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Orange Blooded [4456]
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Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 9:57 AM
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That he can recruit. Can always get an assistant than is good with Xs and Os. Brad is B+ with Xs and Os but C- to D + with recruiting. Recruiting is his biggest weakness.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:02 AM
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Agreed.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:08 AM
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I want that dude from Murray State.
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110%er [7990]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:11 AM
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That he can recruit. Can always get an assistant than is good with Xs and Os. Brad is B+ with Xs and Os but C- to D + with recruiting. Recruiting is his biggest weakness.
Is CBB a weak recruiter or is Clemson a super difficult place to attract basketball talent without shoe contracts or AAU payouts?
We don’t win titles, we don’t put guys in the NBA, we don’t attend games unless it’s convenient, basketball is the 3rd or 4th sports priority on campus, facilities are average, not located near key recruiting locations so not convenient, no NIL funding and no “it” factor as a program. So tell me how a Different coach will do better without changing any of the above or cheating?
Just a thought but if all the whining fans would pool their money forming an NIL it would make a huge difference. Maybe enough to grab a 5* player every other cycle or a high 4* every cycle. This would be a game changer and almost guarantee success while change coaches will almost guarantee failure if nothing else changes
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Legend [19687]
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I keep seeing this, that mens basketball is 3-4
Feb 12, 2022, 10:19 AM
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as far as sports priorities go. How is that? 2nd largest budget, 2nd best attendance, 2nd most revenue, second most talked about.
How is it 3-4, and what sports are ahead of it other than football?
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:25 AM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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That he can recruit. Can always get an assistant than is good with Xs and Os. Brad is B+ with Xs and Os but C- to D + with recruiting. Recruiting is his biggest weakness. Is CBB a weak recruiter or is Clemson a super difficult place to attract basketball talent without shoe contracts or AAU payouts? We don’t win titles, we don’t put guys in the NBA, we don’t attend games unless it’s convenient, basketball is the 3rd or 4th sports priority on campus, facilities are average, not located near key recruiting locations so not convenient, no NIL funding and no “it” factor as a program. So tell me how a Different coach will do better without changing any of the above or cheating? Just a thought but if all the whining fans would pool their money forming an NIL it would make a huge difference. Maybe enough to grab a 5* player every other cycle or a high 4* every cycle. This would be a game changer and almost guarantee success while change coaches will almost guarantee failure if nothing else changes
Agree with basically all of your points.
Also, we should definitely have an NIL fund for our basketball players. Priority 1 would be to keep PJ Hall if there was a coaching change
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Orange Blooded [3383]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:31 AM
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Why couldn’t we just hire a coach that would a reputation of putting players in the NBA to keep PJ Hall?
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Orange Blooded [3616]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:45 AM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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THIS is the most overlooked detail by all the "Replace Brownell now!" contingent:
You can't presume that a new coach will start an upward trajectory with Brownell's players. Last time we changed coaches, players weren't allowed the single no-wait transfer like they are today. Kids like Hall and Dawes who have extreme loyalty to BB would have NO obligation to stay at Clemson.
Firing a head basketball coach would require a total makeover of the program. I realize we get tired of perennially being a 6-12 or 8-10 ACC program, but I think the alternative is becoming a 3-15 program using grad transfers.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 11:04 AM
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Brad Brownell recruiting.
We had the 47th ranked recruiting class in the nation last year. The year before we were 22 because of Hall. The year before that we were 43. The year before that we were 62. The year before that 46. You get the point.
OP's last year in 2009 we had the 15th ranked recruiting class. The year before that 30th.
I am sure Barnes had a top 20 class a couple of times.
All we have to do is step it up 1 notch and we are a tournament team every couple of years, 3 at the worst.
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Orange Blooded [4559]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 1:54 PM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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I’m mentally prepared and ready for a makeover. Even if it means a few years of cellar dweller seasons.
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Orange Blooded [4456]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 5:50 PM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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So we can never be successful in BB is your take. What a defeated attitude. Do you feel that way about everything else or just Clemson BB?
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All-In [27374]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:29 AM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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DO NOT confuse our die hard fans with facts or you will be called names,
Clemson once ‘recruited’ a few Big Time players. How did that work out for Coach Locke.
Recruiting star players to Clemson just isn’t going to happen. At best we can hope that the coach can recruit good players and ‘coach them up’. Even with that you can’t compete with the established programs in the ACC. Clemson is by far the most undesirable location to attract the big city players.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:47 AM
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Rick Barnes recruited at a higher level. Even OP recruited at a higher level. It dropped under Barnes.
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All-In [27374]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 6:46 PM
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RickBarnes did more with less his first season than was even possible. If the big guy hadn’t left early to the draft the Tigers would have been a top twenty team for sure. Look at the lineup he had to work with ... if it is available
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Legend [19687]
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Cliff got Dale Davis, Sharone Wright, Devin Gray
Feb 12, 2022, 11:23 AM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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Wayne Buckinghan, Jerry Pryor, Ricky Jones, all of whom were highly rated. Clark Bynum was highly rated. Milton Jennings was highly rated, as was Noel Johnson.
Some of those guys were great, others good, others flops. But they were all highly rated.
The class with Hall also had 2 other 4 stars, but they both transfered after just 1 year.
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Orange Blooded [4456]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 5:55 PM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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So we should just quit? Sometimes you have to change your mental attitude. Yours is that no good players are ever going to come to Clemson. I say you get a coach who can recruit then we will get good players. I’m sorry to stay this bit Brad is a wet blanket
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110%er [6692]
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110%er [5712]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:51 AM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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Save your breath. The cheapskates on here will moan and complain but they will not contribute to a NIL. Heck, they are too cheap to donate a couple of bucks to this site.
Wish to goodness they would make this a pay to play site. Weed all the cheap , juvenile trash out of here.
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Orange Blooded [4559]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 1:59 PM
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Cheapskate here since 2002 or 2003 I think, and will continue to be. I absolutely refuse to spend one cent towards the smart assery that comes with voicing your opinion here. If I’m gonna be insulted, it’s gonna be for free.
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Scout Team [161]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:54 AM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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I was a student at Alburn in '78. What everyone is saying about Clemson BB is the SAME things that were said about Alburn BB in '78.
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Legend [16255]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 11:55 AM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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Brownell has made recruiting to Clemson even harder, and he struggles to keep the ones he does bring in.
Brad doesn't win titles, Brad doesn't put guys in the NBA, Brad has run off more and more fans every year and strangled enthusiasm around the program. The $65 Million spent on facility upgrades and renovations accomplished zilch. If only were in recruiting hotbed areas like a Manhattan, Kansas or Opelika, Alabama. Brad has made nary a mention to fans about NIL (or anything, really) and he certainly has zero "it" factor. Nada. You certainly nailed it there.
Just a thought but if what's left of basketball fans today after 12 years of malaise were to be rewarded with a new coach, with new energy, with simply the potential for on court success instead of this lackluster, tepid, wheel of destiny, throw your kids under a bus situation we have going for us under the Brad, perhaps we could change the game and fortunes here. Maybe the priceless awareness that football has provided Clemson across the country, where high school kids today, everywhere, have all grown up with Clemson being prominently displayed on the collegiate sports map, maybe that could be parlayed and leveraged into recruiting success for hoops. Those remaining fans that have stayed loyal and weathered the storm have earned it.
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110%er [5482]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 3:07 PM
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Now thatis a mouthfull of truths.
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110%er [7191]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 12:10 PM
[ in reply to Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach ] |
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First off this has been going on for a decade + and how is Clemson any more of a difficult place to attract basketball talent than say Virginia Tech or FSU?
And where is basketball the 3rd or 4th sport on campus .Care to shed a light on what "# 2 and #3 are. Add to that Clemson is no further away than any of the other schools in regards to recruiting locations. You just need a coach, or assistant with some knowledge of those area's. And maybe our facilities are not as good as UNC's or Duke but is Littlejohn the worse court to play on? I doubt that!
Finally as to NIL and the "it "factor what is the it factor and how do you explain the first 10 years of his tenure when NIL was not even a "thing".
Final thought. Forget the 5 star recruit that only attends UNC for the shoe contract or whose mom was " supposedly given" a job if her son attended Duke. Instead go after the 3 and 4 star 'basketball" players that you can build a program around instead of recruiting "athletes" who can run up and down the court all night(aka Oliver Purnell) but night in and out won't have 5 to 7 minute scoring droughts ,or turn the ball over 17+ times, or hesitate to take a wide open 3.And who can play defense.
Shoe contracts, AAU money, NIL and facilities are things you only get if you are Duke ,and UNC, but Clemson needs to be able to compete with the rest of the league before you take on those giants.
Hope the new coach knows all of this!
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110%er [8537]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 10:47 AM
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When has that not been the case? We are not a basketball school, but we do need to have a winning record.
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CU Medallion [58413]
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One thing is painfully obvious year after year - we never
Feb 12, 2022, 12:16 PM
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have the talent to take us to the championship or deep into the NCAA tourney, or be a consistent top 20 team. Period. I have no idea how good Brad is at Xs and Os, or how good of a motivator or leader he is. All of that is highly subjective and up for debate, but one thing is glaring year after year - a lack of real basketball talent.
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Orange Blooded [2336]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 12:56 PM
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With ACC basketball at a decline the last several years we should be recruiting at a higher level. I believe recruiting was much harder when ACC basketball was at its high level but we should be convincing young recruits we are on the rise. We have new facilities and a better student athlete environment so we need to capitalize on that. We are not doing that in basketball.
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Orange Blooded [2409]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 2:11 PM
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Is absolutely not a B+ with the Xs and Os.
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110%er [5683]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 3:32 PM
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I remember when we got out recruited for instate 5-stars Zion Williamson and Josiah Jordan-James. Williamson has been one of the best players in the league, while Jordan-James has been a solid role player on an extremely talented Tennesee team. Our coach needs to win these recruiting battles; who knows how good we would be now if we managed to get these two.
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Orange Blooded [4456]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 6:01 PM
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If you can’t keep the best players in the state home you have no chance. Losing players like Butler and Williamson and others tells you all you need to know- Brad can’t recruit
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All-In [27374]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 6:48 PM
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If you really think the recruitment of Williamson was within the rules you don’t know much,
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110%er [6981]
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Re: Main thing for new Mens BB coach
Feb 12, 2022, 6:56 PM
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I keep hearing this X and O crap, I just don’t agree. I mean I’ll see very little On the court that impresses me. He’s a terrible game manager as well. He’s a mediocre coach that puts a mediocre team on court year after year, save the occasional player who gets hot
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