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110%er [7219]
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Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 6:59 AM
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From what I’m hearing.
Big 10- $100 Million/team
SEC- $90 Million/team
Big 12- $60 Million/team
ACC- $30 Million/team
ACC sucks. That is all.
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All-In [27851]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 7:05 AM
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Big 12 should Keep Oklahoma and Texas and add Clemson and F$U. This will never happen but fun to think about. There would be a lot of travelling for our Tiger's.
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Hall of Famer [24541]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 9:10 AM
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Big 12 should Keep Oklahoma and Texas and add Clemson and F$U. This will never happen but fun to think about. There would be a lot of travelling for our Tiger's.
That ship has sailed(OU/TU) they're SEC Bound..
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Legend [17596]
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Legend [18842]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 7:15 AM
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Ok I have not talked about leaving the ACC or what we should do. What do you think about breaking the contract by taking 8 of the ACC teams, which would break the contract and then adding 8 teams from the west, mostly Pac 12 remaining teams and Big 12 and making a super conference. Playing all teams on your side every year and alternating 2 from the western side. That would leave us three games against lesser opponents like South Carolina etc.
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Orange Blooded [2746]
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Sounds good to me.***
Oct 20, 2022, 7:35 AM
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110%er [6858]
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CU Medallion [64575]
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I've said it before and I will say it again...
Oct 20, 2022, 8:55 AM
[ in reply to Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout.... ] |
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Schools like UNC, FSU, Miami and Clemson, that would be valued by other conferences, should be working together collectively and collaboratively, and pooling resources, to identify a legal challenge and a way out of the ACC's unreasonable and prejudiced, not to mention inequitable, GOR arrangement.
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Hall of Famer [22281]
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I am assuming they are doing that.
Oct 20, 2022, 1:23 PM
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Individually and collectively.
Boards of Trustees are made up of people who have demonstrated they understand how to be successful financially. They hire lawyers, and pay them very well, who have demonstrated they understand the intricacies and legalities and nuances of contracts.
If the rumors are true that B1G is about to add 4 more teams from PAC 12 do not expect the SEC to sit idly by.
Patience, my friend, patience. Situations as complicated as this require responding at the speed of honey.
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Commissioner [991]
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Is there anything like a "Vote of No Confidence" that can be
Oct 21, 2022, 12:12 PM
[ in reply to I've said it before and I will say it again... ] |
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done. It is apparent the ACC leadership was utterly inept when negotiating their deal.
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Legend [19586]
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110%er [6858]
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Nah, if 50%+ walk away, the contract is dissolved***
Oct 20, 2022, 10:12 AM
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CU Medallion [64575]
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Nope !!!
Oct 20, 2022, 10:22 AM
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In order for that to happen, the league would have to fold and effectively cease to exist.
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Legend [19586]
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Oculus Spirit [96831]
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How do you know that? Has anybody actually seen the most
Oct 20, 2022, 10:55 AM
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recent agreement (as amended)?
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Legend [19586]
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Re: How do you know that? Has anybody actually seen the most
Oct 20, 2022, 11:01 AM
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The agreement (2012) states that it requires unanimous vote of active ACC members to change the agreement. In 2016 that agreement was extended for 9 years. A new agreement was not established. Only a new agreement with ESPN was established that included the ACCN.
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Oculus Spirit [96831]
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So you've seen a copy of the 2016 amendment, and you know
Oct 20, 2022, 11:15 AM
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for a fact that the only thing that changed from the original agreement was to extend the term?
Because there seemed to be quite a bit of confusion about that a couple of months ago.
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Legend [19586]
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Re: So you've seen a copy of the 2016 amendment, and you know
Oct 20, 2022, 11:40 AM
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From what I understand in my own research is that the only amendment made in 2016 was to extend the existing contract to be the equivalent term of the new ESPN agreement.
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Legend [16240]
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The question of the hour really is whether or not
Oct 20, 2022, 2:11 PM
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the ACC can be disbanded and folded via a simple majority of members. Adjusting the GOR requires unanimous consent apparently (as that's what it took to approve it), and rules changes require 3/4 on board. However, each of those takes a back seat to there being a league at all, so knowing that scenario is the lynchpin in terms of realistic options. Folding the league would be a drastic step, but I would think that its threshold would be different and exclusive of other voting matters. It's a key question that should be asked.
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Legend [16240]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 10:49 AM
[ in reply to Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout.... ] |
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There are 8 teams in the ACC that could band together and dissolve the league, and thus its media rights deal, and reform as either a new league, or as a restructured ACC. Clemson, Miami, FSU, Va Tech, UNC, NC State, Louisville, and Pitt could accomplish this, via a pledge that they stick together with a new league and deal during the process. These are all east coast programs that invest heavily in football (UNC borderline) and have the stadiums, fans, and infrastructure to produce and support a quality product.
From there, bring in West Va from the Big 12 for a 9-team upper division. With those 8 teams above plus West Va, this makes for a compelling weekly slate of programming, much greater than the large watered down spread the ACC offers today. For those who hate West Va and its fans - great! Overall the ACC lacks passion in football - this would help in that area.
With the 6 remaining former ACC members (Ga Tech, Duke, Wake, BC, Syracuse, and UVA), invite them in as a second division for football plus their other sports programs, with a lesser financial package more commensurate with their investments in football. From here add in a USF, Memphis, and maybe UConn to that second division to round out that football division, plus the value in their other sports, for a total of 18.
This leverages the strengths of the upper tier together creating a significant media rights bump there, while the others would still enjoy a healthy enough deal to remain competitive to the level they've chosen to support. It also keeps things regional, in the neighborhood, and not a cross-country hodgepodge.
Schedule 6 games within each division and two cross, and let each division champ play for the league title at year's end for a David vs Goliath style event. We could also agree to expand to 9 league games, with 9th being a home game for the upper division from one of the lower division squads (think Group of 5 home games we always schedule). Those teams aren't putting their home games to enough use as it is - trade one of them out for more media exposure and money.
Bottom line is the ACC has programs that can generate national interest for their games on a weekly basis, but we also have too many that water that schedule down too often and cost us all in the end. This approach leverages the strengths of the top end that we have today and corrals that into greater media rights compensation, without having to form odd alliances with cast-offs out west.
Go Tigers.
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Legend [19586]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 11:05 AM
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Where do you get that 8 ACC teams can dissolve the league? Is that in the bylaws?
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Legend [16240]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 11:24 AM
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I haven't read it in any document, but 8 is over 50% of the league, and it's hard to imagine any scenario that would have been agreed to by presidents that would allow a minority of programs to have control over the majority with something as significant as dissolving the league entirely. The GOR was to prevent one or two programs from bolting and upsetting the apple cart for the rest from a leverage standpoint. Dissolving from a majority has been tossed around some, and not refuted by anyone in a position to know for sure, so it seems as if it's a possible means forward.
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Legend [19586]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 11:41 AM
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"it's hard to imagine any scenario that would have been agreed to by presidents that would allow a minority of programs to have control over the majority with something as significant"
You don't have to imagine that. Just read the media rights deal of 2012. This is exactly what they did.
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Legend [16240]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 11:50 AM
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The 2012 media rights deal isn't the league charter. The GOR agreement prevents individual schools from leaving without significant penalty to the rest. If there is no 'rest', i.e. a majority of schools kiboshes the league entirely, then there is no GOR to enforce.
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Legend [19586]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 11:57 AM
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I understand, I just want to know if that is the case. What % of the league does it take to vote for it's own demise? We already see that ACC President's were recently willing to give a minority all the power (1 team can hold the entire league hostage in the current media rights deal). Who's to say this isn't also the case when it comes to dismantling the league? In fact, there may not even be a bylaw defining a separation of all members at once. Bylaws could state that members may leave at any time for any reason if they pay the buyout and the ACC remains until the last. If this is the case we're back at square one.
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Legend [16240]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 12:13 PM
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I don't follow you on the one team holding the league hostage take with the GOR. It's just the opposite really - the collective is keeping any single team from leaving without significant penalty to prevent harm to the collective.
I agree that it's all supposition until knowing outright whether a majority of members can dissolve the league. It takes 3/4 to implement rule changes and such, but dissolution is another issue entirely. It's a drastic step, and I would be inclined to believe that a simple majority could achieve that.
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Legend [19586]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 2:12 PM
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The GOR agreement stipulates that it cannot be amended without unanimous consent from all active members. If 14 schools wanted to end the GOR or change it's number of years, one school could say no and hold the other 14 hostage in the GOR agreement.
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All-TigerNet [12208]
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Legend [19586]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 3:51 PM
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WV won't add any more than those 3 do.
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110%er [7972]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 7:24 AM
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Link to support the numbers as they seem to be skewed ?
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Orange Blooded [2746]
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Pitiful. We need to find a way out ASAP!***
Oct 20, 2022, 7:34 AM
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All-TigerNet [10839]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 7:50 AM
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I'm pretty sure they are throwing in Texas and OU the first couple of years then it will go down after they leave. Also saw where they are throwing in bowls and the NEW expanded playoff money into that number which probably isn't in ACC number yet. Those people live in a fantasy land. No way UCF, Houston, and Cincy (currently making around 5 mil in the AAC) are adding that much to the contract.
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110%er [7219]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 8:40 AM
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No, this is the contract WITHOUT those 2.
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All-TigerNet [10839]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 10:52 AM
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Not buying it. Rubberish spewing from the Big 12 talking heads IMO. That conference is nothing but leftovers and a few wannabe additions that didn't move the needle for the Big10, SEC, ACC and PAC money wise. Why would the networks up and award the leftovers more then?
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Orange Blooded [4855]
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The inequity is getting to be more than the members
Oct 20, 2022, 8:08 AM
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can ignore. In some circles, John Swofford was lauded for locking ESPN into such a long-term deal back when it happened. I wasn't in one of those circles nor were any Clemson people that I know. We live in an era where most businesses have backed away from making even five year projections. Instead, we talk now about what we think might happen next year and what we hope that will lead to the year after.
Calling the league presidents together to discuss the possibility of completely dissolving the conference is taking a huge risk but it will soon be time to put that option on the table.
Hopefully ESPN will have no appetite for the chaos that would come from such a move and will be a willing participant in retooling this mess that Swofford left us with.
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CU Guru [1058]
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Re: The inequity is getting to be more than the members
Oct 20, 2022, 10:32 AM
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John Swofford is a POS that was only concerned about what was best for his boy and his Carolina blue when he made this awful deal... As far as risk goes, imho, that depends on which school one is at... Here in God's country (Go Tigers!) I don't see anything but upside to leaving and feel that we would be recruited if we were free of the ACC, but schools like WF, BC, Cuse, etc. there is definitely risk for them. This would be an initiative that schools like Clemson, FSU, Miami, etc. would just have to do and leave the smaller school to their fate I think. I personally like any idea that gets us out of the ACC and Swofford's lingering reach.
Message was edited by: northernVAtiger®
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110%er [8534]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 8:16 AM
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Walk around campus and tell me what we need a few more million for.
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110%er [6858]
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Are you a troll or do you have mental issues?
Oct 20, 2022, 8:21 AM
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Either way, your posts are beyond stupid.
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110%er [7219]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 8:42 AM
[ in reply to Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout.... ] |
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Try again in 10 years and compare to the people we have to recruit against and compete with.
Go to a friend’s house that was making $200k a year but just got fired. Then go look again in a few years.
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Legend [16935]
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Orange Blooded [2746]
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Legend [15748]
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I’m a bit skeptical. Would like to see the source.***
Oct 20, 2022, 8:50 AM
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110%er [7219]
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Re: I’m a bit skeptical. Would like to see the source.***
Oct 20, 2022, 10:04 AM
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You can't "see the source" as it comes from a higher up person at a member school, that I will not reveal as it would look bad for him.
You are welcome to use google (it's easy) to see any of numerous articles in the past 24 hours that quote the commish of the Big 12 saying essentially that the deal is not finalized but it will be more per team than the current contract (that is at $46 Million per team).
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Legend [15748]
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That's fine. Wasn't besmirching your character or anything.
Oct 20, 2022, 10:22 AM
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Just...the devil's in the details, as we know. As someone said, you can't lose Texas and Oklahoma and replace them with BYU, UCF, Cincy and Houston and get an enormous increase in pay.
If that does happen, certainly the ACC has to play SIGNIFICANT hard ball with ESPN with an immediate re-negotiation...or, again as said above...eight teams have to bail to get a restructuring.
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Heisman Winner [139930]
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I hope this doesn't mean more Clemson Basketball cuts...
Oct 20, 2022, 9:13 AM
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are on the way. 
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110%er [9563]
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Re: I hope this doesn't mean more Clemson Basketball cuts...
Oct 20, 2022, 10:15 AM
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We could cut Brownell and let one of the assistants do it. Worked well for the football program
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110%er [7219]
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Re: I hope this doesn't mean more Clemson Basketball cuts...
Oct 20, 2022, 10:37 AM
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Worked like Shyatt the last time we tried that.
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Commissioner [923]
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Swofford had no Vision and was a terrible Comish***
Oct 20, 2022, 9:29 AM
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Legend [19586]
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Re: Swofford had no Vision and was a terrible Comish***
Oct 20, 2022, 9:34 AM
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Every President/AD signed that horrid agreement. They deserve blame as well. The intention has unintended consequences.
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110%er [7219]
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Re: Swofford had no Vision and was a terrible Comish***
Oct 20, 2022, 10:38 AM
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As opposed to "not signing"? As if that was a real choice?
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Legend [19586]
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Re: Swofford had no Vision and was a terrible Comish***
Oct 20, 2022, 10:54 AM
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Had they never been dumb enough to agree to such a terrible contract there would have never been a contract for them to have no choice signing. Had enough of them simply said "no this is a terrible long term deal" there would have been no contract of this nature to sign at all. Their intention was to create a rock solid wall to prevent anyone leaving or other conferences poaching. They accomplished that very well. What they didn't envision and should have envisioned was the fact that that same wall would serve as the basis that would keep the ACC from expanding in the future to keep up with the Jones. Not to mention the bargain in amount and years the ACC gave ESPN, selling their souls to the devil so-to-speak, just to get the ACCN. Combining those 2 things has left the entire conference in the most horrendous situation.
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Commissioner [923]
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We can also thank Miami, FSU, VT, GT for sucking so bad that
Oct 20, 2022, 9:30 AM
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no one wants to watch them
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Commissioner [991]
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Yes, as opposed to Iowa State, Kansas State, Kansas, etc.***
Oct 21, 2022, 12:13 PM
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Freshman [-79]
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That's because of their expansion.
Oct 20, 2022, 10:14 AM
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More money divided among more teams.
If the SEC and Big 10 do end up expanding to 16, then so will the ACC, and with that will come a new contract.
We have everything we need and seem to be doing just fine with the money we are getting, but yeah, it can't hurt to have more. I'm waiting on the football facility to add a roller coaster.
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CU Medallion [65382]
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Any decent college team would be absolutely stupid to join
Oct 21, 2022, 11:43 AM
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the ACC at present. And, their fanbases would crucify them if they did. We always used to laugh at the Big 12, and Pac 12, but look who is coming out on the hind end? Hint: It ain't them.
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Orange Blooded [4086]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 10:16 AM
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Why would the Big 12 get that much after losing Texas and Oklahoma, the only two problems in the Big 12 that have any national interest?
Seems unlikely.
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110%er [7219]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 10:39 AM
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Because the market has changed dramatically for those that aren't locked into 'forever' contracts.
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CU Guru [1043]
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All-TigerNet [10839]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 10:54 AM
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"Current Partners" key words there. Wait until UT and OU leave.
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CU Guru [1043]
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Joined: 4/7/22
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 20, 2022, 11:18 AM
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One thing people keep forgetting is that the ACC's TV contract has "look in" windows in the contract that come up every 5 years. These windows provide an opportunity to reevaluate and renegotiate the contract, depending upon certain conditions.
In other words, if the P5 leagues are getting $60-100 million a year, and the ACC gets $30 million, they could renegotiate the contract under the condition that the overall market value for college football has increased. If ESPN refused, I'd say that's a good basis to take the matter to court.
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110%er [6096]
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I think NIL money is a bigger deal now
Oct 20, 2022, 11:22 AM
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Recruits will put up with less than stellar facilities so long as they are getting paid.
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Hall of Famer [22312]
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Yes, you'd have to say that the ACC "powers that be" were
Oct 20, 2022, 12:40 PM
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completely blind-sided by the shifting sands under their feet. The Commissioner, the Presidents, the AD's... whoever. Gotta give em credit, the SEC & Big guys saw what was coming and were extremely proactive in positioning themselves for the new world of college football. And the ACC was caught flat-footed in a world of $hit...
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CU Guru [1043]
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Re: Yes, you'd have to say that the ACC "powers that be" were
Oct 20, 2022, 3:22 PM
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One problem is that the ACC always has to go first. The ACC TV contract ran out in 2009-2010, before any of the other conferences. After the ACC signed, then the other leagues had their contracts up for renegotiation, and they the baseline was already established by the ACC contract.
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Orange Blooded [4441]
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We’re (Clemson) working behind the scenes…
Oct 21, 2022, 12:08 PM
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I imagine with Florida St and a few other programs. It’s only a matter of time before we’re headed to the SEC.
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Orange Blooded [4036]
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Re: Big12 new contract will almost double the ACC payout....
Oct 21, 2022, 12:15 PM
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Not a big deal. It’s not like they can pay play…. Oh wait. They can pay players.
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