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110%er [6386]
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XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 12:46 PM
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Our defense might literally rest of their decisions. We need at least one of them to return. If both turn pro, we could arguably have one of the worst DE lineups in the ACC.
Mascoll is just an average player. He’s never been impactful for us. And he’s easily the best we would have. After him, we have virtually nobody with any real experience
Greg Williams
Cade Denhoff
Zaire Patterson
Jaheim Lawson
And then there’s the three freshmen: Tomarrion Parker, David Ojiegbe, and AJ Hoffler. Do we really expect them to be ready to compete at an elite level?
The portal simply has to be necessary if XT and KJ turn pro. We cannot afford to return one DE with experience, and a mediocre one at that. The coaching staff cannot fail at their jobs again.
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All-In [30459]
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Nah… we will stick with who we have
Jan 2, 2023, 12:48 PM
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Legend [18262]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 12:49 PM
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Lmfao would love to see you go tell these guys how mediocre they are to their faces, man y’all are so ####### disrespectful it’s really unbelievable to read #### here sometimes
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 12:56 PM
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Leon is 100% correct.
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All-TigerNet [13481]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:01 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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I think his main point was if we lose KJ and XT then all we really have left are guys without a lot of experience who are unknown in terms of how they might perform. They could be awesome or they could be average. We just won't know until we put them out there.
If there were a couple of proven, experienced DEs in the portal then now might be a great time to go after them. And if we do lose KJ and XT, I don't see why we wouldn't try and backfill them out of the portal if there is anyone good enough to be had from there. Otherwise, we have no option other than to run some Freshmen out there who may or may not be ready.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:04 PM
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KJ, Mascoll, and some DTs played snaps at DE against Tennessee. The fact that Greg, Denhoff, and Zaire didn’t play at all tells you everything you need to know about them.
They aren’t ready.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:01 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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Nice rebuttal.
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Orange Blooded [2409]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:14 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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Convince us change our minds that Leon is wrong. Without XT or KJ we have little or no experience coming back. Those 4 names on that list were low tier recruits. Project players to fill in for depth. Hopefully one of the incoming freshman can step up and be a day 1 starter if those 2 leave.
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Orange Blooded [2349]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:39 PM
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With Williams, Capehart, Storey, and possible Ruke the d tackles will still be strong. Mascoll coming back we just need one serviceable body on the other end. Our strength will be linebacker. Trotter, Carter, Woodaz. Throw in Dudley, Maguire. That’s how we get pressure next year.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:01 PM
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I wouldn’t mind dipping into the portal for another LB. Carter and Trotter are special. Woodaz looks like he’ll be special as well. But Keith Maguire is the only backup with experience. Dudley will be good. I like Jamal Anderson. Not sure if Kobe or Crayton will be ready to go.
David and Ruke coming back would be insane. However, I feel comfortable with Page, Tre, Capehart, and Reuben in that top 4 rotation. Story likely makes a significant jump in year 2. And I love Woods, Burley, and Green. I believe all 3 will be special.
CB is another position that we could use a portal player. I believe Wiggins will be Trayvon/Terrell special next year. Pride and Lukus flashed to me, hopefully one is ready. Malcolm will be a veteran. Then we have 4 guys that have never played a snap of college before.
S was bad for us this year. Mukuba needs to start next to Mickens. Tyler and Covil will be solid. Then a few guys with zero experience.
DE will be the weak link if XT and KJ turn pro. And it won’t even be close. My fear is that we won’t be able generate a consistent pass rush. That would kill our defense next year. We all know what a weak pass rush does.
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Recruit [81]
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Re: XT and KJ
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Jan 3, 2023, 6:35 PM
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This is the Gospel Truth.....Leon telling the TRUTH as always!
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All-TigerNet [13481]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:05 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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And pray no one gets hurt...
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CU Guru [1857]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:40 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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Trotsky is right as usual. That is exactly what an NFL scout would tell them btw. The truth hurts at times, but it is still the truth. If this level of scrutiny offends them, they should transfer to No. GVL. Mind you, I place zero blame on the players. The coaches collect steady paychecks and bring the players in. Any responsibility falls squarely on their shoulders.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:06 PM
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The coaches owe it to everyone within the program to be the best team they can be. They owe it to the fans as well.
Best is the standard. If the best players are in the portal, go get them.
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All-TigerNet [10572]
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I think at this point
Jan 2, 2023, 5:25 PM
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We need to know exactly what Best is the standard means?
Best student
Best volunteer for community projects
Best in the Division? Conference?
Best son? Friend? Neighbor?
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Scout Team [193]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:24 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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What is this BS. You are saying that people have to be willing to critique players at the risk of getting their ### kicked? What a joke
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Scout Team [176]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:17 PM
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Please tell us whom in the portal we should pick who is at a higher level than the players already on our squad. Just wondering? Asking for a friend.
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Orange Blooded [3550]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:24 PM
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I don’t understand how you forgot Peter Woods coming in. D Line will be not as much of a concern as you think. I love the guys from this year, but being honest they still did not do as well as they should have in my opinion. They deserve their high 1st round picks because of what they’re able to do individually, but they should have dominated.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:01 PM
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Peter is a DT and I was talking about our DEs.
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Legend [19686]
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So was Wilkins
Jan 2, 2023, 2:07 PM
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but he played DE his entire freshman year. Woods has the athleticism to do the same. I personally think at least one of XT and KJ return. XT pretty much has to, or transfer, because he isn't getting drafted.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: So was Wilkins
Jan 2, 2023, 2:08 PM
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He played DE his sophomore year.
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Legend [19686]
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Corrected then
Jan 2, 2023, 2:20 PM
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The year we won it all. Woods played all over in HS. He's an option, at both DT and DE. Honestly needs to add 25lbs for DT, at least at the 270 he's listed.
Caden Story played all over in HS as well.
I do have questions at DE. Denhoff and Patterson, both top 100 recruits, were no shows this year. One of XT/KJ returning helps alot. Both gives us real options. KJ projected 3rd day in draft. He was among the leaders in QB pressures in the nation, but did not get home enough to really up his stock. If he has NFL ambitions, being drafted 3rd day as a DE isn't the best route. You have to play on special teams to stick from that slot normally
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110%er [6386]
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Re: Corrected then
Jan 2, 2023, 3:32 PM
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Woods is an option. But then we’ll be relying on a true freshman not playing his natural position. Since he’s a DT, he wouldn’t be a speed rusher, which is what we are lacking. Still think the portal is necessary without XT and KJ.
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All-In [44044]
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It’s necessary to everyone except Dat Boy & His Fanboys.
1
Jan 2, 2023, 3:42 PM
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I think I just came up with a great band name.
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Legend [19686]
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I'm not against it
Jan 2, 2023, 5:36 PM
[ in reply to Re: Corrected then ] |
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honestly see no way XT doesn't return. He's not getting drafted off a lost year. KJ would get drafted, but where? Is being a 5th rounder after the improvement he did show this year worth not trying to up your stock?
I'm for the portal at WR, but numbers wise that depends on what Ngata does.
I'm for it at CB, depending on what Jones does.
Basically, depending on who returns, the portal should be evaluated. Getting them here is another matter. In our history, every guy we've expressed interest in has chosen to go elsewhere, few as they have been. Reason for that? Hard not to think NIL has something to do with it.
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CU Guru [1374]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:26 PM
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Clemson players say you are a less than below average fan.
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CU Guru [1857]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:41 PM
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But nonetheless, correct in his assessment.
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Head Coach [797]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:42 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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Not sure why people think losing XT matters. Hate he never lived up to the hype and seems like a good locker room guy - but production wise he had 4 tackles and 2 sacks this year. So…
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All-TigerNet [13481]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:08 PM
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I think it matters because of our lack of depth at DE. He may not have a lot of experience because of injury but even a little is better than none.
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Orange Blooded [4019]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:27 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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XT coming back would be like getting a 10 star. Don’t get it twisted. Do some of you realize our guys and recruits read this board? So sad the way y’all badmouth our guys. Very cootish
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:02 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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I’m more dedicated than most.
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Varsity [204]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 1:42 PM
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I have a feeling KJ will go pro and in all reality, deserves it. He had an outstanding year.
X probably should come back as he has been injured/sick quite a bit but again, the reality is he should go pro and earn that cabbage.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:07 PM
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XT looked dominant against BC in his limited action. His speed off the edge was impressive.
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Hall of Famer [24545]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:02 PM
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Our defense might literally rest of their decisions. We need at least one of them to return. If both turn pro, we could arguably have one of the worst DE lineups in the ACC.
Mascoll is just an average player. He’s never been impactful for us. And he’s easily the best we would have. After him, we have virtually nobody with any real experience
Greg Williams
Cade Denhoff
Zaire Patterson
Jaheim Lawson
And then there’s the three freshmen: Tomarrion Parker, David Ojiegbe, and AJ Hoffler. Do we really expect them to be ready to compete at an elite level?
The portal simply has to be necessary if XT and KJ turn pro. We cannot afford to return one DE with experience, and a mediocre one at that. The coaching staff cannot fail at their jobs again.
I wouldn't write off Denhoff or Patterson yet...
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:03 PM
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I hope you’re right. But I’d be willing to bet there are DEs in the portal that are better than both of them.
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Varsity [204]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:11 PM
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You will be hard-pressed to find someone better than KJ. That dude is a stud.
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Varsity [210]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:42 PM
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and a leader!
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Orange Blooded [4019]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:27 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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Who the hell would give this a TD? Coot?
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:34 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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I was referring to Denhoff and Patterson.
I love KJ and I believe he should go pro. He improved his draft stock a lot this year. He has his masters degree. He’s a great ambassador for Clemson. We’ll all miss him. But I just wasn’t talking about him with that response.
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Legend [16134]
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It make the Kevin Swint transfer even an odder decision...He
Jan 2, 2023, 2:47 PM
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was in line for MAJOR playing time
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110%er [6386]
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Re: It make the Kevin Swint transfer even an odder decision...He
Jan 2, 2023, 3:36 PM
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Even he wasn’t that good IMO. Never popped off on tape. Never made an impact.
That’s probably why he went to Georgia State instead of another P5 school. I doubt there was a ton of interest.
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Associate AD [839]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 2:59 PM
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That’s been my stance all along I am hoping Dabo knows something we do not. If not he’s truly living in a dream world
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Orange Blooded [2319]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:07 PM
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Leon's "discussion" is mute and useless because we have to depend on what we have. You guys are betting on cards that cannot be drawn. If you know so much, get into coaching and find out how little you know.
this constant saying what should and should not be done is like debating how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. You have no sweat and blood in the pot, so just keep to what little you know.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:37 PM
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Sorry for discussing something on a message board. I thought this was the forum for that. But I guess not.
Maybe all my posts should just be “Go Tigers!”
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Varsity [204]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 6:02 PM
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Be careful, you'll be called a coot. Seems to be the #1 comeback if you say anything critical, regardless if it is reality.
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All-In [44044]
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His discussion is mute? You can’t hear him?***
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Jan 2, 2023, 3:45 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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Orange Blooded [4674]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 5:18 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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I’d have to say, most of what’s on this board is pointless and uninformed but it’s fun and that’s what it’s for.
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Orange Blooded [4035]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 5:44 PM
[ in reply to Re: XT and KJ ] |
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Well said!
Just a bunch of people complaining about things they have no control and knowledge of.
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All-Pro [699]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:04 PM
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I certainly agree with your point on Clemson needing at least 1 to come back. It’s possible both decide to come back.
Also I think you are underselling Mascoll, he’s not elite but he’s certainly better than average.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:35 PM
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He’s been playing a lot for 4 years now and I can’t recall any significant plays made by him.
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All-Pro [686]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 8:09 PM
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Pretty sure Mascoll batted the pass that Goodrich housed in the bowl last year.
I only remember this because I was cheering that he finally made a highlight play.
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Orange Blooded [2248]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:20 PM
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Hopefully, the fact that we did not pick up a DE earlier in the portal means that the coaching staff at least has the feel that one or both will come back. I kind of expect XT back. If neither returns then I would think that this is one of those situations that Dabo says that he will use the portal.
We might also have the choice of moving Peter Woods to the outside. Though he projects as a DT, I believe that he is supposed to have the quickness to shift out to DE.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:39 PM
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Dabo hinted that we would have several players coming back on Signing Day.
We have 7 players left to make a decision: Ngata, Davis, Ruke, KJ, XT, Sheridan, and Jayln
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All-In [44044]
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I think KJ is going pro, which he should.
1
Jan 2, 2023, 3:49 PM
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I think XT will be back, simply because he is taking a big risk going pro right now with his injury history. He would test really well at the combine though (assuming he’s healthy).
I’m not sure about the others. I could see a lot of them staying or going.
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110%er [6386]
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Re: I think KJ is going pro, which he should.
Jan 2, 2023, 4:58 PM
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He’s one big season away from being a 2-3 round pick. We all know he has that kind of talent.
I think he should return too. I couldn’t see him being drafted before the 6th round right now. He could earn more from NIL returning, while simultaneously improving his draft stock.
XT would be a huge pickup. Higher ceiling than KJ, IMO
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Legend [19686]
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KJ is projected as a 5th rounder
Jan 2, 2023, 5:49 PM
[ in reply to I think KJ is going pro, which he should. ] |
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that's not even a guaranteed contract. KJ improved tremendously this year, but one thing he did not do was get home for sacks. That's what ups your draft stock. He had almost 40 pressures, but sacks were lacking.
Going pro with a year of eligibility left is a risky proposition as a projected 5th rounder. If his NFL grades show day 2, then that's something to think about.
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Athletic Dir [863]
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:27 PM
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Mascol coming back
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110%er [6931]
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I wouldn’t count on XT playing much *
Jan 2, 2023, 3:28 PM
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Nm
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Orange Blooded [4453]
TigerPulse: 91%
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Joined: 1/1/19
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 3:48 PM
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Hope these guys return and ball it next season
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All-In [31303]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 8/31/15
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 5:35 PM
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New blood may be what is needed. All I heard all year long was how great our D line would be and to some it may have been but for me it was not anything close to the expectations some made it out to be preseason.
Now I’m pretty sure that was the first year DC’s fault. ?♂️. Even though they were coached by Eason whom everyone was thrilled to get.
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110%er [6386]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 3900
Joined: 12/4/18
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 5:58 PM
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I can think of several things that made the DL not look as promising as people had hoped. But it’s a long rabbit hole, so bear with me.
1) Bryan Bresee not being fully ready to go. He was the most talented and disruptive DL that we had. But he was in and out of the lineup so much. I just don’t think he was operating at 100% this year.
2) Xavier Thomas being gone all season. Myles, KJ, and Mascoll are similar type of DEs. None of them are “edge rushers” that have incredible speed off the snap. XT is that guy. He’s one of the most explosive DEs in the country. Missing our only true “edge rusher” hurt us.
3) Our LBs are small, especially Carter and Trotter. Trenton always played the Sam. He always rushed off the edge or dropped into coverage. He never played in the box his first 2 years. I think he struggled getting off blocks, as well as Carter and Trotter. Skalski and Spector were great inside because of their experience at taking on offensive linemen. None of our LBs were up to that task this year though.
4) Our DBs were just bad. I think Wes struggled with trying to leave them on islands. Just look at the Wake Forest game. Because of that, I feel like we weren’t as aggressive as we under BV. Our CBs just weren’t very good this year. If we blitzed, we had to get home or we were going to get burnt.
5) Wes gets the play in earlier than BV. What made BV’s defense so special was how long he waited to call the play. It was truly right at the snap most time. And sure, we got burned a lot because of it, but we also confused the offense a lot. Most of the time it worked well for us.
6) Wes and BV’s demeanor. They are polar opposites as far as their coaching style is concerned. BV brought so much passion and energy that our players fed off of. He got in their face and chewed them out quite often. He also got crazy excited when they made plays. Wes is so much more laid back. So I’m not sure our players fed off his personality as well. However, I still like Wes. I think he’s a brilliant mind. It just might take a couple of years. Let him recruit his players to fit his style.
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All-In [27180]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 5:45 PM
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I think Mascoll has been an average pass rusher and needs a LOT of work on rush defense he’s graded out below average. Not sure having him back is a good thing since our younger guys desperately need snaps/experience
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110%er [6386]
TigerPulse: 97%
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Joined: 12/4/18
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 6:01 PM
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He’s obviously better than everyone else that we are returning. I want the best 11 on the field.
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Orange Blooded [2132]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 1841
Joined: 1/24/14
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 5:49 PM
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You portal idiots are literally that, idiots. If you even knew an once of what you thought you did you wouldn't sound like fools. Like yeah let's bring in portal players to be coached by the coaches you claim can't coach or develop. That's how ignorant y'all sound. First Clemson is not going to get the elite ones who are ONLY in the portal to get paid. So that leaves the guys who weren't good enough to get playing time at their previous school. So please PLEASE tell me how grateful you all would be when they bring in a player from FCS bc Clemson isn't going to get into a bidding war. I can see the hand wringing and hair pulling now. So please shut the blank up about the portal bc you know NOTHING about which you claim. This game is about developing, do you know what that means? It means guys get better with each passing season. So one may not be ready one year but will be the next. Also Clemson only has a spot or 2 open so this big wave of portal guys aren't happening.
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110%er [6386]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 3900
Joined: 12/4/18
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Re: XT and KJ
Jan 2, 2023, 6:00 PM
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Are you okay?
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Recruit [81]
TigerPulse: 50%
Posts: 42
Joined: 12/9/22
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Re: XT and KJ
1
Jan 3, 2023, 6:33 PM
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You are absolutely correct!! Thanks for this truthful post!!
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