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All-TigerNet [10458]
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Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 10:43 AM
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to get a players' union formed, where they would get a share of conference media revenue and additional health care benefits beyond whatever they already have, both during and after their playing careers. There were probably some other things listed but I got tired of reading about it. Basically it was everything synonymous with professional football. Ironically, the article was in the College Football Section of the CBS Sports site.
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Orange Blooded [2319]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 10:50 AM
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It would make everything they receive on scholarship as income. The IRS is liking its lips.
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Athletic Dir [865]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 9:42 PM
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Scholarships are already taxable.
You have to report it ge dollar value of all scholarships on your tax forms unless it is used to pay tuition and books.
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Orange Blooded [3726]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 10:53 AM
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That’s a good thing, these are our sons, working there tail off in academia and providing a massive revenue source for these universities. Having said that all parties on either side need too be held to the highest standards in representing themselves and the university they play for.
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CU Guru [1198]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 11:43 AM
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And there is the problem...
all parties on either side need too be held to the highest standards in representing themselves and the university they play for.
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Freshman [-100]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 11:50 AM
[ in reply to Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying ] |
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Where has been the same voice for students that develop technology, conduct research, and file patents that earn far more money than t he sports programs do?
These are the real money machines for a university and the kids get no income, free insurance, or residuals for their hard work. Many of them aren't even on scholarship.
I am tired of seeing these whiney football players get all the attention.
Instead of looking at just the sports programs, we need to take a wholistic approach to improving the student experience for all.
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110%er [7177]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 11:59 AM
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Russ212 - as it pertains to what I typed out; the difference is: "the people in those fields aren't getting banged up while earning that money"!
Also, the money for the research and development goes directly to the schools? That's cool stuff! They do that under the banner of the school and get zero compensation yet make as much money as big-time college football? That's wrong if it's like that. I would have to do my own research on that.
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Freshman [-100]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 26, 2022, 6:42 PM
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Yes, they do that work under the schools banner and get zero compensation. These kids may not get "banged up" but they work just as hard, get none of the accolades, and actually produce more revenue.
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110%er [6885]
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Legend [16256]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 12:43 PM
[ in reply to Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying ] |
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I wonder how they would then treat the hundreds of thousands of dollars per player spent annually by these programs on the professional and state-of-the-art training, nutrition, coaching, and tools of the trade that are invested in their development, along with enhanced academic tutoring and such. Whether public or private, pretty sure all of these colleges are non-profits at the end of the day. If anything I suspect it will be a real eye-opener when these numbers start getting discussed in terms of some type of compensation or revenue sharing.
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110%er [7177]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 4:14 PM
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I wonder how they would then treat the hundreds of thousands of dollars per player spent annually by these programs on the professional and state-of-the-art training, nutrition, coaching, and tools of the trade that are invested in their development, along with enhanced academic tutoring and such. Whether public or private, pretty sure all of these colleges are non-profits at the end of the day. If anything I suspect it will be a real eye-opener when these numbers start getting discussed in terms of some type of compensation or revenue sharing.
Good take! Great questions you raise!
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All-In [25511]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 25, 2022, 7:04 PM
[ in reply to Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying ] |
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Just like any business, you deduct your operating cost from your income and what is left, if any, is profit. A certain percentage of the profit will be shared with the employees or they will be paid a "salary" as are other employees. The days of amateur D1 football in the Power 5 are over. It is big business. The teams need to get out front of it and turn the whole operation into a business with paid employees(players).
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Orange Blooded [3639]
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This may be the natural evolution of things
Jul 24, 2022, 11:14 AM
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Remember the courts are in play here. The NCAA tried stonewalling athletes' rights for years, instead of being proactive, and the Supreme Court finally shellacked them. People don't realize taking an "all or nothing" stance means you end up with nothing sometimes.
It's better to attempt negotiation now and maybe avoid a union than have a hostile union jammed down your throat.
Whatever the B1G agrees to will eventually become standard for all college athletes. They know this and want to be in control.
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Team Captain [476]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 11:23 AM
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If this comes to fruition, it will be interesting to see what see what happens to sports outside of football & basketball. Do budgets get cut? Do sports get cut? I guess we'll see....
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110%er [7177]
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Unfortunate They Feel They Need It!
Jul 24, 2022, 11:29 AM
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Football players - no matter the school just about; are the money generators for their school's athletic program. Even schools that aren't particularly good in football; look forward to the money football earns. Homecoming events and other things draw paying alumni to see.
All the non-revenue sports ride the coats of football money!
With that said, "for football players, I can see it"! It's unfortunate players feel they need it and it's even more unfortunate schools don't do a better job of helping these "football players" as much as they can after school. The stories of how some players get treated in several SEC schools is horrific. One player said, "it was almost immediately after the bowl game they started treating me differently like I was an outcast all of a sudden after playing every offensive snap"! I have no doubt the Big 10 isn't the same way.
At Clemson you see former players coming back "All The Time"! They aren't forgotten about and believe it or not the "current players" love to see it. It encourages them and deepens their commitment honestly because they have a second home they can come to.
CTE issues for football players and other health issues that will come due to putting your body through multiple car crashes at practice and games for 3 to 4 years takes their toll. Helping with certain medical issues down the road; would be a good thing. The logistics of it is something I would need more info on.
I read somewhere a few years ago that stated most athletic departments "DO NOT MAKE A PROFIT"! In fact, most are in the red. Anybody else see that?
Probably - if you have to spend football money to fuel the jet to get the volleyball, soccer, field hockey, baseball, swimming teams, etc. to games! Then yes! Football alone though; pays for itself and I think despite wanting to try and be blind to the fact of the money football generates - you can't treat football players like they are just other athletes. If they were you would be using other sports teams' money to help buy their meals, plane tickets, uniforms, facilities, etc.
But, this is where the problems come in, right. You can't do that!
Ugghh, I don't know man! I get it though. Ever seen some of these players years later and some of their chiropractors and back and leg issues? But, hillrock other players in other sports have that too, right? Correct! But, unless it's men's basketball, aren't generating their own revenue and enough to spread over the whole athletic program and prop it up! This is going to be interesting as to what happens! Another thing all the money the sport generates causes; I guess!
When does it stop though? Will some H.S. districts out there be priced out because they have to do the same thing? Kind of scary actually; depending on how it goes!
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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Some places and conditions warrant unions.
Jul 24, 2022, 12:24 PM
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Imo, unions are just another fraction of the economic factors governing the management of a commodity. At some times in some places unions are needed. Imo, this is one of those times and NCAA football is one of those places.
I have no issue with income sharing for the players but imo, since they have the rights to their own NIL and the universities having the rights to their NIL the court will allow the players to take away the rights of the universities any more than they now allow the universities to use the NIL of the players.
The players sure aren't going to share in the NIL of each other.
What are they going to do, strike?
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Hall of Famer [22659]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 12:33 PM
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I wonder if this is an attempt to get rid of the 3 year rule and make football like basketball and baseball where players can go directly from high school into the pros.
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110%er [7177]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 12:38 PM
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I wonder if this is an attempt to get rid of the 3 year rule and make football like basketball and baseball where players can go directly from high school into the pros.
That's the last barrier left to be knocked down! But, I don't think this is what this is about. I do believe it's coming though.
This is about players who give up a lot of their college experience(true they are getting school paid for if they are on scholarship) in order to play football. Specifically football and basketball to be specific since those two sports generate their own income.
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Orange Blooded [3311]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 1:23 PM
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Playing sports is Voluntary not mandatory; also, many would not have the chance to receive any college experience without sports like they are today.
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All-In [31310]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 1:45 PM
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Exactly… people act like these kids are forced to play football. It’s voluntary and if you are one of the fortunate ones, you will receive a free education which is worth what these days, 100,000 over 4 years and a degree.
Just my opinion and I understand others view points on this as well.
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All-TigerNet [13114]
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Team Captain [476]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 25, 2022, 5:32 PM
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Amen! Mine was working summers in Beacon Mfg (RIP) in Westminster and piecing together a few $500 scholarships. I'm not even sure I could afford to go to any "BIG" schools these days.
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Orange Blooded [4596]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 1:34 PM
[ in reply to Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying ] |
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Mind you, there's no such rule in the NCAA.
The 3-year rule is an NFL and NFLPA agreed-upon rule as a result of collective bargaining.
The same for basketball one-and-done. The rule is not an NCAA rule, it is an NBA and NBA player's union rule.
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Orange Blooded [3362]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 1:55 PM
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I’m not opposed to players being compensated. But like any business and any independent contractor, there are expenses. If football players get media rights benefits, then there should be expenses paid by athletes for every meal, every workout, uniforms, clothes, gear, and insurance.
If they don’t pay for those expenses, they will essentially eliminate non-revenue generating sports as universities won’t have the ability to foot the bills.
Whether you see it as an employee or independent contractor, someone bears expenses. Sorry, that’s how the real world operates.
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Orange Blooded [4596]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 3:21 PM
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If the athletes don't pay for those expenses, the IRS will be sure to note that they are taxable fringe benefits and will tax them accordingly for most of those expenses.
Clothing. Clothing given to employees that is suitable for street wear is a taxable fringe benefit.
Excessive education reimbursements. Payments for educational assistance that is not job related or that exceed the allowable IRS exclusion are taxable.
Awards and Prizes. Cash awards are taxable unless given to charity. Non-cash awards are taxable unless nominal in value or given to charity.
Expense reimbursements without adequate accounting. An employee must provide an adequate accounting for any expense reimbursement or it will be taxable income.
Working condition fringes. A working condition fringe benefit is tax free to an employee to the extent the employee would be able to deduct the cost of the property or services as a business or depreciation expense if he or she had paid for it. If the employee uses the benefit 100% for work, it is tax free. But the value of any personal use of a working condition fringe benefit must be included in the employee's compensation, and he or she must pay tax on it. The employee must meet any documentation requirements that apply to the deduction.
Gym membership. The IRS usually sees this as a taxable fringe benefit if paid by the employer on behalf of the employee. This benefit would therefore need to be included in an employee’s gross wages.
Room and Board If an employer offers room and board to an employee and it does not meet the above criteria, it will be considered a taxable fringe benefit and part of the employee's income. [But the University situation may allow room and board...the "above criteria" are fairly complex, but might be satisfied.]
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Orange Blooded [3826]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 4:05 PM
[ in reply to Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying ] |
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Do you think NFL players are paying taxes on the uniforms they wear which are a condition of employment? No, they’re not. Neither would college players if this comes to pass.
The value of work clothing provided by the employer is not taxable to the employee if:
The employee must wear the clothing as a condition of employment;
and The clothes are not suitable for everyday wear.
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Orange Blooded [4596]
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Re: Looks like some football players in the Big Ten are trying
Jul 24, 2022, 4:31 PM
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Not the uniforms, but the other swag, like sneakers, hoodies, shirts, shorts, sweatpants. Things they wear to class are certainly categorized as "suitable for everyday wear".
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All-TigerNet [10911]
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All-In [44048]
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Good point.
Jul 24, 2022, 10:29 PM
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A LOT has happened since then. TV and coaching contracts are a lot bigger, the transfer portal is now a thing, and NIL has started.
I’ll be surprised if the players aren’t allowed to unionize.
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