Replies: 74
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All-In [43992]
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The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:11 PM
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I am disappointed that he is transferring. I like him as a player and was expecting significant minutes and continued improvement from him next year.
But may I suggest we wait to see how things shake out before posting more negative stuff about our program? It’s really not helpful.
The transfer portal door swings both ways. Whether you like him or not, Brad is excellent at using the portal and making sure that we have a net gain each year from it. Let’s see what our backcourt looks like in October before we freak out, okay?
I anticipate we will all be pleased - assuming we can actually be objective about it.
Don’t forget, in addition to potential transfers, we have a 6’6” incoming freshman PG who will be able to help too.
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All-In [25697]
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??***
Apr 5, 2022, 3:15 PM
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All-TigerNet [11428]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:17 PM
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Besides the transfer class of Mitchell, Reed, and Thomas there have never been significant contributors from transfers in the Portal. Collins and Bohannon were role players in the portal. for Clemson to make the NCAAT next year, Clemson needs a very good PG similar to Mitchell when he was healthy. When that happens, let me know...
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All-In [43992]
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So you’re going to disregard the three most important transfers
Apr 5, 2022, 3:29 PM
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Brad got, simply because they don’t fit your narrative that Brad doesn’t get good transfers?
LOL, okay.
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All-TigerNet [11428]
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Re: So you’re going to disregard the three most important transfers
Apr 5, 2022, 3:33 PM
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Brad got, simply because they don’t fit your narrative that Brad doesn’t get good transfers?
LOL, okay.
yeah that was 7 years ago. How come he lost his touch?
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All-In [43992]
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What are you talking about?
Apr 5, 2022, 3:35 PM
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Collins and Bohannon were great pickups who made huge contributions.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: What are you talking about?
Apr 5, 2022, 3:38 PM
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Yes - we really improved like you promised from in the tourney to no NIT. Can’t wait to see this next round of improving.
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All-In [37639]
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Portal Players and Next Year...
Apr 5, 2022, 4:03 PM
[ in reply to What are you talking about? ] |
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I do hope we can get some contributors from the portal, but regardless we are looking at another .500 season next year at best. I had high expectations for this year that didn't pan out, so I am going to temper any positive expectations for next year.
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110%er [5379]
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"Great" and "Huge" are only relative because the Tigers
Apr 5, 2022, 10:09 PM
[ in reply to What are you talking about? ] |
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are so bad, that their very average play made them look much better than what they were. I agree that both played well at times, but overall they only shined due to athleticism more so than basketball talent.
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Legend [15976]
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:35 PM
[ in reply to Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable. ] |
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Wow, what a ridiculous post. Collins was not a role player this year. He was a starter, our 3rd leading scorer, our leading rebounder and top assist man.
So he's a role player, but honor and dawes were stud contributors huh?
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Commissioner [963]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 4:20 PM
[ in reply to Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable. ] |
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Technically, Reed and Mitchell were in a different transfer class than Thomas. They happened to finish at the same time, but they transferred in (and became eligible at different times). Reed and Mitchell came in with Legend Robertin, and Thomas came in with David Skara.
Other transfers (other than Reed, Mitchell, Thomas) that were pretty meaningful contributors:
Demarcus Harrison David Skara Mark Donnal Jonathan Baehre Nick Honor Tevin Mack David Collins
We've also had good role depth from guys like Curran Scott, Naz Bohannon, Khavon Moore, Javan White.
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Orange Blooded [3839]
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Yea this year really showed that?***
Apr 5, 2022, 3:18 PM
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All-In [43992]
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Bohannon and Collins both won games for us this year.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:32 PM
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Not sure what you expect from the portal, but considering who they replaced it’s obvious they were an upgrade.
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Hall of Famer [22381]
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Brad is NOT excellent at using the portal and making sure
Apr 5, 2022, 3:47 PM
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that we have a net gain each year from it. Otherwise, our record would have showed it this year.
You seem to be expecting the unexpected from the portal this year.
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All-In [43992]
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There are numerous examples of us having a net gain
Apr 5, 2022, 3:53 PM
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when looking at transfers in vs. transfers out.
If you can’t see that, you’re just not able to be objective.
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Hall of Famer [22381]
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This year really showed that. I would imagine that next
Apr 5, 2022, 4:02 PM
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year will as well.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:18 PM
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We’ll you assured us we upgraded at every position last year and we went from .667 win percentage to .515. Looking forward to how right you are this time.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 4:54 PM
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Honour and Dawes did not really have strong seasons so they contributed to this year's disappointment.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 6, 2022, 8:08 AM
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Dawes was our second leading scorer and lead the team in minutes played.
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Oculus Spirit [78829]
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While I pulled hard for Dawes and Honor . . .
Apr 5, 2022, 3:19 PM
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their transfers do not bother me!!! They did their best for our cause, but neither was the caliber of players we need to improve. Both were liabilities on defense due to size and ability . . . and in a few cases effort. One was a blatant weakness as a turnover magnet . . . especially in the closing moments of close games.
I expect our guard play to improve . . . possibly even drastically!!!
Best Wishes to both young men!!! Go Tigers!!!
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All-TigerNet [11428]
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Oh, also I thought that Brad's players love playing for him?
Apr 5, 2022, 3:19 PM
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How come he loses so many key players, or highly rated recruits to transfer?
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Oculus Spirit [78829]
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I am not convinced that Brad . . .
Apr 5, 2022, 3:29 PM
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doesn’t encourage some players to seek “greener pastures”, especially when he knows their abilities don’t measure up to what is needed.
As much as I disagree with Rick Neuheisel, he has one recurring comment that is so true .. . and it is, “It’s not the recruits you miss out on that hurt your program . . . It’s the ones you get that don’t pan out.”
I am convinced that every coach, to some degree, encourages kids to “move on” . . . be it for their sake and playing time, or for the coach’s need for better talent.
Just an old man’s opinion . . .
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All-TigerNet [10563]
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Well said Skeeta
Apr 5, 2022, 3:42 PM
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Except if you are going to encourage those with limited abilities to transfer you might just want to have someone to on hand to replace them. A plan.
Let's do a golf analogy here. you want to encourage your caddie to move on. okay, i get it. Something though tells though me you have a new caddie ready to go the next day. A plan.
What makes you think after 12 years there is a plan ?
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Well said Skeeta
Apr 5, 2022, 3:53 PM
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Did our second leading scorer who played in every game and average more minutes played than anyone on the team really qualify as “limited ability” relative to other talent available to this program?
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All-In [43992]
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All-TigerNet [10400]
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Re: Honest question, and please don’t take this the wrong way…
Apr 5, 2022, 3:41 PM
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Then turn that around on yourself....are you a Clemson football fan? You seem to go out of your way to criticize and portray the program in a negative light.
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Hall of Famer [21815]
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Oh, also I thought that Brad's players love playing for him?
Apr 5, 2022, 3:38 PM
[ in reply to Oh, also I thought that Brad's players love playing for him? ] |
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How come he loses so many key players, or highly rated recruits to transfer?
Come on man.... you can't be this dumb. You understand not every player transfers because of brownell. There's a whole slew of reasons.
You say that he loses a ton of key players, but then say Collins was a role player. List to me every key player that brownell has lost to the portal. I'll wait.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Oh, also I thought that Brad's players love playing for him?
Apr 5, 2022, 3:49 PM
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Every player who has ever started a game is a key player to a program that has done as little and consistently developed as little depth as Clemson. If you remember their name they were a key player. You’re trying to play this both ways while punching down at others for doing it. Collins was a key player. Dawes was also. Others in this thread are claiming Brad gave him the secret hand sign that he needed to move on because he’ll be seeing less time next year. It’s just stupid. You and JK went to the mat that this team would be better because of the transfers. JK, in this thread, is insisting this team was better because of transfers. We only graduated one significant player and JK insisted his replacements were better. Yet this team took a dramatic step backwards as most of us who follow both college basketball generally and Clemson specifically knew it would. Yet here you and JK are again doubling down that everything is fine and will be yet again, even better. It’s not fine. It’s not getting better. A deep, dark hole is being dug for the next guy. I’m sure Neff truly believes he’s doing the right thing - I have to believe it because we’re gonna be stuck with him awhile. But he’s dead wrong if he thinks there is anything that he can do in one off season to turn this ship around. The stink is on this coach and it isn’t going away no matter how much you, JK, Cobbox, and FutureDoc take umbrage at it.
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All-In [32587]
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You're on ignore by the troll - congerts.***
Apr 5, 2022, 3:51 PM
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All-TigerNet [10614]
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Re: Oh, also I thought that Brad's players love playing for him?
Apr 5, 2022, 5:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: Oh, also I thought that Brad's players love playing for him? ] |
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I can't argue with anything you said ..... and I like Brad Brownell. But at some point you really have to be honest and ask if the program is really getting any better. I think at best we tend to move laterally. It is discomforting to see upstarts, like Virginia Tech, who has no real pedigree as a basketball school, win the ACC Championship, when we have never really even sniffed it. Maybe I am ok with not winning it, but I sure would like to be competitive, which we are not and really have never been on a consistent basis. I was an OP fan, not particularly because he had great teams, but because his teams were at least fun to watch. Brad's teams are tough to watch, especially when it seemed his only focus was holding other teams to 52 points ..... usually when we scored 48. Maybe going back to the four corners offense would have suited him better.
What I really want is for Brad to succeed, even mildly ..... NIT about every year and NCAAs every few years. That would at least be a start. All of that said, I am extremely grateful for the young men that want to come here and give it a shot .... and particularly the ones who understand our culture is different and want to be a part of it for four or five years. I wish the best of luck to those who depart because they see a better opportunity elsewhere.
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Rock Defender [53]
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110%er [9666]
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Okay***
1
Apr 5, 2022, 3:22 PM
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Okay***
Apr 5, 2022, 3:45 PM
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If you think brownell loses better players than he receives through transfers, then back it up with logic and facts. I understand you don't like either one of those, but try......
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110%er [9666]
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Huh?
1
Apr 5, 2022, 3:48 PM
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All I said was “okay”
LOL
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All-In [32587]
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You're on ignore by the troll - congerts.***
Apr 5, 2022, 3:49 PM
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Legend [15501]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:23 PM
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I like your optimism (or maybe, lack of pessimism). Hopefully there really is a pony under, what seems, at least on the surface, to be yet another pile of crap.
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All-In [43992]
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I don’t know what will happen.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:37 PM
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But let’s see how it turns out first.
Give our coaches a chance to fix this, you know?
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Legend [19567]
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What needs to happen is we get starters
Apr 5, 2022, 6:34 PM
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at PG and SF who are upgrades over Honor, Dawes and Collins. Those guys are not on the team right now. That's a heavy lift for a team with middle of the road facilities, a coaching staff not making enough money, poor fan support, and not enough money in the budget
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Orange Blooded [2027]
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Do you proof-read your posts?
Apr 5, 2022, 8:19 PM
[ in reply to I don’t know what will happen. ] |
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Man I have listened to your attempts to defend this program under CBB and I will admit that you are the most patient fan EVER.
CBB is probably on a short lease and even the most loyal fan must know that.
Losing these two guards has to hurt and I do not agree that our transfer have all been upgrades.
However, he is the coach and I am looking forward to the make up of the team for 2022/2023.
Still think missing on uncovering the Richard kid with the orange family speaks volumes to this staffs inability to project. This kid after ONE year is on everybody’s radar.
When/if we ever make a change maybe we should look at the Belmont coach since he ‘developed’ Will Richard in ONE year.
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Orange Blooded [2027]
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Just to clear…replying to JK*
Apr 5, 2022, 8:23 PM
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Nm
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Freshman [-79]
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Hall of Famer [21815]
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Speaking of predictable...***
Apr 5, 2022, 3:27 PM
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All-In [32587]
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You're on ignore by the troll - congerts.***
Apr 5, 2022, 3:49 PM
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Hall of Famer [21815]
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LOL, I got blocked....I guess it's because they don't like
Apr 5, 2022, 4:27 PM
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being called out as a liar months ago.
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Letterman [281]
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Yep, Brad's awesome and can do no wrong,
Apr 5, 2022, 3:30 PM
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we certainly don't need players who average 11.3 points and shoot 39.8% from 3 to stick around the program. The Clown is an offensive guru, so he'll have this ship up and running in no time. Nothing to see here people, you are so colorblind that it's baffling!
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Yep, Brad's awesome and can do no wrong,
Apr 5, 2022, 3:36 PM
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I’m sure he let he’s second leading scorer know his services aren’t needed.
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110%er [6075]
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Lol yeah, Brad is so good at getting ACC caliber players from the portal
Apr 5, 2022, 3:32 PM
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Said no one ever besides JK
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Hall of Famer [22381]
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I would like to see it as an opportunity.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:36 PM
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But, with 12 years of history as our guide, recruiting guys who make immediate impacts while elevating our team is uncommon.
As we know, recruiting/transfers is the lifeblood of a program. As recruiting goes, so goes the future of the program. Hard to conclude that these recruiting losses help our team.
It just feels like more of the same from a recruiting/transfer perspective, which likely means more of the same from a team performance perspective next year.
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All-In [43992]
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That’s precisely the point.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:56 PM
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We need to wait and see if the departures benefit us or hurt us. Brad deserves time to get some players from the portal before getting chastised here.
Based on his history, we should be encouraged that the players who are brought in to replace Honor and Dawes will be upgrades. But we don’t know. We have to wait and see.
Jumping on Brad about this now before the ink has dried on the transfer paperwork only shows that you guys are anti-Brownell to a fault.
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All-In [40100]
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Dumb to say that it could benefit us. He was a great player
Apr 5, 2022, 4:00 PM
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and we would have benefitted from him being on the court/being part of our system. I doubt we will be so full that you'll look back and say I'm glad he's gone. That being said, it is a bit ridiculous on the flip side to overreact about this. It's the new nature of the game.
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CU Guru [1157]
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Re: That’s precisely the point.
Apr 5, 2022, 4:19 PM
[ in reply to That’s precisely the point. ] |
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No one "deserves" anything... Everything must be EARNED and after 12 years he has EARNED the door.
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All-TigerNet [10563]
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You may be the only person around that can beat a dead horse
Apr 5, 2022, 3:37 PM
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Back to life
I for one applaud your sticking to your guns.
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All-TigerNet [10822]
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Orange Blooded [4086]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 3:51 PM
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What a stupid thing to write.
Net gain each year?
So the team has been better and better and better over the last few years?
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Legend [16226]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 6, 2022, 10:17 AM
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Brad's average recruiting class ranking has been 38th over the past four years, a very decent number for our program over that span. It's tough to fathom in any way how our team is actually better than that number with the transfers we've brought in to replace those that have left considering our performances on the court.
If the OP's point that we improve with transfers is accurate, then Brad is clearly squandering what should be a more talented roster than the numbers imply. He is doing less with more.
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All-In [40100]
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I’m not overreacting, I hate losing him too but
Apr 5, 2022, 3:54 PM
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Should we wait one more year or 12 more years. Just sose I can mark my calendar.
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Walk-On [107]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 4:20 PM
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Give it up, man. You're embarrassing yourself.
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CU Guru [1650]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 4:44 PM
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Now, please give us a pep talk about our baseball program and how we are better off with Monte than Jack.
Discuss how our preseason sluggers are going through a slump and how it's not uncommon for a slump to last for half of the season and how a strikeout is better than a single according to analytics.
Please explain the silver lining in getting swept by UCONN at home in a regional and how it's not uncommon that we can't seem to advance from a regional if we even make it.
Follow that up with the rationalizing the inconsistencies in our starting pitching and why we always lose if we don't score the first run.
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Recruit [93]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 7:31 PM
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I need this pep talk right now.
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All-In [38452]
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It’s really not helpful.
Apr 5, 2022, 5:03 PM
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Is posting positive stuff helpful?
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Legend [16900]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 1/25/07
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Re: It’s really not helpful.
Apr 5, 2022, 5:30 PM
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Dawes probably transferred because of my post about Brownell’s salary.
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Legend [16226]
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Posts: 12771
Joined: 11/14/09
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I'm not terribly surprised by Dawes' transfer.
Apr 5, 2022, 5:28 PM
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As an incoming 4-star who showed a lot of potential as a freshman his career here has kind of stagnated since. Hopefully it turns into a win/win.
Go Tigers.
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Oculus Spirit [93608]
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Posts: 95384
Joined: 12/25/09
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 5:35 PM
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They keep score in games and tally wins vs losses. No need to be objective about it.
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Hall of Famer [21722]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 13534
Joined: 11/8/13
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 6:12 PM
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~JKB
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Legend [19567]
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Posts: 17277
Joined: 8/18/05
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Brad has been here 12 years and has yet
Apr 5, 2022, 6:53 PM
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to recruit a true, impact freshman. And the 6'6 guard was recruited as a wing
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Orange Blooded [4035]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 8/19/03
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 5, 2022, 9:38 PM
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Why do you think Dawes did not thank CBB in his Twitter note? Gotta be some bad blood to omit the coach.
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Orange Blooded [2574]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 12/17/21
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Yep I agree. I noticed he didn’t
Apr 5, 2022, 10:01 PM
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mention Brownell either. That’s pretty telling. I have been reading the posts on tigernet for a long time. I just cannot believe anyone is still defending Brownell. My lord give it up. I wish him well but we need a change now. We’ve needed it for a minimum of 3 years. I know we don’t have everything in place to be successful but hopefully Neff will work on that. There are coaches out there who have done more with far less than we have to offer and they are also making much less money than Brad. I want Clemson to be successful in every sport and I support the basketball program. We don’t live near Clemson so we can’t attend many games but try to attend a few a year. I support football more because it’s my favorite sport.
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Legend [15976]
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Joined: 12/11/12
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Good Lord, your mother-henning of Brad is comical...
Apr 5, 2022, 11:20 PM
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...at this point. No one could possibly look at Honor and Dawes transferring as a net positive but you. So we're supposed to wait and see who Brad brings in from the portal before being concerned? It's just wait til next year, oh and wait til the next year, and then wait until the next year after that, ad nauseaum. It's an old and tired narrative, and many of us are done with it. Sorry, but that's the truth.
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110%er [6980]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 9/21/04
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Yes year 13 will make all the difference
Apr 6, 2022, 8:01 AM
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SMH,
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Standout [307]
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 6, 2022, 9:51 AM
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When Brad gets fired, where are you hoping you guys end up?
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110%er [5512]
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Joined: 10/21/15
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 6, 2022, 9:56 AM
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What's predictable is:
(A) Starters leaving our program, and (B) Your post
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CU Guru [1868]
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Joined: 9/9/18
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Re: The overreacting here about Dawes transferring is predictable.
Apr 6, 2022, 1:41 PM
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Agree that Dawes being out opens the door for someone better coming in via portal. Want the tall freshman to contribute right away, but I’m pretty skeptical. Looking like a lot more pt for chase hunter, who emerged as best guard on team. Need to pluck a shelton mitchell type guy. I’m definitely way more down on what brad’s done at clemson than you are but hipe he comes up big with some backcourt transfers and puts together a team that is on par with or better than the 17-18 team that made the sweet 16
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110%er [7913]
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Joined: 1/8/02
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You’ll make excuses for this coach til the day you
Apr 6, 2022, 3:40 PM
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pass away or he’s fired….eventually he’s got to deliver results no matter our history or lack of expectations
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