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Legend [16900]
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All you guys crying about the Collins foul
Feb 11, 2022, 11:07 AM
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How would you have coped with the 1998 game at UNC where the entire game plan was to murder them? We ended up playing 4 on 5 for the last 1:10. We came up behind anyone that went in the air all night, and no one made a thing of it other than UNC getting to shoot 2 more free throws. Best quote from the article about the game:
CHAPEL HILL, N.C. — Clemson coach Rick Barnes set the evening's tone with a profane scolding of Harold Jamison.
''Don't you ever do that ... again,'' Barnes screamed, early in the Tigers' annual defeat at North Carolina on Thursday.
Jamison's sin? After hammering Tar Heels forward Antawn Jamison to the floor with a body-block foul, he reached down to help him up.
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Re: All you guys crying about the Collins foul
Feb 11, 2022, 11:16 AM
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There are two ways to look at your comparison:
1) In the last 20+ years, basketball players, coaches and fans have become extremely soft and can't stand the idea of a competitive intimidation anymore.
2) In the last 20+ years some things have changed for the better and one of those things is that everyone involved has seen enough serious injuries from cheap shots to guys in the air that it is no longer an acceptable play within the game.
Your comment is similar to some baseball fans asking why it's no longer acceptable to throw a 95 mph fastball at someone's head because they celebrated after a home run or a football fan asking why it's no longer acceptable to make intentional helmet to helmet contact on a WR crossing the middle to prevent him from catching the ball anymore that game.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: All you guys crying about the Collins foul
Feb 11, 2022, 11:22 AM
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What was happening in that game was excessively against the rules as evidenced by the fouls and ejections. I don't remember our fanbase prostrating itself at the altar of ACC basketball begging for forgiveness. The rules are the rules and Collins will be punished accordingly. Just as players in all the examples you gave are punished according to the ever-evolving rules.
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Re: All you guys crying about the Collins foul
Feb 11, 2022, 11:24 AM
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I understand where you are coming from now.
You original post gave me the idea that you were saying he did nothing wrong and that nobody should be crying that it was a bad thing.
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Orange Blooded [4086]
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CU Guru [1844]
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Orange Blooded [3123]
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This is so well said
Feb 11, 2022, 11:25 AM
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We can’t compete with other ACC teams according to our “fans”. We can’t play entertaining basketball according to our “fans”. We can’t be tough according to our “fans”. We can’t attract a good coach here according to our “fans”.
This is all garbage, because we have seen us compete, be fun to watch, and be tough… and have great coaches.
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110%er [9323]
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the p**sy fans were either toddlers or not yet born in '98
Feb 11, 2022, 12:04 PM
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fact
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110%er [7134]
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Had bill harder fouled Rasheed like that it would have
Feb 11, 2022, 12:21 PM
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been a full out brawl. Harder grabbed his foot and spun him but didn't de-cleat him like last night...unprovoked mind you. The UNC game there was provocation from Dean Smith yelling at our players and their team talking trash.. it let up to the hard foul. This one was just stupid..made no sense.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Had bill harder fouled Rasheed like that it would have
Feb 11, 2022, 12:25 PM
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If you factor in Brownell literally blaming Collins entirely for the loss to UNC because of his "defensive lapse" it might make a little more sense why Collins might have over pursued after getting beat which led to the excessive contact. Was still a stupid foul, just not sure why so many feel the need to make such a big deal about.
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110%er [7134]
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Unless you're playing on the prison yard that one was tops
Feb 11, 2022, 12:32 PM
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of any i've seen and i've seen many hard fouls. There was nothing "basketball" about it. It was bordering on a blatant attempt to end someone's career. And it was out of nowhere. I grew up watching laimbeer and oakley and all those dudes. At least they made it look like they were still playing basketball. Although Laimbeer might be the outlier on that point..he was pretty dirty and seemed to be interested in hurting you but more in a sleazy way.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Unless you're playing on the prison yard that one was tops
Feb 11, 2022, 12:52 PM
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I'm just gonna put this here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcEq7xhxD4g
^ This pos is still playing and making millions while still doing the same crap and hurting other players. Where exactly did he learn that this style of play was acceptable? I never noticed Coach K rush to make Allen apologize to the opposing coach when he flagrantly fouled other players.
Collins made a dumb play but it's now being called "One of the Most Disturbingly Reckless Plays of All Time" on one news site. We should not be playing along.
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All-TigerNet [10400]
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Hall of Famer [24159]
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110%er [5683]
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Re: How many games did allen get removed from ?
Feb 11, 2022, 7:12 PM
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Greyson Allen got ejected mutliple times and everyone shruged it off like it was no big deal. Collins does it one time and everyone wants him booted from team. While I certainly don't support his actions, I do believe he should get a second chance, as this is most likely a one time thing.
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Re: Unless you're playing on the prison yard that one was tops
Feb 11, 2022, 1:13 PM
[ in reply to Re: Unless you're playing on the prison yard that one was tops ] |
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Grayson Allen being a dirty player and POS doesn't make Collins' play any better.
Also the fact that Allen has done those things 1000 times doesn't make any of the individual plays nearly as dangerous as what Collins chose to do.
My feelings on the Collins play would be the same if he did it to a player from Boston College or anywhere else that I don't care about, but some seem to think that since Duke's coach is trashy and since Duke has had trashy players in the past that it makes what happened less of an issue.
It doesn't make somebody less of a Clemson fan to admit that Collins made a terrible decision.
In fact I think it's the exact type of admission that the Clemson fan base would like to be able to refer to when we are pointing out why coots and others are inferior fan bases.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Unless you're playing on the prison yard that one was tops
Feb 11, 2022, 1:23 PM
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I've already sad it was a bad foul and stupid. But you're drawing all the wrong correlations. I'm not excusing it. Pointing out Grayson Allen was not meant to excuse Collins. Nor was I implying that Duke's prior behavior makes it alright. It was to point out what a ridiculous, hypocritical dog and pony show it is come genuflect to Coach K over a hard foul. Coach K is very likely responsible for putting the dirtiest player in the current NBA after 4 years of his tutelage. I never saw him make any effort to apologize after Allen's actions. In fact, as shown in an article above, he lauded them. And when he supposedly had it with Allen, his "indefinite suspension" turned out to be a single game.
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Re: Unless you're playing on the prison yard that one was tops
Feb 11, 2022, 1:27 PM
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I wholeheartedly agree with you about Coach K.
Combine his continuing to put some dirty players on the court in the past with his choosing to play dumb and play the victim during the Adidas investigations while he was funneling money to Zion Williamson through Nike.
I have no use for him and as far as I'm concerned the college game will be better for him leaving.
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Legend [16900]
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Re: Unless you're playing on the prison yard that one was tops
Feb 11, 2022, 1:26 PM
[ in reply to Re: Unless you're playing on the prison yard that one was tops ] |
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I think it's getting lost that this play is now being spun as "the worst thing anyone has ever done in basketball" in national non-sports media. That's what I'm trying to tamp down. Not trying to defend it as some perfectly acceptable play.
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Re: Unless you're playing on the prison yard that one was tops
Feb 11, 2022, 1:31 PM
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In fairness to the media (even though they don't understand the term), that's how everything is painted in this day of attention grabbing.
Everything is either the best thing or the worst thing anybody has ever seen to try to get more eyes on the information.
Unfortunately it works and so it continues to get worse.
This is probably why I didn't understand your purpose because I have almost completely moved away from MSM for any forms of "breaking news" or headlines.
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Orange Blooded [2336]
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Orange Blooded [4086]
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Re: All you guys crying about the Collins foul
Feb 11, 2022, 1:38 PM
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Human Piece of #### alert.
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Legend [19567]
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Remember when Barnes told Dean if the talk
Feb 11, 2022, 6:49 PM
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didn't stop he'd put Patrick Sapp in to take out Rasheed Wallace?
And that's why Barnes was so popular while here. He's the first and only coach to give it to the elites after decades of bending over.
We need another Rick Barnes
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