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CU Medallion [55674]
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'twas not a good night for Trump. Or freedom. Or wealth.
Nov 6, 2019, 9:13 AM
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In APM's very red district, the Republicans won. However, Virginia's legislature went all blue. This is DESPITE a Democrat blackface wearing governor and an accused rapist lieutenant governor. That tells me something.
It's the suburbs. Educated, rich Whites are bailing on DJT. I hate it because the alternative to DJT really sucks. Oh well, after we get 4 years of Socialism in which those educated, rich honkies lose their jobs and houses and DJT becomes something of a distant memory, maybe it will swing back.
https://apnews.com/03e78ab61fd94074b49bcfbf73ba4f84
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All-In [48078]
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Re: 'twas not a good night for Trump. Or freedom. Or wealth.
Nov 6, 2019, 9:15 AM
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If Hillary were president the economy would be the same for you, but better for farmers.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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So they'd get even more corn subsidies?***
Nov 6, 2019, 9:18 AM
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Heisman Winner [137808]
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I bet it would be something south of $30B, so there's that.***
Nov 6, 2019, 9:25 AM
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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That seems like a lot of money to ruin boat engines
Nov 6, 2019, 9:26 AM
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lawnmowers and weed trimmers.
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All-In [48078]
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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I'd bet on more subsidies***
Nov 6, 2019, 9:56 AM
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All-In [48078]
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Re: I'd bet on more subsidies***
Nov 6, 2019, 10:30 AM
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What were they given under Obama compared to what they have been given under Trump? When were the farmers doing better too?
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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Thats a good question.
Nov 6, 2019, 10:38 AM
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I googled it, and it's more difficult than it initially sounds to find an answer.
I guess Obama signed some farm subsidy bill in 2014, and then Trump had some thing last year but farmers are complaining it didn't help them. So to answer your question, I have no idea. I'm not researching it enough to get a definitive answer because i don't care that much.
All i know is that we are using crops to make fuel that causes an entire problem of downstream affects, and the American taxpayer is generally on the hook to pay for the subsides to grow the corn that makes up the ethanol. People who use the fuel don't like it because it ruins the engines its used in, and environmentalists don't like it because it uses more energy to make the fuel than it saves in actual fuel use.
The only people who seem to like it are farmers, and the people getting paid by the government to grow more of it.
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All-In [46801]
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I look at it as yeah Bernie and Warren have way out there
Nov 6, 2019, 9:16 AM
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policies, but those policies have to go through Congress.
Trump's Twitter account doesn't.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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When Trumps twitter account starts mattering in my life
Nov 6, 2019, 9:18 AM
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I'll worry about it.
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All-In [48966]
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If his twitter account gets Bernie or Warren
Nov 6, 2019, 9:37 AM
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elected, for example?
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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How might that happen?
Nov 6, 2019, 9:42 AM
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Just like with Hillary, I'm still of the mindset that someone who is leaning toward voting for Trump isn't going to automatically vote for his polar opposite due to something he posts on Twitter.
"Wow, that was a really insensitive and dumb comment from Trump. I think i'm tired of him and will vote for Bernie, instead."
Nope..I just don't see it happening.
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All-In [48966]
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But they might not vote at all***
Nov 6, 2019, 9:44 AM
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Standout [347]
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His Twitter definitely contributes to why I will be voting against
Nov 6, 2019, 9:48 AM
[ in reply to How might that happen? ] |
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him in 2020. I’m an independent, and the crap he writes, the attacking, vulgar speech he uses, the lies, the insults, all have helped convince me that I will not be voting for him. The are other factors too, like I think he is a legitimate moron, and has no plan and makes decisions by the seat of his pants. But the speech and twitter are two major factors.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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So you are more worried about his demeanor than you are
Nov 6, 2019, 9:54 AM
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advancing the party's goals.
I guess that makes sense for your perspective if you really hate the guy, but from an overall perspective, the result is just going to make more gridlock.
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All-TigerNet [11145]
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C'mon IE, it ain't about advancing the party's
Nov 6, 2019, 10:32 AM
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goals. If that is true, the GOP platform is currently full up with covering Trump's a s s for every dumb thing he does and says; and cowering in fear that he might call his cult to vote against you if you disagree with him. The GOP has no goal right now, what it should be is cleaving itself from its miasmic addiction to a personality cult. The goal is to advance America and he is clearly not doing that.
We need Pubs and Dems in Washington thinking with their heads on straight and not b itching at each other like school children.
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All-In [48078]
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Re: C'mon IE, it ain't about advancing the party's
Nov 6, 2019, 10:35 AM
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On the other hand, he is better for the Repubs goals than a radical left Dem. Thats how tbey view it.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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And thats exactly how Dems would view it if they had a
Nov 6, 2019, 10:44 AM
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Democratic senate and president.
Thats kinda how that works.
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All-In [48078]
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Re: And thats exactly how Dems would view it if they had a
Nov 6, 2019, 11:25 AM
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More than likely, but I am thinking about Repub voters too. The Dem options make it not worth turning on Trump.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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agreed
Nov 6, 2019, 12:03 PM
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Personally, I think the Democrats would do much more for themselves by unanimously finding a potential candidate and grooming him/her to be elected rather than starting another inquiry or fighting the same fight.
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All-In [48078]
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Re: agreed
Nov 6, 2019, 12:06 PM
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No doubt. They are wasting their time.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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"We need Pubs and Dems in Washington thinking with their
Nov 6, 2019, 10:42 AM
[ in reply to C'mon IE, it ain't about advancing the party's ] |
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heads on straight and not b itching at each other like school children."
Agreed, 100%. When was the last time that happened? I remember that many Dems liked Reagan..but thats been 37 years ago.
And if you really want to discuss a "personality cult", shouldn't we also talk about the last president who was elected solely on his race?
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All-TigerNet [11145]
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The divisiveness wasn't nearly as bad during
Nov 6, 2019, 11:00 AM
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Clinton, Dubya, or Obama. All of those guys understood servant leadership and grew in their position. Trump has no concept of anything larger than himself and when he goes down he will drag as much of the country with him that he can.
As far as Obama being elected because he was black, to my eyes it had more to do with McCain picking a crazy person as his VP and him suspending his campaign during the financial crisis. Didn't hurt that Obama was a midwesterner, either. Midwest gonna vote for the midwest guy, always have.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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I'd disagree on the divisiveness.
Nov 6, 2019, 11:07 AM
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There just weren't as many people voicing their opinions as you see now, and social media certainly has expanded, especially with the popularity of twitter in Obama's 2nd term.
Some of it is blow back from the never ending slamming of Trump from the Hollywood type folks. For instance: Jimmy Kimmel has changed his show in the last 4 years to be anti Donald Trump. Trump could cure cancer and fix the debt, and somehow, Kimmel would find a problem with it. And that's just one guy with one national TV show--there are many examples of the same thing out there.
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All-TigerNet [11145]
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Presidents are always going to get the roast from
Nov 6, 2019, 11:53 AM
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the late night TV shows. The difference now is that Trump is irredeemable, there is literally nothing to like about the guy. Nothing, the entire world knows it. And he only has himself to blame for his critics.
His job is not to respond to every slight, stay up late at night twidderb itching about every little thing said about him. He's not doing his job in any fundamental way. Watching Fox News for 5 hours a day is not what a president should do, in fact it is the opposite of what a president should do.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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I don't recall the vitriol for Obama.
Nov 6, 2019, 12:00 PM
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From any news source, late night talk show, or anyone the general public sees on daily television. Maybe from Fox news..but out of the 5 or 6 major news agencies, I'm not sure they can be considered any sort of majority. Nothing to do with news, but Obama won a Nobel peace prize for God's sake. What did he do to deserve that?
I've already stated what I think a president has to do to be successful. Much like my job, if I can do that in 15 minutes or 15 hours a day...whatever it takes to get it done. I'm not watching his clock--he's not an hourly employee. I don't worry about that kind of stuff.
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Freshman [-75]
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Re: I don't recall the vitriol for Obama.
Nov 7, 2019, 6:07 AM
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On the contrary, he works for you, me, and everyone else.
He should be working and productive 24/7.
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Standout [347]
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Sort of, I never would have thought that I would care more
Nov 6, 2019, 11:32 AM
[ in reply to So you are more worried about his demeanor than you are ] |
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about a president’s personality than his work, but Trump has brought me to that point because he is pretty much the worst representative for the country we could have.
Add on the fact that I don’t think he has really done much to advance his agenda, and I will gladly vote for someone to represent our country much better, along with actually get something done. Sure the economy is in a good spot, but I don’t credit him for much of that. He spends most of his time golfing, or complaining on Twitter about the Democrats. The Democrats tried to meet with him about infrastructure and make progress and he walked out because he was upset he’s being investigated. He calls them the do nothing Democrat’s but he does nothing to actually make progress.
Sorry for the long response, but in summary, I think anyone else in office can do what he has done, and they will represent us much better to the world while they do it.
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Legend [15730]
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This is the crux of the issue for Conservatives.
Nov 7, 2019, 9:06 AM
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I used to make the same point about Obama as the economy slowly recovered. What did he do? There is nothing I could point to that one would argue improves the economy. At best, he stayed out of the way most of the time (and that’s to his credit), but when he got involved, it was, in my opinion, to the detriment of the economy.
Trump has eased regulations, reformed taxes. Yes, he has also created trade barriers, but he is, in my opinion, actively involved in the economy.
Anyway, the crux: how do you weigh the man as he represents the country versus the policies? I don’t blame anyone who values the representation of the POTUS and refuses to vote for the man. Right now, I’m voting for him without question over Warren and Sanders...possibly over Biden (not the most dignified representative himself, but he’s polished next to Trump).
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Standout [347]
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His tax cut didn’t do a whole lot for the country.
Nov 7, 2019, 11:20 AM
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Sure they helped some, but nothing significant. All of the positive stuff going on with the economy started before he was president. And note, I’m not saying Obama was responsible. We’ve been on a long recovery track since 2010 from a deep recession, things are going to inherently go up (or down if you’re talking unemployment). He’s hasn’t significantly altered that in any way. So for me, I think he can easily be substituted by someone else, have the same strong economy, and we would not have to deal with a total a$$hole leading our country. He brings nothing to the table that anyone else couldn’t do. And I think other people would get even more done. He had control of Congress for two years and has nothing to show for it. He could have had $25 billion for his wall, but he made a bad deal, and ended up getting very little. His tariff plan with China is terrible (he doesn’t have a plan, just acts out of impulse). Because of that, looking at leading economic indicators, there’s a chance that could cause a recession in the next year. Because of all that, and you add on the fact that he’s a dope and an awful person, I will definitely not vote for him in 2020.
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Standout [347]
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Sort of, I never would have thought that I would care more
Nov 6, 2019, 11:32 AM
[ in reply to So you are more worried about his demeanor than you are ] |
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about a president’s personality than his work, but Trump has brought me to that point because he is pretty much the worst representative for the country we could have.
Add on the fact that I don’t think he has really done much to advance his agenda, and I will gladly vote for someone to represent our country much better, along with actually get something done. Sure the economy is in a good spot, but I don’t credit him for much of that. He spends most of his time golfing, or complaining on Twitter about the Democrats. The Democrats tried to meet with him about infrastructure and make progress and he walked out because he was upset he’s being investigated. He calls them the do nothing Democrat’s but he does nothing to actually make progress.
Sorry for the long response, but in summary, I think anyone else in office can do what he has done, and they will represent us much better to the world while they do it.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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I think thats a fair statement.
Nov 6, 2019, 11:55 AM
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I don't particularly care for his personality. He's not someone that I have much in common with, nor would want to hang out with. He makes me uncomfortable with his lies and seemingly needless exaggerations and how he often presents himself.
But I'm also not sure that "representing our country" (poorly, I assume) has had detrimental affects to us as a nation. I disagree with his stance on trade and tarriffs, but that's only from an academic perspective because that's what they taught me at Clemson. I do understand Trump's reasoning for enacting them. Is it bad long term? I don't know, we'll see. I don't think it is having the immediate affect that Trump thought they would have. They probably affect China a lot more negatively than they affect the US.
My perspective is Trump was hated by the left before he ever was sworn in. I think that was pretty obvious by the reactions by the left for months after the election, from the protesting and booing, to the wishes to change the electoral college process. They were mad that Hillary didn't win, and have effectively tried every possible reason to get rid of him since he was elected. He's been under some sort of investigation essentially while he has been in office. I can understand his frustration. It would frustrate me.
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Standout [347]
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That’s fair, although I would say that the constant investigation,
Nov 6, 2019, 12:22 PM
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while it may be frustrating, is no excuse to act the way he does. And it should not prevent him at all from continuing to work to advance his agenda, yet he allows it to consume him and he won’t get anything done. He had full control his first two years, and doesn’t have much to show for it. I think that he can be easily swapped out without missing a beat, probably actually get more done, and not #### off the whole world while we are at it.
I think we both stated our points so there’s not much more to say, although I will add this. I somewhat disagree that his behavior and the way he represents the US has detrimental effects with our relationships with other nations, but that’s an opinion. What we have seen though, is people in our own country who see the president’s actions and then feel they are justified in acting the same way. The whole dialogue has become much more divisive and attacking over the last couple years. Not saying he started it, but he sure has made it a whole lot worse. That is detrimental to our country, I think.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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I'm not defending him nor his attitude, or words.
Nov 6, 2019, 1:14 PM
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I tend to agree with your first sentence. That said, I don't need to fly off the handle daily like many in here do due to Trumps reactionary attitude. It doesn't help me, nor really anyone to do that. Its simpler to ignore the noise. Have Felix's daily bombshells on how much Trump sucks changed anyone's mind? I tend to doubt it, and I'm not sure what it really accomplishes.
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All-In [26968]
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I'm an example of someone who probably would vote
Nov 6, 2019, 9:49 AM
[ in reply to How might that happen? ] |
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for President Trump if his demeanor toward people were better, and that includes his Twitter behavior. I'm not voting for the Democrat candidate, of course. I'll likely vote for a so-called "third party" candidate.
I don't know how many are like that, but the number is not zero.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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I don't care a lot about what he says, really.
Nov 6, 2019, 10:01 AM
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He's a liar, and an a-hole. We knew that before he was elected.
But he's doing the only two things i ask of a president: Keep us out of a war, and encourage conditions favorable for a good business climate.
I don't need a politician acting as a moral leader in my life. I'm surprised that you do, either.
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All-In [26968]
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We all need such a leader, always.
Nov 6, 2019, 10:15 AM
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In my opinion, of course. I need them in my home, in my job, in my church, and in my government.
I have directly observe changes in behavior by people I love, that I believe is directly attributable to an attempt to imitate or justify behavior by the President. It happens all around us, every day.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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I've got more going on in my life than what Trump is doing.
Nov 6, 2019, 10:22 AM
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Personally, I don't have time to worry about all his nonsense, and I wonder how other folks with families and jobs have time to worry about it, either.
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All-In [26968]
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It takes the same amount of time to think about that
Nov 6, 2019, 10:50 AM
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as it does to think about anything else that's posted here all the time. In fact, you're thinking about it right now in this thread.
"Worry" is not the right word, to me. I'm considering it in my vote, but not worrying about it.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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I imagine that you spend more mental cycles on what
Nov 6, 2019, 11:02 AM
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Trump has said and tweeted than many do. I'd call that "worry", a you seem to be upset about much of what he says.
I genuinely think a lot of what he says/tweets is to get reactions out of his opponents. And some of it is him simply not knowing when to stop talking out loud. He's not a typical politician by any means, and that seems to fluster a lot of folks, especially those who spend a lot of time worrying about such things. Why people can't seem to accept that and move on is the part I've never understood.
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All-In [26968]
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I don't know what "accept it and move on" means.
Nov 6, 2019, 11:19 AM
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I was just talking about my potential 2020 vote. I don't live my life thinking all day about the President's Twitter feed. I don't even follow it. Sometimes people post here about what he says on Twitter, or I'll see it mentioned in a news article, but that's the only way I know.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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You're being disingenuous again.
Nov 6, 2019, 11:44 AM
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I don't need to explain this to you. Certainly you understand the meaning of "accept it (his behavior) and move on". You are smarter and younger (at least chronologically) than I am. I'm pretty sure you perfectly understand the context of what I stated in that sentence.
You just posted:
"I'm an example of someone who probably would vote for President Trump if his demeanor toward people were better, and that includes his Twitter behavior"
So while you may not technically "follow" Trump on twitter, you are certainly aware of his demeanor and comments on Twitter. And what does much of what he says intended to do? I think we have already determined that his intentions are often to pique his opponents, which above, you said you would base your vote on.
So if you would accept that much of what Trump says is purely for non-governing reasons, and move on to what is his governance is actually causing (good or bad), you would be less inclined to worry about the non related stuff that is said about-and by- him.
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All-In [26968]
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We just have a fundamental disagreement about
Nov 6, 2019, 12:00 PM
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the nature of governing. That's all this is. I believe his his behavior toward people IS governing, and perhaps the most important part of it. Would you say the way your boss talks and behaves toward you is an important part of his job? I think it's one of the most important parts of his or her job.
I don't know why I should "accept that and move on" any more than you should "accept and move on" and not think about some quality you don't like a candidate you may not vote for. If you don't like "Medicare for All," should you just "accept it and move on" that Warren (or some Democrat) supports it, and not consider that in your vote? I wouldn't say that.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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I guess you are correct.
Nov 6, 2019, 12:09 PM
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I've had bosses that I disliked personally, but essentially were good for their position. I don't need to personally like someone for them to be effective at their job.
Like I said, I neither need nor want a spiritual or moral leader as my president. You seem to want that, and think its necessary. I only want them to be effective at what they are there to do-govern. Appeasing those that will not like him regardless of what he does is not an important quality for a president as it offers no value, IMO.
Your example of Medicare for All is a policy/governing related argument, not personality or demeanor trait. That's very much something I think everyone should be concerned about.
Do you not see the difference?
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All-In [26968]
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Of course, there's an obvious and vast difference...
Nov 6, 2019, 12:19 PM
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But not necessarily a difference in importance. We see their relative importance very differently.
It's not so much about personally liking or disliking. I only think in those terms about people I know personally. It's about deciding whether or not the person is the person I want in that position, if I have the ability to affect that, as I do in an election. The President holds very few of the qualities I look for in a leader. In fact he typically embodies the very opposite of several of those qualities.
The way I see it, if I think it's important that a leader be honest, humble, gracious, and kind, and I vote for someone who isn't like that, then that would be pretty small of me. Here's my opportunity to have an impact, tiny though it may be, and I don't use it to stand for what I believe in? I don't want to operate like that. I want my voice to be heard, even if I'm the only person in the world who has that view.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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If you feel the soft skills he doesn't possess are important
Nov 6, 2019, 1:10 PM
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to run a country, then vote what you feel. Many people have voted for a candidate for a lot less important characteristics, like race.
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All-In [42026]
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Re: I don't care a lot about what he says, really.
Nov 6, 2019, 4:01 PM
[ in reply to I don't care a lot about what he says, really. ] |
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I don't need a politician acting as a moral leader in my life. I'm surprised that you do, either.
That's a pretty ridiculous backhanded comment at Prod. Trump's demeanor is hurting our relationship with our allies, it's led to his reckless presidency where he exhibits little respect for our Constitution or integrity in government, and it has further divided our nation.
I'm happy he's checked those two boxes for you, but I'm surprised anyone can use those as reasons to give this president carte blanche behavior.
And if we start to continue to normalize immoral, dishonest, and ####### people like him as our leaders, don't be shocked at the direction our country heads.
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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It's not a backhanded comment at all.
Nov 6, 2019, 4:27 PM
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Its exactly what it said. Why would someone like Prod, who is obviously a very religious person, be looking for ANY politician to be a moral or spiritual leader for him? I can't understand why any semi-intelligent person would do that. I mean if I want to see good football, I don't go to the Citadel to watch it. And I'm not looking for any politician, of all people, to be moral leader, that's for sure.
You say Trump's demeanor has damaged our relationships with our allies. I'm not sure I really believe that, but if it has, how has that manifested itself to any result that has hurt us as a nation?
As to dividing us as a nation...our nation was pretty divided under Bush and Obama--you seem to have pretty convenient memory when recollecting the countries attitude towards its leaders. The left has been mad since even before Trump was sworn in; they didn't get Hillary, and have been upset about it since then. The crying continues, and the "not my president" crowd has pushed its leaders to keep the up the never ending investigations.
"And if we start to continue to normalize immoral, dishonest, and ####### people like him as our leaders, don't be shocked at the direction our country heads."
We've been going in a wrong direction for a long time, and Trump didn't start or cause it. The destruction of the importance of the family unit can be squarely blamed for that, and a lot of liberal ideology is the cause of that, among other things. What ultimately will end America, however, will be our debt; not the ridiculous comments a president (or anyone) doles out on twitter on the reg.
Message was edited by: Ineligible user®
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All-In [42026]
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Re: It's not a backhanded comment at all.
Nov 6, 2019, 6:04 PM
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Its exactly what it said. Why would someone like Prod, who is obviously a very religious person, be looking for ANY politician to be a moral or spiritual leader for him? I can't understand why any semi-intelligent person would do that. I mean if I want to see good football, I don't go to the Citadel to watch it. And I'm not looking for any politician, of all people, to be moral leader, that's for sure.
It seemed like it. And I don't think it's too much to ask that the leader of our nation strive for high moral standards.
You say Trump's demeanor has damaged our relationships with our allies. I'm not sure I really believe that, but if it has, how has that manifested itself to any result that has hurt us as a nation?
That kind of stuff causes long term damage, and history shows it. He's pushed away our traditional allies while somehow getting cozy with the likes of Russia and other despicable authoritarian leaders (because that's what he admires).
As to dividing us as a nation...our nation was pretty divided under Bush and Obama--you seem to have pretty convenient memory when recollecting the countries attitude towards its leaders. The left has been mad since even before Trump was sworn in; they didn't get Hillary, and have been upset about it since then. The crying continues, and the "not my president" crowd has pushed its leaders to keep the up the never ending investigations.
He has made it far, far worse. The fallacy of your position here is this "left" obsession. Trumpies are an unusual breed. They aren't conservatives because he isn't a conservative. That's a simple fact and his actions/beliefs before getting elected prove that. Most moderates don't care for him. He won an election in a weird anomaly that was a perfect storm of the EC and Americans voting against a trash Dem candidate.
How y'all still continue to believe this man is a conservative leader that most Americans want is beyond me. The simple numbers and data show that. He lost the popular vote and his approval ratings have still been horrible. Our country doesn't want him. This isn't some case of sour grapes. The majority of this nation despises the man as president.
It's also pretty absurd to not see why the man is getting investigated. He continues to abuse the power of the office. Y'all continue to pretend that he's some innocent victim who hasn't done anything wrong. It's ridiculous.
Did the "Left" try to get Reagan impeached because they were made Carter lost? Did they try it with Bush Sr. because they wanted Dukakis? Or Bush Jr.? No? Well, there goes that argument.
We've been going in a wrong direction for a long time, and Trump didn't start or cause it. The destruction of the importance of the family unit can be squarely blamed for that, and a lot of liberal ideology is the cause of that, among other things. What ultimately will end America, however, will be our debt; not the ridiculous comments a president (or anyone) doles out on twitter on the reg.
The destruction of the importance of family has never been a liberal tenant, nor anything the Democratic party has embraced. And I challenge you to prove your claim. Idiot presidents aside, we're living in arguably the best time in American history. If you disagree, cite a decade for me (maybe the 90s since the music was ballin').
I'm glad you brought up the debt. At least we can agree there... but you seem to ignore your beloved president who has added to that. Why isn't that inexcusable to you? Why do you give him a pass on his waste?
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
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Re: It's not a backhanded comment at all.
Nov 7, 2019, 9:30 AM
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It seemed like it. And I don't think it's too much to ask that the leader of our nation strive for high moral standards.
Politicians aren't known to be truthful, nor dependable. They say what they need to in order to be reelected. Why would anyone believe much of anything any of them say? Its one thing to be lied to and not know it, but its quite another to continue to believe what someone says when you know they are habitual liars.
That kind of stuff causes long term damage, and history shows it. He's pushed away our traditional allies while somehow getting cozy with the likes of Russia and other despicable authoritarian leaders (because that's what he admires).
I don't know what Trump admires, and I doubt you do either. I don't know the man. But that's a nice redirection from not answering the question of how have Trumps "low morals" have manifested itself to any result that has hurt us as a nation.
He has made it far, far worse. The fallacy of your position here is this "left" obsession. Trumpies are an unusual breed. They aren't conservatives because he isn't a conservative. That's a simple fact and his actions/beliefs before getting elected prove that. Most moderates don't care for him. He won an election in a weird anomaly that was a perfect storm of the EC and Americans voting against a trash Dem candidate.
When you start generalizing entire groups of people as "trumpies" and believe that they all think exactly alike, your fallacy here is ad populanum, and it completely discredits the rest of your argument. Next.
How y'all still continue to believe this man is a conservative leader that most Americans want is beyond me. The simple numbers and data show that. He lost the popular vote and his approval ratings have still been horrible. Our country doesn't want him. This isn't some case of sour grapes. The majority of this nation despises the man as president.
It's also pretty absurd to not see why the man is getting investigated. He continues to abuse the power of the office. Y'all continue to pretend that he's some innocent victim who hasn't done anything wrong. It's ridiculous.
You are really starting to go off the rails here. Y'all? Y'all who? Your hasty generalizations and just pure hatred of the guy are poisoning your reasoning. Who said he is a conservative? Who even mentioned that? And I think there is still a large portion of people who still "want him". Do you see anyone in the next election that will be taking his seat? Who?
Did the "Left" try to get Reagan impeached because they were made Carter lost? Did they try it with Bush Sr. because they wanted Dukakis? Or Bush Jr.? No? Well, there goes that argument.
I think elections and reactions were completely different then due to the absence of social media, but there was no credible audience that thought Carter would win his election. Not many people could get reelected president after having the results of their economic policies coined as "stag-flation". You may not have been around during Carter's tenure, but IMO, in reality it was just as bad as the "great recession" from a purely economic standpoint.
The destruction of the importance of family has never been a liberal tenant, nor anything the Democratic party has embraced. And I challenge you to prove your claim. Idiot presidents aside, we're living in arguably the best time in American history. If you disagree, cite a decade for me (maybe the 90s since the music was ballin').
Divorce, abortion, reduction of punishment for criminals, lax laws for criminal offenders, increased illicit drug use--if those aren't the effects of liberal policy, I don't know what are.
I'm glad you brought up the debt. At least we can agree there... but you seem to ignore your beloved president who has added to that. Why isn't that inexcusable to you? Why do you give him a pass on his waste?
Who gives him a pass? I've railed on every president through Obama (who doubled the debt in 8 years..FYI), but what's the point? The idea hasn't caught on. Not many seem to care. We seem much more interested in Russian investigations and impeachment hearings and continue to kick the can down the road. As I said yesterday, I'm tired of complaining about it. After Obama's spending, its obvious nothing will change with any president, until we are bankrupt and can no longer borrow more money. I hope I'm dead by that point, because its going to be a bad place and time to be alive.
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Orange Blooded [2692]
TigerPulse: 97%
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Joined: 7/3/07
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The pendulum swings back
Nov 6, 2019, 9:44 AM
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this is the cycle of American politics. A reliable, constantly moving needle.
Alternatives to the wild left will bring us closer to the center, but these candidates are usually too vanilla for either party.
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All-In [31864]
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Come on...the alternative to Trump is not Socialism...
Nov 6, 2019, 9:47 AM
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how about a conservative that's not a narcissistic, ill-prepared, undisciplined, incompetent, jack-arse?
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Oculus Spirit [80999]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Who's that running?
Nov 6, 2019, 9:48 AM
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I'll take a look.
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All-In [48966]
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Standout [347]
TigerPulse: 84%
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Joined: 7/1/19
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Well luckily Bernie doesn’t have a real shot so socialism isn’t
Nov 6, 2019, 9:53 AM
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something we need to worry about anytime soon. And those educated, rich suburbanites won’t lose their job or houses just because a Democrat gets elected, so they will be just fine.
Maybe Trump should try to expand his base and appease those suburbanites instead of just pandering to his core supporters every chance he gets. He’s done nothing to gain votes from people in the middle, and has turned independents like me away from him.
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All-In [42026]
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Re: 'twas not a good night for Trump. Or freedom. Or wealth.
Nov 6, 2019, 12:44 PM
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"Educated, rich Whites are bailing on DJT."
Many, if not most of them, were never in his corner to begin with.
It's still a long way until next November, but these last two elections are showing a national pushback against Trump and the GOP on all levels. He's been a disaster and you've got a healthy mix of people who didn't vote in 2016 and those who simply voted against Hillary now joining up to get him and his ilk out of office.
By rallying around this train wreck, the GOP has forced independent voters to choose between SC Gamecocks and UGA Bulldogs. We know we hate the Dawgs, but we know what happens when Coots are successful.
Contrary to the myth of Trump lovers, the majority of the country despises this man. He won on a fluke situation.
And it's pretty funny that you say freedom had a bad night when the public steps up to vote and make a democratic decision.
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CU Guru [1878]
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Oh look, the Socialism boogie-man hiding in ATL's closet again...***
Nov 6, 2019, 4:06 PM
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Legend [15492]
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Re: 'twas not a good night for Trump. Or freedom. Or wealth.
Nov 6, 2019, 8:45 PM
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Well put comrade. 
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