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110%er [8008]
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For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 1:00 PM
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Just watch the media press conferences of the Commissioners of Big 10, SEC, Big 12, and ACC. Three of them were upbeat, confident, excited about their futures, and talked openly about expanding their leagues. The other one looked and acted defeated. Inspired no confidence at all.
That, along with Dabo’s words (“everyone knows where we’re headed”) should tell you all you need to know.
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Senior Writer [∞]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 1:18 PM
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None of this spells anything good for the ACC. None of it.
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CU Medallion [55393]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 3:00 PM
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I have always been one that hated to say that I told you so, but I said years ago that Clemson should ask the SEC for entry every year until they brought us in, and the majority didn't want any part of that. The ACC didn't just get in the shape that it's in now, it has been dead heading in this direction for years!!! How many ACC schools has anybody seen in the past 10 years make a drive to have the best FB team in the ACC, what, how many, and who were they!!!!!
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Legend [17596]
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Copy that ...
Jul 27, 2022, 5:17 PM
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I posted a year or two ago about Wake and Duke receiving an equal football revenue split as Clemson. Received a dozen or so replies defending Wake as a great partner and charter member of ACC. No longer seeing those posts.
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110%er [8534]
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Re: Copy that ...
Jul 27, 2022, 8:09 PM
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Of course every school gets the same share because that is why a conference exists.
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110%er [5021]
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Re: Copy that ...
Jul 28, 2022, 6:17 AM
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Imagine as a coach you are recruiting 24/7….on the road away from your family trying to convince a teenager to come play for your program…You get the kids you covet on campus and you have to protect them and groom them as football players and men…practicing and prepping them for the next level and to compete at their current level…game planning and strategizing…watching film….having a successful Saturday that fortunately lands you in the playoffs…Now imagine winning 4 playoff games and 2 national championships and having to split the revenue from that run with schools in your conference who don’t give a sh*t about football…
We’ve been organ donors for the ACC for far too long. Paying for schools to have a football program…Enough of that sh*t.
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CU Guru [1428]
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Re: Copy that ...
Jul 28, 2022, 9:02 AM
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Way too long? 7 years?
You act like we've been the flag ship program for 30 years.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: Copy that ...
Jul 28, 2022, 9:56 AM
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Intrepid we basically dominated the 80’s and have the most ACC championships may be what he/ she is referring to.
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110%er [6858]
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Well coot, we been beating your ### for 120 years.***
Jul 28, 2022, 10:09 AM
[ in reply to Re: Copy that ... ] |
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110%er [8008]
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Re: Copy that ...
Jul 28, 2022, 11:16 AM
[ in reply to Re: Copy that ... ] |
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We’ve been the flagship of the ACC for almost 70 years!
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Standout [342]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 3:39 PM
[ in reply to Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble… ] |
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Dave, in your opinion what do you think the ACC can do to save itself. The GoR looks hard to get out of so I think the only way for the ACC to survive is to expand. What are your thoughts and what teams realistically could the ACC get that would help get a better TV contract? Notre Dame is a pipe dream I don't think will happen.
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110%er [5072]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 1:25 PM
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It doesn't change the point you're making at all, but what does the Big 12 commissioner have to be excited about?
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110%er [6858]
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They are going to cobble together a decent tier 2 league***
Jul 27, 2022, 1:27 PM
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All-TigerNet [10400]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 1:34 PM
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Not if the ACC remains intact.
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Legend [16779]
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Oh, good lowered....
Jul 27, 2022, 1:41 PM
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Where you've placed your head...it's not a hat.
Message was edited by: Salty55®
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All-In [31241]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 9:35 AM
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No they wouldn't. The ACC would have a larger TV contract, which is the main thing.
The ACC would also have more prestigious programs, which accounts for the TV contract. This Big 12/Pac 12 hybrid won't have programs with the name recognition like Florida St. or Miami, and of course Clemson. I understand that if they played today, Oregon or Houston would smoke Miami or Florida St. However, that's not what makes the difference, especially in terms of TV revenue. It's about who is the biggest name.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 9:40 AM
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Not even close. Clemson and who else. Is Fl St or Miami really relevant right now.
If the ACC is better than the Pac12/Big 12 why are we talking about dissolving.
ACC is a sinking ship with the death knell hammered in with the current tv deal.
Pac12/ Big 12 has a huge tv footprint.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 9:44 AM
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Not speaking to what we are capable I’m speaking to where we are today.
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CU Guru [1043]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 10:14 AM
[ in reply to Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble… ] |
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It's fans on message boards who are talking about the ACC dissolving. The presidents, commissioners, network, etc. are not. I would think after about a decade of these conference expansion rumors, you would know by now that the message board fodder isn't accurate.
The AAC has a big TV footprint as well. They don't make much money.
Here's the thing. About 5 or 6 years ago, the Big 12 considering expanding. They examined a variety of teams, Cincinnati, Houston, BYU, Central Florida among them.
The Big 12 chose not to expand, stating that none of the teams studied were going to increase the revenue. Keep in mind, this was with Texas and Oklahoma in the conference.
Now, the Big 12 is going to add those teams, which already don't add revenue, and you subtract a big chunk because Texas and Oklahoma are leaving. The Big 12 is starting from a much lower base than before.
Now look at the Pac 12. You've already seen the reports of how much they lose with Southern Cal and UCLA. So, you merge a lower valued Pac 12 with a lower valued Big 12, and that's not adding up to a huge contract. Particularly when you consider that you will have to split the pie a lot more ways. Don't forget that when you start mashing all these teams together. You aren't going to nake enough money to feed 16-20 mouths with conference made up of mid and lower Tier leftovers.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 11:25 AM
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I’m saying nothing like B1G or SEC money but I can see no way they would be lower than the current ACC.
Conference dissolving yes is rumored on message boards but looking at it financially is there any other option if we plan to stay competitive?
Even if you split the Pac12 or Big12 and half came to the ACC does that make us a top 3 conference? And if we are a top 3 conference how many dollars would we still be behind the SEC and B1G?
Love your optimism but if Clemson wants to be relative on the national stage monetarily then I do not see us having much of a choice.
Very unfortunate situation seeing the history of the ACC going away.
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CU Guru [1043]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 12:01 PM
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It's not optimism. It's observation based on data. A combination of Big 12 Pac 12 leftovers simply doesn't have enough value to make mare than the current ACC. The numbers simply don't add up.
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Legend [16240]
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Contraction first, then expansion is the key for
Jul 28, 2022, 12:08 PM
[ in reply to Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble… ] |
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non-SEC and B1G right now.
Oregon, Washington, Stanford, Utah, and AZ State - programs that squarely put football first - can pair up with Baylor, OK State, TCU, Iowa State, and BYU for a single 10-team football division, leveraging their strengths for a much better deal alone than with all of their conference extras who have not tied their fortunes to football so heavily. Maybe Colorado could join in for an 11-team division at this level. 11 football media friendly programs dividing the spoils 11 ways, not 20. That's an enhancement over any scenario that either conference could achieve on its own.
What's left? A second football division with Cal, Arizona, Oregon State, Washington State, Texas Tech, Kansas, Kansas State, plus the Big XII's newbies UCF, Cincinnati, and Houston, plus Boise State. This group cuts their own media deal for football, divides it 11 ways, and with a scheduling agreement with the bigger division, keep a few games between in place.
Outside of football, the Pac and Big XII could stay intact for other sports with a separate media package for those to help keep travel costs down and geographic harmony in play.
Most importantly, such a consolidation at the top would wield a strong voice in negotiations for a new post-season model and serve as a check on what either the SEC or B1G may try to angle for on their own or as a united front.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 9:47 PM
[ in reply to Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble… ] |
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the leftovers will go to the BIG12. They have already been trying to get both Arizona schools, Colorado, and Utah. The ACC is just standing still and watching. A plan for failure
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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Orange Blooded [2861]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 11:24 AM
[ in reply to Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble… ] |
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Now what if the BIG 12 and the ACC merge with the remaining PAC12 teams as presently constituted. Could be pretty decent if FSU and Miami step up. GT will be halfway decent again after they work through getting players to fit the system.
Honestly, all the schools need to sit down and have honest discussions about football. This IS a football issue nothing else.
How does CFB move forward to the benefit of all? What programs honestly should not be D1? Does another division need to be created? Do you just eliminate an NCAA championship and have league championships?
The greed of the SEC schools has really made a mess of this situation.
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110%er [8008]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 2:06 PM
[ in reply to Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble… ] |
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You’re right. Big 12 will not be on the same level as the Big 10 or SEC, but they have a plan to remain a solid conference and are being aggressive. To me, that’s even more telling about the ACCs future. The freaking Big 12 is going to outplay the ACC.
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 6:30 PM
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Big 12 is going to be in worse shape than us. They added a bunch of teams that diluted payouts to try and stay solvent.
ACC deal is backloaded, like most I think. This data supports that.
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All-TigerNet [10666]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 6:55 PM
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That's not considering the updated contracts for the SEC, B1G, and most importantly, the Big12.
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1st Rounder [610]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 7:27 PM
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It is a projection of the new contracts for them. No one can truly know where it 100% lands though.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 9:49 AM
[ in reply to Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble… ] |
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Yea but are we talking today’s Big 12 or the possible addition of a Colorado, both Arizona schools, Stanford, Oregon and both schools in Washington.
Is a previous poster seriously think the ACC is in better shape than what that combination would bring monetarily?
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CU Guru [1043]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 11:09 AM
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Yes. A combination of those schools isn't going to bring as much money as you think.
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Letterman [278]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 3:07 PM
[ in reply to Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble… ] |
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It doesn't change the point you're making at all, but what does the Big 12 commissioner have to be excited about?
Excited that nobody wants to poach the teams in your league
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110%er [7219]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 1:34 PM
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He's from Northwestern and more concerned with being "good sports" and preserving seats at the table for the smaller schools. He has all the wrong ideas for this time.
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Freshman [4]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 27, 2022, 7:45 PM
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It seems pretty easy to “fix” the ACC. Pick-up six teams: Washington; Oregon; Stanford; Utah; Colorado; WVU. You create four pods of five teams:
NORTH
BC
Syracuse
Pitt
WVU
Louisville
EAST
UNC
Duke
Virginia
Clemson
Tech
SOUTH
Miami
FSU
Georgia Tech
NC State
Wake
WEST
Washington
Oregon
Stanford
Utah
Colorado
You play each team in your pod every year and rotate through the pods annually. You play every team at least once every three years. The two highest ranked division winners play in the conference CG. This is definitely a doable scenario. The conference easily matches the B1G and comes pretty close to the SEC. Top tier teams of Clemson, FSU, Miami, Washington, Oregon, Utah… Second tier of Tech, WVU, Pitt, Louisville, NC State, Stanford…. Another board suggested swapping Clemson and NC State, I was trying to keep some type of competitive balance. I think this setup would definitely increase the per team payouts. That’s one helluva conference!
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110%er [5096]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 7:27 AM
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Hype. The idea looks good but will it bring more viewers for TV or more mouths to feed? I don't know the answer but I hope the geniuses running the conference do.
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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110%er [5627]
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Legend [18663]
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Miami, VT, Pitt, Syracuse and BC additions didn’t pan out.
Jul 28, 2022, 6:06 AM
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They basically doomed the already weakened conference.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: Miami, VT, Pitt, Syracuse and BC additions didn’t pan out.
Jul 28, 2022, 9:52 AM
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Yea 3 of those surely was not brought in to be of any help in the biggest revenue making sport in college.
I guess we can brag we extended our footprint, but dang what real help has that been.
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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The ACC needed Miami to be a consistent top 5-10 program
Jul 28, 2022, 10:10 AM
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and for VT to consistently be at least top 20. Miami has now been in the league for almost 20 years and has zero top 10 finishes. VT did their part for their first 8 seasons, but they've only finished ranked in the AP top 25 twice in the last 10 years.
And of course FSU going through two periods of mediocrity (or worse) has been a big blow as well.
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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The Big XII doesn't have much reason to be upbeat
Jul 28, 2022, 9:51 AM
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either. Props to them for trying though i guess.
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All-In [31241]
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Re: For the few still not accepting ACC is in trouble…
Jul 28, 2022, 11:35 AM
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In thinking about the ACC footprint we have too many of our 15 teams in the state of NC. Maybe if we had those spread out over multiple viewing areas that would possibly give us more leverage. NC by themselves wraps that state up in viewership.
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110%er [7177]
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What does Accepting it look like to you?
Jul 28, 2022, 12:53 PM
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Wondering what accepting it look like to you? Others?
Like the Sun rising each day; nothing I can do about it; so I don't worry about it personally.
I do think some of the talk is premature and not based in fact; just a bunch of speculation.
Like when TV's were said to all going to have to be thrown away because once HDTV starts - your old set won't work.
I told people - "believe it when I see it"! I still have a pre-hdtv tv in the garage that works amazing. I adapted a new antenna and bam!
This too is something I don't think will be to the level people are saying! As for the ACC - it's not even about the football.
If it were then the Big 10 should be shut down before the ACC. 4 current ACC teams(Miami 01,02, VT 00, FSU 13, Clemson 15, 16,18,19) have either played for the championship or won it since 2000.
Only Ohio State from the Big 10 has made it or won during the same time span.
This is all about how large a viewing area those schools have.
The Big 10 in particular is the largest payout conference to boot. Yet, I don't see Northwestern, Purdue, Illinois, Indiana, Rutgers turning into powerhouse teams. They have enjoyed more for a long time and it hasn't translated.
I don't call that denying the ACC typically has football teams that underperform or that the conference isn't in so-called "trouble". It's just not that big, over-grown problem I see people making it out to be. If you have a fine athletic program; the individual school will be fine. Clemson will be fine and that's all I am worried about!
Go Tigers!
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