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The Greenville News
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The Greenville News


Jul 10, 2015, 11:06 AM

continues to write articles re renaming Tillman yet we are having our BBall team play games there? Really. Has the Board of Trustees again addressed this issue while I was away in the last few days?

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If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control.


Jul 10, 2015, 11:23 AM

Clemson won't let the tail wag the dog.

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Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control.


Jul 10, 2015, 11:26 AM

ClemsonTiger1988: I hope you are correct.

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and neither will the state of south carolina?***


Jul 10, 2015, 11:35 AM [ in reply to If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control. ]



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Re: and neither will the state of south carolina?***


Jul 10, 2015, 1:09 PM

Seems like caving in now after the issue of a name change for Tillman Hall has been address would certainly be letting the tail wag the dog.

I think The University knows how deep this rabbit hole goes.

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Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control.


Jul 10, 2015, 12:13 PM [ in reply to If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control. ]

> Clemson won't let the tail wag the dog.

I was born and raised in SC and have observed in my life time the State's pernicious wrong-headed clinging to meaningless and hate filled symbols and reverences. It is the primary source of negative characterizations of the State and of men of the south. It is simple ignorance to honor evil men and ideas by ignoring the evil and extolling the good. Tillman cannot be divorced from his core self and the acts that he committed.

Changing Tillman is inevitable. It is the tide of history. Robert E. Lee once said: "True patriotism sometimes requires of men to act exactly contrary, at one period, to that which it does at another, and the motive which impels them — the desire to do right — is precisely the same."
(Letter to General P.G.T. Beauregard (3 October 1865))

You are right in that temporarily, seemingly intelligent men will cling to ignorance, justified by "history and heritage". But as time goes on they will find themselves in the indefensible position of honoring Tillman despite his acts to the bemusement and horror of the rest of the country. Eventually they will cave to common sense and the common good.

I have often seen it as latent racism that in SC there are more memorials to the confederacy and it's generals than to the noble men of SC who fought and died in WWI, WWII, Korea and Vietnam combined!

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well, i find anyone that can not separate them limited.***


Jul 10, 2015, 12:18 PM



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easy to say now Confederate Soldiers all evil & hated Blacks ..


Jul 10, 2015, 12:39 PM

When that is not the truth. Yes, the South needed slaves to survive in their agricultural system..but the issue of States Rights was as important an issue in secession as was continuing slavery.

These dead soldiers all served & fought for a cause & reason..and hating on Blacks could not be a 100% certainy for their fighting.

History is History..and should not be totally swept under the rug, but not glorified either if bad and hurts groups who were key parts of that history..including present day Blacks AS WELL AS present day Confederate descendants.

Neither group was there in mid 1860's and as such both sides should remember tolerance and not blame the other..and let live.

Saying, take the flag down & museum it, but don't kill the history.

And, States Rights are "STILL" an issue today!!

GoTiGERS

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Re: easy to say now Confederate Soldiers all evil & hated Blacks ..


Jul 10, 2015, 1:17 PM

Unless you were there you don't know Jack you only know what a "historian" decided to write without knowing what Jack's agenda was. Not saying slavery did not exist or commenting on the merits of recent actions just saying these experts don't know Jack unless them met Jack and lived around him.

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Re: easy to say now Confederate Soldiers all evil & hated Blacks ..


Jul 10, 2015, 1:21 PM [ in reply to easy to say now Confederate Soldiers all evil & hated Blacks .. ]

I can't generally disagree with you. I don't think that most confederate soldiers were evil and hated blacks...far from it. The average Confederate soldier didn't benefit a whit from slavery. To them, it appears they were defending their homes and the sovereignty of their states. In those days, as I understand it, states believed themselves to be similar to small countries. In a very broad sense much like France and England are to the European Union.

But I will point out that in SC's letter of Secession slaves and slavery are mentioned 26 times as the central "state right" that they believed was worth seceding for.

Ultimately, I am only arguing that it is the slow march of history. There has never been substantive change that 100% of the population agreed with. I remember George Wallace standing in the doorway and I remember in SC that integration was antithetical to scripture and the thought of civilized men.

Time happens and change is as inevitable as death and taxes. I respect those that disagree with me. There is more than enough room in the marketplace of ideas for everyone.

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I'd be willing to bet the two Tillman Halls (Clemson and


Jul 10, 2015, 12:29 PM [ in reply to Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control. ]

Winthrop) aren't the only buildings in the US named after known rassists.

We gonna rename them all?

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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


All buildings in the US will now be labeled with a


Jul 10, 2015, 1:11 PM

bar code and be identified with numbers and letters. It's the only way not to offend. Well, except those with number and alphabet fear.

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"When I was young, I was sure of many things; now there are only two things of which I am sure: one is, that I am a miserable sinner; and the other, that Christ is an all-sufficient Saviour. He is well-taught who learns these two lessons." -John Newton


what if the maffs aren't your strong suit & you found


Jul 10, 2015, 1:41 PM

yourself held back for the algebras 3 long years?

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Don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out.


Jul 10, 2015, 1:04 PM [ in reply to Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control. ]

Love it or leave it.

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Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control.


Jul 10, 2015, 1:22 PM [ in reply to Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control. ]

felix: Very simple solution. Those that do not want Clemson to change the name of Tillman for whatever reason are free to fill out an admittance application and if accept, attend Clemson. Those that, for whatever reason feel strongly that the name needs to be changed, are free to recognize that the Clemson Board of Trustees has spoken on this matter, and they are free to attend any one of the thousands of other colleges and universities in the Unite States to which they can gain acceptance.
The Board has spoken and I assume they are men/women of serious purpose and therefore do not render any decisions without examining all aspects of an issue before rendering their final verdict.
Those wishing to rename Tillman need to move along "as there is nothing to see here, the matter has been decided". Lots of other schools to attend.
:

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We are not responsible for what others fill with hate.


Nov 19, 2016, 11:47 PM [ in reply to Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control. ]

I think the 'you're a racist,' crowd should find something more beneficial to society that whining about the name on a building. Teaching small children to read thereby exposing them to the wonderful world of literature and true education would be a much more beneficial cause than protesting. It's especially more beneficial than today's protest which requires no effort except typing on a keyboard, calling a radio program or a representative.

This generation reminds me of my generation of the sixties. I once told my elders I was all for the protesters until one of them asked me what solution I offered. I now ask you, what solution do you offer for the problem of America regarding racial issue. Do you really think one name change after another will change anything except names?

Of course, if you really want to change racial issues teach kids to read and begin the education process. Perpetuate education. We've seen that the government programs are not working. It's your generations turn to address the issue.

But you go on typing away if you think it relieves you of your responsibilities to poor black, mexican and white children who may depend on your efforts. I'm sure they are grateful for you pointing out that racism in this country will be fixed if we'd only change some names.

TOO HARSH?

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Re: We are not responsible for what others fill with hate.


Nov 19, 2016, 11:52 PM

ClemsonTiger1988, not too harsh at all. I'm merely pointing out what seems to be inevitable. People can dismiss the "liberal media" at there peril, like 'em or don't like 'em they are a force in this society. See recent supreme court rulings for proof.

I agree with you that education is really the only means to diminish racial problems in our country. My wife and 2 children are from the Dominican Republic, a culture that has been completely integrated for a century. My children 12 and 18 don't understand what all the fuss is about. They were astonished when I told them that we only completely integrated public schools in the late 60's and early 70's and that in some cases we had to send in the military to accomplish it.

In isolation the name on a building means nothing. Everyone in support of keeping it continue to say that, changing it is meaningless....all the while fighting to keep it.

In my view, the change that means most to me is the ever increasing national awareness of Clemson University. The quality of it's academics and athletic programs not least of which is the continued appearance in the top 10 of graduation rates. Dabo and Administration's commitment to young men's character and development. Those are the discussions I want to see about Clemson on the national stage...not a name on a building.

Change the name, keep the name, doesn't matter to me...but I think it naive to think there isn't a price to be paid either way.

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Re: We are not responsible for what others fill with hate.


Jul 10, 2015, 3:42 PM [ in reply to We are not responsible for what others fill with hate. ]

ClemsonTiger1988: Your point on education is spot on IMO. Problem is the Federal Government is far too involved in education and as a result today's students are somewhat clueless about history, their parental heritage, etc. Return education to local governments and watch the performance level rise out of sight.

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ha.


Jul 10, 2015, 1:54 PM [ in reply to Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control. ]

no.

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There's something in these hills.


Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control.


Jul 10, 2015, 2:05 PM [ in reply to Re: If Clemson reacts to such tripe we've lost control. ]

what a crock of BS!!

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Re: The Greenville News


Jul 10, 2015, 1:27 PM

I wasn't aware that the basketball team was playing at the Greenville News

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Brad Brownell: more losses than any other coach in school history.


Greenville was named after Nathanael Greene, a slave owner. The city should change it's name.


Jul 10, 2015, 1:37 PM

Likewise, The Greenville News needs to change its name as well since it is undoubtedly a racist publication for continuing to honor Nathanael Greene in its title. And until it does, we need to call for a protest and boycott of this vile newspaper while it continues to operate under the moniker of this symbol of oppression.

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