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YOUR BALANCE
Woe is us.. our offense...
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Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 4:19 PM

Points scored thru first 3 games:

2014: 111
2015: 110
2016: 108
2017: 117
2018: 114
2019: 117
2020: 127
2021: 66
2022: 124

Second highest points scored in the BCS era.

(Seen on Facebook)

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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 4:21 PM

Yep. We really are struggling.

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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 4:31 PM

were just not a top 5 team, like we were in 2018

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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 4:34 PM

I hope you do not have a vote in the AP or Coaches polls.

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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 5:26 PM [ in reply to Re: Woe is us.. our offense... ]

Who really is top 5 other than UGA not Bama or Ohio St if you look at what ND is doing or Texas struggling this week

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Oklahoma and SoCal


Sep 19, 2022, 6:42 PM

Should be in the top 5.

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Re: Oklahoma and SoCal


Sep 19, 2022, 8:37 PM

Oklahoma ? You high or do you even watch games

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They've been more impressive than us


Sep 20, 2022, 8:11 AM

1) Georgia
2) Ohio State
3) Bama
4) Michigan
5) Oklahoma
6) Clemson
7) USC

I think 6 and 7 both have major flaws. I think Clemson is going to struggle on offense against the better teams on the schedule, and I think USC is going to struggle on defense against everyone. USC has the offense to outscore everyone on their schedule though. Hopefully Clemson has the defense to hang around in the game against everyone on ours.

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Re: They've been more impressive than us


Sep 20, 2022, 9:07 AM

Lincoln Riley has the Trojans playing Big 12 Football. All offense, all the time.

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Wrong both have 2-3 losses by end of season***


Sep 20, 2022, 8:01 AM [ in reply to Oklahoma and SoCal ]



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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 4:32 PM

2016 was only 108?... sheesh we must have sucked that year.

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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 4:34 PM

Yeah, we had to fight off a close game with Troy, only beat GT by 19, a OT with NC State, and the less said about Pitt the better.

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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 4:55 PM

But muh eye test!?! And those inexperienced coordinators!?! And we don’t pass down the middle!?! (What else are we complaining about this week?)

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Um....it's hot? I'm ready for cooler weather.***


Sep 19, 2022, 6:14 PM



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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 6:48 PM [ in reply to Re: Woe is us.. our offense... ]

And no portal jumpers.

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Is this correct?


Sep 19, 2022, 5:00 PM

If so, it's actually pretty good info.

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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


Re: Is this correct?


Sep 19, 2022, 7:39 PM

https://mobile.twitter.com/ADavidHaleJoint/status/1571882428133687296

David Hale posted in on Twitter earlier today.

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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 5:02 PM

Probably not a good example considering the schedule we have played as compared to those previous seasons.

Post stats after we play a team with a pulse

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Tell 'em u7c coot, no one knows losing better than you


Sep 19, 2022, 5:56 PM

30-0

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Finally! Someone with a few brain cells. It’s a miracle!!***


Sep 19, 2022, 8:05 PM [ in reply to Re: Woe is us.. our offense... ]



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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 8:14 PM [ in reply to Re: Woe is us.. our offense... ]

Yes, we literally opened the season with three cupcakes. Not a fair comparison.

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Great, now list the 3 games each season.


Sep 19, 2022, 5:02 PM

In virtually all of them we played at least one legitimate test in the first 3 games. Auburn a couple times, A&M a couple, Louisville before they were terrible.

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Re: Great, now list the 3 games each season.


Sep 19, 2022, 5:29 PM

2014: UGA, SC State, FSU
2015: Wofford, App State, Louisville
2016: Auburn, Troy, SC State
2017: Kent State, Auburn, Louisville
2018: Furman, Texas A&M, Ga Southern
2019: GT, Texas A&M, Syracuse
2020: Wake Forest, The Citadel, UVA
2021: UGA, SC State, GT

2017: Louisville ranked #70 in team D.
2015: Louisville ranked #39 in team D.

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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


Pretty well proved my point, thanks


Sep 19, 2022, 5:37 PM

In 2017 we also played auburn. In 2015 ville had a top 40 defense. Where are GT Furman and LaTech going to be ranked this year?

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I don't know...


Sep 19, 2022, 5:40 PM

where they will be at the end of the season. I just provided the info you asked for.

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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


I don’t think it understands.***


Sep 19, 2022, 5:49 PM



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Ill hazard a guess here and assume i hurt your feelings somehow***


Sep 19, 2022, 5:59 PM



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I didn’t know you existed so, no.***


Sep 19, 2022, 6:31 PM



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I rest my case. Its ok, just put a new tampon in sweetie.***


Sep 19, 2022, 7:14 PM



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That doesn’t make any sense, but I don’t need


Sep 19, 2022, 8:10 PM

anything, thanks.

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In all fairness, It was a rhetorical question.


Sep 19, 2022, 5:57 PM [ in reply to I don't know... ]

I knew the answer. Just a retort to his data which is meaningless without context.

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It’s interesting to see 2020 vs 2022 so far…


Sep 19, 2022, 6:22 PM

Those teams look the most similar, at least at a glance.

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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


Re: It’s interesting to see 2020 vs 2022 so far…


Sep 19, 2022, 7:47 PM

How?

2020:
Wake Forest: #91 defense
The Citadel: FCS Team
UVA: #66 defense

2022:
Georgia Tech: #113 defense
Furman: FCS Team
Louisiana Tech: #122 defense

I guess it's the closest, but this year's opponents are pretty clearly way below that.

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You realize we played a major role in creating those bad D


Sep 19, 2022, 7:58 PM

rankings, right ???


These hand-wringing conversations crack me up every single year. And TWO of these years we were National Champs.


Hilarious. Carry on.

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Brad Brownell: Only Larry freaking Shyatt has a WORSE overall winning percentage among Clemson basketball coaches since 1975. Let that sink in. It's Larry Shyatt & then Brad Brownell.


Exactly…


Sep 19, 2022, 8:02 PM

Sample size is just too small to know exactly what’s going on yet.

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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


Re: You realize we played a major role in creating those bad D


Sep 20, 2022, 12:22 AM [ in reply to You realize we played a major role in creating those bad D ]

LOL. Or not.

Georgia Tech:
Clemson had 378 offensive yards against them.
Ole Miss had 547 yards against them.
Western Carolina had 390 offensive yards against them.

Louisiana Tech:
Clemson had 521 yards against them.
Mizzou had 558 yards against them.
Stephen F. Austin had 305 yards against them.

So of the four teams our FBS opponents played, Clemson did poorer than 3 of them. Clemson actively helped Georgia Tech's defensive rankings. Without it they'd be below 120. So the only team to have a worse offensive performance was Stephen F. Austin, whom I'd never heard of.

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Yeah, that’s what I’m saying…


Sep 19, 2022, 7:59 PM [ in reply to Re: It’s interesting to see 2020 vs 2022 so far… ]

At a glance they are pretty similar. It’s futile, however, to compare 12 games worth of 2020 stats to 3 games worth of 2022 stats. The sample size for 2022 is just entirely too small at this point to really compare to any other season, but it is very interesting to see the numbers are similar to all but one year going back to 2014.




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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


No actually it didn't.***


Sep 19, 2022, 6:46 PM [ in reply to Pretty well proved my point, thanks ]



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Lol, ok my guy. Bet you still wear a mask everywhere.***


Sep 19, 2022, 7:03 PM



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Whatever helps you maintain keeping


Sep 19, 2022, 7:11 PM

you in whine mode. Face it, you over-reached trying to maintain your need to b!tch.

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Posting facts is whining now? LOL, wow, ok Brandon.***


Sep 19, 2022, 7:16 PM



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Yes. Someone who seeks negativity all day everyday


Sep 19, 2022, 9:01 PM

is a whiner.

Heck, for example, during a game, there are some people who literally post a negative comment almost every play that doesn't score a touchdown. Know what I mean, Vern? That's a softazz whiner in my opinion.

Carry on though... with your endless quest for negativity.

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Showing our age with the Vern reference. :)***


Sep 20, 2022, 7:44 AM



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Boy, you seem sensitive.***


Sep 19, 2022, 8:13 PM [ in reply to Lol, ok my guy. Bet you still wear a mask everywhere.*** ]



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11,500 TDs given..


Sep 19, 2022, 8:43 PM

And I'm sensitive?

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Follow the breadcrumbs, I was talking to the


Sep 19, 2022, 9:03 PM

other troll.

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Tough to see the alignment on the phone


Sep 20, 2022, 8:53 AM

And it's certainly not unusual for you to follow me around clicking the thumbs down.

Speaking of trolls, I thought we covered this? It was shown a long time ago you have a very, very bizarre imagination.

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Oh yay, a useless stat***


Sep 19, 2022, 5:57 PM



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Yeah, I know right. If Streeter


Sep 19, 2022, 6:36 PM

was any good or if we threw over the middle then we'd have the best point total through 3 games since the CFP.

The fact it, it's only "useless" because it doesn't fit your need to b!tch and moan.

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It's useless because it doesn't tell you anything about


Sep 19, 2022, 7:20 PM

the quality of play. We have played 3 terrible teams, our point total against them is 100% meaningless.

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Just stop, Uttles. I'm fully aware we don't have an


Sep 19, 2022, 7:30 PM

offense on par with 2018 or 2020, but the stat is NOT "meaningless".

Keep on b!tching, Uttles. Wouldn't want to try and change your bitterness. Carry on.

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I'm just pointing out how dumb your post is.


Sep 19, 2022, 7:49 PM

I'm not even bitching about the team or anything. I think we'll be ok this year, but not NC quality... unless something on the offense drastically changes.

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And you KNOW world-class dumb posts, right chas tom ? Cause


Sep 19, 2022, 8:02 PM

you have authored so many of them - like


DABO ???? Way to cheap out TDP. Why should we have to pay for on the job training for someone who is SO far over his head ?


And on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on …….

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Brad Brownell: Only Larry freaking Shyatt has a WORSE overall winning percentage among Clemson basketball coaches since 1975. Let that sink in. It's Larry Shyatt & then Brad Brownell.


I admit, I didn't think the Bobby Bowden HC style would work


Sep 19, 2022, 8:08 PM

in the modern era, but I was wrong. We've been able to out-talent the ACC for a long time now, and even win some natty's. I have long since said I was wrong about that.

That doesn't change the fact that this is a dumb OP.

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And you continue with your garbage. Backhanded jabs - you


Sep 20, 2022, 7:27 AM

just can’t let it go. You are a complete loser.

Bobby Bowden HC style ????? Are you kidding ? ANY idiot that still says Dabo doesn’t know the ins and outs of everything having to do with football - is just that - an idiot. It seems like you are trying to say he is the cheerleader, CEO guy - like you have said before ( like those are terrible PARTS of being a head coach ) - still selling him and our program short.

Again - “out-talent the ACC for a long time now” - backhanded doooooshery. Giving no coaching credit. Unbelievable. So NOW, you are saying winning isn’t enough, it is HOW we win. The worst kinda fan. Seriously.

“Even win some natty’s” - lol - what an asssshat. Dismissive and minimizing.


And the kicker is - after how wrong you were FOR SEVERAL YEARS, proven to be wrong and admitted by you - you learned NOTHING. You are still doing the same thing - trying to predict the future based on very little information and, I guess, going with your gut - which has been proven to be monumentally wrong.


No idea why I typed this all out - you have been called out so many times by so many folks about so many things - you are just gonna you and continue to be wrong.

20 years from now - we’ll still be winning for the most part - because of the foundation - and you’ll still be “YEAH, BUT …….”


Go T I G E R S !!! Just WIN bayyyyybeeeee !!!!

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Brad Brownell: Only Larry freaking Shyatt has a WORSE overall winning percentage among Clemson basketball coaches since 1975. Let that sink in. It's Larry Shyatt & then Brad Brownell.


Bingo. Hard to find anything where he was


Sep 20, 2022, 8:59 AM

ever right .. about anything.

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It's not "dumb", Uttles. It's simple, relevant facts.


Sep 20, 2022, 8:56 AM [ in reply to I'm just pointing out how dumb your post is. ]

Please try to be less of a child. Thanks.

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Idiots working the polls says "Fake News"***


Sep 19, 2022, 6:40 PM



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How disingenuous....


Sep 19, 2022, 6:48 PM

But you know that don't you?

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Not in the least bit.


Sep 19, 2022, 6:51 PM

Are you really that desperate to have your daily dose of b!tching and complaining? Seriously bud, it's very becoming of a Clemson man.

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*unbecoming..***


Sep 19, 2022, 6:57 PM



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Why does it need to be one or the other?


Sep 19, 2022, 8:19 PM [ in reply to Not in the least bit. ]

I posted my thoughts on the game, good and bad.

The score doesn't tell the whole story and I think you know that.

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Re: How disingenuous....


Sep 19, 2022, 7:40 PM [ in reply to How disingenuous.... ]

How, exactly?

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Because without context its just a meaningless list of irrelevant data


Sep 19, 2022, 8:03 PM

However, with said context (provided elsewhere in this very post), his attempt at proving a point was eviscerated.

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Re: Because without context its just a meaningless list of irrelevant data


Sep 19, 2022, 8:22 PM

Just because you don’t understand statistics doesn’t mean anything was obliterated. Data is data. Your trying to disregard it because it doesn’t serve your narrative. Clemson (excluding last year) has played within 10% of the median score margin through that entire data set. It would take a good economic analysis to find out what it really means but that you’re tossing around “eviscerated” shows you are fundamentally unserious. The post I was replying to called it “disingenuous”. It was posted originally by David Hale who is usually considered a Clemson hater around here. It was posted without comment. You and PBT are the ones going through mental gymnastics to dismiss it.

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By your very post your assertion is who you play doesnt matter


Sep 19, 2022, 8:27 PM

Which in and of itself it patently absurd. But since thats what you opted to go with, then no statistics, polls, or rankings have any merit or value. Again, without context, data is just data. Its meaningless. But the reality is, who you play absolutely matters, to suggest otherwise is a complete lack of understanding of the subject matter.

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Re: By your very post your assertion is who you play doesnt matter


Sep 19, 2022, 8:40 PM

I did not say that. JFC why are people incapable of sincere debate. I specifically said it warrants further analysis. Somehow the insufficient data of this season is enough to declare this team dead in the water but correlative data from previous season that suggests that might not be the case should be summarily tossed out. It’s absolutely maddening.

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Its only maddening because i dont agree with you


Sep 19, 2022, 8:52 PM

What have you brought to this "debate" other than to suggest i do not understand statistics. Where in fact I did do the "further analysis" rather than take the data at face value. If all you look at is the surface data and not the subsets that make up said numbers, then, sure, we have one of the best Clemson offenses since the playoff era began. Absolutely obscene conclusion is it not?

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Re: Its only maddening because i dont agree with you


Sep 19, 2022, 9:06 PM

Are you referring to comparing the total defense stats for an entire season from 2020 to the total defense through 3 games in 2022? Because that is not a valid comparison? If I’m missing some other deep work you’ve done please refer me to it. In 2020 Clemson was the 5th most, 2nd most, and most points scored against those teams. That would suggest that their total rankings probably improved significantly over the remaining games. But even that can’t be said definitely without further work.

And no, you don’t have to come to the conclusion that we have the best offense of the bcs era. A much more reasonable hypothesis would be that we we have certain offensive objectives that tend to limit our output. Why don’t we have a single upper outlier? None of those seasons are anywhere near some kind of reasonable maximum output. I can’t prove that but I think it’s a more feasible starting point than our team is trash and believing that anything that might suggest otherwise is meaningless.

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Now who is using conjecture


Sep 19, 2022, 9:16 PM

I merely pointed out that there is a large discrepancy in the quality of teams we have played this year vs virtually every other year in that list. I would go so far as to suggest THIS year is an outlier due to the weakness of teams played thus far. Never going to be apples to apples, but relative strength is notable. Now if one were to argue we cant definitively say how good or bad these three teams really are to this point in the season.....well ok, Ill concede that point despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

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It's not an "outlier".


Sep 19, 2022, 9:38 PM

It's within the upper and lower range of data. Again, its the 2nd best output of the CFP era. You can't just write it off no matter how hard you try.

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Again, it's not at all meaningless.


Sep 20, 2022, 9:03 AM [ in reply to Because without context its just a meaningless list of irrelevant data ]

It's not like we played 3 juggernauts in the first 3 games of any other BCS season. It's not like one decent opponent in any given year dragged down the average on the scale you're pretending it did.

You're trying too hard to be negative, like you always do. A loser's mentality for sure.

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Kinda tired of this 'us against them' mentality


Sep 19, 2022, 8:23 PM [ in reply to Re: How disingenuous.... ]

It's simplistic and what is going on has more nuance then what the op posted.

But you know this still you want to argue with the 'dumpers'.

Do you think it would be fun to read a sports board where all you read was how great your team is?

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Re: Kinda tired of this 'us against them' mentality


Sep 19, 2022, 8:34 PM

You called it disingenuous. How’s that not “us versus them”? The data is not disingenuous and the OP is not the originator. It was posted by David Hale on Twitter and he’s often referred to as a Clemson hater around here. The data is interesting so dismissing out of hand is silly. With more in depth analysis which I have neither time nor inclination to do it lends itself only to casual observation. But performing within 10% of a median each and every year (excluding last year) regardless of schedule, which vary widely in quality of opponent, is statistically significant. Last year was a clear outlier. Rather than entertain for even a moment that things are quite as dreadful as you’ve led yourself to believe you’re angrily doubling down on it.

Is there a performance metric versus Wake that would have you abandon your constant negativity. My guess is no. We could win 52-0 in a flawless performance and you would simply dismiss Wake and project these same aggravations forward. Is there any outcome short of winning a national championship that you won’t view as a program in decline?

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Said it much better than I could.


Sep 19, 2022, 9:34 PM

Spot on

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We're all Tigers, of course, but some folks just choose to live


Sep 19, 2022, 9:54 PM [ in reply to Kinda tired of this 'us against them' mentality ]

a life of griping on here.

I just don't get it.

I mean, for example, what kind of true Clemson man spends a whole game posting his negative streams of consciousness, complaining nearly every play, calling out coaches and players like, "fire such and such", and "such and such is a bust"... AS the game is going on?

That's different from occasionally wanting to discuss a potential area of concern in a reasonable manner. Most reasonable emotionally-mature Clemson men don't waste so much of their energy in seeking negativity and constant b!tching. Know what I mean?

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But... but...


Sep 19, 2022, 7:22 PM

No coaching credentials and DJ and WRs and OL and... and... well, you know. Right? This factual, actual light of day stuff can't be trusted. Look how far our recruiting has fallen off. And our historic run is over. Yeah, yeah... nation's longest current winning streak... is that all you got? Pshaw!

You pumpers need to forget all this actual data and reality stuff and go with your gut halftime frustrations.

Let's see how you feel when Wake blows our doors off this Saturday. Based on my expert feelies - it's definitely coming.

Woe is us indeed.

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You guys really have no clue, do you? Do you realize who we’ve played the first 3 games?


Sep 19, 2022, 8:03 PM

Let’s see what the numbers look like the next 3. I bet those 3 defenses average in the hundreds (out of 130 or so teams because I have to spell it out for you).

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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 8:09 PM

This has probably been the weakest 3 teams we have ever opened with.

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Re: Woe is us.. our offense...


Sep 19, 2022, 8:23 PM

How dare you throw facts out when so many on here just come to whine.

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The "facts" suggest that list doesnt prove what he thinks it does


Sep 19, 2022, 8:40 PM

But, that would require you to think beyond your own agenda and we simply cant have that now can we.

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No it absolutely proves what I think it does


Sep 19, 2022, 8:49 PM

Simply put, one, we almost always start out slow , and two, the facts CLEARLY prove we aren't a bad off as some of the negativity seekers want to pawn off on the reasonable folks.

Ya know, maybe you'd be happier with a hobby you can enjoy more?

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Good thing all things are otherwise equal


Sep 19, 2022, 9:48 PM

??‍♂️

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I'll repost this from yesterday


Sep 20, 2022, 8:13 AM

TigersAndCubs®
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Sep 19, 2022, 12:06 PM
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2022: GT, Furman, LA Tech
2021: UGA, SC State, GT
2020: @Wake, citadel, UVA
2019: GT, A&M, @Cuse
2018: Furman, @A&M, GA Southern
2017: Kent St, Auburn, @Louisville
2016: @Auburn, Troy, SC State
2015: Wofford, App St, @Louisville
2014: @UGA, SC State, @FSU!!!

2014 > 2021 > 2017 > 2016 > 2018 > 2015 > 2019 > 2020 > 2022

Some of those in the middle are debatable. Any true road game against a decent team is going to give it a pretty big bump though. 2014 opening slate was insane. We padded the offensive numbers by putting up 70+ against a grossly overmatched SC State team.

I have 2021 2nd simply because we played the best team in the country with the best defense in the country in week 1.

2022, 2020, and 2015 are the only years we didn't play a marque non-con opponent in the opening 3 weeks. 2015 included a pretty good App State team though (won 10 games), and Louisville was a tough out on the road, especially since I'm pretty sure that was a TH night game.

I'm not saying our offensive doesn't look better than at this point last year, because it does, but I also think this has been partially a product of the schedule, and we also don't have the offensive ceiling to grow into that we did from 2014-2016 and 2018-2020 with all time greats at QB and WR corps that were light-years ahead of this one. Also that Etienne guy for 4 years.. he was OK at football.

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Well, yeah, of course it's somewhat related.


Sep 20, 2022, 11:50 AM

If we played UGA 3x then we wouldn't have a very good average, obviously. You can see a correlation throughout the years based on the opponents. That should go without saying.

So yeah, the two schedules you show as the least difficult also have the highest average. One of those schedules was with Trevor Lawrence and one is with DJ.

So yes, it's all relative, and yes, we currently have the 2nd highest point output in the BCA era.

Points are: yes, we have some things to work on, but the same could be said every year. That, and things are not as bad as the chicken littles want to try and convince the reasonable folks.

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