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Orange Blooded [2147]
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Public prayer
Sep 8, 2022, 8:55 AM
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Debates are always ignited this time of year about it at football games particularly high schools.
Doesn’t this go against Jesus’ words in Matthew 6:6 anyway?
“But you, when you pray, go into your room, and when you have shut your door, pray to your Father who is in the secret place; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you openly.”
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Legend [17856]
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Re: Public prayer
Sep 8, 2022, 9:28 AM
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Or what about this quote from Jesus:
“Do not think that I came to bring peace on earth. I did not come to bring peace but a sword. For I have come to ‘set a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law’; and ‘a man’s enemies will be those of his own household.’ He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who finds his life will lose it, and he who loses his life for My sake will find it."
Matthew 10:34-39
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Orange Blooded [2147]
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Re: Public prayer
Sep 8, 2022, 9:42 AM
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What about Paul in Romans 13….
“Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment.”
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Legend [17856]
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Re: Public prayer
Sep 8, 2022, 10:05 AM
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Are you saying that God would sanction, and approve, a government proclamation that He be denied in any public setting?
I would say God does sanction all governing authority. But those He allows to stand against Him, He answers through the witness of those who refuse to deny Him. In public, in prayer, in testimony, in word and deed
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Orange Blooded [2147]
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Re: Public prayer
Sep 8, 2022, 11:03 AM
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I don’t think submitting to this rule would be denying him. Nobody is saying you can’t go home and pray.
And that’s exactly where Jesus said to do it. ?♂️
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Legend [17856]
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Re: Public prayer
Sep 8, 2022, 11:47 AM
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You missed the context of that statement completely. Not even close.
That lesson begins like this:
And when you pray, you shall not be like the hypocrites. For they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the corners of the streets, that they may be seen by men. Assuredly, I say to you, they have their reward.
The intent of the prayer is what Jesus was speaking to... don't make a show of it before men. There is a difference between praying in public and showing off in public.
BTW, i don't have a bumper sticker on my car that says "...I'm just forgiven" either.
But, I find it interesting that use a verse that acknowledges God is real to illustrate He should be hidden from sight. Simply for the sake of argument.
I stand in public with a sword (the word of God) and it will offend. I don't apologize for that. I don't hide from that. I don't hide God either.
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Orange Blooded [2147]
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Re: Public prayer
Sep 8, 2022, 12:27 PM
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I would say that’s exactly what people are doing who are bucking the rule….
Making a show of it to be seen before men.
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Legend [17856]
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Re: Public prayer
Sep 8, 2022, 12:39 PM
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You should let God be the judge of that. Just like He is the judge of everything else.
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Orange Blooded [3615]
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Re: Public prayer
Sep 9, 2022, 5:47 PM
[ in reply to Re: Public prayer ] |
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More than limely Jesus never said any of that. Somebody or some others thought it sounded good or something that Jesus would say.
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All-In [26968]
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No, Jesus is referring there to private prayers
Sep 8, 2022, 1:34 PM
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being made purposefully and ostentatiously in public. They wanted to be seen praying.
Corporate (group) prayer obviously has to be done in public, by definition. That's not about being seen praying; it's about a group of people joining in prayer. Of course, a person involved in corporate prayer could be doing it ostentatiously or just for show, but that's not what you're referring to.
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Orange Blooded [2147]
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Re: No, Jesus is referring there to private prayers
Sep 9, 2022, 8:24 AM
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I think it is for show when they are doing it to purposefully go against the rule.
Again, not being allowed to pray in public and force it on players is not infringing on someones right to worship.
I saw a well known coach in my area make the comment that coaches are afraid to ruffle the feathers of parents by bowing to this rule and not exposing them to prayer and faith.
That's not a decision for a coach to make and it shows a complete lack of respect for people who aren't Christians.
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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I'm glad to know you.
Sep 9, 2022, 9:08 AM
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I only knew One Who could read the heart of man. You make two.
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Hall of Famer [24442]
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Re: I'm glad to know you.
Sep 9, 2022, 3:51 PM
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And one accuser.
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All-In [26968]
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All-In [26968]
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For example, you say "go against the rule"
Sep 9, 2022, 1:02 PM
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I have no idea what "rule" you are talking about there. The only rule in your OP was an instruction from Jesus, which I attempted to clarify.
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Orange Blooded [2147]
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Re: For example, you say "go against the rule"
Sep 10, 2022, 9:28 AM
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Jesus said absolutely nothing about "private" prayer in that passage.
He talked about charitable deeds and doing them to be seen, then moved on to prayer in the same context.
If you are going to the 50 yard line after the game to pray to make a statement because you are not happy with a rule that says you can't, you're doing it to be seen.
Any prayer in public, even at church in front of the congregation, seems to go against Jesus IMO.
Did Jesus ever speak of "corporate prayer"?
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All-In [26968]
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Yes, in fact Jesus executed corporate prayer.
Sep 10, 2022, 12:26 PM
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Multiple times in Scripture.
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All-In [26968]
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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I never considered that though it's common in group prayer.
Sep 11, 2022, 10:00 PM
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I always considered the 'Us,' in the Lord's Prayer as praying for others as one prays for himself.
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Hall of Famer [24442]
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Agree. I don't claim this isn't splitting hairs but I cringe
Sep 9, 2022, 1:28 PM
[ in reply to No, Jesus is referring there to private prayers ] |
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a little at the Tebowing in the endzone, but I think the mixed team prayers at the end of games is great. One is - or could be seen as - a public display of one's piousness, while the other is simply a group prayer. Depends on what is one's intent, I suppose, which is a matter the whatabouters purposely overlook.
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