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All-In [42148]
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Anybody think this is part of the problem?
Apr 15, 2014, 11:07 PM
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I personally see no problem in Dabo openly exercising and discussing his faith. I wonder more so if this particular group takes issues with situations like this:
http://sportstalksc.com/index.php/2012/09/05/clemson-assistant-jeff-scott-clarifies-nuk-hopkins-post-practice-baptism/
Good for Nuk. Great moment in his life. Great if Dabo served as a mentor in that regard. But this belongs in a church, not at a state-supported football practice. And the ties with New-Spring/Perry Noble to our football team should be severed, forcibly if necessary by our administration. It's very clear that this practice could pose problems for players of other faiths (or no faith).
That involvement, IMO, is suspect and risky for our University (in terms of lawsuits). But I don't see problems with Dabo being open about his faith.
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Recruit [81]
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Re: Anybody think this is part of the problem?
Apr 16, 2014, 1:33 AM
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But it's not state supported other than being on state property. The AD is 100% privately funded. The FCA (Fellowship of Christian Athletes), which is one of the largest clubs at Clemson, also meets on state property.
Is there a problem with NewSpring Church I don't know about? Last I heard it was just a really big church.
Having the baptism on the practice fields may be a gray area because of the state property thing, but if this isn't allowed, then FCA meetings or any other religious (or atheist) gathering on campus shouldn't be allowed either.
In my opinion, if this group wants to join a cause for something, fight the definition of marriage in the state. My belief on marriage is based on my religious belief that it should be between a man and a woman. As a result, if the state voted to support the civil union of gay couples, I would support it.
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Heisman Winner [111530]
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Re: Anybody think this is part of the problem?
Apr 16, 2014, 4:52 AM
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it is really sad this post got a couple of TD's
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All-In [32644]
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Why ? If people disagree with it .... Based on the above,
Apr 16, 2014, 7:12 AM
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NO group of students should be able to meet on "state property" unless it is "sanctioned" by the state.
The only "problem" here is a few folks in Wisconsin getting all faux wadded up to try and justify their existence.
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All-In [30789]
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you can have a holy ghost party on any state
Apr 16, 2014, 7:23 AM
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Our federal property you want as long as you get permission. I can rent a pavilion at paris mountain and have a ceremony to the sun good ra if I want. Heck, we are all asked to bow and pray at every home game.
This had nothing to do with religion on government property.
there is no issue here Unless these people are being forced to participate or if they are being punished for not participating in religious activitIes.
My guess is this group looked for another close by target after Pickens cOunty folded.
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Standout [313]
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Re: you can have a holy ghost party on any state
Apr 16, 2014, 9:34 AM
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I don't know. Things like this can get pretty complicated. This is not a situation where a bunch of private citizens rented freely available state property to perform a religious act. This is more akin to a teacher performing a religious act in a classroom. I'm not saying this is the same thing, but it's not far off. A coach uses what amounts to the coach's classroom to perform a serious religious act on one player/student while other students participate by watching. Another way of thinking of this is if the coach is a state employee supervisor and the players are the employees. Would you think it would be alright for state employees to use their office to perform religious ceremonies? Once again, I know these situations are not perfectly analogous, but I think this is more complicated than you make it out to be.
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Scout Team [162]
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Re: you can have a holy ghost party on any state
Apr 16, 2014, 9:50 AM
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By "religious act" do you mean the preaching of evolution in all our schools?
The belief in evolution is by definition a religion!
DERP
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All-In [42148]
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Varsity [207]
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Re: Anybody think this is part of the problem?
Apr 16, 2014, 5:44 AM
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This is a strange situation. I am both a huge Clemson football and Dabo fan, but I am also at heart an atheist. I'm not sure it's fair to spend taxpayer dollars that everyone freaks out about paying "coaches" to really just be glorified FCA councilors. I do NOT think that's what is going on here, but you've got to admit it would suck if you were viewed negatively just because you don't believe in the same god. How about they get the most minor slap on the hand ever and Dabo makes an effort to avoid excessive entanglement. Team prayer is even fine by me because one can bow respectfully and not say anything. Being encouraged to go to church on Sundays so I could get a starting job isn't right though either.
I'm not on the inside of Clemson football, so I don't know what's really going on, but those of you that share this same faith, can't you see how it's just really weird for the rest of us? Imagine you went to a public school and were expected to participate in some other religion you didn't believe in.
Although undoubtedly some view me negatively just because I'm an atheist or for making these comments, I can assure you that all I do in life is strive to do the most good in the world and I'm not some hateful satan worshiper or something. Just a regular guy
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Orange Blooded [2112]
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Re: Anybody think this is part of the problem?
Apr 16, 2014, 7:29 AM
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First off coaches salaries are 100 percent funded by athletic department revenue, which is made through donations and ticket sales. Also Christian students are forced to participate in school in things they don't believe in everyday. Nobody on the clemson team is forced to participate in any religious activity.
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CU Guru [1555]
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All-In [42148]
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Orange Blooded [3881]
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I will not respond to "those" people. They have no leg to
Apr 16, 2014, 6:19 AM
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stand on!
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CU Medallion [51531]
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You do realize that football teams have chaplins, right?***
Apr 16, 2014, 6:22 AM
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Oculus Spirit [93661]
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No sir, I think that's part of the solution.
Apr 16, 2014, 6:23 AM
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Birds of a feather flock together.
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Commissioner [940]
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Re: Anybody think this is part of the problem?
Apr 16, 2014, 6:25 AM
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Isn't New Spring the church that produced a video starring Jad Dean in which he said God made him miss the FG against SC in 2006 so he would be a better person?
But I always assumed the hoaky religious stuff was part of our recruiting strategy. It was the same under Bowden. Makes us more appealing to mama and grandmama. Ties in nicely to our rural location as a place to get kids from rough backgrounds out of bad situations. Since we don't have Five Points and gangs, we gotta have something to sell.
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All-In [32644]
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Why don't you google and watch the video instead of making
Apr 16, 2014, 7:15 AM
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absurd statements.
The video is about finding good after crushing bad.
Geeezzzzzz . . .
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All-Pro [682]
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Ya' gotta' stand for something. You get to make the choice.
Apr 16, 2014, 6:28 AM
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Is it more important to be politically correct or stand firm with God Almighty?
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Head Coach [790]
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Dabo is doing what he thinks is right! More power to you!
Apr 16, 2014, 7:28 AM
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Go Tigersssssssssss
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All-In [42148]
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To reply to everyone at once...
Apr 16, 2014, 8:46 AM
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I'm assuming if Dabo stopped practice to pray towards Mecca and encouraged players to do so instead of having a baptism during practice, y'all would also be okay with that?
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CU Guru [1555]
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Reading comprehension is key, and unfortunately not everyone
Apr 16, 2014, 9:07 AM
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is very good at it. From the link you provided:
"Baptized after practice" this is vastly different from as you said "baptism during practice".
"DeAndre went to Coach Swinney and asked him if he could get Baptized after practice" this is vastly different from "Dabo stopped practice to [insert some silly assertion] and encouraged players to do so"
HTH that helps.
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All-In [42148]
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Ah, yes, thank you for the smart ### reply
Apr 16, 2014, 9:13 AM
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Instead of having a civil discussion like an adult. Maturity is key, and unfortunately not everyone is good at it.
But since we're picking nits, change it up then and answer the question: I'm assuming everyone would also be okay if Dabo allowed a prayer session towards Mecca AFTER practice.
My guess is the majority of people on this board would say no.
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Starter [384]
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Re: Ah, yes, thank you for the smart ### reply
Apr 16, 2014, 9:28 AM
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Wisdom, precision, and preparation, i.e., researching the facts, are all part of maturity as well. If some players want to pray to Mecca after practice, that is their choice and their right. The baptism activities of Hopkins et al. appear to have been voluntary after practice.
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All-In [32644]
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Would have no problem with it.
Apr 16, 2014, 9:50 AM
[ in reply to Ah, yes, thank you for the smart ### reply ] |
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CDS says - "Hey, Mehhmet just found buddha and wants to pray over here - anybody that wants to join is welcomed to."
No problem.
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All-TigerNet [11024]
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Starter [384]
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Re: Reading comprehension is key, and unfortunately not everyone
Apr 16, 2014, 9:22 AM
[ in reply to Reading comprehension is key, and unfortunately not everyone ] |
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Amen! Somebody finally got the actual details correct! I will also note that allowing vs sanctioning or endorsing activities, even on government own property, are two different concepts.
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All-TigerNet [14233]
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Re: Anybody think this is part of the problem?
Apr 16, 2014, 8:57 AM
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If I remember correctly, Nuk requested to be baptized in front of his teammates. This was not Dabo's idea.
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Mascot [24]
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Re: Anybody think this is part of the problem?
Apr 16, 2014, 9:17 AM
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Bowden II ??
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