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All-In [27180]
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One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:10 AM
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once Venables' defense was stung by something (remember the shovel pass, the QB triple option??), they NEVER got stung by it twice. To this day, our defense can sniff out a shovel pass/triple option and stuff it with no problems. That's where Venables earned his money. A Venables defense was NEVER fooled twice by an offensive wrinkle.
Goodwin's defense has proven to be susceptible to the RB screen 2 weeks in a row. And you can bet LA Tech, WF and Nancy Tate are going to run the RB screen until we show we can stop it. I never bought this nonsense that somehow, there would be "zero" dropoff from Venables to Goodwin.
Guys are over-pursuing, safeties making bad reads/taking poor angles, poor tackling, LB's not getting free/not staying at home---it's not a talent issue. This is one of the most talented defensive units in CFB. This is a COACHING issue. I have no doubt Goodwin's a talented guy---but he's got to get this fixed. WF absolutely lives on the short passing game (and RB screens).......
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All-In [27180]
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Orange Blooded [3959]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:14 AM
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Two games and way too early. Why not wait till end of season to make this claim. Yeah rough start from the D. But I’ll wait to judge later.
Message was edited by: Jcantrell86®
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All-In [27180]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:16 AM
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Well that's kind of the point---we never saw a Venables defense do that 2 weeks in a row.
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Orange Blooded [3959]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:38 AM
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Short week and honestly those guys looked very uninspired. Great game plan for Furman to take advantage of our short week. We’ve got two weeks of film on Louisiana Tech so I sure hope we don’t see the same problems this week.
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All-In [27180]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:42 AM
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I agree the 5-day turnaround may have had something to do with it BUT give Furman some credit------Furman is a well-coached team that has some players. The LA Tech game will be telling---can we stop the RB screen??
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110%er [8537]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:16 AM
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Venables is taller and needed a get back coach.
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Letterman [261]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:34 AM
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I can't disagree with anything you said, but I would just point out that we played two games in 5 days, so we really didn't have a full week of practice between the two games. If we continue to get burned on the screens this coming Saturday, then I think your comments become more valid.
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110%er [5072]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 12:00 PM
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Plus, if we have a good adjustment to the screens then would we show that against Furman if we didn't have to? Why not let Wake or NC State think they can expose that and then break out a solution to it? I'm not saying that's the case, but it's too early to conclude that Goodwin can't make adjustments is my overall point.
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CU Medallion [65418]
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There's a whole lot of new moving parts in this defense,
Sep 12, 2022, 9:44 AM
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even if BV were still here. It's called experience for a reason, you have to have it to get the benefits from it. I think we will eventually be fine on defense. And offense, for that matter.
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All-In [27180]
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Re: There's a whole lot of new moving parts in this defense,
Sep 12, 2022, 9:47 AM
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We definitely miss Skalski's influence at LB and Turner's at S....with game experience, we will get better I have no doubt.
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110%er [6168]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:51 AM
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Well I might bring up the Bama tight end in the 2015 Natty, the crossing routes vs LSU in the 2019 Natty and pretty much crossing routes and guys sitting down in the middle of the field the last 6 years. It’s the soft spot in the aggressive D of Venables. Plus whatever Boston College wanted to do last year they pretty much did with Flowers. Sometimes teams not only have a good plan but they have key people to execute it. That little #82 for Furman is a really good player and #2 on the outside looked as good as Tee. Plus their QB had wheels and if you extend plays people get open. Now the screens are 100% on the D line not realizing they are being let in. These aren’t inexperienced guys we’re talking about either.
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All-In [27180]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:56 AM
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Venables' defense definitely had some "high risk/high reward" elements to it. But on the whole, his defenses were solid. We were definitely exposed vs. OSU....that was one game where I felt he didn't gameplan very well.
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110%er [7987]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:57 AM
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As usual you are reading too much into the Furman game. The short week allowed little time for prep and we had less than normal energy (spring in the legs). Our team simply wanted the W where FU wanted to make a point. FU has a solid team with some good pieces (QB and #82 WR). They played with great urgency and we did not. Not sure why we need to make a federal case of it as we got the W under a set of circumstances I don't see happening again this season.
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Orange Blooded [3615]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 9:59 AM
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Goodwin looked like he needed a cup of coffee or three or a few Red Bull.
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Letterman [261]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:01 AM
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Just gave another TU to Rooster and here is why. This is exactly the kind of post we should see on a fan board. Most of us are a bit frustrated and disappointed by what we have seen from the defense in the first two games. I remain supportive (and I don't see Rooster as unsupportive) but have seen what looks like sub par Clemson defense based on what we have to expect. I will go one step farther and say addressing the screen pass is usually an in-game defensive adjustment. Hoping it all comes together soon. Go Tigers.
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Letterman [261]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:10 AM
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OH Crap! looks like I made the wrong call. A Booster ain't a Rooster. Your right it is still early in the season.
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Orange Blooded [2847]
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Push the panic button much?
Sep 12, 2022, 10:06 AM
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Wow. You people in the Lunatic Fringe have zero patience. Give the guy a chance.
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All-In [27180]
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Re: Push the panic button much?
Sep 12, 2022, 10:08 AM
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"You people" lol.......willing to bet I have a lot more invested in Clemson that you ever have/will in several lifetimes.
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110%er [5121]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:12 AM
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I seem to remember Pitt shuttle passing us to death…and we never stopped it. And we lost. So “never” is inaccurate, regardless of your agenda.
FSU BTHO of our D with the tight end one year, as another example
That was BV’s defense, right?
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All-In [34486]
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Did you even read the post?***
Sep 12, 2022, 10:14 AM
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All-In [27180]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:16 AM
[ in reply to Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that ] |
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Read again: it never happened TWICE. That is the point. We've seen the RB screen gash the defense two weeks in a row. We never saw the shuttle pass gash our defense two weeks in a row. Never.
My "agenda" is wanting Clemson to win, and to dominate every, single team we play. As Dabo likes to say, "Best is the Standard". That's my agenda. What's your "agenda"?
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110%er [5121]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:29 AM
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Oh FFS, it’s been 2 games. Two. Dos.
OK, on second thought, lets go ahead and fire his ###. You’ve convinced me.
TNet is a clown show.
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All-In [34486]
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Well it's really nothing to get emotional about***
Sep 12, 2022, 10:30 AM
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All-In [27180]
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Heisman Winner [140464]
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I bet other coaches are thinking this as well.***
Sep 12, 2022, 10:30 AM
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Legend [15863]
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Are we gonna cover the TE this year .... ???
Sep 12, 2022, 10:32 AM
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???
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110%er [5307]
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Missed that Pitt game in 2016, did you?
Sep 12, 2022, 10:33 AM
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They ran a shovel pass play 8 times and we did not stop it once.
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All-TigerNet [13699]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:34 AM
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Agreed. We have a luxury in the way of schedule. Hopefully, Wes and Street are making the most of these opportunities to develop and address deficiencies like this.
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Hall of Famer [22659]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:36 AM
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I wonder if we are showing a different game plan to Ga Tech, FU and LA Tech than we will WF and Nancy St so they don’t get accurate scouting data?? Maybe, just maybe - Goodwin is setting them up so he can knock ‘em down.
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All-In [27180]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:44 AM
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I have a hard time imagining Dabo is going to want to let LA Tech run the RB screen all day long on Saturday. Just sayin'....I think that's one play he'd very much like to eliminate from Clausen's gameplan.
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Hall of Famer [22659]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:56 AM
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Or maybe make WF think they are going to be able to do it all day and then shut them down next Saturday. I predicted an INT by a DE this season and that may be just the place we see it happen. We are lining 5 guys up on the DL pretty regularly and sending them all. Wouldn’t be surprised to see us line up that way at Wake and keep KJ or XT (if he is back) around the line of scrimmage to stop the screen. At least that’s what I’m hoping to see. We can beat La Tech by sending everyone and giving up some yards on the screen just like we did Furman. Then throw the wrinkle at Wake.
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Commissioner [950]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 10:48 AM
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Just because someone is a good cook, it doesn't mean they can run a restaurant. I hope that's not Goodwin. He clearly has a reputation as a good analysis. He has NFL talent all over that D. I agree with you, he needs to google how to stop a screen pass as getting burned on the same thing two weeks in a row is more than enough. That one fumble we got I thought was kind of iffy and without the goal line stand, Furman was about 2 plays from making that game a real nailbiter.
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110%er [5009]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 11:04 AM
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In my opinion, referencing a restaurant analogy just because the coach in question is of greater mass than the previous coach is uncalled for
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Athletic Dir [865]
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It took Venables years to get the team ready for the triple
Sep 12, 2022, 11:02 AM
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option.
We even scheduled a 1-AA team (maybe Woford) to help teach the players how to stop the triple option.
As for the shovel pass...it was something we saw for a few weeks. We took care of it in week 3 if I remember.
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Associate AD [806]
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Re: It took Venables years to get the team ready for the triple
Sep 12, 2022, 11:45 AM
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I know its early and I know there are a lot of variables involved and it takes time for new coordinators to settle in. I will simply say this. We may miss Venables the linebacker coach a little more than Venables the defensive coordinator
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110%er [5072]
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Re: It took Venables years to get the team ready for the triple
Sep 12, 2022, 12:08 PM
[ in reply to It took Venables years to get the team ready for the triple ] |
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To be fair, the only game we lost to GT with BV here was the year Watson got hurt early in the game and Stoudt threw a pick 6. We did give up quite a few points to GT in the first 2 years BV was here but I'd argue the solution to stopping them on our part had just as much to do with obtaining a very dominant DL than having a great plan. I don't say that to take anything away from BV, but the power rangers disrupted everything GT was trying to do at the LOS before GT could begin to execute.
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All-TigerNet [10634]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 11:55 AM
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Maybe not in consecutive games, but we did nothing to stop Pitt's short little pass over the middle the year they beat us in the Valley. So the jury is out whether Wes will take steps to stop it in future games .. I am guessing he will!
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Letterman [274]
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Re: One big difference between Venables and Goodwin is that
Sep 12, 2022, 11:56 AM
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Did you miss the Al and LSU games where Clemson got drubbed time after time for the entire game.
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Lot o points [155901]
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Venables wouldn't be screwed if he wanted to make it to
Sep 12, 2022, 11:57 AM
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the top of the Statue of Liberty and the elevator was broken.
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110%er [6825]
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Re: Venables wouldn't be screwed if he wanted to make it to
Sep 12, 2022, 12:14 PM
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If we are playing in the pinstripe bowl with Venables as our coach, we were screwed already....
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