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110%er [7456]
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Bad play by Ray Ray but just watched TV version and replays
Sep 12, 2016, 11:57 AM
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there is no way that should have been overturned unless they had a goalline version they were reviewing. If they did it based on what we saw via the ACC broadcast then every replay official needs be required to take photography/video classes. It's one thing for fans, coaches and to a lesser extent broadcasters to not understand angles but there is no excuse for replay officials. It has to be indisputable to overturn and that's not even closing to being such. Same thing with media going ballistic over the on-side kick UNC call last year. When the camera is not positioned on or very near the line- there is no way to tell. That camera on Saturday is probably 15 yds off the goalline.
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All-TigerNet [10402]
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Re: Bad play by Ray Ray but just watched TV version and replays
Sep 12, 2016, 12:01 PM
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He clearly flipped the ball before crossing the line
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Orange Blooded [4659]
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Re: Bad play by Ray Ray but just watched TV version and replays
Sep 12, 2016, 12:04 PM
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BadB is right and so were the refs.
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110%er [7456]
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umm- and that picture is supposed to be proof
Sep 12, 2016, 12:09 PM
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it just further highlights my point about camera angles and because the ball was flipped back that's not even the fartherest it may have been advanced.
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Orange Blooded [4659]
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Re: umm- and that picture is supposed to be proof
Sep 12, 2016, 12:11 PM
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That IS the point. We watched it on television.
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110%er [7456]
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it has to be "indisputable" -- it should have been
Sep 12, 2016, 12:14 PM
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a "stands as called" whether they had ruled a TD or Fumble
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Orange Blooded [4659]
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Re: umm- and that picture is supposed to be proof
Sep 12, 2016, 12:15 PM
[ in reply to umm- and that picture is supposed to be proof ] |
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Maybe this is better? It's not really that hard to tell, regardless of angle. I do believe there was a debate as to whether or not it was a touchback since it touches the line when the other player picks it up though. But Ray-Ray clearly pooped the bed with that one.
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All-TigerNet [13035]
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Yeah, that's not even close. You could have a debate on
Sep 12, 2016, 12:48 PM
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whether or not his front knee is over the goal line, but his and is a good foot or two behind that.
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Orange Blooded [4982]
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Heisman Winner [133562]
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Re: Bad play by Ray Ray but just watched TV version and replays
Sep 12, 2016, 12:01 PM
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possible but there never should have been an opportunity to overturn the play.
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CU Guru [1047]
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I haven't rewatched it but I remember it being pretty
Sep 12, 2016, 12:03 PM
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apparent that he dropped the ball before it ever crossed the plane. I think they made the right call. Now as for it being a touch-back, I think that was the error. Troy should have had the ball right around the goal line from what I recall.
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All-In [29036]
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Nope
Sep 12, 2016, 12:10 PM
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The ball, when dropped, bounced into the endzone (crossed the front of the goal line). When the Troy player picked it up it was still resting on the goal line, and since the play can only be "reset" by instant review until the instant it was recovered, then by rule it's a touchback as the ball was technically in the endzone when the Troy player first possessed it.
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Orange Blooded [2844]
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When he flipped the ball it hit around the half-yd line and
Sep 12, 2016, 12:09 PM
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spun a little and sat on the goal line. The ball never completely crossed the goal line. A Troy player then picked up the ball and the official took it from him. The play was dead at that point.
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Orange Blooded [2928]
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Re: When he flipped the ball it hit around the half-yd line and
Sep 12, 2016, 12:27 PM
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The ball doesn't have to completely cross the goalline. If the nose of the ball is across, it is considered to be in the endzone. The ball landed directly on the goalline when it first hit the ground, (may have bounced out), but was again directly on the goalline when picked up by the Troy player. The front of the goalline is all that really matters.
Watch the play again and see what you think. It was difficult to tell from the views they showed in the stadium and I wondered the same thing, but seeing all the replays on tv afterwards, I felt made it clear that the call was correct.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYp76Ig4TL8 The play happens live around the 1:15 mark
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Associate AD [804]
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Re: Bad play by Ray Ray but just watched TV version and replays
Sep 12, 2016, 12:10 PM
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you're simply wrong. The angle on tv clearly showed he dropped the ball before the goal line.
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All-TigerNet [13221]
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I'm sorry, but Ray
Sep 12, 2016, 12:12 PM
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Charles coulda saw he didn't cross the goal line with the ball.
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110%er [6280]
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Re: Bad play by Ray Ray but just watched TV version and replays
Sep 12, 2016, 12:16 PM
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It was obvious he let it go before crossing the goal line. C'mon man!
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Scout Team [180]
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The real problem was change of possession...
Sep 12, 2016, 12:18 PM
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The real problem was change of possession. When it appeared that Ray Ray scored the officials signaled touchdown and blew the whistle. That's the end of the play. If the officials say he fumbled before he scored then it's an inadvertent whistle and Clemson maintains possession at the spot of the fumble. In this case, the officials signaled the end of the play then allowed Troy to claim a fumble recovery well after the play was signaled dead. That was the real failure of the officiating.
-Moon
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All-In [29036]
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Nope
Sep 12, 2016, 12:19 PM
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The rule allows for immediate recovery of a fumble after the whistle if it is evident in replay. The Troy guy picked it up fairly immediately (to his credit).
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Scout Team [180]
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That was far from immediate...
Sep 12, 2016, 12:24 PM
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That was far from immediate. The ball bounced around while we were celebrating. The Troy player walked over and picked it up. That may have been the most lackadaisical, uncontested, disinterested fumble recovery ever. "Immediate" would mean coinciding with the whistle or within the next instant, like the one-step rule on roughing the passer. That was NOT immediate.
-Moon
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All-In [29036]
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By rule it was
Sep 12, 2016, 12:26 PM
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It as the right call.
That's going to be called every single time. As well it should be.
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Scout Team [180]
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I couldn't disagree more...
Sep 12, 2016, 12:37 PM
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The rule says "immedate" as in, within the context of the play, and that slow-motion, long-delayed, half-hearted "recovery" was anything but that. There was no "immediate" recovery. There was an "eventual" recovery and the rule book has no clause for that.
The officials signaled touchdown and the officials stopped play. That ball was dead and we should've retained possession.
-Moon
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Orange Blooded [2683]
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I'm with you Moondog
Sep 12, 2016, 3:35 PM
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Should've been Clemson ball on the 1 yard line.
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Orange Blooded [2928]
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Re: That was far from immediate...
Sep 12, 2016, 12:38 PM
[ in reply to That was far from immediate... ] |
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He was the first guy there after the play. It's not like he waited 30 seconds after the play. It was the correct call. It was something like 5 seconds in slow motion from when it hit the ground to when it was picked up. Probably 2-3 seconds max in real time...
See the 1:18 mark in the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYp76Ig4TL8
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All-In [27363]
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Re: The real problem was change of possession...
Sep 12, 2016, 12:22 PM
[ in reply to The real problem was change of possession... ] |
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That was my thinking also. Blowing the whistle makes it a dead ball doesn't it? Perhaps you can recover a dead ball but I have never seen that happen.
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All-In [29036]
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I imagine you have
Sep 12, 2016, 12:24 PM
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Just in a different scenario. I've seen a bunch of fumbles that weren't called by the refs, but occurred before the play was over and then were awarded after replay to the recovering team.
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110%er [6280]
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Orange Blooded [2928]
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Re: Bad play by Ray Ray but just watched TV version and replays
Sep 12, 2016, 12:21 PM
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I don't see any way this is not a fumble. I get what you're saying about angles (sometimes), but his front foot isn't across the goalline at this point, his arm and hand are behind his body (and foot), and the ball is clearly out. Idk what more you need to see. I was surprised the review took as long as it did.
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All-In [29036]
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I think it only took that long
Sep 12, 2016, 12:25 PM
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Becasue they were determining if it should be a touchback (if the ball was on the goal line at time of recovery) or if it should be inside the 1.
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Orange Blooded [2928]
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Re: I think it only took that long
Sep 12, 2016, 12:30 PM
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Gotcha. I didn't think it was that close from the one replay. The ball landed on the goalline out of RRM3's hand, appeared to roll out, but back onto the goalline before it was picked up. I could see them taking more time to make sure to get that part correct as the 20 yd line vs the 6 inch line is quite different.
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110%er [9048]
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What replays are you watching? A blind man.....
Sep 12, 2016, 12:23 PM
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could see that he dropped the ball before the goal line. He was so busy focusing on celebrating in the endzone that he quit thinking about what he was doing.
I hope Dabo and/or his teammates kicked his ### for such a dumb-ass thing to do. I think Dabo should bench him for a game.
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110%er [6132]
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Bench him for a game? Beating up women might only get a
Sep 12, 2016, 12:53 PM
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player a game.
Message was edited by: RC Tiger®
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110%er [6876]
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He dropped it early. Hold onto the ball and its a non-issue***
Sep 12, 2016, 12:24 PM
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Hall of Famer [24763]
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I just wonder who asked to review it
Sep 12, 2016, 12:29 PM
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The Troy players did not go after the ball as if they thought it was a fumble. The Troy coach was not asking for it. It was the refs just getting cute
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All-In [29036]
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No one has to
Sep 12, 2016, 12:31 PM
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The replay official just has to see it that its close during the normal review of every play in order to instigate the full review process.
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Orange Blooded [3511]
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Re: Bad play by Ray Ray but just watched TV version and replays
Sep 12, 2016, 6:57 PM
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Refs got it right ---- now,on to the next ""history lesson"" !!!!________!!!
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Bad play by Ray Ray but just watched TV version and replays
Sep 12, 2016, 7:05 PM
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All I know is that I cringed when he did it, before any replays. I said some nasty things at that point, that don't need repeating here. It was obvious to me before anyone challenged it. I didn't need a replay to know this would be overturned.
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