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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
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Feb 13, 2023, 11:10 AM
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What's the deal with all of our basketball "fans" lying and spreading falsehoods about Brownell and our basketball program here on Tigernet? If Brownell truly is as bad of a coach as most people think, then you shouldn't have to lie or exaggerate to get your point across. It is truly embarrassing. I don't know if it's just plain ignorance, Brownell Derangement Syndrome.
There are so many lies spewed on here daily, that it is hard to keep up. Here are a few of the dumbest.
- "We are starting our annual February meltdown": I've seen this a ton over the last couple weeks from quite a few posters. Brownell's teams haven't historically "melted down" in February. We had a bad February last year mainly because Tyson and Hall were hurt. In Brownell's career (not including this year), he is 42-46 in February. In the last 5 years (since little john reno) we are 21-16. 21-16 is very solid and not close to "melting down". And before you mouth breathing bozo's say, "42-46 is not good in February"..... Oliver Purnell's February record was 21-27. Did his super fun team's melt down in February too? W/L record would say so.
- "Brownell's typical scoring droughts": This one is hilarious. If you haven't figured out that college basketball is a game of runs, then I don't know what to tell you. Scoring droughts are not unique to Brownell. In every game, there are scoring droughts. I've looked at 10+ games from good teams to bad teams and every game has multiple scoring droughts. This is a symptom of Clemson fans not caring about college basketball and not watching much outside of Clemson games. Again, Embarrassing.
- "Brownell's teams in the past haven't been good at FT's": When things were going good, almost every compliment of this year's team, came with a jab about Brownell or past teams. You would here things like, "FT's have always been a crutch under Brownell, so it's nice to see us shooting so well this year". Brownell's impact on free throws was immediate from the minute he stepped on campus. Brownell's teams have averaged 72% from the line since he has been here. OP teams averaged 62.8%.
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CU Medallion [64517]
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College hoops is a game of runs...
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Feb 13, 2023, 11:17 AM
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and all teams, at some point, experience scoring droughts, but all teams don't experience LONG scoring droughts almost every game including a THIRTEEN MINUTE scoring drought in one half against a very average Quad 3 BC team. This has been one of the most consistent things about Brownell's teams during his tenure at Clemson.
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Oculus Spirit [79073]
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Brownell's teams do have a lot of runs
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Feb 13, 2023, 11:20 AM
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mainly down your pants though.
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Oculus Spirit [79073]
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Here's the truth.
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Feb 13, 2023, 11:19 AM
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Every time Brownell gets our hopes up each year his team Schyatt's their pants down the stretch. I call it Irritable Brownell Syndrome, or IBS for short. Is he the ugliest girl at the beauty pageant? No, not really. But he's never going to place either. So we got to look ourselves in the mirror and ask ourselves if we're OK with having a girl who's never going to take us to glory but is down to do anything we ask her to. ANYTHING. If so, then I guess we can expect some more IBS coming our way.
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All-In [28193]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
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Feb 13, 2023, 11:20 AM
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CU Guru [1031]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
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Feb 13, 2023, 11:22 AM
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It's not a lie to say the basketball program is not very good.
To address a couple of your specific points:
Oliver Purnell's tenure was not all that much better that Brownell's. It was just as disappointing overall.
Clemson basketball has a history of long scoring droughts. It's not just Brownell.
My point would be that it's not really about Brownell. I don't have a problem with him. His tenure is just a continuation of the mediocrity that is Clemson basketball.
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110%er [6970]
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Another Falsehood
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Feb 13, 2023, 11:35 AM
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"Oliver Purnell's tenure was not all that much better that Brownell's. It was just as disappointing overall."
Revisionist history at its best. Granted, OP did not coach well in the NCAA tourney, but he took over a DUMPSTER FIRE of a program from Shyatt and had us in the ACC Tourney final. We went from last place to one of the 4 best teams in the ACC when Purnell left. These are facts.
Brownell took over an NCAA tourney level program and has not moved the program forward. It has been stuck in neutral for 13 years, with one season as an exception..
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CU Guru [1031]
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Re: Another Falsehood
Feb 13, 2023, 3:46 PM
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It's not revisionist history. I'm fully aware of how awful the program was under Larry Shyatt. I'm also aware of Oliver Purnell's accomplishments. They were ok, but not great.
The actual revisionist history more in your characterization of Purnell's tenure. Clemson was not one of the 4 best teams in the ACC when Purnell left. The finished in the top 4 literally once during his tenure at Clemson. That was in his 5th year, out of 7. His last two years, he was 9-7 both times. I wouldn't call that "top 4."
Let be be clear, I'm not saying thus to trash Purnell or the program. I'm just bring realistic about the state of the program. If going 9-7 in conference and losing in the first round if the NCAA tournament is "good," then that's a good indication of the program's mediocrity.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Another Falsehood
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Feb 13, 2023, 5:11 PM
[ in reply to Another Falsehood ] |
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6 straight post seasons after taking over one of the worst Clemson teams ever and played a schedule that was on average 20% harder than Brownell’s has been. Brownell should never, ever, have failed to make an NIT and should have been made a short timer as soon as he did. That he was ultimately rewarded with a raise and extension at a pivotal point in his tenure for making the NIT was a disaster by DRad.
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110%er [5961]
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I'd have to disagree about FTs
Feb 13, 2023, 11:26 AM
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I thought that was one thing Brad had improved was our FT shooting. Didn't we lead the league in % a few years ago? It always seems to be mentioned when we shoot FTs how good we are and near the top of the conference. I'd say the downfall is his style of play doesn't lend to drawing many fouls while shooting.
As for the scoring droughts, I haven't seen anyone say it's exclusive to us. Droughts are expected. With the 35 second shot clock and slow play a 3 minute drought can only be a few possessions with turnovers, missed shots, def. rebounds, etc. It's just that Brad has perfected them.
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110%er [6132]
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what's not disputable is we've made the tourney 3 times
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Feb 13, 2023, 11:30 AM
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in his tenure. The first time was his first year after we made it the previous 3 years. The ACC is down bad so far this year and yet we're on the bubble of making it this year (even with the added 4 teams). If you're ok with mediocrity, then by all means, support keeping him around longer to bring us more seasons of mediocrity.
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All-In [40088]
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Brownell has the second worst overall winning percentage in Clemson history.
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Feb 13, 2023, 11:33 AM
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Second only to Shyatt. Facts, not a lie.
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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Yes, modern history, since the NC2A went to 64 teams...***
Feb 13, 2023, 12:23 PM
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110%er [9023]
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Wow! Thanks for clearing that up for those of us who have
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Feb 13, 2023, 12:19 PM
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been following basketball since Tree Rollins and Stan Rome.
Finally, someone who knows better that everyone else. Where have you been?!
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All-In [43427]
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ZOMG. SO TERRIBLE to read all these lies.
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Feb 13, 2023, 12:21 PM
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So Brad is a good coach with a demonstrated track record of success and we should all be very encouraged about the future under his guidance?
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Heisman Winner [139823]
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CBB’s all time winning percentage at Clemson is 57.7%…
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Feb 13, 2023, 12:34 PM
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and according to your figures, his all time winning percentage in February at Clemson is 47.7%. That means he is 194 - 127 in months not ending in “ebruary”, good for 60.4% win percentage. So every February we can expect a 12.7% drop off. In market terms, this is a “correction”, which is one step away from a “crash”. On average the market drops 10% every 1.2 years, CBB drops 12.7% every 1.0 years, like clockwork, down to the month. So far this February we are 0 - 2, not good.
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All-In [27256]
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Re: CBB’s all time winning percentage at Clemson is 57.7%…
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Feb 13, 2023, 12:49 PM
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Heisman Winner [139823]
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And that’s a 12+ year sample size…
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Feb 13, 2023, 12:52 PM
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I think we know what we have.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: And that’s a 12+ year sample size…
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Feb 13, 2023, 2:06 PM
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Comparing a month where we play all acc teams to overall record where we play a ton of cup cakes is dumb. But whatever makes you feel better!
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CU Guru [1487]
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You simply cannot be this dense, can you, Judge?
Feb 13, 2023, 3:02 PM
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13 years.
Your bogus snippets, meaningless facts, and tiny sample sizes are bullcrap.
Make the tournament or pack the boxes, Judge. Wish you much luck at your next stop.
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Heisman Winner [139823]
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CU Guru [1487]
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Butt, Brad is a good guy.***
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Feb 13, 2023, 3:10 PM
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Legend [16900]
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Legend [16058]
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All-TigerNet [10924]
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110%er [6280]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
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Feb 13, 2023, 1:54 PM
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Going .500 is not good. That is the problem. Some of you are okay with being decent.
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110%er [6280]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
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Feb 13, 2023, 1:56 PM
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We certainly have a large amount of scoring droughts. Lots of teams do but I'm not sure we are not one of the worst at it. Can you prove that we are average at scoring droughts and not below average? Since you are calling us liars.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
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Feb 13, 2023, 2:38 PM
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Let me create a list of strawman arguments then defeat them. Huzzah! Brownell is saved.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
Feb 13, 2023, 2:46 PM
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No. Just dispelling lies I see on here about this program. I don't like it when people intentionally lie.
Again, I'm ok if brownell gets fired if we don't make the tourney this year. Try and keep up.
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CU Guru [1487]
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Your alleged facts are falsehoods.
Feb 13, 2023, 3:04 PM
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All of it.
Any other questions, Judge?
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110%er [6280]
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Legend [16211]
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"All of our basketball 'fans' lying?"
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Feb 13, 2023, 3:31 PM
[ in reply to Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell ] |
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Does that include you then when trying to tell people last year that it only 'seemed' like Brad lost too many close games and that he actually had a winning record in them, until a few of us looked them all up and showed where he was barely at the 40% mark there in his career here, proving why it 'felt' like he blew these far too often?
You know, it's deceitful takes like yours attacking Clemson fans that makes it more and more difficult for many to give Brad whatever he has left of the benefit of the doubt.
Really sad to see these kinds of takes from the CBB pumpers.
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Legend [16900]
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Legend [16211]
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Re: "All of our basketball 'fans' lying?"
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Feb 13, 2023, 3:45 PM
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LOL I wish I had seen that article back in '21. Would have saved me considerable time and effort last season looking all those up.
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Orange Blooded [4542]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
Feb 13, 2023, 2:45 PM
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- "Brownell's teams in the past haven't been good at FT's": When things were going good, almost every compliment of this year's team, came with a jab about Brownell or past teams. You would here things like, "FT's have always been a crutch under Brownell, so it's nice to see us shooting so well this year". Brownell's impact on free throws was immediate from the minute he stepped on campus. Brownell's teams have averaged 72% from the line since he has been here. OP teams averaged 62.8%.
Not sure who may have said that, because this is one area where CBB teams have generally been far better than previous years.
That being said, there were still quite a few games we lost because clutch free throws were missed, sometime because we couldn't manage to inbound the ball to a guard and the worst FT shooter is sent to the line. And we lost games where a normally solid FT shooting team suddenly goes 6-12 or something, where even "average" shooting would have won the game.
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CU Guru [1487]
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Is it a falsehood to point out we have TWO
Feb 13, 2023, 2:58 PM
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tournament wins and TWO top 40 finishes in 12 years, and looking like 13?
Same ol same ol with you, Judge. Nothing but nonsense.
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Orange Blooded [4542]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
Feb 13, 2023, 3:24 PM
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"We are starting our annual February meltdown", maybe "meltdown" is too strong, but not by much. There is certainly a penchant for having multi-game losing streaks in February. Going 3-3 but not having multi-game losing streaks seems less bad than going 3-3 with a 3-game losing streak.
Let's see
2022 Started Jan 10-4, started Feb 11-9, started Mar 15-15. (3-6 in Feb, with 6 game losing streak)
2021 Started Jan 7-1, started Feb 10-5, started Mar 15-5. (5-0 in Feb, 5 game win streak in Feb)
2020 Started Jan 6-7, started Feb 11-10, started Mar 15-14. (4-4 in Feb, but 3-game losing streak)
2019 Started Jan 10-3, started Feb 12-8, started Mar 17-11. (5-3 in Feb, but 3-game losing streak)
2018 Started Jan 12-1, started Feb 18-4, started Mar 22-7. (4-3 in Feb, but 3-game losing streak)
2017 Started Jan 11-2, started Feb 12-8, started Mar 14-14. (2-6 in Feb, two 3-game losing streaks, also 6-game losing streak in Jan)
2016 Started Jan 7-6, started Feb 13-8, started Mar 16-12. (3-4 in Feb, two 2-game losing streak)
2015 Started Jan 8-4, started Feb 13-8, started Mar 16-12. (3-4 in Feb, two 2-game losing streak)
2014 Started Jan 9-3, started Feb 13-6, started Mar 17-10. (4-4 in Feb, but 3-game losing streak)
2013 Started Jan 7-4, started Feb 12-8, started Mar 13-14. (1-6 in Feb, two 3-game losing streaks)
2012 Started Jan 7-6, started Feb 11-10, started Mar 15-13. (4-3 in Feb, but a 3-game losing streak started on Jan 31)
2011 Started Jan 10-4, started Feb 15-6, started Mar 19-9. (4-3 in Feb, did lose 2 in row mid-month)
5 years with winning record in February, 2 years with even record, and 5 years with losing record.
6 years with at least 3-game losing streaks (2 including two such streaks, plus one 6-game skid).
Overall 42-43 in Feb prior to this season.
If we include this year:
2023 Started Jan 11-3, started Feb 18-5, riding a 3-game losing streak that started on Jan 31 (so 0-2 so far in Feb.).
I get 42-45 so far, vs 42-46, so maybe someone (me included) made a mistake somewhere.
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Orange Blooded [3336]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
Feb 13, 2023, 5:18 PM
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I'm just surprised you typed this out, possibly reread it and thought "Yeah, I'm gonna post this. This will end the Brownell hate."
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Legend [19567]
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I've been quiet regarding hoops lately as I want to see how
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Feb 13, 2023, 5:27 PM
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the year ends. Some things I don't think can be argued right now. We are not playing well, haven't for 3 weeks. Unless we pull off a win at State or UVa, we have no win that will really help us with the NCAA's, barring 1-2 in the ACC Tourney. We are clearly a bubble team. Our best player, Tyson, has hit a wall in this stretch.
We can still make the tourney, but the recent poor play must be overcome. We need at least 1 marquee win and can afford no more bad losses. Our SOS is an anchor.
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All-In [32567]
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And our doorknob coach.***
Feb 13, 2023, 5:59 PM
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CU Guru [1620]
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Re: Falsehoods spread here about our bball program and Brownell
Feb 13, 2023, 6:19 PM
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Judge Keller is back resting the waters with a different user name . I love it . Takes lots of GRITS to do it
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