. I don't know about all the other states, but in NJ the teacher's salaries are out of control and have driven the property takes through the roof. The average property tax in the state (2010) was $7500 a year. I'm sick of teachers being able to hold tax payers hostage by using children as collateral. The teachers aren't striking to make the situation better for kids, they are striking to make the situation better for themselves!
http://php.app.com/edstaff/results2.php?pageNum_Recordset1=0&totalRows_Recordset1=300&county=HUNTERDON&district=HUNTERDON+CENTRAL+REGIONAL&school=%25&lname=&fname=&job1=%25&tfm_order=DESC&tfm_orderby=SALARY
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Orange Blooded [3706]
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I guess all the teachers in SC should move to NJ. The
Sep 14, 2012, 8:28 PM
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teachers here don't have any of the things you listed. Both of my kids are teachers trying to support their family's on way less than $40K/year, with SC State heath insurance (junk), paying for their own printer ink (and other supplies), working at "extra" duties without pay, and giving up time with their own families to do school work.
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Legend [16121]
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My mother taught honors Geometry and she worked 12+
Sep 14, 2012, 5:14 PM
[ in reply to Re: You're out of your mind. ] |
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hours a day during the school year and took classes in the summer on her own dime...You obviously never went to her school...
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Hall of Famer [20945]
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Re: My mother taught honors Geometry and she worked 12+
Sep 14, 2012, 5:38 PM
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And yet, she never protested. As said above, the difference between good and great.
Bet the protesters are the ones who go on vacations and leave at 3:30 on the dot...just a guess though.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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While I was coaching and teaching I was working 60 to 70 hrs
Sep 14, 2012, 7:33 PM
[ in reply to My mother taught honors Geometry and she worked 12+ ] |
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I would leave that house at 6 and get back at 6 on non game days and I would get back at around 11 on game days. I would spend my weekends grading papers just to try and keep up. I was probably losing money as a coach because of the gas it took me to get to and from games. Let's do a little math here. I was an English teacher and taught 6 separate classes with an average of 20 students per class. Lets say 90 of the 120 kids turn in a paper I assigned, and I spend 5 minutes per paper grading and making comments. That's an extra 7.5 hours of work, essentially another full work day. Now, my department requires at least one writing assignment per week in hopes to improve scores on the writing standardized test. Now, that's not the only thing I have to grade, so let's put grading at 10 hours a week. So essentially, I'm working 6 days a week. That really starts eating into that supposed 3 months (it's really about 2) I had off in the summer.
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Legend [16121]
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Exactly...***
Sep 14, 2012, 8:59 PM
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: While I was coaching and teaching I was working 60 to 70 hrs
Sep 14, 2012, 11:06 PM
[ in reply to While I was coaching and teaching I was working 60 to 70 hrs ] |
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Couple of things Drew.
1. You didn't have to coach
2. You received a stipend for gas and other costs (i know very well what coaches get and do not get). They lose money because they end up spending money on their equipment and getting their kids better training equipment.....don't try and pull the gas card though
3. It doesn't take 8 hours to grade papers. You know and i know that red ink pen goes quickly through those MILLIONS OF PAPERS your working so hard on
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Legend [16121]
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Wow! Put down the shovel...***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:12 PM
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Fan [70]
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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This is a little late but I thought I would respond
Sep 17, 2012, 12:26 AM
[ in reply to Re: While I was coaching and teaching I was working 60 to 70 hrs ] |
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1. I had to coach, otherwise someone who did coach would have taken the job.
2. I did not receive a gas stipend for personal travel. I did not live in the town I coached in, so I drove my own vehicle to and from games. This allowed me to travel from the game directly home, instead of riding in a bus for an hour going in the wrong direction.
3. You really have no idea. If you actually care, you provide your students feedback on their writing assignments so they can actually improve, instead of just turning in the same crap over and over again. Granted, most of them threw the paper away without reading my comments.
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Orange Blooded [2663]
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Hey, feel free to try to live in Chicago on 40k a year
Sep 14, 2012, 8:48 PM
[ in reply to Re: You're out of your mind. ] |
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and tell us how exciting it is to do it teaching kids who go through a metal detector on their way into the building. Having lived in a large city before, my guess would be a one-room apartment in Chicago probably averages 1,000 a month, in a not-great part of town. In New Orleans, one bedroom on St. Charles would easily run 1,500 a month, and the cost of living in Chicago is probably twice what it is in NO. So your 40k dreamjob BEFORE TAXES has 20k eaten out of it for rent. Heck, even in South Carolina, 40k a year isn't exactly high cotton, and we have a standard of living equivalent to Ecuador.
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110%er [6937]
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Re: Hey, I would not live in Chicago or New Orleans if you
Sep 14, 2012, 9:05 PM
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paid five times that.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Orange Blooded [2609]
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Rock Defender [53]
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As a contractor, architects have a lot to improve on as well
Sep 14, 2012, 9:56 PM
[ in reply to Re: You're out of your mind. ] |
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All I get on my desk is #### drawings. Tweet that!
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CU Medallion [51528]
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I don't know what school you're looking at. Teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 10:11 PM
[ in reply to Re: You're out of your mind. ] |
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I know work till 5.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: I don't know what school you're looking at. Teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 11:08 PM
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Most of the schools i work with are done at 330 as well unless your a coach then practice begins. Other than that those teachers are the first ones out of the parking lot
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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WRONG! Majority of the teachers at both of my schools work
Sep 14, 2012, 11:27 PM
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Until 5:00 on most days. Don't forget the hours they put in on weekends. Someone isn't very bright...lots of assumptions on this board. You know what they say happens when you assume...
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Starter [355]
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IF the parking lots were empty by 3:30, it's because they
Sep 15, 2012, 10:44 AM
[ in reply to Re: You're out of your mind. ] |
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chose to take the work home with them. I taught for 40 years and very few, if any, teachers can get the job done anywhere near 3:30!
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110%er [6937]
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Re: They should be fired. If they don't like the job: then
Sep 14, 2012, 7:17 PM
[ in reply to You're out of your mind. ] |
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quit.
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110%er [8015]
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No, they should get what they need.
Sep 14, 2012, 9:18 PM
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Its incredibly hard to live on 40k, especially while still paying back student loans. Most teachers have to take on a second job. My high school basketball coach was a P.E. teacher, a coach, and he worked as a server at a Carolina Wings. Its incredibly demanding, and most teachers don't get the resources they need as it is.
I'm gonna go ahead and take a guess that you have NO idea what it takes to be a teacher.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: No, they should get what they need.
Sep 14, 2012, 11:10 PM
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Cry me a freakin river 6317.....TONS OF GRADUATES IN ALL FIELDS ARE PAYING BACK STUDENT LOANS. This is the attitude that everyone hates. Give it a rest and suck it up like every other employee in this country.
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110%er [8015]
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Well, that wasn't exactly the point.
Sep 14, 2012, 11:22 PM
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That was just another thing piling on.
I'm glad you completely ignored everything else, though.
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Legend [16121]
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He didn't ignore it...He couldn't comprehend it...***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:23 PM
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: He didn't ignore it...He couldn't comprehend it...***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:50 PM
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Did you go to a 2 month workshop on that? LMFAOO
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110%er [8015]
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I'm still hearing crickets.***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:51 PM
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Legend [16121]
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Those aren't crickets...That's a mouse running on a wheel
Sep 15, 2012, 12:09 AM
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inside his head...
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Legend [16121]
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All-TigerNet [11435]
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Legend [16121]
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Doesn't fit their agenda...***
Sep 14, 2012, 8:59 PM
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CU Medallion [51528]
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110%er [8015]
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40,000 is nothing for what they do.***
Sep 14, 2012, 4:42 PM
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: 40,000 is nothing for what they do.***
Sep 14, 2012, 4:48 PM
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40,000 for working 9 months a year is more than fair compensation. And no they do not go to conventions and work a full year. I am friends with elementary all the way up to high school teachers. They pretty much do what they want for those three year.
I can tell your a teacher.
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110%er [8015]
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Re: 40,000 is nothing for what they do.***
Sep 14, 2012, 4:51 PM
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The great ones are always working to improve themselves. Obviously, your friends haven't dedicated themselves to their profession.
There's a fine line between being a "good" teacher and a "great" teacher. If you're not working to improve yourself, you're robbing your students of the best education they could get.
I'm not a teacher, but I was studying to become one. I changed majors after realizing what a difficult job it is for pretty bad pay.
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Legend [16121]
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yeah, sounds like he's friends with some pretty crappy
Sep 14, 2012, 4:54 PM
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teachers...
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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My mixed feelings as an ex-teacher....
Sep 14, 2012, 7:35 PM
[ in reply to Re: 40,000 is nothing for what they do.*** ] |
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...here in Hampton District 2, one of the worst in the state and a district that received an F in *every* category that was reviewed by the state a few weeks ago. If you can get good students, it's an enjoyable experience, but if you get the opposite, as I did, it's a nightmare.
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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I'm in the same boat gleaner63. I work in 2 title I schools
Sep 14, 2012, 11:38 PM
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And the kids are a nightmare. One school is located in a rough part of town and the kids have no discipline at all! There are teachers that deal with students who spit in their faces (true story) and back talk everyday. Many teachers are defeated. Maybe if they were paid a little more, they'd give a little more. I guarantee...if palmettoson and others had to work in my school fr one day, they would say teachers deserve double their salary. It's not the 1950's anymore. We are dealing with kids that do not respect authority, steal, curse, fight, lie, and in my experience, don't speak English. It is not a cake job by any means.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: I'm in the same boat gleaner63. I work in 2 title I schools
Sep 14, 2012, 11:53 PM
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Coleman,
1. I work with "at risk" kids every day
2. I am a teacher.....just outside a class room setting
I know exactly what you are dealing with. It does not mean you do not do your job. Bitching and moaning about something YOU KNEW when you chose your career path is insane.
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110%er [8015]
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You clearly don't have ANY inkling of an idea.***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:55 PM
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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Legend [16121]
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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If you must know, a school librarian. Wouldn't be a teacher.
Sep 15, 2012, 11:21 AM
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They don't get paid enough to deal with the #### they deal with.
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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Legend [16121]
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: I can tell you NEED a teacher...And apparently make less
Sep 14, 2012, 4:58 PM
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Never said it was "Kingly Sum". I do not make over 40,000 a year. I am not the one who took the job and then cried about it on a freaking highway and beat down a door during a meeting.
The average income of the City i live in is 63,000. You mean to tell me 40,000 isn't enough for you wack jobs.
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Legend [16121]
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I'm not a teacher...just found it hilarious that you said
Sep 14, 2012, 5:08 PM
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"I can tell your a teacher"...
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: I'm not a teacher...just found it hilarious that you said
Sep 14, 2012, 5:15 PM
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Well then your related to someone who is. I find it hilarious that your trying to toe around that.
I'm done. Time to move onto football babbbbyyy!!!
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Legend [16121]
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Yes, I am related to and or know many award-winning teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 5:24 PM
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that is why I find it hilarious that you can't use you're and your properly...Maybe your(notice correct usage) earning power would be higher if you paid more attention to your teachers instead of complaining about them...
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All-In [40875]
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110%er [8015]
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If all teachers did that, there wouldn't be any teachers,
Sep 14, 2012, 4:56 PM
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would there?
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All-In [40875]
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No, we would have to pay them what they are worth
Sep 14, 2012, 5:01 PM
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if teachers made 100k a year there would be a lot more competition. If you don't like your pay then quit and find a job that suits you better.
What is so amazing is all of the teachers that had no clue what teachers pay would be when the got out of school.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: If all teachers did that, there wouldn't be any teachers,
Sep 14, 2012, 5:01 PM
[ in reply to If all teachers did that, there wouldn't be any teachers, ] |
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That is where you are wrong. Right now we have more teachers than job openings.
And to add onto my point. It looks like these two particular areas don't have any WORKING TEACHERS. That in my opinion is the biggest load of ****. Don't take it out on the kids
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110%er [6937]
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CU Guru [1395]
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All-TigerNet [11435]
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Re: 40,000 is nothing for what they do.***
Sep 14, 2012, 8:23 PM
[ in reply to 40,000 is nothing for what they do.*** ] |
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Exacly, the lowest paid are Police, Fireman and teachers and are the most important. Shows where priorities lie in this country
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: 40,000 is nothing for what they do.***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:16 PM
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BULL. Police and Fire are very well paid these days. I work with both and they make a very good living (not from the start but once you get in and rank goes up you are good to go)
Teachers are paid what they are worth. There is only so much money to go around.
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Legend [15730]
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Where did your $40,000/year number come from? ******
Sep 14, 2012, 4:47 PM
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Where did your $40,000/year number come from? ******
Sep 14, 2012, 4:49 PM
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If you look in the video....the lady holding up the poster in the protest.
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All-Conference [421]
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You have it wrong sir
Sep 14, 2012, 4:52 PM
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You have it wrong buddy. In America we have the right to march and protest for better pay. If you look at the history of America, it has happened in every field. They have a right to protest for better conditions and pay.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: You have it wrong sir
Sep 14, 2012, 4:54 PM
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In America you are worth what somebody is willing to pay for your services. In this particular county they are only offering 40,000 a year
Having that job is not a right. If so the school board also has the right to fire every single one of those jackassessssss who can't seem to control themselves in a professional environment. I can tell you one thing.....these nut jobs wouldn't be teaching my kids
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Scout Team [156]
TigerPulse: 88%
Posts: 450
Joined: 12/27/99
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Re: You have it wrong sir
Sep 14, 2012, 4:55 PM
[ in reply to You have it wrong sir ] |
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I have no problem with the right to strike for better pay and working conditions as long as it is tied to an employer right to terminate those strike.
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Orange Blooded [3405]
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Re: You have it wrong sir
Sep 14, 2012, 6:26 PM
[ in reply to You have it wrong sir ] |
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The employer also has a right to fire your ### for doing so...oh wait that's just private non-unionized jobs. If I protested outside of my architecture firm they would fire me on the spot.
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CU Medallion [51528]
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But these teachers who are "marching" are forgetting
Sep 14, 2012, 10:25 PM
[ in reply to You have it wrong sir ] |
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one thing...
the kids.
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Rock Defender [53]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
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In Chicago teachers average $76k plus great
Sep 15, 2012, 12:04 AM
[ in reply to You have it wrong sir ] |
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benefits and they only work 8 months a year. People forget they get 4 weeks off plus a bunch of other holidays during the school year.
Unions ruined this country.
States without unions are doing great and people have great paying jobs. Ask someone at Union Camp, BMW, Boeing, etc. etc. if we need unions in SC.
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Legend [18069]
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What amazes me is the people that make
Sep 14, 2012, 4:54 PM
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assumptions like you do about teaching. My wife is a special needs teacher and her job is more demanding in a single day than most jobs are for an entire year.
"If you don't like the pay"...
I guess we'd have no one to teach our kids then, would we?
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Rock Defender [53]
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Right now they DONT have anyone to teach their kids***
Sep 14, 2012, 5:01 PM
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: What amazes me is the people that make
Sep 14, 2012, 5:05 PM
[ in reply to What amazes me is the people that make ] |
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Here is the thing Joe. Take your personal opinion out of it. I get that your wife is a teacher and she works very hard at her job.
Heres the deal....EVERYONE WORKS HARD AT THEIR JOBS. In this instance teachers work hard 9 months out of the year. It doesn't give you the right to act like a complete a**. I can guarantee you that if the guys working the line at BMW decided they wanted to complete this type of action......EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM IS LOOKING FOR ANOTHER JOB TOMORROW. This holier than thou attitude is getting annoying
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Head Coach [757]
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In every BMW factory in the word lwith the exception of SC
Sep 14, 2012, 5:11 PM
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Workers are in unions and can strike if they need to....
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: In every BMW factory in the word lwith the exception of SC
Sep 14, 2012, 5:13 PM
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Well that is the only BMW factory i know of.....and right now I can tell you a lot of those guys over there aren't treated like royalty. They simply do their job or they find another place of employment.
It is that simple.
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Legend [16121]
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I think the problem appears to be the lack of knowledge you
Sep 14, 2012, 5:19 PM
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possess about teachers and BMW as a whole...Quit trying to tie everything to your small scope of personal experience...You know crappy teachers, therefore ALL teachers must be crappy...Your knowledge of BMW factories is based off of 1 factory...yet you make blanket statements about those too...
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: I think the problem appears to be the lack of knowledge you
Sep 14, 2012, 5:22 PM
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Not at all.
I am simply providing two instances where
1. Teachers who serve the public are acting like complete idiots
2. Get fairly compensated
3. Have a chance to find another job. They are no slave to this school district
4. Holding the kids hostage
Nice job at your blanket statement above by the way.
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Legend [16121]
TigerPulse: 90%
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What blanket statement did I make?***
Sep 14, 2012, 5:28 PM
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Legend [18069]
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Teaching children is slightly more important to society
Sep 14, 2012, 5:24 PM
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those guys who work at that plant pay the taxes that pay for your wifes salary, and school, and equipment, and on and on and on and on.
Once again take your personal opinion out of this and just look at the articles. Google Chicago teacher strike. Its a joke Joe and you know it.
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Legend [18069]
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Joined: 7/7/03
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If you want to live in a world without teachers..be my guest***
Sep 14, 2012, 5:27 PM
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Legend [16121]
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Posts: 26428
Joined: 11/18/03
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Fan [70]
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Posts: 143
Joined: 8/22/11
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Re: Teaching children is slightly more important to society
Sep 14, 2012, 11:42 PM
[ in reply to Re: Teaching children is slightly more important to society ] |
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Palmetto. you are a complete idiot or drunk one. Reading everyone of your posts seems like you are talking out of your a**
then you say "enough of this, lets get to football"
You are the biggest idiot i have ever seen on tigernet.
nm
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Teaching children is slightly more important to society
Sep 14, 2012, 11:58 PM
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Well then don't read the post. Its pretty easy. Go back to your day as i am obviously getting underneath your skin.
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Orange Blooded [3405]
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Re: Teaching children is slightly more important to society
Sep 14, 2012, 6:53 PM
[ in reply to Teaching children is slightly more important to society ] |
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Importance of the job has little bearing on salary. Salary comes from possessing a skill set that few other have to offer to make one unique and offer something to the employer that few others can. There is a plethora of average and poor teachers, and some good/great teachers. Obviously, like in any profession, most will fall in the average category. I don't see the issue in giving good/great teachers incentives to continue what they are doing to make sure they are being well compensated for the job. However, the unions (and those striking for the union) don't want to be evaluated or judged at how well they do their job. They want everybody, bad, average, good, and great to all get the same compensation. They also want unlimited job security. This is what largely pisses people off.
Why should average teachers get life time job security? In my field average is good way to be shown the door. Why should a teacher who is doing an average job be employed instead of giving an up and coming teacher a chance?
I think if teachers were treated like any other profession and not as a mass collective (that they have worked so hard to achieve in appearance), you would see less anger and resentment. A lot of teachers or teacher supporters say they don't like it when people generalize them, when it's the teachers unionizing and wanted to be seen as one that created the image.
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1st Rounder [602]
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BMW employees make more than teachers, if they have been
Sep 14, 2012, 5:30 PM
[ in reply to Re: What amazes me is the people that make ] |
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there for sometime, and work over time, holidays, etc...
They also don't have student loans to pay back.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: BMW employees make more than teachers, if they have been
Sep 14, 2012, 11:19 PM
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Quit bringing student loans into this. ### does that have to do with anything. How do you know that
1. All teachers have student loans
2. All non teachers do not have student loans
ITS FREAKING IRRELEVANT TO THE ARGUMENT.
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Legend [16121]
TigerPulse: 90%
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Why are you still arguing?***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:22 PM
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1st Rounder [602]
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Joined: 9/1/08
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It is very relevant idiot.
Sep 14, 2012, 11:46 PM
[ in reply to Re: BMW employees make more than teachers, if they have been ] |
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Teaching requires at least 4 years of training before you can even get hired. Training that you have to pay for.
Do you have to have 4 years to work at BMW, and make 15-25 an hour???
Crickets!!!
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: It is very relevant idiot.
Sep 15, 2012, 12:04 AM
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I don't know how you cannot understand this.
1. Tons of professions require degrees and training that are paid for by employees. What makes you so special in that you can use this as an excuse to raise your salary
2. What makes you think nobody else has student loans to pay for.
Dry your eyes, stop crying like a *****....if you don't like reading about the articles included in this post hit the ignore button.
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CU Medallion [51528]
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All-TigerNet [12197]
TigerPulse: 72%
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Re: Did you just compare teaching to working on an
Sep 14, 2012, 11:21 PM
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I compared one employee to another
One is completing the job they were hired for without bitching and moaning
The other is crying like a bunch of losers who knew full well what they were hired to do and what type of salary they would be looking at
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Legend [16121]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 26428
Joined: 11/18/03
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Wow...If you believe that, you know less about factories
Sep 14, 2012, 11:33 PM
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than you do teachers...
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All-TigerNet [12197]
TigerPulse: 72%
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Joined: 2/13/05
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Re: Wow...If you believe that, you know less about factories
Sep 15, 2012, 12:06 AM
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I do know this....if what happened in the video above happened at the BMW plant down the road then BMW would be accepting applications the following day.
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Legend [16121]
TigerPulse: 90%
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Joined: 11/18/03
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While that might be the case, that hardly excuses your ill-
Sep 15, 2012, 12:13 AM
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informed opinion on all teachers and their workload...
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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Joined: 12/22/03
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This is my second year working in a school with special
Sep 14, 2012, 11:52 PM
[ in reply to What amazes me is the people that make ] |
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Needs students and let me tell you, special Ed teachers deserve a raise! That is probably the most srtressful job a person can have. God bless her!
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Rock Defender [53]
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Joined: 11/30/98
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Tough titty said the kitty. She knew what teachers were paid
Sep 15, 2012, 12:05 AM
[ in reply to What amazes me is the people that make ] |
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and still chose to be one. so shut up!! It's a bogus argument!! Want more money? Go do something else.
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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Joined: 12/22/03
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Like talking to a five year old lol!***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:27 AM
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Legend [17449]
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Joined: 7/1/03
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My wife is a teacher...
Sep 14, 2012, 4:56 PM
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There are 3 or 4 teachers at her school that I can name off of the top of my head that should have been fired long ago. There are a bunch she works with that deserve raises. It would be nice if their pay was based on merit instead of seniority and other BS. It would also be nice if a teacher could actually be fired when warranted. I hear stories at least once per week that totally define how idiotic the whole system is. For instance, they make my wife pay $50 to have a lamp in her room. I did the math. It would cost literally less than $3 to burn continuously for 9 months. However, every time I go into the school, the #### thermostat must be set on 68 degrees F. Get a freakin' clue! The whole system is shortsighted and assbackwards. I'm seriously considering homeschooling or private school for my kids (if we ever have any).
GO TIGERS!!!!!
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Orange Blooded [3405]
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Joined: 1/26/09
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Re: OT: this is why i have zero sympathy for teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 5:00 PM
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The teachers in Chicago average 75,000 a year in salary (not including the ridiculous health, benefits, and pension plans), and one of the reasons they were protesting was because the 4% raise each year is not enough when the average raise in the country is 1.6%
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: OT: this is why i have zero sympathy for teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 5:11 PM
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Yep....all the while they are protesting their raises....new school funding and renovation projects are getting cut out.
I have a job where i work with kids everyday. I love my job. I knew coming out of college I was never going to be rich or live in the trendy neighborhoods. I work with a lot of at risk kids who truly need help. I am not mad at my employer or the community for my career decision.
I KNEW IT THEN AND I KNOW IT NOW. I am never going to make a big salary. I live ok...and i am not hurting by any means. Just suck it up already and do your freaking jobs
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Legend [18069]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 15511
Joined: 7/7/03
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You live in Greenville, SC. Have you ever compared cost of
Sep 14, 2012, 5:23 PM
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living in Greenville vs. Chicago?
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: You live in Greenville, SC. Have you ever compared cost of
Sep 14, 2012, 5:25 PM
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Joe,
You don't want to go there. Chicago teachers make over 70,000. The school district in Florida is very similar to ours in the upstate.
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Connoisseur [357]
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Joined: 6/20/08
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I saw on MSNBC that they were making over $70k/year...
Sep 14, 2012, 5:01 PM
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$40k/year doesn't seem to be enough to live in a city like Chicago. I also heard that a lot of the schools in Chicago don't have proper air conditioning units and that they have crowded classrooms of 40+ students with no A/C. Hell, I'd be striking too! However, this seems to be a case where both the city and teachers are at fault.
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CU Medallion [58376]
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Posts: 46314
Joined: 4/23/00
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Connoisseur [357]
TigerPulse: 75%
Posts: 584
Joined: 6/20/08
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Yep, I guess that's what MSNBC was referring too.
Sep 14, 2012, 5:14 PM
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nm
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Rock Defender [53]
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Joined: 11/30/98
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Re: OT: this is why i have zero sympathy for teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 5:12 PM
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geez - give them more money if they only make 40k. I'd starve on 40k a year. JK - but that's chicken feed.
Even if you prorate the 40k/9-mon, it's only 53.33k/12-mon. I guess that sounds a little better, but they need to make at least 60k/12-mon, so that's 45k/9-mon.
Hey - that's (5k raise) what they're asking. Someone has been doing their homework I guess. Wow - this is too easy. Pay 'em the 5k and let's move on to the next problem.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Joined: 2/13/05
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Re: OT: this is why i have zero sympathy for teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 5:19 PM
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Streaking,
Here is the problem on that.
1. Where is the money going to come from
2. What makes those guys worth 60,000 a year. What are you basing that off of. I am with the other guy on the board. The best teachers should be paid the most. Who are you to say they are worth that. Your not paying them. Port St. Lucie decided that is what they are worth. Take it or leave it if you do not like it.
3. If Port St. Lucie wants to add to all of those salaries then they shouldn't be mad when taxes go up.....riggggggght? wrong.....you know it and i know it....people want more but want to pay less
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Legend [15212]
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Posts: 18245
Joined: 6/10/09
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How do you determine a good teacher? It's purely based off
Sep 14, 2012, 5:59 PM
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the parents of the students 90% of the time. There's no way in determining that except for the principal watching you teach, and that sounds like a terrible idea.
I would certainly discourage my kids from becoming teachers. Terrible system.
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Starter [380]
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Joined: 2/2/01
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Re: You have it wrong sir
Sep 14, 2012, 5:16 PM
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Yes, they have a right to negotiate and strike if they see fit. their employer should also have the right to terminate any of them as he sees fit. that is the risk of a strike, and it should apply to all, especially public sector jobs. they serve the public welfare first.
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Walk-On [143]
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Joined: 4/27/11
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Thank you
Sep 14, 2012, 5:23 PM
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Finally someone who understands economics.
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CU Medallion [51528]
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Joined: 8/10/04
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Why don't you explain it to us.***
Sep 14, 2012, 10:17 PM
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All-TigerNet [12536]
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Posts: 12246
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I know someonewho teaches in Atlanta. In the last five years
Sep 14, 2012, 5:23 PM
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they have
1. not had one raise
2. had another class added to their daily schedule making it six classes instead of five, during a seven period day.
3. had the limit of students per class raised from 28 to 34. They said that changed it from teaching to crowd control.
4. They have 179 students that they have to teach, grade their papers, grade essays, answer emails and call parents.
5. They have to be at work at 7:45 and the earliest they are allowed to leave is 4:00. A 4 pm exit never happens because they have tons of work to do that they can't do during the day because they are engaged with the students. They have to cram about four hours worth of paperwork into after school work and one planning period. On top of that, the county office usually schedules about three department meetings a week which eats up their planning and the school has about four faculty meetings a month, eating up after school time. In addition, they are expected to assist any student that shows up after school and have plans in the office for after school extra test prep. This means all the work they have to do then goes home with them. They are also expected to manage the students in at least one extra-curricular activity. He stays until 8 pm once a week in the fall working with Model United Nations. In the Spring it is Mock Trial. He has to wait until every last child has been picked up before he can leave. One night, after waiting 45 minutes for one last chil's parents after the others had come, he gotspecial permission from the school police officer to drive her home. When he took her to the door, he family was all comfy-cozy on the couches and floor watching TV.
6. They are observed officially three times a year, but the administration of the school and the county does walk-throughs with computer write-ups at least five times a month. He said he can not be sitting down ever when they come by to observel even though he should be meeting with students about grades etc.
7. There is a 25-minute lunch and no other break. THey are on duty from the time they get there with morning duty through the afternoon duty. Imagine if you were at your job and you had tons of work to do, but they gave you no time to do it.
8. He is expected to check his emails when he first arrives, before he goes on dutey, so arrive early. He is also expected to check them during his 25-minute lunch and then at the end of the day. He gets many emails from the shcool administration throughout the day as well as the county office. Oh and the 179 students on his rosters email as well as their parents. He says he answers about 60 emails in the morning, 20 at lunch and about 25 more at the end of the day.
9. Did I mention creating lesson plans? He says he has to do that on Sunday.
10. They have three months off is a myth. They have two months off for which they don't get paid. They may have the county spread their pay over 12 months instead of 10, but they don't get paid for 12 months. They have had five furlough days a year for the last four years.
11. Oh, and he asked if I had to go through a metal detector to enter my job. He does every time he enters or exits the building.
12. He contributes to every school fundraiser and buys every candy bar or ribbon that a school group is selling. Only to drive home and hear peoople on the radio that have never spent one working day inside a public school classroom bashinng him and his co-workers.
13. Oh, and his website must be updated daily.
14. Their test scores better be good, no matter how bad student absenteism is, or what kind of drama they come from. The curriculum must be covered on a scope and sequence that becomes nearly impossible when the county throws in demands for Social Science Fair participation that eats up day they he doesn't have.
15. Grading papers happens at home, at night.
God Bless the Chicago school teachers and good luck to them! Please think things out before you make some judgement without all the facts. If they stay out much longer, the public might see that they value them much more than they thought. They have only been on strike four days and the weeping crying from parents is loud.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Posts: 20769
Joined: 2/13/05
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Re: I know someonewho teaches in Atlanta. In the last five years
Sep 14, 2012, 5:28 PM
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Guess what Clemson81to85
EVERYONE IS DEALING WITH THOSE SAME PROBLEMS. More work and less pay in an economy that absolutely sucks right now. Your buddy just now figuring that out.
God bless him. He is blessed to have a job that pays him that well and a roof over his head. God has blessed him very well.
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1st Rounder [602]
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Posts: 1558
Joined: 9/1/08
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All-TigerNet [12536]
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Posts: 12246
Joined: 11/21/11
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Yes, and I forgot to mention after school parent
Sep 14, 2012, 6:37 PM
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meetings. There are usually about eight of those a month. These are not quick meetings. They are in the guidance office with all the other teachers for that student or in the IEP settings. These meetings mean anything that was going to get done that day either goes home with him or backs up to another day.
Please excuse all of my typos as I was just trying to throw down everything that I had heard him talk about before they left my mind.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: You are spot on. You left
Sep 14, 2012, 11:25 PM
[ in reply to You are spot on. You left ] |
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As of right now i do have a clue based on what we are seeing in the news
According to these 2 incidents teaching includes
1. Crying about your self worth
2. Leaving kids behind
3. Acting like ######### in a public forum
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Legend [15212]
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Joined: 6/10/09
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Yeah that's the problem. The demands are unrealistic and
Sep 14, 2012, 5:41 PM
[ in reply to I know someonewho teaches in Atlanta. In the last five years ] |
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if you have a teacher who is a "rule follower" and wants to do things right, then they'll burn out and quit.
The only way to survive is to do every thing halfass and not give a crap. The ones who figure out that they can't get fired, pretty much, are the ones who will make a long career of it.
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CU Medallion [51528]
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Where do you figure teachers can't/don't get fired?
Sep 14, 2012, 10:24 PM
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Teachers in South Carolina get fired all the time. For example: principals review student's test scores and if there is a pattern of low scores from a particular teacher, they're fired. Teachers are also fired for insubordination, and any other reason people are fired in other professions. There is no such thing as "tenure" in SC, which keep teachers from being fired elsewhere. There are also no unions in SC, who provide cushions preventing firing of teachers.
Seriously, if you don't know what you're talking about don't say it.
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CU Medallion [51528]
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: "But they only really work 9 months a year!"
Sep 14, 2012, 11:26 PM
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Here is me keeping my mouth shut.
TEACHERS WORK 9 MONTHS A YEAR. Deal. With. It. Stop. Crying
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110%er [8015]
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You know the old saying about being quiet
Sep 14, 2012, 11:48 PM
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instead of opening your mouth and proving what an idiot you are?
You should take that advice.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: You know the old saying about being quiet
Sep 15, 2012, 12:09 AM
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You know the old saying about not crying like a ***** once your profession gets called out
You should take that advice
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Legend [16121]
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Apparently you haven't heard his saying...***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:15 AM
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110%er [8015]
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Legend [15212]
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I think teacher's get paid about right, but people higher up
Sep 14, 2012, 5:37 PM
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in education are bunch of freaking morons and have no idea how to lead... for the most part. Exceptions are everywhere.
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Legend [15212]
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*teachers-- i need a teacher for my grammar.
***
Sep 14, 2012, 5:37 PM
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Varsity [229]
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Voice of Reason
Sep 14, 2012, 5:40 PM
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I think it is hard to make such a sweeping generalization on whether being a teacher is "easy" or "hard."
I imagine that would depend on the person, the subject, the age of the kids, the school, and the area, and probably many more variables.
It does seem pretty clear that teachers dont make much money comparably to other "professions", but on the other hand they do work 185 days a year and have about the most secure job you can get.
Is that worth it? Not to me. That is why I am not one. But I would much rather be a teacher than work any job for minimum wage. Those are usually the most terrible, those are the people who should be striking. $7.25/hr x 40 hours x 50 weeks = $14,500 per year. Holy shsitballs that is terrible. Even if you worked everyday of the year, 8 hours a day, thats only $21,170. Teaching looks pretty nice from that perspective.
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Legend [16121]
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How many Min. wagers have a college degree? How many
Sep 14, 2012, 6:11 PM
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have student loans? Hardly apples to apples...
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CU Guru [1250]
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A lot of programs out there so that teachers don't have to
Sep 14, 2012, 9:45 PM
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pay those loans back.
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CU Medallion [51528]
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Those programs also don't take hold until a teacher
Sep 14, 2012, 10:21 PM
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has been working for 5+ years.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Those programs also don't take hold until a teacher
Sep 15, 2012, 12:11 AM
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Most loans are not paid off in 5 years. Those programs also start a whole lot earlier than 5 years. Think your trying to booster your argument with a bogus line
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Legend [16121]
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You used it once correctly in that sentence...But which
Sep 15, 2012, 12:17 AM
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time?
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: How many Min. wagers have a college degree? How many
Sep 14, 2012, 11:29 PM
[ in reply to How many Min. wagers have a college degree? How many ] |
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There it is again. Student loans....student loans..student loans.
Anybody else out on the board tonight that had to pay back student loans? I know i did...and still do pay on my student loans. I know my brother did...and still does pay on his loans
Both of us.....not teachers. SHOCKING for you i guess
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Legend [16121]
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How does that invalidate the question "How many Min Wagers
Sep 14, 2012, 11:37 PM
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have student loans?"
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CU Medallion [51528]
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Teachers work more than 185 days a year. HTH.***
Sep 14, 2012, 10:20 PM
[ in reply to Voice of Reason ] |
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All-Conference [414]
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Re: I know someonewho teaches in Atlanta. In the last five years
Sep 14, 2012, 5:41 PM
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I am a teacher and verify your post
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Orange Blooded [2760]
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Couple of wrong comments
Sep 14, 2012, 5:55 PM
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First, the teachers in Chicago are the highest paid in the country (on average) and have some of the worse student academic achievements. Also, the pensions the main problem, along with the benefit package. As a matter of personal opinion, I think more public sector employees should be paid more but NO pensions should ever be given (no tenure either) and benefits should reflect the market.
The pay is based on revenue, mostly property taxes, in Chicago and most areas of the country. Chicago's property taxes are some of the highest in the country and their teacher's average pay is $78,000. So, why should a person who is making $50,000 a year have to pay more taxes to increase a teacher's pay?
The educational system and delivery of "teaching" is very poor in the US. Hopefully at some point, focusing on the best methods to teach kids will mean more than a certain groups payscale. There are all sorts of models out there, especially with older students, that show less emphasis on the physical school and more focus on learning tools with higher success rates.
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110%er [5236]
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They might would kill for that 40,000 salary, but would ...
Sep 14, 2012, 7:20 PM
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they be willing to get the education and training , develop the skill , and then actually do the WORK, to get that salary ?
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: They might would kill for that 40,000 salary, but would ...
Sep 14, 2012, 11:33 PM
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Absolutely. One of my cousins is looking for a job right now as a teacher. He just wants to get his foot in the door. He has his masters and is trying to become a history teacher right now. He would be knocking the door down for 40K a year
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Varsity [239]
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Re: Re: Where did your $40,000/year number come from? ******
Sep 14, 2012, 8:36 PM
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I heard on the news this morning....Chicago teachers were raking in $75k, not $40.
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Amateur [31]
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Re: OT: this is why i have zero sympathy for teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 8:59 PM
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Oh boy, looks like someone has mommy issues.
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Orange Blooded [2609]
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Re: OT: this is why i have zero sympathy for teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 9:46 PM
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To set the record straight, teachers TEACH for 9 months but attend workshops and continuing ed more. The time that we have off in the summer is paid for by having it taken out of our salaries to stretch over a 12 month period. It is not money for nothing as some perceive. 40,000 is a high salary; Master's degree or many years of service. Most only earn around 32,000 and and have 1/2 of that deducted each month. If you all knew what the government is trying to shove down our throats youd understand a little more.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: OT: this is why i have zero sympathy for teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 11:34 PM
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I know very well what the government is doing......as I am a government employee just like teachers
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Rock Defender [67]
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Teachers are needed bad
Sep 14, 2012, 9:59 PM
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My mom has been a teacher in SC for almost 30 years. She makes around 80k a year, but she also has a BA, Masters, Masters+30, National boards, and does summer school. All by which she had to pay to take all of those classes, courses, meetings, etc.. Most teachers in SC make 35k or less. You teach because you care, not because your money hungry. But at the same time your due what your worth, and teachers need to be a higher priority. You compare their salaries to min. wage!!! Really, you want someone to be happy making a couple grand more than someone who couldn't graduate high school!!! Really!!! And you want these people to teach your children!! Its called Obama- more for less- that should be his campaign slogan. Because this country is crap right now!! And its only going to get worse! Oh yeah, 70k in Chicago is like 25-30k here, and thats gross pay. Probably only bring home like 15k. If you have a 1000 dollars a month for rent or house+car+insurance+children+food+student loans+school supplies(not provided by the school)+gas+food+etc.. You get the point!! Doesn't go very far. Back to football, nothing to see here!
Go tigers!!!!
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Rock Defender [53]
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The teaching profession is a racket these days...some do
Sep 14, 2012, 10:02 PM
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good but most are whiners who can't get any other job so they suckle off the gov't teet. Despite their moaning about being underpaid, most are paid more than they're worth given the dismal results they produce.
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CU Medallion [51528]
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You have no ####### clue.***
Sep 14, 2012, 10:17 PM
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Rock Defender [53]
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Convince me otherwise, hotshot.***
Sep 14, 2012, 10:31 PM
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Legend [16121]
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110%er [5156]
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Athletic Dir [864]
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A no no
Sep 14, 2012, 10:06 PM
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Dont bring up politics, religion or teachers salaries on this board...lol
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CU Medallion [51528]
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Please do not classify all teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 10:07 PM
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in that group. They are not all greedy like that.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Please do not classify all teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 11:36 PM
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Not classifying all teachers. Most are great people....I think its the holier than thou attitude that is rubbing everyone wrong.
And yea that video really ticked me off. If I am that district i fire them all.....and find replacements the next day.
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110%er [5931]
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at least theyre not a fireman
Sep 14, 2012, 10:10 PM
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my sister in-laws brother is in his fourth year as a fdny FF....barely makes 40k plus the cost of living in nyc is outrageous. Not to mention his house is in the Bronx.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: at least theyre not a fireman
Sep 14, 2012, 11:38 PM
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Work with a ton of firemen. Once you start moving up in rank he will see a very very very significant raise. The lowest salary i know of at Captain where i am from is right around 55
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Orange Blooded [3405]
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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If you are not a teacher, you have no idea how tough that
Sep 14, 2012, 10:58 PM
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Job is. If everyone had to spend one day in a teacher's shoes, they'd change their minds.
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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I agree with that...have been in some bad situations as....
Sep 14, 2012, 11:17 PM
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...teacher.
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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Teacher tales from the crypt....
Sep 14, 2012, 11:28 PM
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..did my student teaching in Colleton County. While walking into class one day discovered a heavyset gal talking very loudly about "getting some a$$". When I inquired what was going on, another voice from another part of the room responded "I've got all the a$$ you need right here". The two gals, both 200 pounders then squeezed my 165 pound behnd in between them and "commenced" fighting. I took a couple of short left jabs to the back of the head, the rest of the class erupted in panic, some headed for the door. Never seen anything like it, and one of the gals said the fight started because of a piece of Pizza the other gal had given to her boyfriend. Not to mention, the next day one of the other students said "..hey Mr. Causey, heard you got yo a$$ beat yesterday..". What could I do but laugh?
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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FYI, due to budget cuts, I'm forced to split my time between
Sep 14, 2012, 11:20 PM
[ in reply to If you are not a teacher, you have no idea how tough that ] |
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Two schools. Basically, I'm doing two jobs for one salary. I had no summer vacation because I was too busy trying to provide the best learning environment I could for my students. Obviously I'm not in it for the money because if my salary was hourly, I'd make nothing. Some teachers like myself deserve a raise.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: FYI, due to budget cuts, I'm forced to split my time between
Sep 14, 2012, 11:44 PM
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1. Due to budget cuts.....welcome to 2012. Everyone is dealing with budget cuts and no raises
2. You say "im not in it for the money" and then go on to say "some teachers like myself deserve a raise". You don't deserve anything. We are all paid what we are worth. If you truly think you are better than what your getting paid. Quit. Find a new job that meets your self worth.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: If you are not a teacher, you have no idea how tough that
Sep 14, 2012, 11:41 PM
[ in reply to If you are not a teacher, you have no idea how tough that ] |
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Ridiculous statement.
1. Spend a day in the life of a textile worker, fast food worker, steel mill worker, coal miner, oil rig roughneck, detention center guard.....
I mean come on. You act like your job is just out of this world tough. Its a job.....just like everyone else. Stop acting like your job is the end all be all
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Legend [16121]
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Do you need a degree to mine coal or mill steel?***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:46 PM
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Do you need a degree to mine coal or mill steel?***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:16 AM
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No.....you don't. I also do not see those employees bitching about salary. They knew going into that profession that it would pay their bills, but never make them rich. Its almost like the teachers want the best of both worlds....9 month job and a 12 month salary.
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Legend [16121]
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You have never been to a steel mill, coal mine, fast-food
Sep 15, 2012, 12:26 AM
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restaurant or oil rig where there was any grousing about pay? I have never been to a foreign planet where teachers were not treated as Gods...See...I can make things up too...
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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I have worked on a line in a plant and it was tough. I
Sep 15, 2012, 12:02 AM
[ in reply to Re: If you are not a teacher, you have no idea how tough that ] |
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Decided to go back to school and work with children. Although manual labor is physically exhausting, teaching is mentally exhausting. Unless you've been in a classroom dealing with today's youth, you have no right to judge whether or not the deserve the raise.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: I have worked on a line in a plant and it was tough. I
Sep 15, 2012, 12:18 AM
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I can judge those teachers in these two instances all i want.
1. They gave up on the kids
2. They have a false sense of entitlement
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Legend [16121]
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Key word being THOSE teachers...Not ALL teachers moron...***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:28 AM
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Fan [70]
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Re: OT: this is why i have zero sympathy for teachers
Sep 14, 2012, 11:30 PM
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I tell you what buddy. I'm not a teacher but you are a dumb*** for this post
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110%er [9648]
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Yes. But then you'd have to spend your day with 25 kids
Sep 14, 2012, 11:37 PM
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and work 60 hours a week. It's not for the faint of heart.
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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Palmetto, don't forget that teachers spend a lot of their
Sep 14, 2012, 11:47 PM
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salary on supplies and their students. Many students at my school would not have food on the table or a nice Christmas if it wasn't for teachers. Many of our kids come to school wearing dirty clothes or shoes with holes in them. Teachers will buy clothes and shoes for their students. Also, we will take the little free time we have during the day to wash the students' clothes. Maybe you should go volunteer in a school before making such ignorant comments.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Palmetto, don't forget that teachers spend a lot of their
Sep 15, 2012, 12:20 AM
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I do volunteer in after school programs as well as provide extra curricular activities for at risk kids.
Don't lecture me about knowing what your day entails. I know you spend money on the kids....but don't lie about the amount. I spend money as well on some of my kids.....doesn't mean I am going to my boss tomorrow demanding a raise. I chose to help the kids.....not my employer
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Legend [16121]
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Sounds like you need to stop hating and move to Chicago for
Sep 14, 2012, 11:41 PM
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that 71k payday and the Mardi Gras that is teaching...Sounds like a fat chunk for an easy gig...
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: Sounds like you need to stop hating and move to Chicago for
Sep 14, 2012, 11:45 PM
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Why....I don't want to teach. Never said anything about wanting to teach. I just want people to shut up and do their freaking jobs. If you don't like it...quit and find another district
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Head Coach [757]
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Re: Sounds like you need to stop hating and move to Chicago for
Sep 14, 2012, 11:50 PM
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Man you are one effed up son of a beotch....
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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In case you missed my point, which obviously you did, I have
Sep 14, 2012, 11:57 PM
[ in reply to Re: Sounds like you need to stop hating and move to Chicago for ] |
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To work at two schools because of budget cuts. Do you think I would work two jobs for one salary for the hell if it? No, there are no job openings and I have to take what I can get. I have to pay bills and put food on the table.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: In case you missed my point, which obviously you did, I have
Sep 15, 2012, 12:22 AM
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Your a teacher and having trouble putting food on the table? Calling complete BSSSS on that
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Legend [16121]
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"Your a teacher"...Here's hoping you get it once before this
Sep 15, 2012, 12:30 AM
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thread disappears...
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Legend [16227]
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Teaching is a thankless job. We whine about our
Sep 14, 2012, 11:49 PM
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country falling behind on the production front yet pay those responsible for shepherding our youth through their formative years like USuC grads.
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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IMHO, the blame placed on the teachers....
Sep 14, 2012, 11:53 PM
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...is not entirely deserved. Here in good ole Hampton County, a brand new Estill High School was built back in 1985 with the idea that "our children can't learn unless that have a modern facility to learn in". Decades later, it's still a terrible school and the building made no difference. Now we've built a brand new middle school under the same premise. It will make *no* difference.
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Head Coach [757]
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So what do you say is the answer to correcting this?***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:54 PM
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110%er [8015]
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Get our priorities straight.***
Sep 14, 2012, 11:58 PM
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Head Coach [757]
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I'm talking about in Hampton County, SC...
Sep 15, 2012, 12:00 AM
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How do you fix the schools in a district like that? Specifically?
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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This is just my opinion...
Sep 15, 2012, 12:02 AM
[ in reply to So what do you say is the answer to correcting this?*** ] |
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..an article that appeared in the WSJ a few months ago asked this question; what if some of the "failing" schools were literally doing the best they could do? How do you take children who parents don't care about education, who come from broken homes, who are openly antagonistic toward education and then expect them to shed that baggage? For a person who believes education is nothing, the best building and the best teachers won't, on the whole, make a significant difference. Until the culture is changed, the results won't change. Again, that's just my opinion.
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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Parents are a huge part of the problem. Many students get no
Sep 15, 2012, 12:06 AM
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Help at home and they have no discipline. Until that changes, schools are going to get worse. Pretty soon, there will be no education system because no one will want to become teachers.
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Head Coach [757]
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So the teachers are blamed for dysfunctional families?
Sep 15, 2012, 12:09 AM
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What's the answer on how do correct this? No decent teachers want to teach at those schools....
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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So the question then becomes: how do you change....
Sep 15, 2012, 12:13 AM
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..a "sub-culture"? Which is where a lot of the problem children come from. Sometimes it take generations...
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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I doubt it will be fixed any time soon.***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:17 AM
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Head Coach [757]
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LOL, not at this rate....***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:21 AM
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Head Coach [757]
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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Of course. I heard Dr. Thomas Sowell talk about it...
Sep 15, 2012, 12:28 AM
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...those sub-cultures tend to have an open antagonism toward education. I have tried many times talking with students like that and you may as well have tried to convince the late Carl Sagan that UFOs were spacecraft from another world; obviously, I didn't get very far...
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Rock Defender [53]
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Rock Defender [53]
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Because we aren't firing bad teachers and kids will never
Sep 15, 2012, 12:07 AM
[ in reply to IMHO, the blame placed on the teachers.... ] |
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do well if they don't want and value and education, nor have people at home that demand they do better.
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Head Coach [757]
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So how do you fix all of that?***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:10 AM
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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Isn't that the million dollar question?***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:12 AM
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Head Coach [757]
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Yeah, somebody got the answer?***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:22 AM
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Orange Blooded [4005]
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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Legend [18783]
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LOL. I love non-teachers who make comments
Sep 15, 2012, 12:19 AM
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on things they know nothing about.
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Legend [16121]
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No doubt...***
Sep 15, 2012, 12:22 AM
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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I'm an ex-teacher, but you don't have to be a teacher....
Sep 15, 2012, 12:34 AM
[ in reply to LOL. I love non-teachers who make comments ] |
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..to understand these issues. For example, *anyone* can tell you the value of discipline, no matter what you do for a living...
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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To fix any problem, one needs not only the political....
Sep 15, 2012, 12:24 AM
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...will, but the moral as well. So, since it's been asked, how would one fix a really poor school? If you wanted to pursue the idea that all kids can't be salvaged (as harsh as that sounds), you could then make an effort to educate those that are, and that would mean getting rid of those who simply aren't going to do anything but cause problems. In each of the classes I taught, there was always a core of bright, eager and disciplined students, say around 30%. With just that group, the entire image of the school would be different. That's one solution, but of course it wouldn't be popular on either side of the political spectrum. The good teacher is then left with the role of spending more time with discipline issues with the poor students which further detracts from how the good students learn.
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All-TigerNet [12197]
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Re: To fix any problem, one needs not only the political....
Sep 15, 2012, 12:27 AM
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^^^No child left behind.......unless you have discipline problems or your not as smart as little Tommy from a well to do neighborhood and good family base
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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Unfortunately there is no way to level society....
Sep 15, 2012, 12:31 AM
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..where everyone is the same; not money wise, family or even DNA...
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Legend [16227]
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A level society would bite. Without imbalance, we are
Sep 15, 2012, 1:00 AM
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kaput. At minimum though, we should make efforts to ensure that as many as possible learn to read, write, and figure. A teacher knows when they have a student that's struggling in one of those areas. Offer them some leeway on approaching the problem. With many teachers seeing these same kids every day in the schools, they can share what's working and what's not.
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Orange Blooded [2213]
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All of that would help. There are other things....
Sep 15, 2012, 1:15 AM
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..as well that might help also. One example might be to make it as easy as possible to remove a child at the request of the parent from a "failing" school. If the parents choose to home school or opt for a private school, fix it so they don't have to support the public school system via their taxes. My wife and I home school our twins and yet we still are forced to pay for a school system we don't use. I fact, no one in my family has attended a public school since 1957. Yet the tax man always demands we pay anyway; not fair in my opinion.
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Legend [16121]
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Head Coach [757]
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Head Coach [757]
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