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Replies: 59
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All-Conference [448]
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Academic Scandal Report for UNC Out Wednesday
Oct 21, 2014, 11:54 AM
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Tomorrow thee latest investigation of Chapel Hill's academic fraud will be presented first to the leaders at UNC and then out to the public. Should be out around 2 pm. Chapel Hill's Basketball team has skated so far, expect NCAA to step in after report is provided.
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CU Medallion [64585]
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Swofford is out buying a bigger rug for UNCheat as we speak***
Oct 21, 2014, 11:56 AM
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Starter [354]
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If probation, Swoffie should insist that ACC tag on another
Oct 21, 2014, 12:33 PM
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year. They set the precedent with Clemson in the 80's. Honorable (yea right) thing to do is the same with UNCheat.
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: If probation, Swoffie should insist that ACC tag on another
Oct 21, 2014, 7:16 PM
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I BET AT THE WORSE IT WILL BE ONLY A SLAP ON THE HAND.THE BASKETBALL WILL GET NOTHING SUBSTANCIal.
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Orange Blooded [2683]
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And they'll call a foul on Booker for the slap on the hand***
Oct 22, 2014, 10:58 AM
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Orange Blooded [3730]
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Orange Blooded [3826]
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Re: If probation, Swoffie should insist that ACC tag on another
Oct 21, 2014, 7:48 PM
[ in reply to If probation, Swoffie should insist that ACC tag on another ] |
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You could not be more right. But I don't think Clemson or any other ACC school will rock the boat and pressure him to do it. It will likely remain message board fodder only.
Clemson is such a good ACC citizen. Not jumping leagues. Agreeing to the Grant of Rights deal. Approving basketball schools being added.
I would love to see this happen and if Swoffie was a man of integrity he would do it, but it's just not going to happen.
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Orange Blooded [2420]
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Re: If probation, Swoffie should insist that ACC tag on another
Oct 21, 2014, 7:56 PM
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Maybe even Swoffie doesn't have a legit degree. Regardless of what the NCAA does, if the acc doesn't do anything then Swoffie ought to be fired, if UNC is found guilty.
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Starter [354]
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Re: If probation, Swoffie should insist that ACC tag on another
Oct 23, 2014, 12:49 PM
[ in reply to Re: If probation, Swoffie should insist that ACC tag on another ] |
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Spot on about Clemson being a good ACC citizen,... as in "not prone to kick a fellow conference mate when he's down". Still, since the ACC did that to Clemson, and since what UNC did is infinitesimally more reproachful than Clemson's "out of institutional control" actions, then fairness and consistency would require the same to be done with UNCheat.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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All-TigerNet [10460]
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Re: Academic Scandal Report for UNC Out Wednesday
Oct 21, 2014, 12:38 PM
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The previous "investigations" have been complete whitewashes. The guy doing this one, Ken Wainstein, has superb credentials and no UNC ties. Maybe this will be the one that is done with integrity.
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CU Medallion [64585]
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It won't matter if the NCAA continues to ignore it.***
Oct 21, 2014, 12:46 PM
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110%er [7831]
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Re: Academic Scandal Report for UNC Out Wednesday
Oct 22, 2014, 9:14 AM
[ in reply to Re: Academic Scandal Report for UNC Out Wednesday ] |
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No unc ties.... Other than their paying him to do the investigation.
Code word for..... Anything you find hide it or make it look not as bad
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All-TigerNet [12505]
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I say we get in touch with all the other ADs
Oct 21, 2014, 12:47 PM
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And vote to add a couple years to the penalty. Has that ever been done before?
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: I say we get in touch with all the other ADs
Oct 21, 2014, 7:18 PM
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I DON'T BELIEVE YOU COULD GET CLEMSON TO TOUCH THAT WITH A TEN FOOT POLE.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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All-TigerNet [12505]
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Maybe not Swoffy in particular, but most seem to think
Oct 21, 2014, 10:13 PM
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the scoundrels at UNCheat had a lot to do with it. And it's not like Swoffy tried to stop it. What's happening at UNCheat now is so much worse than paying kids money to play. It's academic fraud that puts into question the university as a whole, not just some dirty boosters.
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CU Guru [1059]
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Re: Maybe not Swoffy in particular, but most seem to think
Oct 21, 2014, 10:18 PM
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Ladies and gentlemen, I'll be brief. The issue here is not whether we broke a few rules, or took a few liberties with our female party guests—we did. But you can't hold a whole university responsible for the behavior of a few, sick perverted individuals. For if you do, then shouldn't we blame the whole university system? And if the whole university system is guilty, then isn't this an indictment of our educational institutions in general? I put it to you, NCAA, isn't this an indictment of our entire American society? Well, you can do what you you want to us, but we're not going to sit here and listen to you badmouth the United States of America. Gentlemen!
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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"most seem to think" really?
Oct 22, 2014, 8:16 AM
[ in reply to Maybe not Swoffy in particular, but most seem to think ] |
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is that all you got?
what i'm wondering is why 'most seem to think' i've searched and searched and i can't find any evidence to back up the idea.
where did the myth come from? and why do so many here just accept it as fact?
And it's not like Swoffy tried to stop it.
what?
why would a first-or-second-year AD from UNC try to stop probation at another ACC school? you might want to re-think that one
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Team Captain [481]
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Tarheel, do you work for the PR firm UNC hired
Oct 22, 2014, 8:57 AM
[ in reply to no it hasn't been done before ] |
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UNC hired a PR firm whose sole purpose was to deflect the negative publicity resulting from uncovering the truth. That included comments in the comments section of articles about UNC and other team forums discussing UNC and the fraud, as well as other social media outlets. I've noticed your only comments on Tnet are defending UNC.
Congrats to your firm for landing the whale though, I'm sure you've rung us NC tax payers up for millions by now with the dumpster fire that is UNC creating more work by the minute. It pales in comparison to the $8 million Wainstein got paid to reinvestigate the previous $1 Million investigation/whitewash, and Tami Hansborough made you both look like amatuers with how wll she milked the system, but still getting paid is great.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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you didn't look very hard
Oct 22, 2014, 10:36 AM
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i'm a C.U. employee.
i (used to) usually post more in basketball than elsewhere. but you're right, i do respond to a lot of NC-related threads; someone who doesn't see the world through orange glasses has to supply some perspective
and you need more facts:
UNC actually hired three different firms and as of last summer the bills were a bit more than $500,000. but tax payers aren't footing the bill. the university's privately funded foundation paid/is paying
(for comparison Rutgers spent $2.3 million regarding it's basketball coach scandal)
but like many here, i'm sure you won't let the truth interfere with your opinions
it will be an interesting afternoon. kinda surprised there haven't been any leaks about the report coming out today.
UNC Chancellor Folt has sent emails this week, you can watch/listen to the report today at 2 and find the report and other materials posted here:
http://carolinacommitment.unc.edu/
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Team Captain [481]
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"taxpayers aren't footing the bill"
Oct 22, 2014, 12:29 PM
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Let me be clear, as a parent in the state of north Carolina and a reasonable human being in general, I'm well aware that everyone benefits from the well being of state universities and for me that would include UNC-CH. All sports team bias aside, I assure you in this matter no orange colored glasses. Even if none of my kids attended UNC there's a myriad of reasons why (as long as I remain a resident, and am employed in NC) and that's another discussion altogether but one I'm guessing we'd probably agree on.
I haven't seen anything substantiating the total bill was $500k as of last summer, which is a lot btw.) Joel Curran alone makes $300k/yr from the university for PR work. You said as of last summer. Well as of this May they've hired a PR firm out of D.C., Edelman, and have 14 individuals assigned in some capacity to the UNC spin campaign. Unless all 14 were summer interns I'm guessing its going to exceed $1 Million. Wainstein's getting paid $8million. That number has been confirmed (getting paid +$900/hr) - if the University hadn't rolled out Martin and instructed him on what to say in his "investigation" summary a couple years ago, and then been exposed by NYT and Bloomberg only to have to reinvestigate the investigation, well I guess they could have saved $8million right there. Is this also privately funded? Were these private funds donations and tax write-offs as well?
Also, the idea that these funds are completely compartmentalized without any comingling of some variety at any point in the future is totally ignorant, btw. The university's endowment and their budget is large enough that most people shrug it off, and even if it was entirely funded openly by taxpayers, the number would still be insignificant per resident and would be brushed aside. But it doesn't make it right. As a resident and parent in NC, I can promise you I'm aware that its in my own selfish, best interest for the state institutions to be successful in providing quality education at a reasonable price, but I don't give a rats @$$ about Dean Smith or Roy or the banners they may have cheated to get, and I take objection to the amount of money and spin to protect them.
The bottom line is UNC has spent this $8million on a second investigation after attempting to roll out a fake investigation and getting caught red handed, and a lot more than we will ever know for PR spin, to protect basketball and banners.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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where are you getting $8 million?
Oct 22, 2014, 1:38 PM
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can't find that number anywhere
$8 million for Wainstein's firm would require more than 8,000 billable hours (and that's at his rate, no the lower associates' rate) - in other words, nearly an entire year's work, with 2 hours off every day.
the $5 million figure in the article you link is the total for 3 different issues
if you think this is all about basketball, then you are the ignorant one
this is about restoring confidence in the academic integrity of the university
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CU Guru [1052]
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This is about consequences Tarhole
Oct 22, 2014, 1:53 PM
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Go preach about restoring academic integrity on a uncheat forum.
For me, it's about holding the institution accountable for their wrongdoings and ignorance. I want to see punishment and public embarrassment from the president to the players, without skipping Roy, then you can rebuild your academic integrity.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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you're probably going to be disappointed
Oct 22, 2014, 1:59 PM
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sorry, but there won't be any crucifixions
and did you miss the punishments already inflicted?
did you miss the folks who lost jobs? including coaches, an AD, and a Chancellor?
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Team Captain [481]
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helpful article detailing the cost of this scandal
Oct 22, 2014, 12:46 PM
[ in reply to you didn't look very hard ] |
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This of course doesn't include all of the Wainstein investigation cost which the University confirmed was $8 million. So its even more than this article details.
https://synapse.creatavist.com/scandal
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CU Guru [1052]
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Re: helpful article detailing the cost of this scandal
Oct 22, 2014, 12:56 PM
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Good read.
I find it very hard to believe, at that school, that the athletic department doesn't have cash set aside for 'unexpected expenses' such as this.
The anticipation is real. Looking forward to the report.
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CU Medallion [51531]
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Proof once again the CU has one of the most screwed up
Oct 22, 2014, 3:13 PM
[ in reply to you didn't look very hard ] |
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hiring policies around.
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110%er [5436]
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Re: no it hasn't been done before
Oct 23, 2014, 9:19 AM
[ in reply to no it hasn't been done before ] |
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Go cry somewhere else Tarhole, swoffie was your AD at the time and UNCheat said we brought the conf. down.
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Legend [16504]
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One year has been added before somewhere if I remember
Oct 23, 2014, 7:52 AM
[ in reply to I say we get in touch with all the other ADs ] |
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correctly. Thus the big anti-acc screw constructed during homecoming on Bowman in the mid-80's.
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All-TigerNet [10572]
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RUG check. Broom check.
Oct 21, 2014, 1:31 PM
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2pm tomorrow.
Commence sweeping.
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All-Conference [418]
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Re: Academic Scandal Report for UNC Out Wednesday
Oct 22, 2014, 11:06 AM
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Looking from the football viewpoint I'm sure Larry Fedora sees now what a hard job that was to take. Probation, sanctions etc. and continued bad press hurts rrcruiting and everything. At least he goes from 63 to 70 and finally the 85 scholarships everyone else gets next year.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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maybe Fedora can recruit some defenders..
Oct 22, 2014, 11:29 AM
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if there's no further punishments or sanctions for UNC
he's shown he can recruit and coach offense... defense, not so much
no doubt UNC lost some guys due to the scandal - Everett Golson being the first one that comes to mind (he said explicitly that the scandal is why he de-committed and ended up and ND)
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All-Conference [418]
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Re: maybe Fedora can recruit some defenders..
Oct 22, 2014, 4:47 PM
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Zero depth on defense. But they have played well at times considering. People forget how that many scholarship losses can hurt.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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if you want to read the report
Oct 22, 2014, 11:32 AM
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it will be posted here:
http://carolinacommitment.unc.edu/
there will be a live presentation and press conference streamed to the site.
a bit surprised there haven't been any leaks as to the contents of the Wainstein report
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Legend [15748]
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They'll find rampant corruption and then say "We're glad
Oct 22, 2014, 11:35 AM
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that's behind us and look forward to continuing to do the right things moving forward."
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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CU Guru [1925]
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So basically
Oct 22, 2014, 1:53 PM
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IT WAS TWO ROGUE EMPLOYEES! THEY'RE GONE NOW! NOTHING TO SEE HERE!
Whatever.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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and a sytematic failure of oversight
Oct 22, 2014, 2:00 PM
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i guess you missed that part?
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CU Medallion [51531]
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That was sarcasm you #######.***
Oct 22, 2014, 3:14 PM
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110%er [5436]
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CU Guru [1052]
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Re: here are the links
Oct 22, 2014, 1:53 PM
[ in reply to here are the links ] |
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Thank you.
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Legend [15748]
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Lol.
Oct 22, 2014, 2:52 PM
[ in reply to here are the links ] |
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"Mr. Wainstein’s investigation found no indication of wrongdoing in any academic departments beyond
AFAM, that no current coaches were involved or aware and that the reported wrongdoing ended in 2011."
Lol. What a joke and what a horribly corrupt institution.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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i knew you'd be disappointed
Oct 22, 2014, 4:16 PM
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and so is everyone else who wanted to see Roy and Dean made more complicit in the scandal
i'd say the report is pretty damning - several layers of institutional failure
will be interesting to see what the NCAA does with it.
when you find some proof of corruption, please share it
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Legend [15748]
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Oh give it a rest. How many times can your beloved
Oct 22, 2014, 5:07 PM
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Tar Heels get caught blatantly cheating, offer up some patsy, push back on all the questions, hire PR firms, lawyer up, fake an "internal investigation", then give a little more in hopes that it will placate the masses? All they do is damage control. Not an ounce of character on that campus. You want to own that relationship? Go ahead. But they're not fooling anyone. Roy's either the dumbest, most dis-interest coach in basketball history or he's corrupt. Which one do you own? Played at UNC, was an assistant coach and then head coach from 2003 until today, through all the allegations and investigations, and never knew a thing...never talked about course work with his players, even after all the allegations. That is one disinterested SOB.
I'm glad your proud of them, though.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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you still make me laugh
Oct 22, 2014, 6:03 PM
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thinking you're smarter than Roy Williams. which Hall of Fame are you in?
the way you twist facts shows your myopia.
just because the report didn't say what you wanted it to say, didn't report what you think or wish had happened, it's another whitewash.. as i said in my prior post, i knew and your ilk would be disappointed
you're going to believe whatever makes you feel better - but that won't make you right
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Team Captain [481]
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Oh no tarholed(fake)tiger
Oct 22, 2014, 9:53 PM
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You're the one we are laughing at, and that dumpster fire "school" of yours.
A handful of takeaways from today
1. Dean smith is exactly the smug, cheating p.o.s. that we all thought he was. Told Daugherty not to make changes with his system he set up. Guthridge was a good guy and bailed because he couldn't match dean and his corruption. That absence of a soul is hard to come by but Dean was blessed with this "gift?"
2. Roy basically indicted himself today. He didn't know anything in 2013-14 during this most recent investigation. In 2012 Hes on record as saying he knew everything. http://blogs.newsobserver.com/uncnow/unc-coach-roy-williams-serious-mistakes-were-made
He is guilty. Everyone knows it. No one cares because UNC could probably do better so nothing will be done. Roy is basically a big, (actually little, dwarf-like) f@g and everyone knows it so yall keep defending him please. He's a Kansas fan anyway.
3. Unc as an institution is a corrupt joke. The school, the degree, the bs that comes out of that spin factory is a big pile of bs.
4. The football program- awesome power point presentation, dumbed down for the unc graduates I presume to "instruct the fb coaches" - but yeah the fb is so bad that they cheated their way to the middle of the Coastal, at the high point, and now they suck, still. Like always.
This school is a joke. This report is pretty accurately describing it as such. I can't imagine anyone seeing this for face value and coming away with a different opinion, but then again tar holes are a different breed. And I mean that in the most insulting, accurate way possible. #truth
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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you have a vivid imagination, that's for sure
Oct 23, 2014, 8:20 AM
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maybe it's my lack of reading skills {i'm a UNC grad after all  } but where in that article you linked does Roy say he "knew everything?"
you're entitled to your opinion, but not your own facts
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Legend [15748]
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Re: you have a vivid imagination, that's for sure
Oct 23, 2014, 8:28 AM
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-on being as sure as he can be that things are done the right way in the UNC basketball program:
“No question about it. Our track record is pretty doggone good. And our track record has been pretty doggone good for 15 years at Kansas, nine years at North Carolina. And we know how much we emphasize the academic side in the basketball office. We know what our guys are majoring in. We know – every day we’re in touch with those kids. So it’s something, again, that I’m very proud of.
“And am I going to sit here and say there is absolutely no way nothing will ever happen? Nothing will ever show up? We don’t know what’s going on every day. I mean, I’ve got 13 to 17 kids, counting the walk-ons and things like that. You don’t know. But boy, I feel really, really good about what’s happened academically in the basketball program since we came.”
______________
Side note - LOL at mentioning 13 to 17 kids as if that is some big deal. A kindergarten teacher has twice as many, makes about 1/50th the salary and doesn't have 6-7 assistants helping him or her. But that teacher is expected to know what the students are doing.
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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nice try
Oct 23, 2014, 8:42 AM
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but it's a big stretch from that statement to 'he knew everything'
and it's a big leap from knowing there are classes that only require a paper (assuming, arguendo, that he even knew that, which i think he did) to knowing that the 'paper class' is created and graded by a secretary and not a faculty member...
should a coach know every class every scholarship player is taking?
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Legend [15748]
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Usually I would suggest someone like you stops drinking
Oct 23, 2014, 8:56 AM
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the Kool-Aid, but in your case, I say chug it. I'm afraid of what would happen if you saw UNC-CH for what it was.
Coach Roy said that he was in touch with the players every day regarding their academics. What was he talking about with them? None of them mentioned to him that one of their classes required no work at all? None of them mentioned that they were pushed into those classes by advisors? In the decade that he was coaching there, not ONE of the players on his team had a concern that maybe they should be getting an education or had a close enough relationship or enough respect for Roy to tell him anything about what's going on?
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Orange Blooded [4401]
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Posts: 4363
Joined: 10/13/13
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there you go again
Oct 23, 2014, 9:10 AM
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you're combining two statements.
where does he say "he was in touch with the players every day" regarding their academics?
he said he knows their major. next statement is 'we're in touch every day' the phrase "regarding their academics" is not there.
do you really think players are going to tell him that they're taking a ridiculously easy class or getting an essentially un-earned grade and credit? really?
you believe what ever makes you feel good.
i see UNC as the top-5 public university that it is and as objective observers see it.
i see the major that i earned my degree in as one of the 10 best (public or private) such programs in the country, again, as objective observers see it.
and that top-5, top-10 flavor Kool-Aid tastes pretty f'n sweet... even after the bitter tastes of this mess
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Legend [15748]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 17370
Joined: 2/1/99
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"probabilis est negatio".***
Oct 23, 2014, 9:13 AM
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CU Guru [1163]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1655
Joined: 2/7/07
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Re: there you go again
Oct 23, 2014, 9:44 AM
[ in reply to there you go again ] |
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And that last sentence pretty much sums it up.
Don't much care how that top 5 or top 10 is achieved... just tastes sweet.
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110%er [5436]
TigerPulse: 88%
Posts: 11913
Joined: 9/23/01
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Re: there you go again
Oct 23, 2014, 9:46 AM
[ in reply to there you go again ] |
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Good grief can you read? I guess not you said you were uncheat grad. Did you take aas?
That explains alot.
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Team Captain [481]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 777
Joined: 7/19/10
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basic summary of the Tarhole fanbase narrative
Oct 23, 2014, 12:03 PM
[ in reply to there you go again ] |
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1)EVERYONE knows this goes on at every college
2)Except for UNC coaches
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Legend [15748]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 17370
Joined: 2/1/99
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I hear they are changing their motto from "Lux libertas" to
Oct 23, 2014, 8:58 AM
[ in reply to nice try ] |
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"probabilis est negatio".
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Varsity [238]
TigerPulse: 40%
Posts: 704
Joined: 9/7/14
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For #3, is that why it's the number 5 public university,
Oct 23, 2014, 8:46 AM
[ in reply to Oh no tarholed(fake)tiger ] |
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according to U.S. News? Sure many student athletes bascially didn't go to class, but for the rest of the university getting a degree from UNC is worth a lot of money in the job marketplace.
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Legend [15748]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 17370
Joined: 2/1/99
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I said Roy is either an indifferent moron or corrupt...
Oct 23, 2014, 7:31 AM
[ in reply to you still make me laugh ] |
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How else do you explain his ignorance of what his players have been doing for a decade? He has about 15 players at an given time and about 7 coaches. Roy makes a couple million a year...think he could divvy up the players and maybe check in on a couple himself? Of course he could, and of course he should. So either he could not possibly care less about his players as people, or he's a drooling incompetent, or he's corrupt.
You accuse me of thinking I'm smarter than Roy...but I don't. I think he's plenty smart. He knew everything that was going on. He's corrupt.
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CU Guru [1163]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1655
Joined: 2/7/07
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This has to be the most hilarious (sic) quote from UNC.
Oct 23, 2014, 7:59 AM
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Quoth Folt
"When we find people who are accountable, we will take decisive action," she said.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!
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