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YOUR BALANCE
More reality
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More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 10:11 AM

Just wanted to point out a few things...

During the 2016 Championship season, Clemson beat:
Auburn by 6
Troy by 6
Louisville by 6
NC St by 7
FSU by 3
Va T by 7
And lost to Pitt by 1

Yes, I know that several of those teams were ranked, but the point is that we were all wondering what was wrong at the time, and Clemson still made it to the playoffs, and won it!

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Yep at the Auburn game kept thinking we were going to


Sep 22, 2021, 10:18 AM

Blow it wide open. Their qb really wasn’t very impressive though to be fair our defense was. As you said went on to be a nice season. Don’t get me wrong there are things I think our offense can and should do better but certainly not the end of the world. I know you don’t win that many games by taking too many chances but you can tell games where we look uptight and aren’t having fun and games we are playing loose and having fun. I would love it if first play of the game DJ launched about a 70 yard pass. But then I’d be a terrible head coach or offensive coordinator.


Message was edited by: lovingit®


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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 10:23 AM

Thanks for the poast. Things are rarely as bad as they seem at the moment.
Hopefully the Tigers will begin to show life in the offense this weekend... and just as importantly, the defense continues to perform at a high level.
Go Tigers!!! Beat NC State!!!

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"If a pig had a better personality, he would cease to be a filthy animal."


Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 10:35 AM

And, during the TL 2018 undefeated season, remember how slow he started and the doubts we had?

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Looked around TTT for you Saturday


Sep 22, 2021, 11:10 AM [ in reply to Re: More reality ]

I must've left before you settled in for the game. I should've come back by during the delays and watched the 2nd half on the TV.

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Re: Looked around TTT for you Saturday


Sep 22, 2021, 11:19 AM

As soon as you walk in TTT, my wife and I were sitting in a booth on the right. We got there about 2:00 and left when the delay began. We'll catch up eventually.

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"If a pig had a better personality, he would cease to be a filthy animal."


Re: Looked around TTT for you Saturday


Sep 22, 2021, 12:35 PM

I think I left around 1:30 or a little earlier. Next game is at 7:30 so no idea what my schedule will be like.

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Re: Looked around TTT for you Saturday


Sep 22, 2021, 3:10 PM

Me either

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"If a pig had a better personality, he would cease to be a filthy animal."


Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 10:24 AM

At no point during any of those seasons did the feeling of we suck come into the general thought process. It doesn’t take a genius or football guru to look at our offense and see that it has been very inept. We’ve looked completely lost in all three games this season. While that is still a small sample size it’s not a one game deal. Hopefully we get it figured out this week. The likely hood of that happening is minuscule at best.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 10:30 AM

You watched us beat Troy by 6 and NC State take us to overtime and you never thought we sucked?

The only difference that season is that neither side of the ball was elite early so both sides showed signs of being good and then would fall apart at times. Also when the offense was awful we "just knew" Deshaun would turn it on because of what we saw him do the previous season.

In reality the only difference is that we haven't seen these players make enough plays to know if they aren't good at all or if they are just struggling.

The 2016 team played horribly in several games prior to taking a loss to Pitt and turning it on to finish the season.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 11:15 AM

I guess it’s hard for you to comprehend someone not agreeing with you but our offense hasn’t looked this bad in 3 consecutive games to start the year since the Tommy West years

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 11:32 AM

Comprehension is tough for both of us I guess because you struggled to read that while I agree that our offense is the worst it's been in a while, in 2016 both our offense and defense had times of looking like a complete disaster.

My point is that this year the difference is that we don't have proven players that we know will get better to keep us optimistic.

While that year we kept saying "we played terrible but we know these players are better than this", this year we aren't sure if the players are better than this. Maybe they are and maybe they aren't.

Also people always freak out when an offense can't score because the thought is that at some point the defense won't be able to save them. I wonder why people worry less when an offense puts up 50 and a defense gives up 44.

If that was our GT score then the outlook would be much different moving forward, but in reality a 6 point win vs GA Tech is equally bad whether it's the offense or defense falling on their faces.

Also you are forgetting how bad our offense looked in most of 2010 and nearing the end of the season in 2014 when Watson was out.

I believe you are also forgetting scoring 28,24, and 24 against Wake, Syracuse and GA Tech in consecutive games in 2017 which included some defensive and special teams scores in those low totals.

I get it. You are worried and you want me to be worried with you and tell the world that Clemson sucks right now.

Maybe I don't comprehend how bad we are right now, but I recall similar times when things got corrected and turned out ok.

Hopefully things will improve this season without taking another loss.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 12:18 PM

I’m not going to research it for you. I guess we can agree to disagree or maybe not but I’m quite certain statistics would show our offense after three games is the worst it’s been in a very very long time. . As I sat in the Bank of America stadium during the Georgia game this year my thought at halftime was I haven’t seen anything that makes me believe that we can do anything the 2nd half to be better. During the SC State game the lady beside me said what do you think and my thought was this isn’t any better. After last weeks game my thoughts are the same. While I know it’s difficult to understand I haven’t felt this way about our offense at any point during the Dabo era. When Kelly Bryant was our qb my thought was we want be able to win a playoff game because he can’t throw a 10 yard pass. The other players covered for him and we won inspite of him until the playoffs arrived. This particular year we are terrible all the way around on offense. If we have a bright spot on offense I haven’t seen it.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 12:27 PM

So to be clear and a little more specific to your statements:

Justyn Ross is terrible? You don't see him making more of an impact moving forward?

What you have seen from Joe Ngata at this point is not a bright spot?

What you have seen from Will Shipley at this point is not a bright spot?

You didn't see an improvement with DJ running the ball last weekend?

Based on your story about the 3 games, you seem to have made up your mind during the first game and now you are trying to be right instead of continuing to analyze.

The total points are all that matter in the win/loss column and those are too low, but if you watch the plays I'm not sure how you can say that this offense is terrible and will continue to be terrible and there is no hope for them.

If we mix in a few explosive plays per game, I don't see how this offense if much different than 2017 at the moment.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 12:40 PM

I didn’t make up my mind. I’ve hoped it would improve. It hasn’t. We rank near the bottom in most offensive categories. I hope we get it fixed. Pumping sunshine want make it better. We’ve been pretty bad offensively. Can we improve I sure hope so we can’t do much worse. We had to stop Georgia Tech at the 2 from scoring a touchdown to tie the game. Blow all the smoke you want.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 12:50 PM

I don't know that we will become a good offense either, but to say we are all around terrible and there are no bright spots is pretty extreme.

We haven't been good on offense, but continuing to refer to national rankings may not reflect the product moving forward.

It would not have mattered what we did against SC State and GA Tech, there was no quick recovery statistically after the UGA game.

Finishing with 2 yards rushing and 180 total yards and 3 points wasn't going to average out to anything great in the short term.

Let's hope we get things moving in the right direction this weekend.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 12:56 PM

I think the outrage is - "seemingly nothing has been done to address the OL"! TL was able to check out of plays he knew would get stuffed and Powell and Rogers had been around forever and could adjust their routes.
Can this group of QB's and WR's do that?

The OL is just plain not good. One would think it would have been stressed and emphasized during the entire offseason - but appears to be the same line. No progress. No more nasty than last year this year. You had the best RB in school history and he couldn't get yards behind that line; what are players who may not be as skilled going to do?
Bad teams with a good OL can stay in the game because they can grind out 1st downs and possess the football. We can't do that.

Our OL recruiting has to pick up. In the interim - teach the OL how to cut block or something(LOL) new. Heck hold or something, dang!

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 1:05 PM

I agree that the Oline is a major weakness.

Recruiting has picked up in that area, but the performance has not.

I also agree that a major issue when protection breaks down or when somebody brings a blitz is that DJ and his receiving options don't appear to be on the same page many times. That seems like it should improve unless the entire group just can't read defenses which would surprise me.

In saying all of that, I think the oline is taking the fall at times because the skill guys are not operating smoothly either.

I would imagine that individual players are grading out higher than the offensive group as a whole because if one or two guys have a breakdown then it ruins a play. Clemson's biggest problem at the moment is that players are rotating who is having those breakdowns so there isn't a quick substitution fix or a spot to isolate the changes. Everybody just has to execute plays more cohesively on a consistent basis.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 12:22 PM [ in reply to Re: More reality ]

Just to let you know...our offense is averaging 22 points a game...

In 2004, our offense averaged 19.8 points for the first 5 games (and 22 for the first three)....

I think that was well after the West years.

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GD....


Sep 22, 2021, 1:10 PM [ in reply to Re: More reality ]

Have to think about that, makes me nauseous to consider that statement. Sadly, it may be a valid comparison.

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You must not TigerNet much. Every single season at this time


Sep 22, 2021, 10:51 AM [ in reply to Re: More reality ]

People say our offense sucks and that BV is amazing and we should fire our offensive coordinator. Has happened at least 5 years in a row now. So basically as far as TigerNet goes you are 100 percent incorrect. And then we go on to win the ACC Championship, go to the playoffs, and have won a couple. The difference here is we don’t get the same vibe from DJ that he can almost be a superhero like DW and TL.

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nor is the talent level the same almost across the board on


Sep 22, 2021, 2:38 PM [ in reply to Re: More reality ]

offense and don't even look at the recruiting stars, just watch these guys, dip at almost every position IMO. Experience will provide for some improvement, but we need to up the talent level also(perhaps some guys from this class that aren't "there" yet and hadn't really seen the field will be an answer- if not, it's back to the recruiting board to find the elite)

Defense is a different story

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 10:46 AM

Okay, yeah, we’ve had close games and bad losses like Pitt. I was at that game and it was a gut-punch.
But the offense was still able to move the ball downfield and score! It’s concerning how the play calling is so vanilla every game, and how there is virtually no passing game so far this season.
Even the sunshine pumpers on WCCP have been talking about something being “off” with this offense.

Hopefully, this ship gets righted on Saturday.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 11:08 AM

We moved the ball this past Saturday against Tech. You're not gonna get monster stats with only 8 possessions. I agree with the lack of a downfield passing game and that needs to be addressed, but it's a myth that GT's defense dominated us.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 11:57 AM

I agree, it wasn’t that GT was all of a sudden a great D. Clemson O couldn’t get out of their own way.
That’s been the problem.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 12:03 PM [ in reply to Re: More reality ]

We had 8 possessions and scored twice. For a defense as bad as GTs and as much talent is on this offense, that is domination against us.

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 12:32 PM

2 TDs in 8 possessions and we fumbled away a routine FG and opted to go for it on 4th down and were stopped instead of a routine FG try.

If we kick those FGs we score points on 50% of our drives.

I wonder how 50% stacks up against what we typically expect our offenses to do.

I honestly don't know the answer, but that fumble was huge.

Also I think our coaches went for the 4th down based on the decent success we were having up to that point in short yardage with the expectation that it would give our offense some momentum to pick it up and finish the drive strong. It obviously backfired because we blew an assignment and were stopped short.

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You really are determined to die on that hill aren't you? We


Sep 22, 2021, 3:23 PM [ in reply to Re: More reality ]

moved the ball SLIGHTLY better than Kenesaw State did, but not as well as Northern Freaking Illinois did...and I hate to break it to you, but 2 TDs in 8 possessions against their shitass defense is absolutely pitiful...He should have hung 49 on those losers

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Great stats....except...


Sep 22, 2021, 10:55 AM

we actually scored points in those games too.

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Re: Great stats....except...


Sep 22, 2021, 10:58 AM

We had: Deshaun Watson, Mike Williams, Wayne Gallman, Hunter Renfrow, Artvis Scott, Dion Cain, and Jordan Legette and scored 26 vs Troy and 21 in regulation vs NC State.

Really that much better than 14 vs GA Tech?

The difference is we knew all of those guys would get better, and this year we aren't convinced of the improvement because there are so many new faces.

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Re: Great stats....except...


Sep 22, 2021, 12:13 PM [ in reply to Great stats....except... ]

That season, we averaged a score of 39.2 to 18 for all the games.

This season we are averaging 22 to 7. If you subtract the 11 points difference in defense from the offensive average for 2016, that is 28 points a game. That means that during that championship season, our margin of victory was 6 points higher than what it is now...One more touchdown per game, and we equal that season production, when you look at the difference the defense is making this year!

In other words, with the defense doing so well, the offense does not have to produce as much to give us the same margin of victory average...

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Truth!


Sep 22, 2021, 10:56 AM

:)

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Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 11:02 AM

Great post! Go Tigers!

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if you look at tnet during that time and after those games


Sep 22, 2021, 11:05 AM

You will probably find the same posts from the same posters as you do today.

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Geville Tiger on Clemson football , "Dabo's only problem is he has to deal with turd fans questioning every move he makes.”


Re: More reality


Sep 22, 2021, 12:19 PM

What I remember about that season was that every week I thought I was going to have a heart attack! I actually had to get up and leave the room several times as the games were so tight.

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That is an excellent point.


Sep 22, 2021, 4:26 PM

What a fun season that was!

Unfortunately, I don't see a Deshaun Watson, Wayne Gallman, Mike Williams, Hunter Renfrow, or Jordan Leggett on this offense. Do you?

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


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