Replies: 51
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CU Medallion [73569]
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So my question is, do y'all think Dabo/coaches
Nov 28, 2022, 8:37 AM
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Not see the problems or is it his pride to not admit anything?
I truly don't think he sees much wrong besides turnovers and dropped balls. Which is gonna drive the fanbase insane. My grandma can see issues with the offense.
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Orange Blooded [3615]
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Re: So my question is, do y'all think Dabo/coaches
Nov 28, 2022, 8:39 AM
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Tough to say. I am hoping they see what we see and are just being supportive. I think Dabo might be in denial though. JMO
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Oculus Spirit [85065]
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Did I miss the meatup post / schedule?***
Nov 28, 2022, 8:55 AM
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Orange Blooded [3615]
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Re: Did I miss the meatup post / schedule?***
Nov 28, 2022, 9:31 AM
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I don't know what that means.
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All-In [26968]
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What the coaches say to the media
Nov 28, 2022, 8:41 AM
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is as much a part of their player development strategy as anything else.
I don't know any details about this situation, but I grew up under the Bobby Cox school of player management, where if someone had a bad performance, he talked to the media like he was just the unluckiest player in the world, who actually was awesome. It's intended to motivate the player.
The proof in the pudding is not what is said to the media, but changes that are actually made to the staff and to playing time.
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Lot o points [155595]
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It's a solid rule of thumb. Praise your players in public,
Nov 28, 2022, 10:34 AM
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and beat your wife in private.
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All-In [36448]
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Wait wut??? Poor Cathleen***
Nov 28, 2022, 11:28 AM
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Lot o points [155595]
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It was a poor taste Bobby Cox reference.***
Dec 7, 2022, 9:14 AM
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Hall of Famer [21833]
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Kind of what Prod said
Nov 28, 2022, 8:48 AM
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thought about this a little yesterday while moseying around the yard hanging up lights...
What's Dabo supposed to say re: Coaches?
Yeah, you know what, I made a massive mistake in hiring these guys. They're all fired, and oh by the way, we have an ACC championship in 5 days that we'll figger out a game plan for.
That's not going to happen.
He COULD, however, bench Cade. But then is it perceived he's throwing in the towel going into the ACC Champ game?
Idk. Tricky spot to be in, and he has no one to blame but himself.
Ultimately, he can't make any changes until the offseason coaching wise. And the optics are turrible either way...benching DJ prior to Champ game vs not given his performance against Sakerlina.
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Hall of Famer [21833]
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poor man's not enough coffee edit
Nov 28, 2022, 8:49 AM
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thought about this a little yesterday while moseying around the yard hanging up lights...
What's Dabo supposed to say re: Coaches?
Yeah, you know what, I made a massive mistake in hiring these guys. They're all fired, and oh by the way, we have an ACC championship in 5 days that we'll figger out a game plan for.
That's not going to happen.
He COULD, however, bench DJ for Cade. But then is it perceived he's throwing in the towel going into the ACC Champ game?
Idk. Tricky spot to be in, and he has no one to blame but himself.
Ultimately, he can't make any changes until the offseason coaching wise. And the optics are turrible either way...benching DJ prior to Champ game vs not given his performance against Sakerlina.
Bench DJ for Cade***
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All-In [49146]
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agree, and furthermore,
Nov 28, 2022, 9:08 AM
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the decision on DJ playing does not mean anything negative about Cade. Dabo and staff feel like leaving DJ as the starter is their best bet to win, apparently some of his plusses outweigh the glaring obvious negatives. Hey, he could have a monster game out of nowhere, like Cole did that time.
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CU Medallion [73569]
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he could say a LOT of things
Nov 28, 2022, 9:07 AM
[ in reply to Kind of what Prod said ] |
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We called a ###### game. We, AS COACHES, gotta figure out why our offense just sucks. Its not the players, its us. We get paid a lot of money to put them in good positions and we're not. We gotta move some players around that might not be up to their best. We will be looking at what we're doing poorly as coaches and try to rectify it.
I could go on and on
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CU Medallion [73569]
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at least that would let people know, that they know
Nov 28, 2022, 9:12 AM
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he doesn't think its turnovers and dropped passes that lost the game, which seems to be his go to lately. That they are Actively looking to make this offense better and not just hope for less turnovers.
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All-In [47625]
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He COULD, but he won't.
Nov 28, 2022, 9:46 AM
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Y'all need to remember that Dabo is one of the most (if not the absolute most) positive thinking individuals in college football. At least in front of the cameras.
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Hall of Famer [24445]
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Agree with both you and
Nov 28, 2022, 10:06 AM
[ in reply to he could say a LOT of things ] |
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dawghater23. Dabo is in a bad spot re comments. But you're right: what makes fans crazy is hearing him call out defensive guys by name while denying what we all see on the other side of the ball. All anyone wants to hear is, "Best is still Standard, and we're not seeing it right now, and you all know I won't let that continue. I won't discuss details now." Fine. We all understand that complex organizations go through ups and downs, and we don't mind the downs.
But he sounds like he has personally identified with DJ to the point of calling out other players to justify that decision. No one likes to hear that. As much as he loves DJ, we feel that way about the rest of them. We all know Mukuba let a couple of people get behind him. We don't hate either him for DJ for what happened. We all saw Dabo last year pat DJ on the head after a 3-and-out, then go get in Brent's face about something while the D was working on a 100 yard game. Something seems off. But as you guys said, we can't really know.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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I think the issue is fans need some kind of bone…
Nov 28, 2022, 9:28 AM
[ in reply to Kind of what Prod said ] |
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and an acknowledgement that what we have seen the last 2 years is not going to continue. Where I think Dabo is confused is he dismisses all fans as delusional. Most fans don’t demand us go to ACC Championship every year, the playoffs every year, the NC Championship every year - heck, don’t even have to beat the coots every year. However, most fans want to see that we are trying and that we are putting our best foot forward every week. What we have seen the last 2 years is frustating mediocrity with seemingly no progress or attempt to make it better.
Everybody sees it. Can’t help to think recruits see this.
I get it. He can’t do much or say much right now. But a lot of fans feel like Dabo is giving us the middle finger. We expect too much. No Dabo, we just expect to come out and play 1 complete game out of 24. Quit winning by simply outlasting inferior opponents and quit beating ourselves. I don’t think I’ve seen us play a complete 60 minutes in 2 years.
I love Dabo, but it really comes off as a pride thing…like trying a 60 yard FG for no reason when we certainly hadn’t put the game away.
Dabo’s words and actions are an insult to those of us who have been here through thick and thin. We have been here before Dabo came and we will be here after he leaves.
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110%er [6934]
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Am I crazy or did Dabo not specifically say that Clemson
Nov 28, 2022, 9:40 AM
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fans know football very well? It seems like he said that after a home win a few years ago.
That always stuck out to me because I think it is true. We don't expect Natty's every year but anyone can see that there is something wrong.
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Lot o points [155595]
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I've learned to take what comes out
Nov 28, 2022, 10:24 AM
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of his mouth with a grain of salt. Not because the guy is some sort of massive liar or anything. I just think he's a salesman still at heart. His favorite color is plaid, and his mantra at any given time is whatever saying he read on his daily motivational calendar and liked.
For instance, for a while he was preaching a "windshield mentality".....how winners look ahead of them at what's coming next and losers stare in the rearview mirror, both at wins and losses.
Now, as he is a fountain of historical stats at ever press conference, I've literally heard him say that we learn from looking in the rearview mirror.
I think the guy has a set of core values he sticks too, but most of these slogans are whatever he sticks his finger into the wind and thinks sounds best.
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110%er [6934]
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Lot o points [155595]
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Heck f’in yeah.
Nov 28, 2022, 10:19 AM
[ in reply to I think the issue is fans need some kind of bone… ] |
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The constant gaslighting and condescension is maddening and insulting.
It feels like we would have a top notch P&R firm on our payroll at this point to help Dabo with his messaging.
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All-In [42000]
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My only devil's advocate here is...
Nov 28, 2022, 11:30 AM
[ in reply to I think the issue is fans need some kind of bone… ] |
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When a guy has a resume like Dabo's, it's easy to dismiss a bunch of people who don't know as much about it or couldn't do what he does.
And yeah, I know that can produce some arrogance and lack of self awareness, but I also get why he's telling us to #### off in the most Christian way he can.
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CU Medallion [65975]
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Completely agree, but all Dabo has to say is:
Nov 28, 2022, 12:32 PM
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"There's going to be changes this offseason, I'm not going into detail and you will learn about them at the appropriate time."
The constantly spin is ridiculous, it's almost as bad as watching a political press conference the way the truth is never talked about
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All-In [31361]
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Re: Completely agree, but all Dabo has to say is:
Nov 28, 2022, 12:36 PM
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Exactly! That’s all he has to say! Say that, and ok, sure thing Dabo, you’ve earned enough credit w us that saying that is sufficient. But no amount of prior success will make constantly bullshi>tting and gaslighting us acceptable.
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Hall of Famer [21833]
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At the very least
Nov 28, 2022, 12:00 PM
[ in reply to I think the issue is fans need some kind of bone… ] |
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He could've said, "DJ didn't cost us the game, but we got to have better QB play to compete. It's our jobs as coaches to do that."
I'll concede that...as you and others here are spot on. He goes after the other guys but is softer than puppy #### to DJ.
The real rub here, in my opinion, is that the bigger issue is that we need a complete offensive overhaul, down to the cultural level of how we approach scoring points. Force teams to quit and call timeouts for curtain calls for your seniors...THAT is championship football. Will we hit it every game? Lord no, but at least approach the game with that mentality every series.
I agree with everything you said, and just got done bitchin to my dad about that. We haven't seen a complete game, I'd argue, playing the Clemson Football that Dabo himself has built, in 2+ years.
And yes, I'm one who's been here through it all (at least since I've been alive). And I'm out. I've got better things to do than (like I've said ad nauseum) watch kids and millionaires put a #### product on the field and tell us it smells like roses.
This is Rob Spence level bad, and that's what ultimately (amongst other things) led to Bowden's departure. Attack games. Put points on the ####### board. Show some ####### fire. Get the boys fired up, to play AT HOME, AGAINST SOUTH CAROFUCKINGLINA. Win or lose, this fan base will ride or die with you 365 days out of the year. Put whateverthefuck we watched Saturday on display, and you'll lose us.
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All-In [38096]
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my grandma is dead and knows our offense sucks
Nov 28, 2022, 8:53 AM
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sorry granny
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All-In [42000]
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Re: So my question is, do y'all think Dabo/coaches
Nov 28, 2022, 8:59 AM
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I refuse to believe Dabo can't see what's wrong as he's been very adept at that in the past. I do think Dabo would avoid a trial by media over DJ and even Streeter so that he an quietly deal with it at season's end.
Dabo understands better than anyone the gravity of losing to South Carolina. He expected to be fired in 2010 after losing to them. He fired Napier shortly after.
Now, if come next year DJ and Streeter are still calling this show and nothing has changed in production, then I'll worry about Dabo.
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All-TigerNet [12102]
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Radio this am "Mickey" relayed a story earlier in year
Nov 28, 2022, 9:22 AM
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was asked about a certain OL players development (didn't name names but sounded like our frosh RT). Was overly lauding his development to media, Micky's friend who evidently has access to practices calls him later and says Dabo was riding that kid all week long, obviously not happy with his performance.
Dabo gonna paint sunshine to media, may be tearing people new ones this AM.
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All-In [47625]
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I disagree. Dabo knows EXACTLY what the issues are.
Nov 28, 2022, 9:39 AM
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His pride and hubris are getting in the way of him admitting it, not that I would expect him to admit it at this point anyway. That's just not his style. He has made the tough decisions before. We will see if he will do it again, or the pride and hubris has taken over to the point of no return and he chooses to go down with the ship.
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Hall of Famer [21888]
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Yep
Nov 28, 2022, 10:18 AM
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I made that similar point. He clearly has shown he will make tough calls in the past, but it's obvious he's not going to do it this season, and I honestly don't expect it next season unfortunately. So that either tells me he's going down with the ship...OR Cade just isn't nearly what we thought he was. neither of those bode well for us at the moment. I don't expect coaches to cater to what fans want because let's be honest, most fans are reactionary morons, but with that said, his way of being so flippant about the glaring issues everyone outside this program can see is wearing very thin.
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Lot o points [155595]
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All-In [47625]
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Confident he knows - yes.
Nov 28, 2022, 10:52 AM
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Confident he will do something about it - 50/50 at best.
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All-In [31833]
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Isn't that 100% speculation though...
Nov 28, 2022, 11:43 AM
[ in reply to I disagree. Dabo knows EXACTLY what the issues are. ] |
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how do you know for sure Cade has shown him in practice that he should be starting?
He certainly hasn't looked any better when he was put in games, for the most part.
Dabo has a pretty good history of making QB changes in favor of freshman over established starters into the season.
Could also be that with our WR and OL play that he's concerned about rolling Cade out there as a starter now and having him fail and what that might do for next year.
Dang...good coaches don't just normally forget how to coach and manage a team. Look at all of the drafted players that played additional years...the man has shown he knows how to keep teams together and players bought in.
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All-In [47625]
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My post had nothing to do about CK***
Nov 28, 2022, 12:05 PM
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All-In [31833]
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So it wasn't about the QB situation?....
Nov 28, 2022, 12:42 PM
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then what off coordinator or position coach(es)?
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All-In [47625]
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I was just stating that Dabo knows what is wrong
Nov 28, 2022, 1:32 PM
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Players, coaches, water boys, whatever. He knows what is wrong but sure as hayull ain't gonna tell the fans. We will have to wait until after the season to see what happens, if anything.
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All-In [31833]
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Then i misread...the "pride and hubris" comment...
Nov 28, 2022, 1:48 PM
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threw me.
I'm still not seeing exactly how pride is factoring in here. If he knows what's wrong and it's coaching, there isn't a whole lot he can do about that mid-season...in terms of making personal changes...unless he just fired an assistant mid-year and I don't see anyone that really deserves that.
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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Almost everything I've said is speculation.
Nov 28, 2022, 12:15 PM
[ in reply to Isn't that 100% speculation though... ] |
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The entirety of Tnet is filled with speculation. We're all angry and frustrated because we didn't replace Trevor with someone like Watson and many of us are ready to fire people because we are human and feel like someone has to pay for us not enjoying the very best QB in college football and it happened two years in a row.
It's just not fair. It's not fair because we deserve it and we want it.
OFF WITH THEIR HEADS!
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All-In [35541]
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Re: They've said he is a leader
Nov 28, 2022, 10:12 AM
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and we saw that when he was pulled in the 'cuse game. He was on the sideline helping Cade. That leadership is probably the only thing keeping him as the starter at this point.
I think Dabo should have pulled him and put Cade in. The energy would have changed in the stadium.
Punting with under 3 min to play felt like Dabo had given up. Our defense did all they could to keep us in the game. Shame our offense couldn't produce and the play calling was gawdawful
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Heisman Winner [135455]
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We're constantly told that DJ is the leader but you what?
Nov 28, 2022, 10:31 AM
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It's not evident on the field to me. I think we seem to think if coaches say it to the fans and the media enough, we'll all believe it and the players will believe it but this team does not have the clear leadership from players like teams in the past. It's just not evident to me from what I see on the field.
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Lot o points [155595]
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Yessir, I agree.
Nov 28, 2022, 10:32 AM
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I suppose behind the scenes could be different, but on the field and on the sidelines, I see a team that is mostly indifferent to DJ's presence. There has been a noticeable energy increase every time Cade has come in, regardless of the outcome.
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All-In [35541]
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Heisman Winner [135455]
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It's time to turn DJ's keys over to Shipley.
Nov 28, 2022, 12:00 PM
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He's the guy that has the energy and backs it up with his play on the field. I think the coaches bet on the wrong horse.
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Lot o points [155595]
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You need to watch the game a little closer.
Nov 28, 2022, 12:44 PM
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Those OL guys look amped when Drew Swinney comes in and tries to jump up really high to reach their hands for a high five. That's our backbone-in-waiting.
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CU Medallion [65975]
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All-In [35541]
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Re: We're constantly told that DJ is the leader but you what?
Dec 7, 2022, 8:38 AM
[ in reply to We're constantly told that DJ is the leader but you what? ] |
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By David Hood:
Dabo and the QBs emoji_events [137] Sep 7, 2022, 9:33 AM
Sitting here listening to Furman coach Clay Hendrix, but I'll take a break to tell you about a phone call I had last night. Reached out to a person who is a coach, knows Dabo, etc. Someone connected but not on staff at the moment. I was actually surprised they picked up, considering it is football season, but they answered by laughing and saying, "bet you're calling about the quarterbacks."
I said yes. This person knows Dabo inside and out, and he said, "A coach can't take a chance on losing a locker room. No. 2 is special, anyone can see that, but 5 is respected and well-liked and he's become a team leader. And you can't bench a player now based off last season, and you have to give him more than a few quarters like some of the fans want. That doesn't send a great message to the team - hey you've done everything we've asked of you and you/ve worked hard, and now after 20 passes we are going to bench you. A coach has to think about unity in the locker room. So this will be decided on the field. At some point, one of them will separate, and you can't say that after one drive from one of them late in a game. And when they separate, and everyone knows it including the team, you'll have your answer, one way or the other. One of the biggest reasons Dabo has been successful is because he is loyal. I know fans hate it, because they want all outside coaches and players benched, but that's what he does. And it ensures people are loyal back, which in this climate is imperative. You have to keep everyone unified and on the same page. That's the way I look at it."
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Lot o points [155595]
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Sure, there are things going on behind the scenes, but
Dec 7, 2022, 9:18 AM
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the whole team literally plays better, tries harder, and has an energy when playing with Cade that they don't have when DJ is in, and I was noticing that well before the UNC game. Dabo knows his team dynamic a million times better than I do, but based on their actions on the field, they sure didn't look like guys that would have been abandoning ship with Cade inserted in the game.
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All-In [35541]
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Re: I agree with that statement, the team plays differently
Dec 7, 2022, 9:20 AM
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and looks sharper with Cade. IDK why Dabo didn't make the switch sooner, the way he pulled KB for TL. Its another 10 win season and a BCS bowl.
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All-In [33418]
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I'm very worried he's going to run it back
Nov 28, 2022, 11:24 AM
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People mention that he's made the "tough decisions before" but I disagree and think he only made them because he was desperate to keep his job (Napier) and the situation was so untenable it was a no-brainer (Steele) - he wasn't exactly proactive on either of those situations.
I also feel like he's gotten way too proud on other things like the portal, giving way too many schollies to walk-ons, promoting inxperienced coaches from within instead of hiring fired head coaches with experience, etc because things worked out in the past his way and he thinks they always will
Streeter is the most obvious fix that needs to be made and I really doubt he has the balls to demote/replace him
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All-In [31833]
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Neither...
Nov 28, 2022, 11:32 AM
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of course they see the offense issues. To think they don't is nutz. What they see, that we don't/can't, is the execution level of the entire offense. For example, did the WR run the right route/read and did they run it correctly. Was DJ doing what he was coached to do on a certain play or not. and so on. Not at all saying that DJ played well on Sat, but that it's a bit more complicated than many seem to understand.
I believe he thinks DJ gives us the best chance to win based on what he sees in practice and when Cade has played in games.
I think this whole "stubborn" line makes no sense. I can't imagine a scenario where Dabo really thinks Cade could do better, but he won't put him in because he's to "invested" in DJ. My guess is there is something else going on...either Cade's play in practice or something else.
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All-In [31361]
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Re: So my question is, do y'all think Dabo/coaches
Nov 28, 2022, 12:15 PM
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Several people have hit on this and I agree 100%, I don’t expect to win every game. What I do expect is for Dabo to quit blowing smoke up our ##### trying to tell us we aren’t seeing what we’ve been seeing for 4 years now. Come out and just say it, just say “yes, the offense is not good enough, our QB play, playcalling, and execution isn’t good enough.”
That’s it, that’s all I want to hear. I don’t even need him to divulge his plans to fix it. But stop getting indignant when asked about it, stop blaming 3 drops and the defense when our QB is 8/29 and we can all see plain as day that our offense is stuck in 2012 and it isn’t getting better.
But instead, he is going to allow his ego and obstinance to drag this program, and ##### at us that it’s somehow our fault or that we “want them to fail.”
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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"DJ sucks and I'm throwing him off the team." - Dabo
Nov 28, 2022, 3:16 PM
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What's the chance of that? Better yet, what good could come of that and how would that make the team perform better on the field?
Do we want to win or do we want people punished to satisfy our need to inject venom in retaliation for the pain of losing?
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 12/25/09
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I don't like someone asking me a question yet...
Nov 28, 2022, 3:11 PM
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allowing me only two pre-selected responses. Not to play as if I'm offended but there are other responses which perhaps might be just as applicable.
I doubt that Dabo is unable to see the problem. Such accusation would be a most horrific insult to his intelligence and coaching prowess and be ignoring his accomplishments.
I also find believing that Dabo has lost all humility and gone fully Lebron James/Chad Kelly in life or on the job is nonsense.
I can eliminate those two selections but anything more is speculation. Perhaps after two years of fans and media beating on his #1 quarterback he's hunkered down for the fight. Imo, it's pretty easy to think he, if he only, sees DJ as the best then attacks on DJ are equally attacks on his opinions and decisions.
I do not think Dabo likes what is happening any more than any of us. I think perhaps, since he is the only one in the position to fix our problem(s) the last thing he believes he should do is perpetuate the issue by abandoning team spirit and lashing out at DJ. That goes with typical corporate attitude; the workers are never considered 'they,' in public, the workers are 'we,' in public and 'they,' during corporate meetings when no strange ears can hear.
Would it make any of us feel better if Dabo broke out in a rant about how horrible DJ is playing and how incompetent DJ is after the ball is snapped and how confused Dabo is when DJ does so well in practice the stinks up the field on gameday?
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